Road riding, numb penis, erectile dysfunction

[Dead Man]

OH YEA, I'm going there.

I've been making some big changes to my riding this summer, and especially the last month. I've made some big changes to my saddle position also, which seems to be having a big effect on my saddle comfort endurance. Looks like I'm gonna be on ANOTHER quest to find a comfortable saddle, to accommodate my new riding position and style.

I went out on what I thought was a pretty moderate ride (relative to how I've been riding lately) yesterday - 66 miles and 4,757'... a few months ago, that would have been a bigger day for me, but that's actually on the low side for gain these days, if still a little on the high side for my typical ride, mileage wise.

For some reason, my nether region went out on me pretty early in the ride, and I was alternating between uncomfortable, numb, and downright painful for most of the ride. I had a 20 mile stretch of flat highway to get home from the base of the last climb, and OH MAN IT SUCKED. I had to thigh-squeeze the saddle for about half the segment.. almost stopped to raise my saddle, but it's already pretty high to begin with, and I just really wanted to get home.

I'd done two rides with substantially greater gain but with about 15 miles less distance earlier in the week (and little rides in between) with basically no saddle discomfort, so it was quite a disappointing surprise to me to suffer so much.

After I got home and ate and stripped down and got in the shower, I noticed my penis seemed to be numb on one side... indeed, I got out of the shower and started poking at it, and I couldn't pick sensation or a pain signal at all on one side of my penis. Today, I think I have full sensation back, but I do think I feel weird down there still.

I've read in the past that chronic numbness on the bike (generally the hands) can and has caused permanent nerve damage in some people. Subsequently, I put a great deal of effort into handlebar and position experimentation to get rid of my hand numbness... I don't have any of that anymore. I also remember reading that some cyclists can suffer from ED attributed to their riding, I'm assuming also from chronic circulation, inflammation, nerve compression problems, whatever the case may be..

Firstly... how much damage can come from a single bad session on the bike? Have I possibly permanently decreased sensation in my penis, from one bad ride? Or is this a cumulative effect only? I mean, if you cut off circulation to your finger for 2 hours, you're probably going to suffer some irreversible cell death- probably a LOT. Not realizing just how numb I was (it was only later in the ride that I stuck my hand down my shorts and realized my penis was numb, so I don't know how long or for how much of the ride this was the case)

Secondly, and this'll be the one nobody wants to talk about... anyone actually suffer lasting/permanent effects from time on the saddle, and what's your doctor have to say about it?

Any other thoughts/input on the topic welcome

-B

[oldpotatoe]

OH YEA, I'm going there.

I've been making some big changes to my riding this summer, and especially the last month. I've made some big changes to my saddle position also, which seems to be having a big effect on my saddle comfort endurance. Looks like I'm gonna be on ANOTHER quest to find a comfortable saddle, to accommodate my new riding position and style.

I went out on what I thought was a pretty moderate ride (relative to how I've been riding lately) yesterday - 66 miles and 4,757'... a few months ago, that would have been a bigger day for me, but that's actually on the low side for gain these days, if still a little on the high side for my typical ride, mileage wise.

For some reason, my nether region went out on me pretty early in the ride, and I was alternating between uncomfortable, numb, and downright painful for most of the ride. I had a 20 mile stretch of flat highway to get home from the base of the last climb, and OH MAN IT SUCKED. I had to thigh-squeeze the saddle for about half the segment.. almost stopped to raise my saddle, but it's already pretty high to begin with, and I just really wanted to get home.

I'd done two rides with substantially greater gain but with about 15 miles less distance earlier in the week (and little rides in between) with basically no saddle discomfort, so it was quite a disappointing surprise to me to suffer so much.

After I got home and ate and stripped down and got in the shower, I noticed my hot-rod seemed to be numb on one side... indeed, I got out of the shower and started poking at it, and I couldn't pick sensation or a pain signal at all on one side of my junk. Today, I think I have full sensation back, but I do think I feel weird down there still.

