On the lookout...

[makoti]

http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/citydesk/2014/08/20/have-you-seen-this-rogue-cyclist/

Bad enough that people can't move over without taking someone down, but then to keep going KNOWING what you caused?

https://www.facebook.com/bikerackdc/photos/a.311070785569843.82862.162897867053803/842132089130374/?type=1&theater

Nice little close-up

[LJohnny]

I actually was riding on that area that day and saw the group of people waiting the ambulance/help. Sad

Once you hit DC where the roads are closed to traffic on weekends and holidays, you have to be really on your tippy-toes because there are lots of inexperienced riders, rollerbladers, dogs w/o a leash, it is a mad house.

I usually ride through very carefully and then go to the adjacent roads that are less popular, like ross.

[distanc3]

wow at least stop and make sure the people are ok...

[54ny77]

i wouldn't call that a rogue cyclist.

i'd call that a dumbass who thought it proper to hand signal to indicate he was turning left, and clipped the front wheel of the guy behind him.

yes, he should have slowed, waited to turn, yadda yadda.

[ultraman6970]

Well just to start, all the riders in that video are people normally (aka never) you won't see me riding with at all. Not that I'm super elite right now or that I'm a poser, but after years racing you learn that there are some people you don't have to ride with EVER!!!. Why you must wonder, just because of crap like this, even group rides are like that in this area a real monkey's B-day party to say the least.

The moron thought that with putting his hand was enough, well normally is but the old dude that got the accident can't handle the bike neither pay enough attention to figure it out he was too close, you can't blame the guy in front of him, the guy riding behind needs to be paying attention all the time (racing rules, PAY F... ATTENTION IN FRONT OF YOU ALL THE TIME). Hope the dude is ok but next time he will pay more attention. The other guys that were behind is for sure that they will pay more attention next time, they were not even close to him and got caught in the accident, that happens when you are not paying attention, they were far back enough to stop IMO. If you guys notice the guy that got the accident put his hand in the brake lever plus he moved his head positively aswell, he knew what he was doing... in other words, he screwed up. You can't blame the guy in the front for stupidity if the other guy doesnt know what is he doing, the other two simply were looking at the stars or something, you dont pay attention you hit the deck specially in sunday rides.

Many people think they are doing the right thing and bam!, some guys are down, because of their Brilliant minds.

Now you know why I ride only with you Martyn :D

[makoti]

Well just to start, all the riders in that video are people normally (aka never) you won't see me riding with at all. Not that I'm super elite right now or that I'm a poser, but after years racing you learn that there are some people you don't have to ride with EVER!!!

That was one of my first thoughts as I was watching it, waiting for the crash to happen.

[Elefantino]

Makes you sort of wish that everyone and everything had escaped unscathed .. except for the Pinarello.

[rustychisel]

used to be known as a clusterf***.

Guy in front, essentially clueless, but how could you not know the guy behind you had crashed.

guys behind: racing on a shared path, more fool them.

guys further back: so witless they couldn't pull aside or miss that?

name and shame for all.

[ultraman6970]

I'm with rusty.

[shovelhd]

What I saw were a bunch of guys riding at their max and stupid stuff happened.

[mcteague]

A paceline on a multi-use path? Bad judgement all around IMO.

Tim

[velomonkey]

Rusty nails it!!!! I've ridden that road thousands of time - it's a death field. I have one scar on my body, it's from one of the parts where cars are allowed so they can get to reserved park area. Dude, pulled right up to the stop sign - looked at me and drove right in front of me - the guy I was riding with ran his tire into the back of my leg.

You gotta be wicked careful on shared areas like that.



used to be known as a clusterf***.

Guy in front, essentially clueless, but how could you not know the guy behind you had crashed.

guys behind: racing on a shared path, more fool them.

guys further back: so witless they couldn't pull aside or miss that?

name and shame for all.

[bikerboy337]

A paceline on a multi-use path? Bad judgement all around IMO.

Tim

My thought exactly...

My wife had a 1/2 marathon last weekend that was partially on a MUT. I was amazed at how many bikers were trying to crank along at 20mph through crouds and police along the MUT and weaving around runners...

I've always felt that MUTs are for nice, slow rides, for walkers, runners, kids, etc. If you plan to be doing over 15mph, its just too dangerous and not worth it... imho

I ride about an 8 mile section of MUT to work sometimes (20 mile total ride), I'll cruise along at 20 mph with no traffic on the trail, but as soon as we see someone, its slow down time... just not worth injuring myself or someone else when all i'm trying to do is get to work...

[djdj]

It is not a MUT, but a two-lane road, portions of which are closed to cars on the weekend. However, because it is closed to cars, there are plenty of pedestrians, skaters, joggers, dogs, etc. Lots of ruts and bad pavement also. Not a good place for a pace line, or trying to set a PR, except maybe during very off hours.

