Shimano 11 speed interchangeability

[oddsaabs]

I know that DA 9000 and Ultegra 6800 shifters and rear derailleurs can be used with each other, but has anyone tried using new 105 5800 11 speed parts with DA or Ultegra? One would assume that they all play nice with each other, but you know what happens when we assume. :)

[oldpotatoe]

I know that DA 9000 and Ultegra 6800 shifters and rear derailleurs can be used with each other, but has anyone tried using new 105 5800 11 speed parts with DA or Ultegra? One would assume that they all play nice with each other, but you know what happens when we assume. :)

5800 is compatible.

[oddsaabs]

Excellent! Thank you.

[cderalow]

none of the above work with older brakes and derailleurs supposedly though because shimano revised the cable pull ratios slightly.

has anyone verified that though?

[kramnnim]

I've been wondering the same thing. Obviously the FD is different...but will an 11sp RD work with 6-10 like almost all previous Shimano?

[oddsaabs]

It's my understanding that 11 speed shifters only work with 11 speed rear derailleurs.

I recently tried unsuccessfully to use a 6700 series 10 speed Ultegra rear with a 6800 series shifter. Works fine for a few gears, then skips 2, then works again. Clearly the cable pull/derailleur movement ratio is different between 10 and 11 speed systems.

It's good to hear that at least all the Shimano 11 speed systems have the same ratio and those parts can be interchanged.

[oldpotatoe]

I've been wondering the same thing. Obviously the FD is different...but will an 11sp RD work with 6-10 like almost all previous Shimano?

5800/6800/9000 ders work with only those shifters.

[guido]

I've been happy with 6800 brifters and Tektro R559 Brakes...

[oldpotatoe]

I've been happy with 6800 brifters and Tektro R559 Brakes...

Yep, the whole brake caliper compatibility issues are overplayed. Shifters-ders for shimano 11s is the way it is but the rest..not so much.

Cranks, pretty much need a 11s crank or you 'may' get some chain rub at extremes altho a 11s works just fine on 10s 'systems' w/o modification(no, you don't need CR spacers).

[coreywood]

FYI, I have been running 6800 brifters and ders on a 6700 cassette for a bit now(wheels are 10spd) and all gears run quietly and shift smoothly. Have Force calipers in the mix too, predictable braking with what feels like a very slight decrease in power. fwiw

[peanutgallery]

Though it is a pain to maintain the whole compatibility thing, its worth it. I really like the new shimano brakes, they work much better than any road, rim brake I've encountered

[Likes2ridefar]

none of the above work with older brakes and derailleurs supposedly though because shimano revised the cable pull ratios slightly.

has anyone verified that though?

i used 7900 shifters with 9000 brakes with no issues. i can't tell much difference now that I have 6800 shifters with the same brakes.

[Vinci]

FYI, I have been running 6800 brifters and ders on a 6700 cassette for a bit now(wheels are 10spd) and all gears run quietly and shift smoothly. Have Force calipers in the mix too, predictable braking with what feels like a very slight decrease in power. fwiw
Did you just set the rear derailleur limits to keep it from shifting to the 11th position (aka: into the spokes)?

[oldpotatoe]

FYI, I have been running 6800 brifters and ders on a 6700 cassette for a bit now(wheels are 10spd) and all gears run quietly and shift smoothly. Have Force calipers in the mix too, predictable braking with what feels like a very slight decrease in power. fwiw

So 11s shifters, ders are shifting thru a 10s cogset?

[coreywood]

Did you just set the rear derailleur limits to keep it from shifting to the 11th position (aka: into the spokes)?
Exactly. I always set the limits for the cassette in play. Like when changing wheels with different hubs, and you need to make a small barrel adjustment on the der, the limits need to be checked as well.
So far no hiccups.

[coreywood]

So 11s shifters, ders are shifting thru a 10s cogset?
Correct oldpotatoe . Thus far very well. If the cable adjustment is at all off, the first sign is noise in the 11t or 28t(the extremes), it seems more sensitive to this than with the 11spd cogset, which makes sense.
I believe I am "getting away with it"

[kramnnim]

Interesting, but I guess it makes sense... Similar to using 11sp Campy ergos+RD with a Shimano 10sp cassette.

[Exonerv]

I've been hunting around for solutions to using 11 speed Shimano cassettes on 10 speed hubs and ran across this rather detailed explanation:

http://darkspeedworks.com/blog.htm

They break it down for various Shimano cassettes including 11-25, 11-28 & 11-23.

I also plan to try Echelon John's suggestion of using a 1.5mm spacer and eliminating the 11 cog. I have a 12t 1st cog on the way and hope to have a functional 12-28 (10sp) cassette when I'm done. Found the cog on Amazon for $7.00.

[Mr_Gimby]

The new XTR 11-sp cassette fits and is designed for a 10sp freehub, but I am unsure of the 580/6800/9000 shifter compatibility with a new XTR RD, as it is needed to reach the massive 40t first gear cog...

EDIT/IDEA: I wonder how feasible it would be for the aftermarket to make an 1/12t threaded lockring, ala the old Uniglide system, to make 11sp cassettes fit on a 10s freehub...

[kramnnim]

EDIT/IDEA: I wonder how feasible it would be for the aftermarket to make an 1/12t threaded lockring, ala the old Uniglide system, to make 11sp cassettes fit on a 10s freehub...

It would hit the inside face of the DS dropout...

[odin99]

Correct oldpotatoe . Thus far very well. If the cable adjustment is at all off, the first sign is noise in the 11t or 28t(the extremes), it seems more sensitive to this than with the 11spd cogset, which makes sense.
I believe I am "getting away with it"

very interesting! i've been waiting for shiftmate or someone to come out with an adapter thingy to use 11spd shifters / RD w/10spd cassette, but might have to just give it a go as is.

[Mr_Gimby]

It would hit the inside face of the DS dropout...

After actually looking at a bike, I realize you are completely right. :-/

[beeatnik]

I've been happy with 6800 brifters and Tektro R559 Brakes...

Better braking w/ 5800 and Cane Creek Long Reach https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7548/16048742446_c18d58c8e1_b.jpg

Than Athena (or Veloce) and Cane Creek
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8116/8660297436_9a887e5d48_b.jpg

In fact, I would not recommend Campy Ergos w/ long reach brakes as this combo almost got me killed a few times (ambulance ran me off the road). I guess it evens out as Ergos and Skeleton brakes have also saved my life a few times (modulation, yo). Sorry, OldP!:eek:

[whatwolf]

The new XTR 11-sp cassette fits and is designed for a 10sp freehub

Whoa, really? I need to look into this. So I can buy cheap MTB wheels and go 1x11 with xtr?

[thirdgenbird]

Whoa, really? I need to look into this. So I can buy cheap MTB wheels and go 1x11 with xtr?

Yes. The 40t cog is so large they were able to dish it over the spokes. I haven't seen it first hand, but that's what I read.