I've read in the past that chronic numbness on the bike (generally the hands) can and has caused permanent nerve damage in some people. Subsequently, I put a great deal of effort into handlebar and position experimentation to get rid of my hand numbness... I don't have any of that anymore. I also remember reading that some cyclists can suffer from ED attributed to their riding, I'm assuming also from chronic circulation, inflammation, nerve compression problems, whatever the case may be..

Firstly... how much damage can come from a single bad session on the bike? Have I possibly permanently decreased sensation in my little head, from one bad ride? Or is this a cumulative effect only? I mean, if you cut off circulation to your finger for 2 hours, you're probably going to suffer some irreversible cell death- probably a LOT. Not realizing just how numb I was (it was only later in the ride that I stuck my hand down my shorts and realized my dick was numb, so I don't know how long or for how much of the ride this was the case)

Secondly, and this'll be the one nobody wants to talk about... anyone actually suffer lasting/permanent effects from time on the saddle, and what's your doctor have to say about it?

Any other thoughts/input on the topic welcome

-B

Might try SMP saddles if ya got the cojones to ride again..

[Hat]

I mean, if you cut off circulation to your finger for 2 hours, you're probably going to suffer some irreversible cell death- probably a LOT.

Not sure how true that is - I had some pretty bad numbness in my left pinky and ring finger that lasted for 7 months, and then went away completely within a week or two.

[FlashUNC]

Did anything change between your rides earlier in the week and the one that gave you some tackle box problems?

Just unexpected that you'd go from no issues to severe numbess in less than a week without something changing in fit/position/saddle angle, etc.

[donevwil]

Can't answer the long term impact questions, but a hard-headed (not that one) buddy of mine had minor pain and numbness a few years ago and just assumed that was the price of admission. Got to the point that he was having trouble peeing and had it looked at. Dr diagnosed enlarged prostate and he had to take 2 years (yes 2 years) off the bike before things returned to semi-normal and he was authorized to ride again, with a new saddle. Things never returned 100% to normal, but he can't say if it's solely due to cycling or not.

I ride a saddle from the early '90s for just this reason, every other saddle I've ever tried causes discomfort of one type or another. Even this one will cause numbness if the set-up isn't perfect.

Good luck, it's important to take this seriously early on.

[AngryScientist]

first of all - it is a legitimate inquiry, but as a moderator i'm going to ask you to clean up your post and take out all the vulgarity and slang wording. you can certainly ask the question with more appropriate terminology to the wide audience that reads this board. please, and thank you.

secondly, NO amount of numbness on the bike is OK. numbness indicates a lack of circulation or compressed nerves or something else up. you'll have to work on your position or equipment to eliminate that condition. it can be done, just keep working on it. i can ride a 10k' century with zero numbness in any part of my body, so it's more than possible.

one thing i find helps a lot is to stand up and pedal every few minutes, whether you want to or not. helps change up the position and increases circulation from a seated position.

hope that helps.

[Dead Man]

Not sure how true that is - I had some pretty bad numbness in my left pinky and ring finger that lasted for 7 months, and then went away completely within a week or two.

I think it depends entirely on what's causing the numbness. If it's oxygen deprivation/circulation, then cells are likely dying. My non-MD opinion.

[batman1425]

Nerve compression and loss of blood supply are not the same thing. You can have nerve compression which leads to tingling or a limb going "alseep" with out affecting blood supply to the area. No tissue death, just nerve issues. If you have ever pinched a nerve in your back you know what I mean. In the case of the nether regions - the nerves and blood vessels are very close together so blood cutoff can occur during peritoneal nerve compression but you would know (pain wise) if blood flow to that area for any lengthy period of time.

Once a nerve is aggravated, it can take time to return to normal. Ask anyone that has had nerve damage from surgery, injury, etc. Over time it can heal, but the process is slow and not always complete - some nerve damage is permanent.

Is there a chance your saddle slipped during the week causing your issues on the bigger 3rd ride?

[Admiral Ackbar]

is your saddle level?

sounds like you would certainly benefit from a saddle with a relief channel or cutout.

[christian]

i can ride a 10k' century with zero numbness in any part of my body, so it's more than possible.Can you do 3 hours on the trainer? That's the only place I ever get numbness.

[guido]

I used to suffer numbness issues. I found that saddle choice makes a big difference. I have had great luck with the Cobb JOF Randee or ISM Adamo (a bit too wide in the nose for me but beat the numbness issue).

