Any foreign top notch makers..??

[Catulle]

No doubt US makers such as e-RICHIE, Kirk, Weigle, White, et al., are at the top of the game and making bicycles at a level of quality and technical prowess at par or superior to the any of the bicycles ever built. However, considering that high-end bicycle making is a relatively new occurrence in the US, I imagine that there must be some pretty cool bicycle artisan makers in more traditional bicycle making countries such as Italy or France. Is that so? In if that were the case, who are they?

Having said that, I understand that bicycle making in Europe, generally speaking, has few points of comparison with the work carried out by e-RICHIE, for instance. Making bikes for the US makers entails a mystique and idealism of sorts which is not present in the European shops. Even when the now famous Italian makers started their careers in a small shop and working mostly alone, they worked mainly out of necessity as they had few options available for making a living. Nevertheless, I imagine there must be a few European makers building worthy bikes. I know of one guy in Australia doing some wicked work.

[jerk]

ahem.....dario pegoretti

[fiamme red]

To mention a few:

Alex Singer.
Tommasini.
Grandis.
Marschall (http://www.marschall-framework.de/english/frames/frame_firma.html).

There are probably quite a few frame-builders on the continent that we never hear of.

[e-RICHIE]

ahem.....dario pegoretti


i do believe dario-issimo is about
the only guy left over there. all other
frames are manufactured. dario, irio, and
mebbe 3 others are keeping the flame from
going down with the ship. sorry for mixing
metaphors, and have a nice day.

[ada@prorider.or]

No doubt US makers such as e-RICHIE, Kirk, Weigle, White, et al., are at the top of the game and making bicycles at a level of quality and technical prowess at par or superior to the any of the bicycles ever built. However, considering that high-end bicycle making is a relatively new occurrence in the US, I imagine that there must be some pretty cool bicycle artisan makers in more traditional bicycle making countries such as Italy or France. Is that so? In if that were the case, who are they?

Having said that, I understand that bicycle making in Europe, generally speaking, has few points of comparison with the work carried out by e-RICHIE, for instance. Making bikes for the US makers entails a mystique and idealism of sorts which is not present in the European shops. Even when the now famous Italian makers started their careers in a small shop and working mostly alone, they worked mainly out of necessity as they had few options available for making a living. Nevertheless, I imagine there must be a few European makers building worthy bikes. I know of one guy in Australia doing some wicked work.

just one remark
europe is more then italy and france

[manet]

let's call them flems

[fiamme red]

just one remark
europe is more then italy and franceTrue. In Holland, there's RIH.

[e-RICHIE]

just one remark
europe is more then italy and france


potm atmo cheers. :beer:

[manet]

True. In Holland, there's RIH.

red + white

[e-RICHIE]

True. In Holland, there's RIH.

has RIH remained a frame shop since the 80s?
i think/thought it was just a brand now. and,
hey f.r.-issimo, have a nice day.

[Climb01742]

pegoretti, dario, see above.

[manet]

seat pin ALERT:

http://www.rennrad-news.de/fotos/data/503/medium/1893Pegoretti_1.jpg

[fiamme red]

has RIH remained a frame shop since the 80s?
i think/thought it was just a brand now. and,
hey f.r.-issimo, have a nice day.Yes, they are still making frames.

http://search.bikelist.org/getmsg.asp?Filename=classicrendezvous.10503.0065.e ml

[e-RICHIE]

Yes, they are still making frames.

http://search.bikelist.org/getmsg.asp?Filename=classicrendezvous.10503.0065.e ml


if it's "there", then it must be so. cheers. :beer:

[Darrell]

ahem.....dario pegoretti


Check out the cool lugged single bolt stem he used for this beauty
http://www.cyclingnews.com/photos/2005/tech/shows/eicma05/?id=eicma055/eicma05-pego2
No prizes for the correct answer to where these stem lugs orginated from.
Pass me the vegemite sandwich Tania

[fiamme red]

if it's "there", then it must be so. cheers. :beer:I should have said, "TIFWIW". :rolleyes:

BTW, how many lugged Pegorettis are made each year? Do you know, e-RICHIE?