[makoti]

A paceline on a multi-use path? Bad judgement all around IMO.

Tim

It's not a path. It's a road closed to traffic on weekends. It is multi-use, but it's not bike-path narrow.

[Ti Designs]

What I saw were a bunch of guys riding at their max and stupid stuff happened.

The only response here I can agree with in the least...

[redir]

Well just to start, all the riders in that video are people normally (aka never) you won't see me riding with at all. Not that I'm super elite right now or that I'm a poser, but after years racing you learn that there are some people you don't have to ride with EVER!!!. Why you must wonder, just because of crap like this, even group rides are like that in this area a real monkey's B-day party to say the least.

The moron thought that with putting his hand was enough, well normally is but the old dude that got the accident can't handle the bike neither pay enough attention to figure it out he was too close, you can't blame the guy in front of him, the guy riding behind needs to be paying attention all the time (racing rules, PAY F... ATTENTION IN FRONT OF YOU ALL THE TIME). Hope the dude is ok but next time he will pay more attention. The other guys that were behind is for sure that they will pay more attention next time, they were not even close to him and got caught in the accident, that happens when you are not paying attention, they were far back enough to stop IMO. If you guys notice the guy that got the accident put his hand in the brake lever plus he moved his head positively aswell, he knew what he was doing... in other words, he screwed up. You can't blame the guy in the front for stupidity if the other guy doesnt know what is he doing, the other two simply were looking at the stars or something, you dont pay attention you hit the deck specially in sunday rides.

Many people think they are doing the right thing and bam!, some guys are down, because of their Brilliant minds.

Now you know why I ride only with you Martyn :D

The first thing I thought of when that guy came into the frame was... Fred, watch out! Sure enough. Geesh what an a-hole. Yup when I see jumpy riders like I go elsewhere.

[LJohnny]

It's not a path. It's a road closed to traffic on weekends. It is multi-use, but it's not bike-path narrow.

It is not a path, but in practice in some areas it is, due to large pot holes and bad pavement all-around. That area where the accident happened has a bunch of areas where you have to go pretty much in the middle of the lane. Either extreme of the lane has bad pavement.

As others have mentioned, going at full gas there this time of the year on a crowded weekend is indeed a poor choice.

I love riding in that area when I have a day off during the work week and also in the colder months when it is not crowded. It is a lovely area, really.

[Ti Designs]

The first thing I thought of when that guy came into the frame was... Fred, watch out! Sure enough. Geesh what an a-hole. Yup when I see jumpy riders like I go elsewhere.

Please post a video of yourself riding...


The way I see it, there are two sets of riders who you can judge. The ones you can do something about, and the ones you probably can't do anything about. At very least the set of riders you can do something about includes yourself. If everybody focused on their own riding skills, cycling would be great. Is this really that hard a concept to grasp? Be more critical of your own riding than you are of others... With cycling, this alone can solve many of the problems. Cycling skills go a long way in keeping you upright. I go on lots of group rides, many of them have new riders (I coach new riders). There have been plenty of crashes on rides I've been on, for some reason I'm not the one on the ground. I take myself down when I'm off road all the time because I'm pushing the limits of my ability, but I'm damn hard to take down on the road. It could have something to do with the fact that I'm far more critical of my own riding than I am of my riders, and I practice bike handling skills all the time.

[eippo1]

Please post a video of yourself riding...


The way I see it, there are two sets of riders who you can judge. The ones you can do something about, and the ones you probably can't do anything about. At very least the set of riders you can do something about includes yourself. If everybody focused on their own riding skills, cycling would be great. Is this really that hard a concept to grasp? Be more critical of your own riding than you are of others... With cycling, this alone can solve many of the problems. Cycling skills go a long way in keeping you upright. I go on lots of group rides, many of them have new riders (I coach new riders). There have been plenty of crashes on rides I've been on, for some reason I'm not the one on the ground. I take myself down when I'm off road all the time because I'm pushing the limits of my ability, but I'm damn hard to take down on the road. It could have something to do with the fact that I'm far more critical of my own riding than I am of my riders, and I practice bike handling skills all the time.


For some reason all I can think of is the O2 masks in airplanes
http://haveheartmagazine.com/build/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/oxygen-mask1.jpg

But, really, you're right. Not saying I'm a stellar rider, but one thing I learned by doing a series of carnage crits is to take care of yourself first; and if you're solid, you're in a much better position to react and watch out for others.