Good luck!

[FlashUNC]

Nerve compression and loss of blood supply are not the same thing. You can have nerve compression which leads to tingling or a limb going "alseep" with out affecting blood supply to the area. No tissue death, just nerve issues. If you have ever pinched a nerve in your back you know what I mean. In the case of the nether regions - the nerves and blood vessels are very close together so blood cutoff can occur during peritoneal nerve compression but you would know (pain wise) if blood flow to that area for any lengthy period of time.

Once a nerve is aggravated, it can take time to return to normal. Ask anyone that has had nerve damage from surgery, injury, etc. Over time it can heal, but the process is slow and not always complete - some nerve damage is permanent.

Is there a chance your saddle slipped during the week causing your issues on the bigger 3rd ride?

+1. Docs had to fiddle with my ulnar nerve in my right arm quite a bit with my elbow surgery a few years back. Led to numbness and then pins-and-needles for a good month after the operation. Finally it's settled down. Never was any loss of circulation. Just couldn't feel most of my hand pinky and ring finger for a few weeks. Still gets a little grumpy now and again during the change of the seasons, but I wouldn't equate blood loss and nerve damage as a 1:1.

[joosttx]

Can you do 3 hours on the trainer? That's the only place I ever get numbness.

sometimes my head (brain) gets numb on a trainer.

[zap]

I've been making some big changes to my riding this summer, and especially the last month. I've made some big changes to my saddle position also, which seems to be having a big effect on my saddle comfort endurance.

-B

What changed?

[bcroslin]

I was having similar issues with my tried-and-true Aliante saddles and switched to the Pro (shimano) Turnix 142mm saddles with the anatomic cut out. Pro has a 30 day return policy - no questions asked and I've taken advantage of it. Great saddle but even better return policy.

The big question though has to be when was the last time you had a bike fit? A quality bike fitter will be able to help you with your issue and will also have saddle recommendations for your specific issue. $150-$250 for a bike fit is a bargain when compared with the money you'll spend on doctors visits and loss of time in the saddle.

[sailorboy]

I think it depends entirely on what's causing the numbness. If it's oxygen deprivation/circulation, then cells are likely dying. My non-MD opinion.

So then why don't you go and get and actual MD opinion...you really want to ask people on a forum if they think your penis is still working right?

I can see some instances where some internet 'doctoring' might be OK, e.g. stretching advice, sore muscle or joint, but this?? no, why even mess around with it.

[MattTuck]

Yeah, I wouldn't mess around.

On the other hand, if you start riding, and you feel a problem, turn around and end the ride. Or do rides close to home, tweak saddle position, and see if you can find a solution that works.

[xia_ke]

+1 for Selle SMP. I was having varying levels of issues ranging from mild numbness to outright pain. Tried several options from Selle Italia and Fizik, with cutouts and without, and at different seating positions. I had a couple times where even hours later after riding where there would be no... ahem... flag getting raised, which is something I NEVER had any problems with before I started biking. Someone recommended an SMP. I ponied up for a Glider and it is a night and day difference! Everything is great now both on and... ahhh... off the bike.

[false_Aest]

OH YEA, I'm going there.

I've been making some big changes to my riding this summer, and especially the last month. I've made some big changes to my saddle position also, which seems to be having a big effect on my saddle comfort endurance.
-B

Big changes + short amount of time seem like a bad combo.

If you're gonna go searching for this holy grail of saddle you might look for a fitter that has access to the Geobiomized (stupid name but just wait it gets worse) GP BikeMess (told you!) -- http://gebiomized.de/produkte/messtechnik/gp-bikemess (http://gebiomized.de/produkte/messtechnik/gp-bikemess)

It's not a direct solution (e.g. I ride a Toupe and its totally comfortable but I have a "hot spot" whereas a Gel Flow has no hot spots but isn't comfortable to me.) but it might send you in the right direction.

