NAHBS awards

[soulspinner]

No entries for best lugged???? huh?

[victoryfactory]

Maybe the powers thought there weren't enough lug-heads
with folks like K Bedford, R Sachs and D Kirk not there?
A few years ago, bespoke carbon was almost unheard of.
And a few years before that, Ti was new too...

Maybe most of the lugged frames on display weren't new models?

I'd like to hear the official explanation

VF

[soulspinner]

Maybe the powers thought there weren't enough lug-heads
with folks like K Bedford, R Sachs and D Kirk not there?
A few years ago, bespoke carbon was almost unheard of.
And a few years before that, Ti was new too...

Maybe most of the lugged frames on display weren't new models?

I'd like to hear the official explanation

VF

Didn't realize Sachs and Kirk weren't there.........

[FlashUNC]

Rich Adams had a gorgeous lugged bike as an entrant for Best Theme bike. (Some photos here: http://bicycleframes.com/frames/the-lehigh-bicycle/) His Lehigh University themed machine was sweet in person with a great depth to the paint and the detail work really shined up close. Then there was Ellis Cycles' lugged SLX that was ridiculously purty.

But yes, overall, it was a TI/bamboo and wood/carbon dominated show this year I think.

[christian]

I am starting to wonder whether NAHBS is a meaningful reflection of the custom bicycle industry or a funhouse mirror.

[oldpotatoe]

I am starting to wonder whether NAHBS is a meaningful reflection of the custom bicycle industry or a funhouse mirror.

Talked to a gent who wasn't there this year. He laments the names like Ritchey(mass produced, asian sourced bikes), being there at all..in addition, those making 'art' rather than useful machines..'tools rather than trophys'.

BUT money talks and some of the big boys will spend lotsa $ to be there, whether they can be seen as part of the HandMade Bike philosophy or not really.

I went in Portland and was really impressed by the small builders..their quality and the 'stars in their eyes'...hopefully the reality of this weird biz doesn't take the wind out of their sails. They can remain happy and can survive on small batches, doing what they love..obviously not to make them rich...but to survive.

[R2D2]

Talked to a gent who wasn't there this year. He laments the names like Ritchey(mass produced, asian sourced bikes), being there at all..in addition, those making 'art' rather than useful machines..'tools rather than trophys'.

BUT money talks and some of the big boys will spend lotsa $ to be there, whether they can be seen as part of the HandMade Bike philosophy or not really.

I went in Portland and was really impressed by the small builders..their quality and the 'stars in their eyes'...hopefully the reality of this weird biz doesn't take the wind out of their sails. They can remain happy and can survive on small batches, doing what they love..obviously not to make them rich...but to survive.

The VeloOrange guys lamented the fact they could NOT bring frames as the didn't make them I don't know if Ritchey had actual frames there.

But there were some good useful bike.


But even Moots had an odd bike with a chain saw and hoe etc. But it had a purpose to maintain trails.

And even weirder bike dedicated to some grumpy old guy ....

[kramnnim]

The little sign said that Tom made the fatty frame they had on display.

[oldpotatoe]

The VeloOrange guys lamented the fact they could NOT bring frames as the didn't make them I don't know if Ritchie had actual frames there.

But there were some good useful bike.


But even Moots had an odd bike with a chain saw and hoe etc. But it had a purpose to maintain trails.

And even weirder bike dedicated to some grumpy old guy ....

tee-hee...Moots is now known as one of the HUGE frame makers there..

http://prollyisnotprobably.com/2014/03/2014-nahbs-ritcheys-new-breakaway-carbon-road-and-swiss-disc-cross/#1

As mentioned, in Portland, the small builders really were particularly nice. Sean Walling, SoulCraft, bikes that were beautifully made but made to ride, not show..one was dirty, His bike, ridden in the mud couple of days prior.

NAHBS is evolving, as it gets bigger..we'll see where it is in a few years..hopefully not a mini Interbike, which 'seems' where it is heading...

