Track Gearing for Beginners?

[maximus]

I have read some posts on other forums, but since Paceline is my trusted home, I figured I would seek some advice here.

Signed up for some beginner lessons at the local velodrome. I have ridden fixed on the street for many years but always with a more moderate gearing (46x16 and 46x18).

I am not participating any specific events yet (sprints, scratch, etc...). I just need a good multi-purpose gear for getting comfortable on the track. Since I don't have a ton of cash, I am hoping to land on something good without purchasing a bunch of chainring/cog combos upfront.

What would you guys recommend? The largest chainring I currently have is 46, which probably wont cut it...

[11.4]

You have a 46x16. That's a 77 inch gear and a great way to start on the track. That's a common training gear. The standard non-racing gear on a lot of tracks is an 81 inch, which for most is a 48x16 but with your current ring, a 46x15 does pretty well. And you shouldn't have to race in anything higher than a 46x14 for your first year or two.

[FlashUNC]

You have a 46x16. That's a 77 inch gear and a great way to start on the track. That's a common training gear. The standard non-racing gear on a lot of tracks is an 81 inch, which for most is a 48x16 but with your current ring, a 46x15 does pretty well. And you shouldn't have to race in anything higher than a 46x14 for your first year or two.

+1 to this. 46x16 is great to start. I used to race a 48x16, though some guys fiddled with their gearing a bit. Some liked to run a slightly lower cadence and would use a 50x16. Others would really like to spin.

I personally preferred a higher cadence as it was easier to adjust to moves on the track, but the balance is having enough top end to sprint for the line when the time came. Didn't want to get spun out on the lead in to the final. I say start at 46x16 and see where it takes you.

[nooneline]

I agree with most of the advice so far.

Go buy yourself a 15 and a 14 tooth cog - use that 46t ring of yours, and use the 16 and 15 for warmup and getting comfortable on the 'drome, and the 14 when you start racing. For racing, I usually recommend 88" (49x15) for most beginners. 46x14 is pretty darn close to that.

[ptourkin]

I took the same classes (Mondays with Pam) and started out 48-15 and it was fine but I had ridden out there a bit. A lower gear will be easier for the jump drills and starts, though and the rental bikes for class are 46. You can email her or Sean's people and ask, too.

Be ready - you do a timed flying 200 on day one. Have fun and see you out there!

[maximus]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the advice. New cogs are cheap. Also cool to know their rentals are 46.

Stoked to get on the track. I've never been competitive with my riding in any formal sense. Should be fun to learn some proper etiquette and maybe even add some actual training into my riding routine.

[FlashUNC]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the advice. New cogs are cheap. Also cool to know their rentals are 46.

Stoked to get on the track. I've never been competitive with my riding in any formal sense. Should be fun to learn some proper etiquette and maybe even add some actual training into my riding routine.

Track racing was easily the safest form of racing I've ever done. Have fun with it.

And once you're in the sprinter's lane, hold yer line.

[ptourkin]

Despite what happened at the velodrome last year, I agree that it is a safe form of racing because it is generally orderly.

Also, if you ever get tired of just riding around, you can come out and motorpace behind Eddie B. (yes, that one.)

[maximus]

Nice. I need to work on my beard for the extra "aero" factor.

Class starts in 3 weeks

[carpediemracing]

I went to the track as a long time roadie. I couldn't spin quickly long enough - when I used a 48x15 I got shelled almost immediately. I used a 51x15 since that's what the bike had originally - I got the 48 when I bought a different crank for the bike - and it was fine. I was okay with the jumps and such and I actually enjoyed the faster races, like the keirin.

On the other hand I was a total fixed gear novice so my experience probably was not ideal.

I'm assuming that a proper trackie will get fluent with an easier gear and then move up. I do this with sprinting gearing on the road (start doing most of my sprints in a 14, go to a smaller cog, and if I'm having a great year I might see the 11T). For the track I sort of dove in.

Oh and I was using 170 cranks, to mirror the road cranks I had at the time. It probably helped push me toward the bigger gear. I don't know how a 165 would have affected me. I was trying the 170s on the road instead of the 175s I normally used and basically had a horrible year, so I'm a pusher or a coaster or both.

[ultraman6970]

If you are just learning dont go with something that heavy, I would start with 50x16 that is light enough... then after a few months when you get the body used to the track move to 50x15 and probably you will die using that.

Since you have 46 I would go 46x15... will feel like 50x16 but is not the same, 46x15 will feel like with more drag, the 15 has less torque, but you should have no problems IMO. Then move to 46x14...