I remember one crit where I had a solid line in a turn and knew where I wanted to be in the entry and exit when someone came in way too hot on the inside of me. They started to slide out when I reached out and pulled him closer to me by the saddle, redistributing his weight and allowing him to lean into me. He was grateful and very impressed with my ability to stay upright. When we talked later, I said that the big thing is not to panic, protect your front wheel and stay aware of where you want to be -- not where you are or don't want to be.

[zap]

No surprise. Many have broken bones in Rock Creek Park. Shame on the cyclist who caused the crash for not stopping/or having the awareness that a crash happened.

When I pass cyclists in Rock Creek Park I stay wiiiide and if I see potential passing maneuvers, I slow way down to let the move happen then pass. As mentioned, some sections of the road are in bad shape so in effect, it becomes much like a path down the center of the road.

There are many users in the park and not everyone on a bicycle has the skills, the experience and the knowledge to ride safely. One has to ride accordingly.

Oh, and factor in deer.

[redir]

Please post a video of yourself riding...


The way I see it, there are two sets of riders who you can judge. The ones you can do something about, and the ones you probably can't do anything about. At very least the set of riders you can do something about includes yourself. If everybody focused on their own riding skills, cycling would be great. Is this really that hard a concept to grasp? Be more critical of your own riding than you are of others... With cycling, this alone can solve many of the problems. Cycling skills go a long way in keeping you upright. I go on lots of group rides, many of them have new riders (I coach new riders). There have been plenty of crashes on rides I've been on, for some reason I'm not the one on the ground. I take myself down when I'm off road all the time because I'm pushing the limits of my ability, but I'm damn hard to take down on the road. It could have something to do with the fact that I'm far more critical of my own riding than I am of my riders, and I practice bike handling skills all the time.

The ability to judge sketchy riders and avoid them is just another tool to use to keep the rubber side down. In 15 years of racing all the way up to cat 2 I've not ever had one crash in a race that caused me to hit the deck. I have been through several of them and that is 95% luck. Training is another story and those crashes were mostly due to animals in the road or sketchy riders like the one in the video. I'll stick to my guns and avoid them.

[Bostic]

I use a Take A Look mirror on my glasses quite often now. It comes in very handy when in Sacramento and on the American River Bike Trail. The posted speed is 15mph but not many cyclists follow that. I'm a Fred but not a FOAM (Fred on a mission) and I've witnessed several bike wrecks on that trail when riders are doing their best KOM segment pace.

[ultraman6970]

I somehow Agree with Ti Design, havent get an accident like in 25 years, and the few I got before were racing so pretty much you know what to do. As for teaching other people you can't fix stupid, specially riding a bike. Martyn, a forumite I ride with time to time started noticing all the dumb ass things people does and is because somebody told them to act like that. I do a bunch of stuff backwards of what people advice because that's how the racing world works and kept me safe for the last 25 years.

Have so much examples like the sucker that is listening music full blast and dancing over the bike, the moron that dont look back before doing a U turn, the smarty pants that spit at the left side of the road, the idiots that dont stop in the stop signs or red lights, the guy that can't keep the darn bike still but swings around the road. The 2 guys that have to use the whole wide of the street or both sides of the trail instead of using half of it, add that a woobly rider and makes sense why car drivers dont give a damm. The dog walker that is at the left side of the road and the dog with the leash at the right side of the road and the funny thing is that if you even dare to tell something to any of those eisteins you are the one that is wrong.

With that there's nothing else you can do and just let them be. In the case of this dude everybody is looking for, look at the video, he knew what the other guy was going to do, pressed the brakes, moved his head to let the other guy know and he misjudged the distance... not paying attention, the two guys in the back were looking at the stars, thats nobody's fault but themselves too. Easier to blame somebody else than themselves specially in dumb ass accidents like this one.

[djdj]

If I'm not mistaken, this crash occurred just shy of a 4-way stop intersection, so none of them should have been going full tilt there anyway (but appear to be doing so), but I'm sorry someone got hurt.

[FastforaSlowGuy]

So much here I don't get:

1. Protect your front wheel.
2. Is that supposed to be a paceline? I see one person riding sorta behind someone else and sorta to the side. Are they trying to ride together or is the guy in grey passing another rider? It looks like the guy in front is signaling that he plans to take a gap that opened up, but I can't tell. Looks like a group ride I wouldn't want to be on.
3. That's a pretty sudden move to the left to pull in a group setting. He's either squirrely or an ass.
4. Protect your front wheel.
5. There's no way the guy in front doesn't see/hear the guy behind hit the deck. Not stopping is a schmuck move.
6. I know Beach Drive and used to ride on it when I lived in DC. Yeah, it's a road, but there's no way I'd go tearing around there at anything over a casual spin pace. Plenty of runners and walkers with strollers out there, and I'm not going to weave past a mom and her infant at 22 mph.
7. Protect your damn front wheel.