[ada@prorider.or]

has RIH remained a frame shop since the 80s?
i think/thought it was just a brand now. and,
hey f.r.-issimo, have a nice day.

well i think since 1920
and a dozen more builders

[Grant McLean]

What qualites make a "top of their game" maker?

I place value on:

1.Made to Measure fit
2.Dialed geometry
3.Build 'em Straight
4.make 'em last
5.Finish 'em neat

There are many builders that will do the first 4. Only in the USA is the
5th point ranked so highly, often put first on the list. If I were a builder
i'd be insulted by all the emphasis that's placed on something so irrelevant
as finishing details, why does that matter so much?

-g

[e-RICHIE]

well i think since 1920



cees-issimo
what i meant was that atmo imho, RIH's halcyon
days were the late 60s (peter post, etc.) through
to the mid 80s (that female russion fire hydrant
that won all the track titles). in reply to catulle's,
ahem, query, my comment implied that RIH has
not been making "artisan-ish" frames for quite
a while at this point, at least not the types that
would scratch his itch. oh and heb een aardige dag.

[Grant McLean]

i do believe dario-issimo is about
the only guy left over there. all other
frames are manufactured. dario, irio, and
mebbe 3 others are keeping the flame from
going down with the ship. sorry for mixing
metaphors, and have a nice day.


Isn't it e-ronic that Dario built those tig alu frame for Indurain,
that helped put a nail into the coffin of lugged steel in the pro
peleton?


-g

[e-RICHIE]

Isn't it e-ronic that Dario built those tig alu frame for Indurain,
that helped put a nail into the coffin of lugged steel in the pro
peleton?


-g


is that really how it happened?

[Grant McLean]

is that really how it happened?


... i said "helped"....

Tig alu wasn't widely "accepted" in the Indurain era. You're saying a
five time tour winner using a particular technology didn't have any
impact? The fact that Lance won 7 tours on carbon hasn't "helped"
the market accept carbon that's been around for almost 20 years?

-g

[ada@prorider.or]

cees-issimo
what i meant was that atmo imho, RIH's halcyon
days were the late 60s (peter post, etc.) through
to the mid 80s (that female russion fire hydrant
that won all the track titles). in reply to catulle's,
ahem, query, my comment implied that RIH has
not been making "artisan-ish" frames for quite
a while at this point, at least not the types that
would scratch his itch. oh and heb een aardige dag.

well the days from peter post was
presto on haarlemmerstraat with legrand as frame builder (same school where was on )
the the rih shop is a cross that school at westerstraat
they make frame for russian team at amsterdam olympics if that what you mean
and basiscly all steel track frame's comes from rih with other brand names on them like batuvus koga giant and so on.....

you have to know the frame builders from that shop like decesead bustraan

well amsterdam have many famous frame builders
like zieleman aandewiel legrand .................

[Fixed]

bro I don't much about the good stuff but I saw a mondonico that looked like it was made well i.m.h.o. cheers

[e-RICHIE]

well the days from peter post was
presto on haarlemmerstraat with legrand as frame builder (same school where was on )
the the rih shop is a cross that school at westerstraat
they make frame for russian team at amsterdam olympics if that what you mean
and basiscly all steel track frame's comes from rih with other brand names on them like batuvus koga giant and so on.....

you have to know the frame builders from that shop like decesead bustraan

well amsterdam have many famous frame builders
like zieleman aandewiel legrand .................


"well amsterdam have many famous frame builders
like zieleman aandewiel legrand"
i think you mean "had" many famous framebuilders.
isn't zieleman dead and legrand inactive?

[ada@prorider.or]

"well amsterdam have many famous frame builders
like zieleman aandewiel legrand"
i think you mean "had" many famous framebuilders.
isn't zieleman dead and legrand inactive?

well there are 3 generations zieleman
and legrand is active i heard i south africa (thats the last i heard)
on my school they still have his frame builders jig
if he come's (home!!)