When you are riding in the banks you will try to go up or keep the line but the bike will push you down (per say)... just shift the weight against the bank and you will be able to stay in the line. Practice that in the red line... then over the blue line... then move from line to line... then go mid bank... then go to the top... switch up and down in each turn, at every exit of the banks move in diagonal (using the inertia) to where you want to ride at the entrance of the next bank, so on and so forth.... in a week you should be riding ok and even your commuting will get more hmmm... solid. Track helps a lot.

Is easier to ride in the upper banks than in the bottom just in case you are scared as hell. Why? figure it out :D

Second thing, all the tracks are different and since apparently you havent ride in any ever, the only way to know how slow you can ride is just start going slow till the bike slides down (here is when people will get mad at me), no idea the track you are but if the banks are like >30 degrees thats quite low and in those you can do like 5 km/h and nothing will happen, in 33 to 45 degrees generally the minimum speed is like 15 to 25 km/h, but you won't know till you force the accident at purpose, you will slide down, no damage to the bike or you either... then you will get the minimum speed recorded in your head forever :P People can tell you but unless you have the experience is hard to tell.

Last two things... learn how to stand up over the pedals in the flats and in the banks, if your technique is not good you will have problems with this in the track so practice and practice. Meet people that sucks in the road and clearly in the track they couldn't do it, so practice and practice till you get it right. This is pretty much needed if you want to sprint at some point. And to finish.. do not be afraid of the track, get respect to it because is not funny to have an accident there but don't be afraid of it and all will be just fine.

:)

ps: is so nice to go at 60km/h in a track behind a motorcycle, that I would love to do it again, but the overweight wont allow me to go even 10 km/h hehe

ps2: just saw pictures of san diego velodrome... flat as a pancake, I would not worry that much, A lot of wind for sure hhehe you will like it :D

[jamie789]

I'm really jealous. I wish there was a track in New England.

Different tracks demand different gearing too. Flatter:easier, steeper:harder. I was riding 47 X 14 on a really steep track and ended up being pretty under geared when racing, but I learned how to spin pretty fast as a result.

Have fun

[carpediemracing]

I'm really jealous. I wish there was a track in New England.

+1

A proper track. I went to the NE Velodrome for a summer plus two weekends and it was a taste of what could be. It was super shallow (318m track, 14 degrees; in comparison T-town is 333m and 28 degrees I think) so the main problem was staying low when going fast.

I was surprised how unfit I was. I guess I coast a lot when I race regular bikes.

[bikinchris]

Things must have changed since I raced track. A standard gear for most all around riding was a 50x15. I would spin the hell out of that, too. But Baton Rouge does have decent banking.

[Gummee]

I usually recommend 88" (49x15) for most beginners. 46x14 is pretty darn close to that.
This. ...or 90" (50 x 15). A pretty close approximation is a 53 x 16. (89.4")

The track isn't about how hard you can push that gear, its how fast can you spin it. :nod

M

[Gummee]

Track racing was easily the safest form of racing I've ever done. Have fun with it. I agree with this.

And once you're in the sprinter's lane, hold yer line.Hold your line anywhere on the track, but especially on the bottom.

Coupla easy rules for track riding and racing:

1. Never, EVER! stop pedaling
2. Don't turn right
3. Don't underlap wheels.

The rest is riding a bicycle

M

[pinoymamba]

52x15 - scratch, match sprint
50x15 - scratch, points, miss n out, win n out
52x14 - flying 200, keirin
49x14 - scratch, match sprint

these are some of the gears I use.

[nooneline]

I'm really jealous. I wish there was a track in New England.

Different tracks demand different gearing too. Flatter:easier, steeper:harder. I was riding 47 X 14 on a really steep track and ended up being pretty under geared when racing, but I learned how to spin pretty fast as a result.

Have fun

Hmmmm, that's not entirely accurate. It's right, until it isn't anymore and it's the opposite. Flatter tracks are bigger; shorter tracks are steeper and that means that you have to back off the speed in the turns, whereas on a big, flat track you can work up a big head of steam. Take a look at six-day tracks in Europe; 160m isn't uncommon and guys will ride nothing bigger than 90" for most races. Part of the reason is that they're racing for six days; part of it is the size of the 'drome.

[ptourkin]

San Diego is a 333m track with shallow banking. The class will teach everything one needs to know about safety, technique and etiquette. Just relax and enjoy.

