My Butt Hurts after 3 hours --> New Saddle?

[metalheart]

The past six months I have been riding more miles than in the past. My rides are not more in the 3-4 hour range than in the 2-3 hours I have done the past few years. As saddle time has increased, so has my discomfort in the saddle. I wear decent bibs for longer rides (Rapha Classics or Desoto 400 mile) and I experience the same discomfort with either pair. Before the saddle time increase, I seldom experienced any discomfort while or after riding.

My current saddle in a San Marco Regal and I have ridden it for about three years. My guess is that it works fine for me for less than 3 hour rides, but something happens after 3 hours and the discomfort sets in. The increased rides have been in the past 3-4 months (3-4 times a week) , so I think I should have enough saddle time at that duration to know if it is just my butt getting used to increased miles/time.

So, my guess is that a different and maybe more padded saddle might help since the Regal seems plenty wide enough.

Any ideas?

[eddief]

You don't really say much about the specifics. Do you use the cream? Once before getting on and then every 20 or so miles for my 4 hours today. I think if a saddle is good for as long as 3 hours, then the saddle is mostly ok. But think about the rubbing and sweaty parts. Lube-ify. Maybe an answer.

[metalheart]

I do use cream before a ride, DZ nuts, buttonhole, Bag Balm, all depending on the conditions. I have not thought about reapplying during a ride, but it is worth a try. I now have these point specific callouses where my sit bones meet the saddle so I can see that maybe there is some need for reapplication during a longer ride. Good thought, thanks.

[Ralph]

Creams don't do much for me. I just use vasoline. But I have a feeling your body is changing, and what you could ride in past, you no longer can. And you may find everyone's latest greatest just won't work for you. You may just have to find a seat that fits with some (lots) of padding under those sit bones. After using them for many years, I gave up on Regals long ago for the reason you describe.

[mike p]

I really have no use for creams of any kind, creams were popular when real chamois was still in use. To me it's a matter of finding the right saddle. Not just a good quality saddle but a good quality saddle that suites you. That's why so many people that have a saddle they love have many spares. Once you've got your saddle choice worked out it's all about time in the saddle, another words HTFU :-).
Two other quick tips. If your over weight it's not helping and extra padding is seldom the answer.

Mike

[eddief]

My guess is you talk to 100 cyclists, 50 are using cream with today's shorts.


I really have no use for creams of any kind, creams were popular when real chamois was still in use. To me it's a matter of finding the right saddle. Not just a good quality saddle but a good quality saddle that suites you. That's why so many people that have a saddle they love have many spares. Once you've got your saddle choice worked out it's all about time in the saddle, another words HTFU :-).
Two other quick tips. If your over weight it's not helping and extra padding is seldom the answer.

Mike

[eddief]

Then the reason is magnified a bunch 20 miles in. Not saying lube is the answer, just saying it's an easy thing to try. I just accept after a couple of hours, my saddle is going to feel like I have been sitting on it for a couple of hours. Reapply and then chafe is alleviated. There is a difference between chafe and having your butt hurt. Which is it?

I use a small Go Tubb container. Fill it with whatever. Pop in a jersey pocket:

http://www.humangear.com/gotubb/

These are good too:

http://www.humangear.com/gotoob/

I do use cream before a ride, DZ nuts, buttonhole, Bag Balm, all depending on the conditions. I have not thought about reapplying during a ride, but it is worth a try. I now have these point specific callouses where my sit bones meet the saddle so I can see that maybe there is some need for reapplication during a longer ride. Good thought, thanks.

[Ralph]

We get a lot of saddle posts on here.

My Orthopedic Doc, who is a cyclist......says over time our butt muscles lose some of their ability to hold us up, our bones degenerate some in the coccyx area, and aging just takes it's natural course. I know what I could sit on years ago, I no longer can. My sit bones just can't take a hard saddle any more. Have no idea if general aging has anything to do with your discomfort. Upping your miles may have something to do with it. What you could tolerate in past, you no longer can. We're heard that story before. I tried all the popular saddles....no luck. Specialized were the worst for me. Local bike has a saddle tryout program, and I got measured, and tried them all. Do Ok on a Terry Fly Ti.....it's got padding under my sit bones and is narrow between the legs. There are other saddle like that. Maybe a LBS has a saddle program.