[e-RICHIE]

well there are 3 generations zieleman
and legrand is active i heard i south africa (thats the last i heard)
on my school they still have his frame builders jig
if he come's (home!!)

and peter serier - where did he land?
so, who in holland makes handmade frames
that would fill the need that catulle asked about?

[SoCalSteve]

bro I don't much about the good stuff but I saw a mondonico that looked like it was made well i.m.h.o. cheers

I think he is going to retire soon (if he hasnt already). Anyone know more about this than me?

Steve

[YO!!!]

Prolly some cottage folks still kickin it in the UK.

Twas a hotbed of small one man shops in years past.

[Catulle]

Prolly some cottage folks still kickin it in the UK.

Twas a hotbed of small one man shops in years past.

Yo!!!, I thought you'd enjoy seeing this beauty.

[andy mac]

if 'foreign' includes australia sounds like our very own darrell is cooking up some magic downunder.

big dazza, do you have a website up and running?

[e-RICHIE]

if 'foreign' includes australia sounds like our very own darrell is cooking up some magic downunder.

big dazza, do you have a website up and running?


go bay-bee
http://www.llewellynbikes.com/main.htm

[dbrk]

Last I looked Canada was a "foreign" country from where I sit in these United States, which is darn close to that border. So we must add the redoubtable and remarkable Mike Barry of Mariposa Bicycles.

dbrk

[manet]

ha ha grant's a fourinher

[Fixed]

bro you guys all know nag san is wonderful too cheers :beer:

[Darrell]

if 'foreign' includes australia sounds like our very own darrell is cooking up some magic downunder.
big dazza, do you have a website up and running?

Is not the rest of the world foreign?
It's them that's mad, not us eh!
Been web bound since March 2001

[Grant McLean]

ha ha grant's a fourinher

wee wee, oops that's, oui oui !

-g

[Catulle]

Is not the rest of the world foreign?
It's them that's mad, not us eh!
Been web bound since March 2001

Fantastic work...!!!!!! :beer:

[pale scotsman]

This guy looks to be doing some fine work across the pond. Super clean looking imho...

http://www.robinmathercycles.co.uk/ben13.htm

[ClutchCargo]

A Good Frame Builder In Taiwan ?















;)

[sspielman]

...I find the original question a little strange...even backward...Of course there are ALOT of foreign top notch makers. The original question pre-supposes that the US is the center of the cycling craftsmanship universe. There are ALOT of factors that are important for a builder to be considered top notch in my opinion. Here in the US, we are blessed with a good number of great craftsmen...What I see as the great weakness is that very few actually address the fit issue. Now, most of them CLAIM to, but I have seen some pretty bizarre fits explained away as "solutions" to hard-to fit riders...I would surmise that Serotta's system of certifying fitters is a solution to this problem.Part of the craftsmanship that you get from a guy like Richard Sachs is his knowledge of how a rider has to fit and be BALANCED (keyword) on a bike for it to perform really well.

[e-RICHIE]

you can't commit if the cleats don't fit atmo cheers. :beer:

[BigDaddySmooth]

Chris Boardman seems to like his work. The bike CB featured in "Procycling" was pretty cool-looking IMHO.

[pdonk]

Chric Dekerf from Vancouver builds really nice bikes. A few items you folks might have issue with

1) Only does mountain bikes
2) Rarely to never does full customs. Don't worry his geometry is awesome for pretty much all types of riding and he offers a few different models.

His workmanship is incredible, from the silver brazed pierced interlocking seatstay assembly, to the staggered cable guidles, to the filet brazed seat tube/top tube/stays (no longer done), to the stainless steel head tube gusset, to the internally and externally machined head tube to the custom paint options.

I kick myself for not buying a road bike from him when he was building them, or the one that has been on ebay a few times that is my size.

He will be at the Handbuilt show, check him out.

Another builder, from Ontario, that is getting talked about is Hugh at True North, full customs in a variety of materials.

[Climb01742]

another aussie builder who knows his stuff:

http://www.teschnerbikes.com/