[aramis]

1. Protect your front wheel.
7. Protect your damn front wheel.

:hello:

And like everyone else said that looked like a terrible place to be doing whatever they were doing, with a bunch of cyclists that aren't part of your group.

[Dead Man]

What kind of liability are we talking about in a situation like this? It's not a race (that I can tell anyway), it's vehicles out on the road, colliding, with degrees of fault. Seems like tort, to me.

In Oregon, the entirety of the vehicle code is applied to bikes, as "vehicles." "Failure to perform duty of a driver" AKA, hit-and-run, would obviously apply here. Is it not like that elsewhere?

[Mark McM]

What kind of liability are we talking about in a situation like this? It's not a race (that I can tell anyway), it's vehicles out on the road, colliding, with degrees of fault. Seems like tort, to me.

In Oregon, the entirety of the vehicle code is applied to bikes, as "vehicles." "Failure to perform duty of a driver" AKA, hit-and-run, would obviously apply here. Is it not like that elsewhere?

We had a case in my cycling club where a rider crashed in a paceline on a club ride and attempted to sue another rider. After a few letters were exchanged between lawyers, nothing ever came of it, because no clear fault could be established.

If you're riding in a paceline, you're already violating due care by following too closely, so you're already partially to blame for anything that goes wrong. I agree with Ed, that first line of responsibility for their own safety is themselves and their own skills.

That being said, one thing I did notice in the video is that rider that crosses from left to right, taking out the following rider's front wheel, actually does look around behind him, both before and after the crash (not to mention that he has a rearview mirror on his glasses). Regardless of who is ultimately to blame for the crash, what kind of jerk is aware of making contact with another rider who subsequently goes down and doesn't stop to see if they are okay?

[LJohnny]

If I'm not mistaken, this crash occurred just shy of a 4-way stop intersection, so none of them should have been going full tilt there anyway (but appear to be doing so), but I'm sorry someone got hurt.

Not that close, it happened well before the underpass of Military Rd.

[R2D2]

So much here I don't get:

1. Protect your front wheel.
2. Is that supposed to be a paceline? I see one person riding sorta behind someone else and sorta to the side. Are they trying to ride together or is the guy in grey passing another rider? It looks like the guy in front is signaling that he plans to take a gap that opened up, but I can't tell. Looks like a group ride I wouldn't want to be on.
3. That's a pretty sudden move to the left to pull in a group setting. He's either squirrely or an ass.
4. Protect your front wheel.
5. There's no way the guy in front doesn't see/hear the guy behind hit the deck. Not stopping is a schmuck move.
6. I know Beach Drive and used to ride on it when I lived in DC. Yeah, it's a road, but there's no way I'd go tearing around there at anything over a casual spin pace. Plenty of runners and walkers with strollers out there, and I'm not going to weave past a mom and her infant at 22 mph.
7. Protect your damn front wheel.

+1
The rider who went down did say "Go ahead. Go ahead."
But the other guy did make some squirely movements.

I've seen this stuff too often.
Someone causes a crash and just rides away.

[Bob Ross]

The moron thought that with putting his hand was enough, well normally is

I like to remind the cyclists I coach that hand signals at best convey what your intentions are; you should never expect them to tell the other person what they should do.

[ultraman6970]

This is when common sense has to kick in too, you know. Rule #1... pay f... attention.

I like to remind the cyclists I coach that hand signals at best convey what your intentions are; you should never expect them to tell the other person what they should do.

[mcteague]

It's not a path. It's a road closed to traffic on weekends. It is multi-use, but it's not bike-path narrow.

Semantics. The end result is the same.

Tim

[Black Dog]

Please post a video of yourself riding...


The way I see it, there are two sets of riders who you can judge. The ones you can do something about, and the ones you probably can't do anything about. At very least the set of riders you can do something about includes yourself. If everybody focused on their own riding skills, cycling would be great. Is this really that hard a concept to grasp? Be more critical of your own riding than you are of others... With cycling, this alone can solve many of the problems. Cycling skills go a long way in keeping you upright. I go on lots of group rides, many of them have new riders (I coach new riders). There have been plenty of crashes on rides I've been on, for some reason I'm not the one on the ground. I take myself down when I'm off road all the time because I'm pushing the limits of my ability, but I'm damn hard to take down on the road. It could have something to do with the fact that I'm far more critical of my own riding than I am of my riders, and I practice bike handling skills all the time.


This is so very very true. I have been riding for almost 30 years including many years of elite racing and I am still work on the basics (handling skills every year). So few newer riders ever do this. So few people think that cycling involves a skill set and technique….:confused:

[tylerbick]

Is it just me, or does the fork on the Pinarello look bent as hell?