[oldpotatoe]

+1

A proper track. I went to the NE Velodrome for a summer plus two weekends and it was a taste of what could be. It was super shallow (318m track, 14 degrees; in comparison T-town is 333m and 28 degrees I think) so the main problem was staying low when going fast.

I was surprised how unfit I was. I guess I coast a lot when I race regular bikes.

Hopefully this summer, for the republic people.

http://www.bouldervalleyvelodrome.com/

[Gummee]

San Diego is a 333m track with shallow banking. The class will teach everything one needs to know about safety, technique and etiquette. Just relax and enjoy.

This

Its a fun time.

Just remember rule #1 from above.

Riding Encino is another story. Last time I was there, the banking wasn't the right angle and you needed to countersteer to stay on the bottom. Don't keep that pressure on the inside bar and you end up in the boards

M

[maximus]

Between this thread and watching YouTube videos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCvH-uvtTCY) of different exercises, I am completely stoked to get out there!

Thanks all for the advice. I am definitely going to pick up a smaller cog (15T likely since my current cog is a 18T). If I am spinning out, I'll definitely grab a larger chainring.

[Gummee]

Between this thread and watching YouTube videos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCvH-uvtTCY) of different exercises, I am completely stoked to get out there!

Thanks all for the advice. I am definitely going to pick up a smaller cog (15T likely since my current cog is a 18T). If I am spinning out, I'll definitely grab a larger chainring.
At Sandy Eggo, you can get away with a 49t and a 50t ring with 14, 15, and 16 cogs.

When Shaun Wallace and Co are running 49 x 15 and winning, well... they're MUCH more experienced than I am, so I tend to follow along with their choices.

M

[ultraman6970]

You can win races perfectly with 50 and 51x15.... in general lines even in a wooden track more gearing is just overkill specially in short TTs like KM and per point races.

Wish they had a track here I would be going 3 times a week there.

[11.4]

At Sandy Eggo, you can get away with a 49t and a 50t ring with 14, 15, and 16 cogs.

When Shaun Wallace and Co are running 49 x 15 and winning, well... they're MUCH more experienced than I am, so I tend to follow along with their choices.

M

The trend FOR ELITE RIDERS is to go into bigger gears for sprints, kilo, 200m. If you want to win in Elites you pretty much have to do a 98-104" these days. But if you're doing a miss-and-out or points race, or a madison, the gearing is a LOT lower -- 86-89" for Elites. When you pull out the big rings, it's partly because amazing power is developed (ten years ago riders weren't passing 2000 watts and nowadays everyone is going past 2500 thanks to lots of power training and better nutrition. But you don't see the Elites or pros riding at cadences over 140 rpm for those events. In the massed start and madison events, on the other hand, you'll ride 145-150 rpm consistently and faster in the sprints. It's two very different kinds of riding. At SD you will ride mostly massed start events, and you need to be able to accelerate many times in a short event. You can't do that with the bigger gears. Bear in mind that juniors are gear limited and yet they compete very successfully with Elites. Once riders have been racing a few years they tend to emulate the other riders at the track who win a lot, but those guys can turn a bigger gear than all the wannabe's. Starting out, you won't be racing against elites and you do need to learn how to accelerate rapidly again and again. I'd suggest training in no more than an 81-82 inch gear, and racing in no more than an 88 inch, for at least the first couple years. This isn't to teach you to spin your legs off -- if you want to work in the power events you need to build power and do some selective training in bigger gears. But even then you'll do a warmup in a 77-81 inch gear, do some jumps, multi lap efforts, etc. in the same or just a little more, and only go into a power gear for a few efforts, then back to the lower gear to do a few endurance efforts and a warm down. And those power gear efforts aren't where you want to work for the first couple years. You'll have to master the markedly faster speeds on the track, and being able to sprint in a big gear doesn't do much if you're hanging on at the back of the pack or are off the back. You need to be able to stay right at the front and ride off the front before you can use a sprint. Everyone wants to sprint, but few really have the chops to win with a sprint.

In short, keep in low gears as suggested above, put your money into race fees and some coaching. And don't expect to win in the first year and don't put on ego gears or ego wheels until they make a difference and you can handle them. You want to be winning without those gears, because to move into the 3's or higher you have to win, and the speeds are shockingly higher when you upgrade. Track racing isn't easy on your ego, so don't exacerbate the problem by going into gears that will actually detract from your performance.

[TRACK]

Im running 49x16 or 15. and 52x15 for training.
if you want to train your legs, train on bigger gear count.
if you want to practice skip stop, train on lower gear count.