[pbarry]

Try a new/modern saddle with similar width. [The need to re-apply cream just amplifies a reason to examine the source of discomfort]. You've got plenty of miles in, so your a** is hardened.

[Ken Robb]

Try standing to pedal every few minutes to improve circulation around your lower regions. I have to remind myself to do this because I am naturally a "sit-down-and-grind" kind of rider.

[VTCaraco]

Try standing to pedal every few minutes to improve circulation around your lower regions. I have to remind myself to do this because I am naturally a "sit-down-and-grind kind of rider.

I found bag balm to help a whole bunch ~ just one application, however. But 2+ hours and I'm sore. Not "holy-cow get me off of this thing", but clearly aware of my position.
I do, however, have a much better time managing things when I make it a point to shift around a little. Fortunately, God gave VT it's fair share of hills, so unless I'm pedaling away from home, I have reason to pop up and down now and then to fight the good fight against gravity :banana:

[Louis]

There's a massive difference between the various chamois used in shorts. You might try a few different mid to high-end shorts to see if that helps. (Be sure before buying that the chamois are indeed different.)

[Peter P.]

Listen to Ralph's orthopedic doc; we age, we change, and so will our saddle preferences. More padding is what you need, not likely a different shape.

In order to minimize your cash outlay while searching for a new saddle, I'd recommend you buy off eBay. That way if you don't like the saddle you purchase, your cash loss is less and you can probably turn it around on eBay as well.

[dekindy]

Have you tried experimenting with saddle fore/aft, angle or height? Sometimes twisting the saddle off center slightly can help.

Had a fitter try to troubleshoot?

You might want to watch some Cobb saddle videos for more information and read Steve Hogg's bike fitting tips.

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

...

[Louis]

My current saddle in a San Marco Regal and I have ridden it for about three years.

Did you buy the saddle new or used? They do get old after a while and the padding eventually gets soft. You might want to compare (by pressing with your thumbs) your saddle to a new Regal.

I now use Regals because the Selle Italia model that used to be be perfect for me is no longer in production, but after a few years those would go bad and I'd have to toss them. the difference between an old painful one and a new one was relatively easy to detect by just pushing down in the sit-bone area.

[pbarry]

I'm just trying to wrap my head around a product called bag balm.

Never use cream, after the first few long rides of the season, the soreness seems to lessen.

Bag Balm used to be a dairy-industry-only secret. Saved many a teet before it gained wider usage.

[Charles M]

Go see a fitter that has a Gebiomized saddle pressure sensing pad...


You'll go through a few years of trial and error inside an hour and wind up with not only the saddle that works, but an understanding of why it works for future ref...

[wallymann]

this happened to me as i've gotten older. same saddles and same bibs no longer worked for me on longer or multi-day rides. fine for 2-3 hours, but beyond that, mega soft-tissue soreness right under the sit bones.

the only thing that helped was going to a gel-equipped chamois. i keep my non-gel bibs in the basement for trainer-use only, the gel bibs are all i use on the road now -- makes a HUGE difference. but for me my gel chamois cant be a big diaper like thing, i found the santini bibs gel pads are still trim with a race-ready fit and agree with my anatomy while providing the gel protection for my sit-bones.

btw...i was once the young know-it-all cyclist that sneered at old dudes and swore i'd never use: a) a cut-out saddle or b) gel chamois pads. 25 years later i've become that old guy and swear by both (a) and (b).

[Saxon]

I'm curios...has anyone out here had a saddle that started to become uncomfortable after around four hours, switched to a different saddle, and then could instantly ride for thirteen hours without any saddle discomfort whatsoever? Sounds like a tall tale to me.

[aaronka]

I think it's worth experimenting with saddles widths/densities to ensure you've got the best option. I've noticed significant differences between my Fizik, Specialized and Ritchey saddles.

[tigoat]

Don't think it is a saddle problem. I ride a back-to-back century almost every other week so I have some experience with endurance riding pains all over my body. The padding in your shorts might be the problem assuming the saddle works and fitting is not an issue. I have more than 10 pairs of tights to rotate and these 10 pairs were screened from 20+ pairs so needless to say I spend a lot of money buying cycling pants and screen them out to see which one works and which one doesn't. Try a new pair of pants to see if it will make a difference.