[RedRider]

I would say the big changes you made to your saddle position need to be adjusted. If your saddle was comfortable in the previous position but is now causing extreme problems it's your position. You might be seeing an increase in performance from your changes but that doesn't mean you found the "right" fit. Switching saddles might help but every time you change a saddle especially to a dramatically different shape such as an ISM or SMP you need to re-look at your total fit not just saddle height. Get a proper fitting from an experience professional, you'll save yourself a lot of time and pain.

[Dead Man]

I would say the big changes you made to your saddle position need to be adjusted. If your saddle was comfortable in the previous position but is now causing extreme problems it's your position. You might be seeing an increase in performance from your changes but that doesn't mean you found the "right" fit. Switching saddles might help but every time you change a saddle especially to a dramatically different shape such as an ISM or SMP you need to re-look at your total fit not just saddle height. Get a proper fitting from an experience professional, you'll save yourself a lot of time and pain.

No question - it's a fit issue. Too much setback had be riding the nose of the saddle, putting way too much pressure on my perineum. I just was shocked that 20 minutes of it ruined my whole day. But yea, I've needed to go to a zero-setback post for a while, I just haven't had any seriously problems before now.

I'm not looking for solutions to my fit problems here - I'm wondering about peoples experience or knowledge on possible problems with firehose function due to road bike riding... short term or long term. Fit issues or not.

Could be there's not much to it, and what little I've read has been sensationalized internet hype. Hope so!

[seanile]

Might try SMP saddles if ya got the cojones to ride again..
+1 smp dynamic is a lifesaver for me

[Dead Man]

Well call me Fred, but SMP saddles are super ugly.

I haven't yet given up on my saddle- I just know what as my position evolves, I might need to. And even if they are hideous, if an SMP saddle prevents ED, I'll buy 5 of them.

[ultraman6970]

Had problems with that too....

Between the things that helped me I can count:

1 bicycle correctly fit. Many people have numbess just because the saddle is like 2 or 3 cm too high, and they are seated over the junk, not over the bones, have you seen the bike with the saddle pointing 35 degrees down plus the dude rocks the hips big time.

2 Pick the right saddle, in my case the toupe worked fine.

3 right shorts or bibs. some bibs are just plain crap.

[Dead Man]

Interesting article

http://www.latimes.com/local/obituaries/la-he-cycling9apr09-story.html#page=1

[93legendti]

My saddle tilted up on my bike, unbeknownst to me, and gave me what my dr called prostatitis. I think the awful roads around here contributed to the problem... Leveled the saddle, took a week off and now I get out of the saddle much more often. I've noticed with 2 bib shorts, I still have pain.

[Dead Man]

http://cdn.velonews.competitor.com/files/2014/05/101.jpg


Please God... may it never be

[seanile]

Well call me Fred, but SMP saddles are super ugly.
if it's relatively centered it really doesnt look too bad though.

heres a great breakdown on em:
http://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/bikefit/2011/09/all-about-smps/


https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10414877_718630594867487_8959936354640959326_n.jpg ?oh=aa0c51e41cbe75158c5873a51c76cfa7&oe=5488659A&__gda__=1418884080_3d9788237094428894fdf07d0a382b2 4
https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/385258_466231543440728_1560937734_n.jpg?oh=cce581a 1c03c3b3f4e36037a44c1e239&oe=5490FF7C

[Dead Man]

My saddle tilted up on my bike, unbeknownst to me, and gave me what my dr called prostatitis. I think the awful roads around here contributed to the problem... Leveled the saddle, took a week off and now I get out of the saddle much more often. I've noticed with 2 bib shorts, I still have pain.

I actually tilted my saddle up one tick a little while ago (one bolt/toothed design). I do remember feeling like I had slightly more perineum pressure, but no pain. Before, it was nosed down too far... felt fine deep in the drops (why I had it there) but sitting upright felt like sitting on a slide.. no rest.

Perhaps I'll get a two-bolt design on my new post, so I don't end up needing a position that doesn't exist.