[11.4]

Im running 49x16 or 15. and 52x15 for training.
if you want to train your legs, train on bigger gear count.
if you want to practice skip stop, train on lower gear count.

Train in a 93 inch gear? While there are always some over-gear drills you can do when you're in good form and building for big events, and are already a good cat 3 or a 2/1, those are very limited events. If the OP wants to begin racing with any hope of winning and upgrading, I'd strongly recommend that you stick to the lower gears suggested previously. The gears in this post are really excessive and the reasoning doesn't seem to make sense for track training.

[rustychisel]

Train in a 93 inch gear? While there are always some over-gear drills you can do when you're in good form and building for big events, and are already a good cat 3 or a 2/1, those are very limited events. If the OP wants to begin racing with any hope of winning and upgrading, I'd strongly recommend that you stick to the lower gears suggested previously. The gears in this post are really excessive and the reasoning doesn't seem to make sense for track training.

+ 1

Maximus, I don't know the San Diego track from a basket of eggs, but if you're as new to the track as you indicate you'll find the legs are fine but somewhere around 1/2 of the way through the first session you're blown. Dry rasping cough and your lungs are flapping around your earlugs somewhere. At that point, trying to pull a big gear to stay with the lineout becomes a fantasy.

Stay lower geared, learn to spin and jump into a sprint with it, adjust as necessary

[jamie789]

Hmmmm, that's not entirely accurate. It's right, until it isn't anymore and it's the opposite. Flatter tracks are bigger; shorter tracks are steeper and that means that you have to back off the speed in the turns, whereas on a big, flat track you can work up a big head of steam. Take a look at six-day tracks in Europe; 160m isn't uncommon and guys will ride nothing bigger than 90" for most races. Part of the reason is that they're racing for six days; part of it is the size of the 'drome.

Yeah. I wasn't very clear. I guess I meant in general you can use a bigger gear on a flatter track, on a short steep one you have to accelerate against the banking more so you don't want to use to big a gear. Almost all of my track experience has been on a 166 meter track with 50 degree banking. I never found I had to back off in the turns, it was just more work to accelerate or keep speed up. I'm no expert though.

[11.4]

Yeah. I wasn't very clear. I guess I meant in general you can use a bigger gear on a flatter track, on a short steep one you have to accelerate against the banking more so you don't want to use to big a gear. Almost all of my track experience has been on a 166 meter track with 50 degree banking. I never found I had to back off in the turns, it was just more work to accelerate or keep speed up. I'm no expert though.

This really depends on the track. On big flat tracks like a Marymoor (400 meters, 25 degrees or so), it's practically like winding up to ride a road time trial. But that rule only applies at the pole. If you're riding up track, it has a real hill on each banking -- you'll be hauling a big gear up a real ramp on turns 1 and 3. On the other hand, on some smaller tracks, the straights have a real banking so the elevation mid-track is not as different between the banking and the straights and you can maintain more speed and potentially a bigger gear there. Try to do that on some other short tracks that feel like the Mortirolo going into the turns and you'll quickly see how you have to know each particular track. San Diego has a little more banking on the straights than Marymoor does, not quite as much as T-town, and all three tracks were built in the day when their original owners wanted easy-to-ride community tracks that didn't deliver such high speeds. You can claw a big gear around SD if you really want to, but remember that there's almost always a gale blowing across the track, and when you see a track peloton racing in echelons, you start to understand why a really big gear isn't that smart. Every track is different and each track has its own unique needs in gearing, sometimes its own unique needs in positioning, and definitely its own unique way it imposes on how you race. Trying to gain a lap is hard at a big track, as is trying to jump out of turn 3. A weird track like Alpenrose throws extra technical issues at you -- great to learn but a big surprise to newcomers.

I grew up on the ultra-short ultra-steep six-day tracks in Europe and raced amateur sixes there for several years. On those tracks, you didn't even slow down on the bankings, and when racing sixes you quickly understood why you could keep your speed up even when your partner was racing. If you went to a typical larger American track, you couldn't do that because you'd be trying to keep speed up on the up-track ramps of their rather crappy designs.

And back to the issue of gears: If you have to ride those ramps twice every lap, you can't do it hauling a big gear. If you're riding a points race or madison you can't handle the repetitive accelerations in a big gear. And in a miss-and-out, you're both having to accelerate and then decelerate quickly (the latter because if you aren't in front you have riders slowing in front of you as soon as they escape the cut, and if you ARE in front you slow down to wreak havoc on the riders behind you and make them regret not riding the race from the front). All in all, smaller gears.