[FlashUNC]

Ritchey did have frames there. A fat bike brazed by Tom, their new carbon breakaway, the two iterations of their cross frame and a 650b and 29er mtn bike.

I was a little surprised by the size of the Shimano booth, and the total lack of really anything in it save for a couple demo bikes. SRAM brought a ton of stuff, and Campy's booth was small, but jam packed with just about all their bits. (I'm also now in love with their 35mm Boras, but that's another conversation for another time.)

I think Nate Zukas might have been the happiest guy all weekend. Great dude.

[BumbleBeeDave]

Lots of fat bikes . . . Who will buy all these? Want one? Wait a year and you'll find plenty on eBay. People will buy them, take one or two rides, then get tired of them and put them on the bay. Same as cross bikes over the past five years. People buy them, do one or two races, decide it's not for them, and sell them.

Bamboo bikes . . . Never seen one ANYWHERE but at this show or on the web. Who buys these things?

Wood bikes . . . Ditto.

Electric assist . . . Great idea, but again, never seen one on the street or trail (yet). When you do, there are sure to be regulatory issues. Is it a bike? A motorscooter? Hmmm . . .

Belt drive with internal geared hubs . . . Seems like a great idea for city bikes for people who don't want to lube chains or get their Polo slacks caught in the chain or cogs as they ride the 1/4 mile to Starbucks. That may sound snobby, but it does translate into a valid market to sell to.

Show rules . . . What on earth is "handmade" any more about the Ritchey bikes? Or "North American" If they come from Taiwan? I know Tom may have brazed the ones at this show, but as at least one review I read mentioned, the one YOU get won't be. Same goes for the Italian guys who had the motorcycle in their booth. What exactly IS the definition now of "handmade?"

No lugged bike award? . . . Dave Wages has several lugged bikes in his booth that were wonderful. So did others. I'd also like to hear an explanation about this.

Don't get me wrong . . . it was a great show and I had a great time. But it seemed that it has drifted away from really being the "North American Handmade" Bicycle Show.

Also agree that Zukas had one bike there and it was beautiful. I know I was far from the only one impressed.

BBD

[August]

Frames submitted to be considered in the "construction" categories had to be raw and unbuilt, that is, no paint no parts. I assume that's why no lugged.

[Lovetoclimb]

Talked to a gent who wasn't there this year. He laments the names like Ritchey(mass produced, asian sourced bikes), being there at all..in addition, those making 'art' rather than useful machines..'tools rather than trophys'.

BUT money talks and some of the big boys will spend lotsa $ to be there, whether they can be seen as part of the HandMade Bike philosophy or not really.

I went in Portland and was really impressed by the small builders..their quality and the 'stars in their eyes'...hopefully the reality of this weird biz doesn't take the wind out of their sails. They can remain happy and can survive on small batches, doing what they love..obviously not to make them rich...but to survive.

Having spent the weekend helping my friend and frame builder Max Lundbeck of Lundbeck Cycles, we had a similar discussion on the drive back. Tom Ritchey seems like a great guy, we were next to "Cycle Monkey" who were very helpful people during setup and tear down, but what is the process for filling booths. Don Walker runs the show with complete control or so I have been told. But it seems most frame-builders spend a large amount of coin to come out year after year. Seeing a ROI from their perspective would be interesting to me. Max hopes to have generated buzz for 3 or 4 orders from it all, one from a Campagnolo North America employee which is just the bees knees given he specs his bikes only Campy (unless you want to costly SRAM/Shimano upgrade . . . ). I imagine the show maintains some percentage, say 80% for NA builders, and after a certain deadline if those spaces are vacant the organizer(s) must open them to whomever is willing to pay. After all it is a business venture is it not?

All in all I had fun seeing the other side of the coin, having been an attendee in Austin and now an "exhibitor" in Charlotte. Quite a few points for improvement I will suggest given the opportunity. Overall though the builders themselves were great to talk to and I appreciate everyone who comes together to showcase one of the best aspects of cycling.