[teleguy57]

if it's relatively centered it really doesnt look too bad though.

heres a great breakdown on em:
http://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/bikefit/2011/09/all-about-smps/

Another one to eyeball; agree on the centered on the rails (this is an older pic;a bunch of different components on now). Hogg says (and I agree) that SMPs need to be about a cm further forward over the bb to put the sit bones in the same position over the bike as a regular saddle. Many folks need to run a straight post or one with shallower setback (my post has 15mm setback) to achieve that.

http://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/attachments/f11/64879d1394737097-hampsten-tournesol-dsc_0091.jpg

[cinema]

Fit your bike properly. Figure out reach. This is personal. Discover your PBH. your saddle height, from the center of the BB to the top of your seat where your butt hits, should be 8-10cm less than your properly measured pbh.

Start with your saddle leveled perfectly and tilt on a miniscule basis upwards during your ride if you feel yourself sliding forwards or putting abnormal amount of pressure on your hands/wrists. A two bolt seatpost with infinite adjustment is a necessity

Reducing the drop between your saddle and bars will help. I specifically seek geometry that allows the bars to be slightly below the saddle or at saddle height for the reasons you outlined in your post. I am not and will never be Nibali and I won't pretend to be. Cycling is something I do for fun, transportation, to push myself, and to stay healthy. So what if I don't look pro with my stem flipped up I'll still pass you on the climb.

Another thing to consider is leather. It properly molds to and supports your body in a way that only organic material can. You think I am joking, and I know cycling is primarily a fashion industry where people dress up like Flash Gordon so they can be in a special superhero club, but once you get a leather seat that works for your type of cycling, you can wear regular casual shorts where your penis will be free to move with you instead of stuck in the same place in your spandex and subjected to repeated abuse.

[numbskull]

If you want to sell that saddle you might talk to my lovely wife of 32 years.....she's probably looking for my Xmas present by now and would likely pay you triple what it's worth.

[Louis]

A random comment: In my experience the less padding and gel in the saddle the less likely you are to have numbness issues. What's comfy for the sit bone area is not necessarily good elsewhere.

http://peaceanonymous.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/comfortably_numb_by_knightmare_san-d5p0uk6.jpg

[HenryA]

I actually tilted my saddle up one tick a little while ago (one bolt/toothed design). I do remember feeling like I had slightly more perineum pressure, but no pain. Before, it was nosed down too far... felt fine deep in the drops (why I had it there) but sitting upright felt like sitting on a slide.. no rest.

Perhaps I'll get a two-bolt design on my new post, so I don't end up needing a position that doesn't exist.


Would it be too simple to just put your saddle back where it was before it hurt??????


.

[oldpotatoe]

Well call me Fred, but SMP saddles are super ugly.

I haven't yet given up on my saddle- I just know what as my position evolves, I might need to. And even if they are hideous, if an SMP saddle prevents ED, I'll buy 5 of them.

Can't see 'em when yer sitting on it AND, well not something to trifle with...

[beeatnik]

Well call me Fred, but SMP saddles are super ugly.

I haven't yet given up on my saddle- I just know what as my position evolves, I might need to. And even if they are hideous, if an SMP saddle prevents ED, I'll buy 5 of them.

R. Bahati rocks those saddles. The key to overcoming their ugliness? Don't take any pics of your bike(s).

[jr59]

Can't see 'em when yer sitting on it AND, well not something to trifle with...


This^^^

[93legendti]

I don't care what a saddle looks like. I only care how it feels when I am sitting on it. Ymmv.

[CNY rider]

A random comment: In my experience the less padding and gel in the saddle the less likely you are to have numbness issues. What's comfy for the sit bone area is not necessarily good elsewhere.



Agree completely.
I find gel bibs as well as thick padded or gel saddles get very uncomfortable after a bit of time. I've only ever gotten numbness once and it was on a gel saddle.
I'm most confortable on a fine slab of Brooks leather with a nice Rapha bib short on.

[cmg]

Would it be too simple to just put your saddle back where it was before it hurt??????


.

it took 40 comments to get to here? what were the changes?

[MattTuck]

Sometimes the simplest advice is the best. If you can replicate the old fit and it resolves the problems, that would be the first thing to do.

[Dead Man]

Just to reiterate...

No question - it's a fit issue. Too much setback had be riding the nose of the saddle, putting way too much pressure on my perineum. I just was shocked that 20 minutes of it ruined my whole day. But yea, I've needed to go to a zero-setback post for a while, I just haven't had any seriously problems before now.

