So let me get this straight......

[David Kirk]

You wait all year for the Tour to come to town or to be able to take time off the go see it in person and you stand by the side of the road waiting for the race to come by and when it finally does......for the very few seconds that it is passing right by you..........you take a photo of yourself getting in the way of the guys you supposedly came to see in the first place? Is that right?

Are 'we' so self absorbed at this point that 'we' go faraway places to be near rare things just so we can take a photo of ourselves being self absorbed?

I feel like I'm an old curmudgeon saying the above but I am really mystified by this.

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/07/news/peloton-fans-selfies_334784


dave

[OtayBW]

You wait all year for the Tour to come to town or to be able to take time off the go see it in person and you stand by the side of the road waiting for the race to come by and when it finally does......for the very few seconds that it is passing right by you..........you take a photo of yourself getting in the way of the guys you supposedly came to see in the first place? Is that right?
Yes - that's correct. Except I think you forgot the poking, pushing, screaming, and all other means of obnoxious, self-serving behavior that serves to distract these guys from their efforts.

Unbelievable....

[8aaron8]

A sign of a declining society...I've read 1 in 25 Americans is considered to be a sociopath. In my neck of the woods this is certainly the case. I can't tell you the lack of empathy I see amongst my community and the egocentrism that takes its place....

[MadRocketSci]

your real life is immaterial in relation to what you can post on FB

[RedRider]

On the positive side... the English crowds, mostly peaceful, have been huge and encouraging to the riders.
I do agree that the selfie/must update Facebook thing is absurd.

[CaliFly]

your real life is immaterial in relation to what you can post on FB


Indeed.

http://vimeo.com/97115097

[David Kirk]

On the positive side... the English crowds, mostly peaceful, have been huge and encouraging to the riders.
I do agree that the selfie/must update Facebook thing is absurd.

I agree..........the English crowds were shockingly large in the best way. It even looked like many of them were experiencing it directly with their own eyes and not 'watching' the race through a view finder.

I've never been to a Grand Tour and used to be interested in going. At this point the crowds and their behavior have me much less enthusiastic. I'll guess I'll need to stay at home, take some selfies and then photoshop them into the crowd getting in the rider's way. You know....now that I say that it seems that could be the solution. If EVERYONE stayed home and shopped them selves into the crowd the riders would have room to go up the hill.

You're welcome.

dave

[8aaron8]

your real life is immaterial in relation to what you can post on fb

+1

[victoryfactory]

Yes Dave. And don't forget diving for discarded bottles and bags.
I guess it could be partly forgiven. They are excited.
I've selfied myself but not when
it's a safety hazard. These people want to share. They also are the
ones who spend hours on the phone every day. You see them in the
supermarket describing the spots on the lettuce to somebody over
the phone. Just because you have that technology, you don't have to
use it every waking hour!
Where's your peace?
In the words of Baba Ram Das:
Be Here Now

VF

[bikser]

I'm not into selfies or FB or any of that. But, I will say from having been to numerous big races such as the TdF I realized that by taking pictures I miss the actual race. I've actually refrained the last few years at events just so I can actually see the race with my own eyes. The crowds may be a nuisance at times to the riders, but it's a great place to be. A great way to spend the day.

[guyintense]

That's one my favorites,a fellow stands on the side of the road all day to watch the peloton ride by and he misses the show because he's chasing a thrown water bottle.

[David Kirk]

I'm not into selfies or FB or any of that. But, I will say from having been to numerous big races such as the TdF I realized that by taking pictures I miss the actual race. I've actually refrained the last few years at events just so I can actually see the race with my own eyes. The crowds may be a nuisance at times to the riders, but it's a great place to be. A great way to spend the day.

I had my city dwelling brother-in-law visit a few years back and while he was here we had some muledeer come into the yard. We hardly look up as they live right here and we see them most days but the brother looked out the window and saw the deer and then instead of looking at them and being there in the moment 'with' them he ran for the phone. He got it and they had moved further from the house making them hard to get a snap of but he still watched them through the phone. It's like he couldn't REALLY see or experience them without the phone as his eyes.

I'll bet if I asked him about it he wouldn't remember any of it but somewhere in the bowels of that phone are his wonderful memories of the wildlife in a suburban backyard in Montana.

dave

[Hindmost]

It hadn't occurred to me that there could be another spectator behavior as obnoxious at putting on a costume and running along side and stumbling into the riders.

[majorpat]

If you are busy dorking around with your smartphone/camera to get the best shot, aren't you then missing the spectacle actually passing by? Might just be me, but I would rather have the memory of standing at the roadside and taking it all in than a half assed, out of focus shot of me mugging it up with the race in the background...