[wallymann]

I'm curios...has anyone out here had a saddle that started to become uncomfortable after around four hours, switched to a different saddle, and then could instantly ride for thirteen hours without any saddle discomfort whatsoever? Sounds like a tall tale to me.

i think that's a fantasy. lots of pressure and movement on a very small surface-area. add in a pair of schweddy balls getting juggled around, there's no way anyone can be totally free of discomfort.

[buddybikes]

Saddles do wear out after 8K miles or so, does it deform in the middle compared to a new model of the same thing?

Saddle issue may also not actually be a butt problem but tight muscles -- piriformis, glutes, hamstrings

If you are having chaffing, another product to try is body glide anti chafe (looks like deodoran) or sprinkle gold bond down there

[shovelhd]

Do you shift positions often during the ride? Tops, bends, hoods, drops? Or do you stay in the same position the whole time? Have you made any fitting changes lately?

I experience the same thing at around the same time, but I ride a flat racing saddle (Toupe) because it's the perfect saddle for me for racing. It has very little padding. It is designed for riding in an aggressive position with very little weight on the saddle. So when I take long easy rides in a more upright position, saddle pressure increases and I get sore after 3-4 hours. I expect that.

[rccardr]

I rode Regals for years but this year retired and am putting a lot more miles on the bikes than before. Now a Regal is only good for up to 30 miles, then it becomes very uncomfortable. Tried a bunch of other saddles and found several that work for long distance (for me, a ProLogic) and mid distance (super course Concours).

Combination of age and increased saddle time are to blame, I think.

[ultraman6970]

Maybe age is catching up with you, did you try lowering the saddle a tiny bit??

By the way is the bones or the crotch ball sack area what is bothering you?

[Tandem Rider]

BID I rode Rolls saddles. It was about 25 hours per week, never a problem. Now I mostly ride a Toupe and I'm lucky to hit 10 hours per week on a good year. I find that I do get sore a lot sooner on the Toupe on long rides.

I think that riding more aggressively helps with saddle pain as well. Some of the weight is removed from the saddle and applied to the pedals, side benefit is you go faster ;^)

All kidding aside, I don't think I'd want to tour on a Toupe, but I will again on a Rolls, even though it's a lot heavier.

[metalheart]

Wow, lots of useful comments.

During a ride, the discomfort is both soft tissue and what feels like sit bone pressure/pain. Post ride, the discomfort is soft tissue and very specific to the area immediately surrounding the sit bones. No skin breaks or blisters, just some callous-like skin right under my sit bones.

I have been fitted more times than I can count and right now I am pretty comfortable with the exiting fit, other than the butt discomfort. I shift position often while riding, both my butt and my hands, riding in the drops, on the hoods, and occasionally on the top of the bars. With arthritic knees, I seldom stand, but once the saddle discomfort sets in, every so often I do get out of the saddle for some relief.

I am approaching 70, so the biology thing may be catching up with me. According to my ortho doc, my hips are in good shape, but I get that things change with age, no matter what.

The suggestion for reapplication of cream (more bag balm this time of year) is the most straight-forward place to start. A different pair of bibs is worth a try, thanks for the Santini suggestion. I ride about 7k a year, so the Regal has some miles on it and it may be worth trying a replacement, although if I can identify a different saddle, I would try it. I have experimented with an off-center saddle position and that does not seem to help. For today's ride, I will try lowering the saddle a couple mm.

Little things tend to add up to improve or degrade my riding experience --- cumulative impacts. In the grand scheme of things the butt pain is tolerable, but if it can be lessened or eliminated, it would help. After two heart attacks, six stents, a boat-load of beta blockers, and two bone on bone arthritic knees, the butt pain is among the least of my cycling worries. However, if I can fix it, every little bit helps!

Thanks again for the observations and suggestions.

[buddybikes]

Why not treat yourself to a new Rolls?

[eddief]

Bag balm was meant for cow teats. Not saying it does not work well, but cows don't ride bikes with ass hatchet saddles. There are many formulations for butt cream on the market. Another relatively inexpensive and harmless way to do some experimenting. I like Beljum Butter better than some others I have tried.

Wow, lots of useful comments.

During a ride, the discomfort is both soft tissue and what feels like sit bone pressure/pain. Post ride, the discomfort is soft tissue and very specific to the area immediately surrounding the sit bones. No skin breaks or blisters, just some callous-like skin right under my sit bones.