I'm not looking for solutions to my fit problems here - I'm wondering about peoples experience or knowledge on possible problems with firehose function due to road bike riding... short term or long term. Fit issues or not.

Could be there's not much to it, and what little I've read has been sensationalized internet hype. Hope so!

It's not a matter of just putting the saddle back- the saddle needs to be following the changes in my riding position. The changes I'm making to height and fore/aft position are noticeably increasing my power on climbs.. along with some new pedaling techniques I'm trying (new to me, probably old news to others), I'm really liking where everything is going. Faster times, stronger climbs, more dropping, less getting dropped.... that's what it's all about, right?

I've just never put any concern into this topic (crotch safety) before, and want to get some experiences/opinions/insight from people who actually ride bikes.

[unterhausen]

probably have to look elsewhere to find people that actually ride bikes... oh, wait

I haven't had numbness in my crotch for a couple of years now. It used to happen to me occasionally. Just out of the blue, I'd have a day where my crotch would get numb. Probably had something to do with how I was sitting on the bike. But since then, I've done some stupid things with my position, for example lowering my seat to try to avoid knee problems. Still no issue. I do tend to sit back on the saddle no matter how far back it is.

[beeatnik]

Yo, SMP saddles can look pretty dope. Peeped this bike tonite at my L B S, eses.

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3854/15327498302_2a33682452_b.jpg

It's a full on, wacky-azz Seven 26ererer, part Ti, part Carbon Fiberz. My favorite bike of 2014. So, I said to the owner of the shop, "I didn't know you guys were a Seven dealer." He said, "ya, we have been forever, but no one effing rides Ti anymore." Ha Ha.

[mtechnica]

I didn't read the thread but I'm pretty sure this is the best advice you'll get if your junk is always going numb: Lower your saddle like an inch, make sure it's level, and gradually raise it by 2mm over the course of a few months until you have no numbness and acceptable leg extension. I really think if you're sitting on the saddle right and are wearing good bibs nearly any road saddle from a good brand can be acceptably comfortable with the right adjustment.

I think a lot of people have / are fitted with saddle heights that are unnecessarily high and attempt to ride with more drop and less reach than they need. This is how things seem now compared to the "french fit" positions of years past which are actually better for almost everyone.

[oldpotatoe]

Yo, SMP saddles can look pretty dope. Peeped this bike tonite at my L B S, eses.


It's a full on, wacky-azz Seven 26ererer, part Ti, part Carbon Fiberz. My favorite bike of 2014. So, I said to the owner of the shop, "I didn't know you guys were a Seven dealer." He said, "ya, we have been forever, but no one effing rides Ti anymore." Ha Ha.

Ha ha is right...jokes on him if he 'can't' sell ti..

[jr59]

Ha ha is right...jokes on him if he 'can't' sell ti..

The trick to selling anything is to have it there for them to look at. You Peter, had a demo fleet of Moots for them to ogle and drool over, so you had a chance to sell such bikes. Any LBS that has trouble selling Ti, or steel has the same problems, and will tell you that "nobody wants that", over and over.

[oldpotatoe]

The trick to selling anything is to have it there for them to look at. You Peter, had a demo fleet of Moots for them to ogle and drool over, so you had a chance to sell such bikes. Any LBS that has trouble selling Ti, or steel has the same problems, and will tell you that "nobody wants that", over and over.

yup...demo fleet is the cost of doin' biz..

[uber]

Agree with the other posters; bike fit, bibs and saddle selection seems to cover the variables. The fact that the original poster had more one sided symptoms suggests that one of the pudendal nerves was more affected-more suggestive of position?
If the saddle needs to be replaced by one with a larger cut out, I have had good experiences with the Selle San Marco Mantra and the Selle Italia Superflow. Good luck.

[notoriousdjw]

I had periodic numbness during the first 5 or 10 years that I cycled and had to get out of the saddle every few minutes to keep the tingles at bay. It was a byproduct of having the saddle height 1cm too high and reach 1cm too long. Once I started buying 56cm bikes instead of 57 and lowered the saddle, everything was great. The shorter reach felt great immediately but the lower saddle felt weird for a few rides.