[parris]

It's interesting to see who ISN'T there. Just what does their absence say about the show and where it's heading?

[FlashUNC]

Having spent the weekend helping my friend and frame builder Max Lundbeck of Lundbeck Cycles, we had a similar discussion on the drive back. Tom Ritchey seems like a great guy, we were next to "Cycle Monkey" who were very helpful people during setup and tear down, but what is the process for filling booths. Don Walker runs the show with complete control or so I have been told. But it seems most frame-builders spend a large amount of coin to come out year after year. Seeing a ROI from their perspective would be interesting to me. Max hopes to have generated buzz for 3 or 4 orders from it all, one from a Campagnolo North America employee which is just the bees knees given he specs his bikes only Campy (unless you want to costly SRAM/Shimano upgrade . . . ). I imagine the show maintains some percentage, say 80% for NA builders, and after a certain deadline if those spaces are vacant the organizer(s) must open them to whomever is willing to pay. After all it is a business venture is it not?

All in all I had fun seeing the other side of the coin, having been an attendee in Austin and now an "exhibitor" in Charlotte. Quite a few points for improvement I will suggest given the opportunity. Overall though the builders themselves were great to talk to and I appreciate everyone who comes together to showcase one of the best aspects of cycling.


Max was great to talk to. I loved his single speed/geared race cross frame. Really smartly put together. And I love his Campy snobbery. Birds of a feather...

[Ken Robb]

It's interesting to see who ISN'T there. Just what does their absence say about the show and where it's heading?

I think it says that participating requires quite a bit of cash and time. Most builders will evaluate what benefit they will derive from the show. A relative new builder without a comfortable backlog may think he can get a few orders or at least some name recognition that will lead to future orders.

A well-known builder with a multi-year waitlist may think attending would not make business sense. The people in his backlog list would probably hope he would stay home and build frames. :)

OTOH some guys might attend just to have fun with other industry folks and look at it as a deductible vacation. :beer:

[Exonerv]

I too was impressed with Max Lundbeck and glad to see he got some mention here. He appears to be a very smart and enthusiastic young man. He only builds in steel/stainless. I'm betting he's a name that will become more familiar as time goes on.

[gomango]

I too was impressed with Max Lundbeck and glad to see he got some mention here. He appears to be a very smart and enthusiastic young man. He only builds in steel/stainless. I'm betting he's a name that will become more familiar as time goes on.

Out of the pics I've seen from this year's show, his bicycles really caught my eye.

Well his pics and the ones of the various Moots including the trail bike. Man, that would really come in handy up at the cabin all summer.

Maybe Mr. Lundbeck will be there next year when I can go again.

[Bob Ross]

Bamboo bikes . . . Never seen one ANYWHERE but at this show or on the web. Who buys these things?

Cyclists with a big stable (literally; or a big garage/storage shed) who subscribe to the "Hey kids, collect the entire set!" school of aquisition

...where a "set" consists of one from every possible frame material. Seriously, everyone I know who owns a bamboo bike -- which admittedly is only two people -- also owns a steel, a carbon, an aluminum, and a titanium bike.

[Formulasaab]

Zukas actually had two bikes there, but those folks in the "new builder" category were limited to showing a single bike at a time. His other one was behind the curtain and he swapped bikes between Friday and Saturday. I really loved the one I saw on Saturday.

I did wonder why some of those builders were there. I was surprised to see folks like Casati and Level on the exhibitors list as they are certainly not North American. However, I really enjoyed looking at their bikes and talking to them.

Casati has so much history and is still kicking it old school. Even though they have "production" models, a customer asked them to do a naked brazed stainless frame and polish it, so they did.

Level had the most stunning Keirin bike. It was understated and elegant in a way very little else in the show could match. It was a challenge for Mr. Matsuda to talk through his interpreter, but his enthusiasm was evident in his excitement about his new "Shinogi filed" lugs.