[Grant McLean]

i forgot my phone...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINa46HeWg8

[Kirk Pacenti]

I had my city dwelling brother-in-law visit a few years back and while he was here we had some muledeer come into the yard. We hardly look up as they live right here and we see them most days but the brother looked out the window and saw the deer and then instead of looking at them and being there in the moment 'with' them he ran for the phone. He got it and they had moved further from the house making them hard to get a snap of but he still watched them through the phone. It's like he couldn't REALLY see or experience them without the phone as his eyes.

I'll bet if I asked him about it he wouldn't remember any of it but somewhere in the bowels of that phone are his wonderful memories of the wildlife in a suburban backyard in Montana.

dave


Fwiw, I recently watched a proud dad pedaling behind his child... upright, no handed, iPad in front of his face recording the whole thing.

Last summer saw someone assuming a similar position texting as they pedaled aimlessly down the trail.

???

KP

[MadRocketSci]

but if you don't get that stuff captured on your phone/ipad/gopro, all those moments will be lost, in time...like...tears, in the rain.

[MadRocketSci]

Fwiw, I recently watched a proud dad pedaling behind his child... upright, no handed, iPad in front of his face recording the whole thing.

Last summer saw someone assuming a similar position texting as they pedaled aimlessly down the trail.

???

KP

i've posted this before and not afraid to post this again

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/19/louis-ck-smartphone-kids_n_3952105.html

Warning, language NSFW

[fiamme red]

I'd love to see a racer give one of those idiots a good kick, in the style of Bart Wellens.

https://i0.wp.com/www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/races05/cross05/druivencross-thekick.jpg

[rugbysecondrow]

It is all in good fun. How many times have folks posted photos of their epic rides on here, cools shtuff or evening cycling selfies or shadow selfies. People are excited, they want to share their excitement with others. Instant access to a camera means we have devalued the photograph, meaning everything is now photoworthy...even ourselves. It is a natural evolution from blogging, to status updates, tweets, instagram shots. Just think if these selfies and candid shots included a Kirk Framworks. :)

[texbike]

It hadn't occurred to me that there could be another spectator behavior as obnoxious at putting on a costume and running along side and stumbling into the riders.

At least there's an element of creativity with the crazy costumes...

i forgot my phone...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINa46HeWg8

Great video! That girl is cute!

Guess I should get off the forum now and go live some life for a few hours.

Cheers,

Texbike

[tiretrax]

I think the english are getting a bums rush for what's normal on the mountains stages - where people camp and drink for days while staking their location. Rewatch a stage on Alpe d' Huez, for instance. People think of the brits as polite and standing in cues. They forget they drink beer and ale like fiends and have riots at soccer matches. To make matters worse, the spectators are penned in on most of those roads by the dry stone walls 2 feet off the narrow roads. I've driven on them, and it was claustrophobic with one car and no spectators.

That said, I have often thought it ridiculous that the riders have to pass through that gantlet with no protection from the drunken masses. It's a wonder more riders haven't been knocked off their bikes or impeded. Cycling is unique in the lack of separation, and people are abusing that.

I agree that folks are too self absorbed, especially with posting their lives on facebook. They are uncaring about their impact on others, so they text and drive, drink and drive, etc. Selfish and self entitled so that they demand services but don't want to pay for them.

[CaliFly]

I had my city dwelling brother-in-law visit a few years back and while he was here we had some muledeer come into the yard. We hardly look up as they live right here and we see them most days but the brother looked out the window and saw the deer and then instead of looking at them and being there in the moment 'with' them he ran for the phone. He got it and they had moved further from the house making them hard to get a snap of but he still watched them through the phone. It's like he couldn't REALLY see or experience them without the phone as his eyes.

I'll bet if I asked him about it he wouldn't remember any of it but somewhere in the bowels of that phone are his wonderful memories of the wildlife in a suburban backyard in Montana.

dave

I just had a conversation with a colleague who introduced me to the term "mediated experience". Through this filter, a person is able to buffer themselves from any harshness of the scene. The danger being that direct experiences start to feel "less real".

Put the phones down and live, people!
http://ispr.info/2011/05/27/the-effects-of-technology-mediated-experience-rediscovering-the-real-world/

[jlwdm]

...

I've never been to a Grand Tour and used to be interested in going. At this point the crowds and their behavior have me much less enthusiastic...

dave

Dave,

I went on a 14 day bicycle tour at the 2001 Tour de France and think that going to the Tour is an experience every serious cyclist should do once.

Forget the photos, it was the experience that made it special and unforgettable.

Jeff

[Dromen]

It is all in good fun. How many times have folks posted photos of their epic rides on here, cools shtuff or evening cycling selfies or shadow selfies. People are excited, they want to share their excitement with others. Instant access to a camera means we have devalued the photograph, meaning everything is not photoworthy...even ourselves. It is a natural evolution from blogging, to status updates, tweets, instagram shots. Just think if these selfies and candid shots included a Kirk Framworks. :)

Saw a gentlemen sketching his bike in front of a piece of art in full kit and helmet on the Chicago lake front a couple weeks ago. Didn't think much about it until i was on the return portion of ride and he was still there sketching. Pulled over to watch a few minutes and didn't take a pic or vid.