[Ahneida Ride]

first of all - it is a legitimate inquiry, but as a moderator i'm going to ask you to clean up your post and take out all the vulgarity and slang wording. you can certainly ask the question with more appropriate terminology to the wide audience that reads this board. please, and thank you.


+ 1 on that .... this is a family phorum.

[Ahneida Ride]

Now to the question.

I too had similar issues. A Brooks B17 was the solution.

One would think that my original seat would be perfect.
Nice firm padding. 5 miles was limit.

Finding a Seat/Saddle that works may be the most difficult challenge
of the sport.

Wallbike has a 6 month return policy on Brooks.

Ps. I might add that for a Brooks to be comfortable, one has to find the sweet spot. This can take considerable trial and error but is worth the effort.
Even tiny changes on a Brooks can have a dramatic impact.

[giordana93]

the solution is simple: you need to sit on your sit bones.

now the means to that end might take a little while, but you don't have to go smp necessarily. first hone in on flat vs curvy, width, etc. It does sound like you went a little high for saddle height, which can make it worse when you bend over into a more aero position. regardless, there is a saddle out there that should work. but you absolutely need a micro adjust seat post, as a few mm can be the difference between go and no-go.

[Dead Man]

the solution is simple: you need to sit on your sit bones.

now the means to that end might take a little while, but you don't have to go smp necessarily. first hone in on flat vs curvy, width, etc. It does sound like you went a little high for saddle height, which can make it worse when you bend over into a more aero position. regardless, there is a saddle out there that should work. but you absolutely need a micro adjust seat post, as a few mm can be the difference between go and no-go.

Word. I ordered a Thomson zero setback this morning.. Hoping it'll be a 100% fix for me, but am prepared to try a cutout saddle also if not.

Even if it isn't 100%, I know it'll be at least a 3/4ths fix.

[Dead Man]

So nobody has had, or is even aware of anyone having, ED or similar problems from road riding??

That's very encouraging... runs contrary to what internut articles tell you, but should that be a surprise?

[jr59]

So nobody has had, or is even aware of anyone having, ED or similar problems from road riding??

That's very encouraging... runs contrary to what internut articles tell you, but should that be a surprise?

REALLY????

You really think someone on a bike forum is going to disclose that he has ED, and it relates to road riding?

Thats pretty funny stuff right there.:banana:

[Louis]

So nobody has had, or is even aware of anyone having, ED or similar problems from road riding??

Not I personally, but quite a while back a study or an article of some sort came out with a number of horror stories about cycling and it's impact on the plumbing & nerves and their various uses.

[beeatnik]

The B, give Steve at Bike Effect in Santa Monica a call. He's pretty much one of the few dudes in the industry that is willing to talk about the problem candidly and objectively. He keeps up (hahah) on the peer reviewed science (although there isn't much that's considered definitive in the medical literature).

Many in the road/racing world don't want to talk about ED (for obvious reasons). I'm kind of surprised that the ole Jens Voigt Gots 14 Kids cliche hasn't popped up.

[11.4]

When this comes up (pardon the inverse pun, as it were), everybody has a saddle to sell you, or they have a problem with your position. But with what you describe, you may have one of a few different things going on.

First, understand that figuring out saddle pains -- unless you have an obvious boil or chafe mark -- is not something that docs are particularly good at. It's like an overuse injury -- they tell you to stop, or to try changing things, but that way lies long discomfort and frustration.

Second, this is because in at least one instance of the pain you describe, you can simply inflame the sheath around the pudendal nerve and it becomes very painful to ride on. The first few miles may be ok, but when it gets going, it's intolerable and no position or saddle will help. An inflamed pudendal nerve can be caused by a variety of things, as simple as a new pair of bibs that are sized slightly differently and inadvertently put your rear in a slightly different position. It can be the result of too much riding. It can also be -- and I find this the most common -- the result of either lower back stiffness or excessive tightness in the glutes or hamstrings, such that you rotate your hips slightly differently. It isn't just about "whether you're sitting on the nerve or not." You can cause pinching inside your pelvis simply by the position of your hips relative to your spine and the rotation of your hip joints.