I honestly don't mind if the bike is more art than tool. I look at this show as being all about showing what the builder CAN do, not necessarily what they must do when bound by the economies of their business.

Still, my favorite bikes were the ones that took the art, skill, and free thinking and applied it to something that would be fun to ride FAST!

In that vein, Zukas's personal bike, Six-Eleven's track bike, the Level track bike, and Bilenkey's Time Trial rig were some of my personal favorites.

It helps a lot in each of the above cases that the folks I spoke to about those bikes were super nice.

By the way BBDave, I've seen a few of the wooden bikes in the wild... Last seen on the Mountains of Misery Century ride that I've done a few years now.

[Lovetoclimb]

Out of the pics I've seen from this year's show, his bicycles really caught my eye.

Well his pics and the ones of the various Moots including the trail bike. Man, that would really come in handy up at the cabin all summer.

Maybe Mr. Lundbeck will be there next year when I can go again.

Indeed, we talked about the value of having a large booth (10'x20') at Louisville next year since he will be one of the closest builders to the venue. Hopefully I can get favorable travel conditions and ride my bike up from Asheville!

Already thinking about a project to be completed for his booth next year. Columbus is apparently releasing a tube set that will be an answer to True Temper's MTB option. Hoping I can convince Max to build me his first 29er to be put through the paces in Pisgah and Dupont. And make use of the new Thomson 27.2 dropper post!

[BumbleBeeDave]

Louisville?

I thought they rotated from coast to coast.

BBD

[FlashUNC]

Louisville?

I thought they rotated from coast to coast.

BBD

Yup, Don announced Louisville as next year's locale.

[BumbleBeeDave]

OK. Given the expense of travel, entry fees, and the need to have several "show" bikes available, I'm gonna predict right now there will be a lot of builders from both coasts who will take a pass.

BBD

[spacemen3]

I like Louisville and I like Bourbon!

[RedRider]

Guess where Don Walker lives?

[gavingould]

wasn't Walker based in Indianapolis when the show went there a few years back?

if you run the show, you pick where it goes, right?

[R2D2]

wasn't Walker based in Indianapolis when the show went there a few years back?

if you run the show, you pick where it goes, right?

Yes and yes............

[RedRider]

Cyclists with a big stable (literally; or a big garage/storage shed) who subscribe to the "Hey kids, collect the entire set!" school of aquisition

...where a "set" consists of one from every possible frame material. Seriously, everyone I know who owns a bamboo bike -- which admittedly is only two people -- also owns a steel, a carbon, an aluminum, and a titanium bike.

The bamboo bikes at NAHBS are a high-end demonstration of what can be done with a versatile material. There are a few organizations like the Bamboo Bike Project that fund programs to bring bamboo bikes to Africa and other underdeveloped regions. Bamboo can grow quickly in these areas and with a basic tool kit be cut and fabricated into a bicycle. In areas that are impractical for cars and trucks a doctor can ride to many villages.
I know Craig Calfee and other industry leaders have been involved with these programs and I admire them for it.

[scooter]

The 2014 NAHBS Award winners
Best City or Utility Bike: Cykel Mageren
Best Road Bike: Kent Eriksen Cycles
Best Mountain Bike: Breadwinner Cycles
Best Cyclocross Bike: Retrotec & Inglis Cycles
Best Track Bike: Six-Eleven Bicycle Co.
Best Tandem Bike: Co-Motion Cycles
Best Fillet Frame: Ellis Cycles
Best Tig Frame: Kent Eriksen Cycles
Best Layup: Argonaut Cycles
Best Finish: Independent Fabrication
Best Theme: SyCip Bicycles
Best New Builder: Harvey Cycles
President's Choice: Peacock Groove
People's Choice: Six-Eleven Bicycle Co.
Best in Show: Argonaut Cycles

[R2D2]

Bamboo sounds good.

[Steve in SLO]

A couple of years ago in Sacramento, I talked to a busy builder who budgeted $10K for a trip to NAHBS. That cost did not take into account the disruption in workflow due to prep/travel/return time. Given that, I am surprised many more don't opt out, or maybe attend every 2-3 years rather than annually.