[Ahneida Ride]

A sign of a declining society...I've read 1 in 25 Americans is considered to be a sociopath. In my neck of the woods this is certainly the case. I can't tell you the lack of empathy I see amongst my community and the ego-centrism that takes its place....

Of the seven deadly sins, Pride I recall is the most dangerous.

[cbresciani]

Some people are just idiots, besides you can't fix stupid!

Could you imagine training as hard as these guys do for the tour and then have some a$$hat take you out... yeah I'd be pissed!

[BumbleBeeDave]

A sign of a declining society...I've read 1 in 25 Americans is considered to be a sociopath. In my neck of the woods this is certainly the case. I can't tell you the lack of empathy I see amongst my community and the egocentrism that takes its place....

Just go out around town--just about any town these days--and see how many people do things that clearly indicate they think "the rules" apply to everybody EXCEPT them. Parking in handicapped reserve spots . . . cutting in lines . . . just walking out into the street and expecting everybody to stop for you . . . or worse, walking down the street IN the street and expecting everybody to go around you.

I used to think it's just me, just because I'm becoming an old codger. But no more. It really IS worse.

BBD

[oldpotatoe]

but if you don't get that stuff captured on your phone/ipad/gopro, all those moments will be lost, in time...like...tears, in the rain.

Best.....sci-fi......movie......ever.

[mcteague]

Best.....sci-fi......movie......ever.

No, that would be 2001: A Space Odyssey but Blade Runner is right up there.

Tim

[oldpotatoe]

No, that would be 2001: A Space Odyssey but Blade Runner is right up there.

Tim

Didja know Rutger Hauer's speech was an ad-lib? He wrote it himself..'I've seen things 'you people' wouldn't believe', "attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion"...geezz, great stuff.

'Time to die'..still gives me chills.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTzA_xesrL8

Sorry for the drift....

[Bob Ross]

Are 'we' so self absorbed at this point that 'we' go faraway places to be near rare things just so we can take a photo of ourselves being self absorbed?

I love you man.

[C50]

I don't think anyone could have expected the crowds to turnout like they did in the first few days. Everyone expected big crowds but what I saw on TV this year was impressive from just the sheer numbers of people on the roadside. I will have to say that with as much drinking and partying and waiting around that happens as you are on the side of the road waiting for the race to come by I have to say that being in the crowd at the Tour was the best, most fun, polite large crowd group of people I have ever been in at a sporting event. And this includes being on Alp d'Huez. The whole ridiculous trend of selfie tacking aside I would rather be on the roadside at the Tour or World Championships then sitting in a stadium at an NFL game.

After coming back from the Tour one year the next sporting event I went to was NFL game and the amount of belligerent, drunk, foul mouthed, rude and just generally unpleasant people in the stands was in sharp contrast to the fun festival atmosphere involving hundreds of thousands of more people on the side of the road in France. And I don't think it is necessarily a cultural difference between the USA and Europe. I experienced the same thing watching the Olympic road race in Atlanta and the World Championships in Canada.

So my recommendation is that if you ever get a chance to be a part of a grand tour I highly recommend it because as up close coverage as you can get on TV there is nothing like the experience of being on the race watching and taking in the whole experience.

[redir]

I'm not into selfies or FB or any of that. But, I will say from having been to numerous big races such as the TdF I realized that by taking pictures I miss the actual race. I've actually refrained the last few years at events just so I can actually see the race with my own eyes. The crowds may be a nuisance at times to the riders, but it's a great place to be. A great way to spend the day.

I totally agree and to some extent it drives my wife crazy. We went to Portugal last winter and I told her why bother taking all these pictures of all these old beautiful buildings when they are already taken and available for free on line and probably from a pro or at least a very good hobby photographer? I mean I like pics of us but all these pics of buildings and things like that just get transferred to a hard drive backed up in the cloud and sit there forever doing nothing.

I've never taken a selfie in my life, don't see the point. Probably break the camera lens anyway :D

[soulspinner]

I love you man.

Dont know about that, but would like to have a brewski with him.............

[bikinchris]

Didja know Rutger Hauer's speech was an ad-lib? He wrote it himself..'I've seen things 'you people' wouldn't believe', "attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion"...geezz, great stuff.

'Time to die'..still gives me chills.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTzA_xesrL8

Sorry for the drift....

Where is the shoulder of Orion? Betelgeuse or Bellatrix? One is 245 and the other is 642 light years away. They are only in line when viewed from Earth, so there isn't a "shoulder" to speak of in reality.

On another hand as bad a problem as I have with selfies, I have a far larger problem with the drunken idiots who run alongside the riders. I say tazer them, tie them up and leave them on the side of the road until an hour or so after everyone else has left.