I have been fitted more times than I can count and right now I am pretty comfortable with the exiting fit, other than the butt discomfort. I shift position often while riding, both my butt and my hands, riding in the drops, on the hoods, and occasionally on the top of the bars. With arthritic knees, I seldom stand, but once the saddle discomfort sets in, every so often I do get out of the saddle for some relief.

I am approaching 70, so the biology thing may be catching up with me. According to my ortho doc, my hips are in good shape, but I get that things change with age, no matter what.

The suggestion for reapplication of cream (more bag balm this time of year) is the most straight-forward place to start. A different pair of bibs is worth a try, thanks for the Santini suggestion. I ride about 7k a year, so the Regal has some miles on it and it may be worth trying a replacement, although if I can identify a different saddle, I would try it. I have experimented with an off-center saddle position and that does not seem to help. For today's ride, I will try lowering the saddle a couple mm.

Little things tend to add up to improve or degrade my riding experience --- cumulative impacts. In the grand scheme of things the butt pain is tolerable, but if it can be lessened or eliminated, it would help. After two heart attacks, six stents, a boat-load of beta blockers, and two bone on bone arthritic knees, the butt pain is among the least of my cycling worries. However, if I can fix it, every little bit helps!

Thanks again for the observations and suggestions.

[unterhausen]

I'm curios...has anyone out here had a saddle that started to become uncomfortable after around four hours, switched to a different saddle, and then could instantly ride for thirteen hours without any saddle discomfort whatsoever? Sounds like a tall tale to me.there are two kinds of saddle discomfort. Saddle sores are basically not related to the saddle much at all, and that takes saddle time and experimentaion with shorts to get past. My experience with saddles is that almost anything is tolerable up to 50 miles. But if a saddle is still comfortable after 80 miles, it's likely to be comfortable at any distance. I have definitely had saddles that were fine up to 80 miles and then became torture devices.

Probably jinxing myself, but the Aliante has shown itself to be comfortable for me to just about any distance. I have ridden three 1200k grand randonnees with no saddle issues at all. Other than RAAM and a few other crazy rides, that's probably the ultimate test of a saddle. Because of lack of saddle time this year, I'm having saddle sore issues. Those will go away

[Gummee]

**It is designed for riding in an aggressive position with very little weight on the saddle. So when I take long easy rides in a more upright position, saddle pressure increases and I get sore after 3-4 hours. I expect that.**

This. I expect that what the OP is feeling is the same thing I feel when I just sit and spin: stuff starts to hurt because you're not supporting part of your weight with your thighs as you would going shorter and harder.

I doubt its new saddle time. Just go into the longer rides expecting to ache because you're riding the saddle you have differently. You'll be better off mentally and have a heavier wallet.

edited to add: there's a DIY 'Assos' chamois creme out there on the innerwebs. I've found it a few times now (and have forgotten where) that's pennies on the dollar.

M

[classtimesailer]

If I don't ride often enough, I can get butt issues like chafing and/or pressure problems. 5 days a week minimum and no problems. I don't use creams and I ride two different saddles on my commuters an a third on the weekend go-fast bike. I'm only 56. When I turn 70 and my butt hurts from riding, I am definitely getting a new bike or fresh paint on my current one and then I'm gonna ride till the pain stops.

[metalheart]

update ---- I took off my Regal and put on another Regal that had been sitting on the shelf. I have been doing longer rides on hot days, climbing rides, and plenty of miles and elevation gain. The butt pain went away. I think the padding in the old Regal just died and I was riding on plastic.

I am turning 70 and aside from some new wheels, I think i will get a new saddle anyway, probably an SMP 209 or Drakon just because.

This was a helpful thread for me, learned a couple of things and I now carry a couple of small packets of chamois cream (Doc's) just in case.

[Louis]

Glad to hear that the "new" Regal is working for you. But(t) by all means experiment if you like.

It helps if you have more than one bike on which to do this. On your go-to bike keep a saddle that you know works. On a secondary bike you can experiment as much as you like, and take your time trying out stuff. That you don't have hurry quite as much, and can make better decisions without constantly swapping out saddles.

[dhalbrook]

Just curious, have you tried a selle an-atomica? As long as it's properly tensioned it's more comfortable than anything I've ever ridden, by a longshot.

[aingeru]

Check your saddle height.
Also went from a Regal to a Rolls, not coming back...