[Formulasaab]

My guess is that social media makes the location less and less important as time goes on.

I went to the show with a buddy of mine who owns my favorite LBS. He was telling us about how in recent months he can attribute a real rise in business to his increased use of Instagram. His account feeds directly to his shop's homepage. Through clever use of hashtags and such he's gotten a lot of additional traffic to the website, which has translated into actual foot traffic in the door.

NAHBS has an element of that too. If you get an award, or get a lot of people taking your picture and tagging you, it will translate into orders for bikes/parts.

I admit, I've added several new accounts to my list of "following" which is essentially the same as my list of wishes and wants.

[pdmtong]

Lots of fat bikes . . . Who will buy all these? Want one? Wait a year and you'll find plenty on eBay. People will buy them, take one or two rides, then get tired of them and put them on the bay. Same as cross bikes over the past five years. People buy them, do one or two races, decide it's not for them, and sell them.

Bamboo bikes . . . Never seen one ANYWHERE but at this show or on the web. Who buys these things?

Wood bikes . . . Ditto.

Electric assist . . . Great idea, but again, never seen one on the street or trail (yet). When you do, there are sure to be regulatory issues. Is it a bike? A motorscooter? Hmmm . . .

Belt drive with internal geared hubs . . . Seems like a great idea for city bikes for people who don't want to lube chains or get their Polo slacks caught in the chain or cogs as they ride the 1/4 mile to Starbucks. That may sound snobby, but it does translate into a valid market to sell to.

Show rules . . . What on earth is "handmade" any more about the Ritchey bikes? Or "North American" If they come from Taiwan? I know Tom may have brazed the ones at this show, but as at least one review I read mentioned, the one YOU get won't be. Same goes for the Italian guys who had the motorcycle in their booth. What exactly IS the definition now of "handmade?"

No lugged bike award? . . . Dave Wages has several lugged bikes in his booth that were wonderful. So did others. I'd also like to hear an explanation about this.

Don't get me wrong . . . it was a great show and I had a great time. But it seemed that it has drifted away from really being the "North American Handmade" Bicycle Show.

Also agree that Zukas had one bike there and it was beautiful. I know I was far from the only one impressed.

BBD

Fat, bamboo, wood, electric, belt, commuters, and haulers really do exist outside the show. I've seen them, friends own them. The breadth of cycling disciplines wants and needs is now finding its way into the corners. I've ridden the examples you have listed and it was immediately obvious to me why such a material or bike would appeal. Of the above, IMHO only wood is perhaps the 10th bike you own...all the others could easily make the the short list in your garage depending on your location and needs. For example the electric assist is pretty amazing. 4 strokes and you are going 25mph. In some ways safer since relative speed to cars is less. IN other ways more dangerous since not used to going that fast in neighborhoods (panic stops, etc....)

The show is no longer about lugged road bikes with level top tubes.

Sure way back it was true NA and all hand made...now the show perhaps should be called NA hand made plus some small focused market firms not called specialized giant cannondale or trek.

Its Don's show. He makes the "rules" and would be the one, and the only one, to ask.

[I Want Sachs?]

This is where it gets me. Seems like there's such bias against Asian made bikes.

Just because a bike is made in Asia does not make it bad. The North American refers to the location of the show, not the location of the production. Otherwise, Pegoretti should be banned.:no:

The handmade criteria should be adhered to, however. But nothing against mass production though; Moots is mass production by Ellis standard. Ritchey is mass production by Bedford standard.

[FlashUNC]

This is where it gets me. Seems like there's such bias against Asian made bikes.

Just because a bike is made in Asia does not make it bad. The North American refers to the location of the show, not the location of the production. Otherwise, Pegoretti should be banned.:no:

The handmade criteria should be adhered to, however. But nothing against mass production though; Moots is mass production by Ellis standard. Ritchey is mass production by Bedford standard.