[bikinchris]

I think the english are getting a bums rush for what's normal on the mountains stages - where people camp and drink for days while staking their location. Rewatch a stage on Alpe d' Huez, for instance. People think of the brits as polite and standing in cues. They forget they drink beer and ale like fiends and have riots at soccer matches. To make matters worse, the spectators are penned in on most of those roads by the dry stone walls 2 feet off the narrow roads. I've driven on them, and it was claustrophobic with one car and no spectators.

That said, I have often thought it ridiculous that the riders have to pass through that gantlet with no protection from the drunken masses. It's a wonder more riders haven't been knocked off their bikes or impeded. Cycling is unique in the lack of separation, and people are abusing that.

I agree that folks are too self absorbed, especially with posting their lives on facebook. They are uncaring about their impact on others, so they text and drive, drink and drive, etc. Selfish and self entitled so that they demand services but don't want to pay for them.

On mountain stages in the Alps, riders are going by single file. Here, the terrain wasn't hard enough to stretch out the peleton and the crowds had room to move back, but didn't. I am happy they had shown up and were enthusiastic. I wish they stood back. They would have seen just as well.

Like when we went to the TdF finish and bought seats on the grand stands. Everyone could see fine. Until the lower rows got excited and stood up. Why? I don't know. Now that seat I paid for is being unused because I can't see sitting down.

[mcteague]

Didja know Rutger Hauer's speech was an ad-lib? He wrote it himself..'I've seen things 'you people' wouldn't believe', "attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion"...geezz, great stuff.

'Time to die'..still gives me chills.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTzA_xesrL8

Sorry for the drift....

LOVE that speech. I did know the back story. Sort of like Robert Shaw adding key bits to his Indianapolis story for Jaws.

Just heard a story on NPR (http://www.npr.org/2014/07/08/329731479/richard-dreyfus-children-jaws-makes-no-sense) with the Dreyfus kids. Seems lots of people think Richard Dreyfus said the famous "you're gonna need a bigger boat" line that Roy Scheider ad-libed.

Tim

[MadRocketSci]

Where is the shoulder of Orion? Betelgeuse or Bellatrix? One is 245 and the other is 642 light years away. They are only in line when viewed from Earth, so there isn't a "shoulder" to speak of in reality.


Little known fact, the "shoulder of Orion" is short for "Shoulder of Orion Timeshare Community," which is guarded by the Tannhauser gate, where the lone agent checks to see if incoming steam powered spacecraft have had their occupant's ID's called in and put on the admit list for that week. Seems the owners got a bit unruly, and armed themselves with top of the line Tyrell Industries modified attack space hummers over increased zero-g golf fees resulting in a crack squad of Nexus 6 skin jobs being called in to "retire" the owners. With all the newly opened vacancies in the community, however, a new marketing campaign had to be hastily conceived using floating blimps, space geishas themes, and offworldhotwire.com to entice the scummy ground dwellers to bid for unnamed units without having to draw negative publicity.

This backstory was part of the original's Deckard voiceover but didn't survive final edit because Ridley Scott couldn't obtain the rights to use the name Tannhauser gate from the estate of Richard Wagner. Rutger Hauer managed to squeeze one reference in there but no one saw the movie in 1982 so no one bothered to remove it.

[gary135r]

I agree..........the English crowds were shockingly large in the best way. It even looked like many of them were experiencing it directly with their own eyes and not 'watching' the race through a view finder.

I've never been to a Grand Tour and used to be interested in going. At this point the crowds and their behavior have me much less enthusiastic. I'll guess I'll need to stay at home, take some selfies and then photoshop them into the crowd getting in the rider's way. You know....now that I say that it seems that could be the solution. If EVERYONE stayed home and shopped them selves into the crowd the riders would have room to go up the hill.

You're welcome.

dave

Don't give up. Went to 3 stages of the Vuelta in Holland and Belgium back in 2009 during a Military deployment. The crowds were great and respectful. Belgium was extra special as the the stage was on the classic Liege route and it was a weekday, raining of course, hanging with the locals was a memory of a lifetime.

[Scuzzer]

I've never been to a Grand Tour and used to be interested in going. At this point the crowds and their behavior have me much less enthusiastic.

You can't let a handful of jerks keep you away. I went to my first TdF stage in 1982 and have seen a bunch of them since and I can barely remember the few douchebags I encountered but I certainly have plenty of great memories of the events on the road and the folks I met along it.

Heck, I was on top of Huez for the time trial stage in 2004 and although the porta potties were overflowing it was still an incredible time. Supposedly the jerks were out in force at that stage but I never encountered one the entire time I was there. Folks actually stepped aside so my 4 year old daughter could stand at the rail and see the riders pass and were great to me with my 1 year old son on my shoulders.