If you want to rule out pudendal inflammation, get a doc to give you a prednisone series -- it's an injection in the hip followed by a rapid tapering of oral prednisone for about a week. It's relatively harmless, very cheap, and will tell you if you're dealing with an inflammation issue, plus it will kick back the inflammation so you can ride. Do note that you shouldn't race, at least where you might face a drug test -- a TUE is hard to get for a hefty little bolt of prednisone. Note that you will feel stronger for a few days (that's why it's not allowed in racing after all), but it's not permanent. Getting rid of the inflammation -- if that does it -- may permanently solve your problem (sometimes it doesn't come back) or it may just be temporary, but will at least point you in the direction of what to do next. I'd suggest you ask for this simply for pain relief and to see whether you have an inflamed nerve. It won't make anything shrink or do anything weird, and the brief treatment won't affect your weight or give any side effects of long-term prednisone.

Second, you can have problems that aren't directly pressure-related (i.e., you aren't just sitting on the nerve or other part of you to cause the pain). Imagine sciatica of the ... you know where ... and that's what you might be dealing with. The numbness is part of how your body responds to nerve impingement, and that can be happening if the nerve is trapped inside your hips or at your spine. Those come down to lower back and hip flexibility -- you develop a tight back or tight hamstrings so that you can't rotate your hips both to give you the most strength on the bike and also to keep the nerves safe. If you read up on Piriformis Syndrome, it's a form of sciatica that comes about from the same kind of issue.

I mention this because in the correct position, you actually DO want to be sitting right on the base of your ... [Deleted by Angry Scientist -- haha!]. Seriously. And it doesn't hurt to be sitting on it. And realize that your you know what is actually quite long -- over a foot -- and goes back up into your hips quite a ways, so it's rather hard to avoid sitting on it. It's the nerve you want to protect. And since the nerve runs right alongside, it can sometimes get irritated (especially by a bad saddle) but mostly gets irritated further inside your pelvis. It's time to do LOTS of stretching exercises and also some weight work -- both will strengthen the muscles and create more flexibility in the glutes, hamstrings, various lower back muscles, and various smaller muscles in and around the pelvis. A good sports-oriented PT can work you through the right exercises, but in weights it basically amounts to a back squat. Don't do one-sided squats or lunges at this point -- you may exacerbate the issue. Just do those standard back squats, possibly some Roman chair lifts, and even some isometrics. I'd recommend against machines -- just use free weights because they will do a better job of activating muscles that you may not have been using and didn't realize it.

For the duration of the prednisone run (usually less than a week), stay off the bike and work on weights and stretching instead. Yoga is good. And work on your proprioception -- I find these problems more in people who can't just stand on one leg stably or can't do a squat (just with body weight) while standing on one leg.

If you had a saddle you were comfortable with before this came up, I wouldn't necessary change it. It becomes a chase after the perfect saddle and that's like trying to find a winning lottery ticket. You had a saddle that worked -- don't change too many variables or you'll never know what you did to make it work.

I'd like to say that you should go in to see a fitter who can really analyze your position on the bike (especially hip rotation and lower back position) but in my experience that's less than 1% of the fitter population. If you have one, great. I just see a lot of BS thrown around.

Basically you probably did something to cause a difference, even if it was just picking up a refrigerator the wrong way or went backpacking with a pack that didn't fit you right, or you had a nagging injury and rode through it, but altered your position in the process.

This is hopefully easier and more effective than replacing all the contact points on your bike. It's just important to realize that the cause of the problem isn't the couple square inches that is in hard (pardon the pun) contact with your saddle.

[Ralph]

It can be a lot of things....or combination of things....as noted in above posts.....but it sounds to me like saddle is to high and maybe back to far, stem too long, or seat to bar drop too much. Causing rider to move to far forward on saddle nose and possible rock on top of saddle to reach pedals. One might not even know you are doing this. To high will feel like a strong riding position though. I doubt if solution is a different saddle. Assuming the fit was OK before, somehow the current fit is way off to cause this much trouble. You're not talking about a wear spot from a slightly off fit saddle, you're talking about something serious and dangerous to your health.

[shovelhd]

Trainer video really helps.