There were several Japanese builders there this year. They had some of the nicest bikes I thought.

[BumbleBeeDave]

This is where it gets me. Seems like there's such bias against Asian made bikes.

Just because a bike is made in Asia does not make it bad. The North American refers to the location of the show, not the location of the production. Otherwise, Pegoretti should be banned.:no:

The handmade criteria should be adhered to, however. But nothing against mass production though; Moots is mass production by Ellis standard. Ritchey is mass production by Bedford standard.

From the NAHBS "about" page . . .

The industry contains a wide variety of builders from all walks of life, but they all have one thing in common: they all make bicycle frames by hand. The event was not only intended to serve as a forum for builders to meet and share ideas, but also to showcase North America’s finest builders.

Seems pretty clear to me. I'm not saying there's anything at all bad about Asian produced bikes, or Italian or anywhere else. But maybe rename it the "International Handmade Bicycle Show?"

Also maybe clarify what's meant by "handmade?" My mental image when I read that in relation to this show is that it's one guy--or no more than 4-5--who are making one brand of bike out of a small workshop. I would wager I'm not the only one who has that interpretation given the quote above.

After all, aside from BMC's claim the Impec is wholly made by robots, EVERY bike could legitimately claim to be "handmade" if a human hand touched it at some point in the production process. :rolleyes:

BBD

[tiretrax]

From the NAHBS "about" page . . .

The industry contains a wide variety of builders from all walks of life, but they all have one thing in common: they all make bicycle frames by hand. The event was not only intended to serve as a forum for builders to meet and share ideas, but also to showcase North America’s finest builders.

Seems pretty clear to me. I'm not saying there's anything at all bad about Asian produced bikes, or Italian or anywhere else. But maybe rename it the "International Handmade Bicycle Show?"

Also maybe clarify what's meant by "handmade?" My mental image when I read that in relation to this show is that it's one guy--or no more than 4-5--who are making one brand of bike out of a small workshop. I would wager I'm not the only one who has that interpretation given the quote above.

After all, aside from BMC's claim the Impec is wholly made by robots, EVERY bike could legitimately claim to be "handmade" if a human hand touched it at some point in the production process. :rolleyes:

BBD

I'm with you, BBD. I was surprised to see foreign bike makers at the show I attended, not that I didn't like their work. But, it's all good (even that electric assisted stuff).

[oldpotatoe]

I'm with you, BBD. I was surprised to see foreign bike makers at the show I attended, not that I didn't like their work. But, it's all good (even that electric assisted stuff).

Heard a rumor today that the owners of Interbike 'may' be looking at 'buying' NAHBS...Don gonna make some $....

[R2D2]

Heard a rumor today that the owners of Interbike 'may' be looking at 'buying' NAHBS...Don gonna make some $....

Seriously? I never know with you. And that's a compliment.

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . I have absolutely no problem with anybody who's at the show. The more the better. It's just after some years of the show it seems we go through the same postmortem every year with debate about who was there, whether their product was really "handmade," etc. They should widen the mission statement and I think a lot of the debate would be eliminated.

Of course, if I was Don I'd be totally sick of doing the darn thing by now and would jump at the chance to sell! :crap:

BBD

[jimmythefly]

I think it says that participating requires quite a bit of cash and time. Most builders will evaluate what benefit they will derive from the show. A relative new builder without a comfortable backlog may think he can get a few orders or at least some name recognition that will lead to future orders.

A well-known builder with a multi-year waitlist may think attending would not make business sense. The people in his backlog list would probably hope he would stay home and build frames. :)

OTOH some guys might attend just to have fun with other industry folks and look at it as a deductible vacation. :beer:

This is a year old and specifically pertaining to a Seattle builder and a Seattle bike show, but is otherwise a nice piece on what went into one builder's decision to not attend a show and why.

http://www.rodbikes.com/blog/?p=1080

[Ken Robb]

Thanks Jimmy--That's what I guessed too.