If you are simply accelerating once into a kilo or 500m, and you are strictly on the pole, and then you're done, it's a place for a bigger gear. PROVIDED you have the fitness to turn it faster. If you're trying to qualify on a flying 200m, you are riding a short distance and for most tracks you're getting the benefit of a downhill acceleration. But again, IF you are fit enough to go faster with the big gear. That means you're winning and you want to do still better. If you're not qualifying against elites in your 200m, a bigger gear is a waste of time. It's ego. And a rider moving up in competitiveness at the track is better served learning to increase speed without dying on a too-big gear and on learning how to float in the pack without lugging it and having the turn of speed to do evil things to your competition. Just a few easy accelerations in an 88 inch gear can shatter a pack if you can be in front to do it. If a couple such accelerations blow you up, you ain't gonna win anything. And track is about winning. Sorry, but it ain't a triathlon. Track is purely about who gets there first.

[ptourkin]

At Sandy Eggo, you can get away with a 49t and a 50t ring with 14, 15, and 16 cogs.

When Shaun Wallace and Co are running 49 x 15 and winning, well... they're MUCH more experienced than I am, so I tend to follow along with their choices.

M

Wallace is spinning an amazing cadence out there at 50 x 15 and maybe smaller. It's amazing to watch a 50+ guy still kicking ass out there, especially in the longer races.

Stick with a low gear and enjoy the classes and when it's time to come out and race Cs and Ds on Friday night, you can adjust. When it's time for USAC upgrade races or Tuesday night, a bigger one might come into play, maybe not.

[FlashUNC]

Track is purely about who gets there first.

Unless it's a Miss-And-Out, and then it's all about not being last. Until it gets to the final sprint for the win. Then it's about being first.

:banana:

As 11.4 and others have rather eloquently noted -- and as my first track instructor told me -- it's easier to match an acceleration spinning a smaller gear at 110 or 120 rpm than it is to match it in a bigger gear at 70 or 80 rpm.

Ride what you've got and adjust as you learn. Have fun with it.

[pinoymamba]

here are my times for the 200m i did last year. of course each time had different conditions. it was my first year riding and racing a bike. I race crits and mass starts but I love match sprints and keirin. sprints and keirins don't happen often so my motivation for strength work isn't there.

103' - 12.2 (i wasn't going fast enough before the 200m line.)
96' - 11.9 (i felt I ran out of gear or my body couldn't handle +140 rpms)
90' - 12.2

I want to try 100' gi hopefully remember to come in hot before the 200m. I also lost a considerable amount of weight since I first started riding so maybe that will help or sap all of whatever little power I was making.

[Gummee]

Wallace is spinning an amazing cadence out there at 50 x 15 and maybe smaller. It's amazing to watch a 50+ guy still kicking ass out there, especially in the longer races.

Stick with a low gear and enjoy the classes and when it's time to come out and race Cs and Ds on Friday night, you can adjust. When it's time for USAC upgrade races or Tuesday night, a bigger one might come into play, maybe not.

When I was racing there, he was typically riding a 49 x 15.

I found that I liked the 53 x 16 better, but ended up on the 49 x 15 too 'just because.'

Some of the guys would roll 51/52 x 15 for the final points race and sit in till the the last sprints. I tried that a few times and didn't have the strength to get the big gear rolling in the intermediate sprints.

As a n00b, our OP isn't likely to be doing any Kilos or Match Sprints. :nah They don't typically race those on Tuesday nights, so its all Miss-n-Out, Points Races, and Scratch races. Every once in a while you'll get a Madison. ...which happens to be my favorite thing to train and race. Miss that mass chaos!

M

[maximus]

Lots of good advice here.

More interested in having fun, staying fit and trying something new than being a competitor.

Who knows, maybe that will change. Then at least I'll have a real excuse to build up a true racing rig.

@Gummee, hang in there in NoVAland. I just moved to SD from Arlington. Not missing that cold.

[Gummee]

Lots of good advice here.

More interested in having fun, staying fit and trying something new than being a competitor.

Who knows, maybe that will change. Then at least I'll have a real excuse to build up a true racing rig.

@Gummee, hang in there in NoVAland. I just moved to SD from Arlington. Not missing that cold.

you suck. I'd go back in a heartbeat IF I could find something to do that made me enough $ to live there BEFORE I moved (this time!)

Tried it the other way last time. Didn't work so well.

In season, I missed very few Tues Night Racing nights. Highlight of my week. ...right next to Thurs Night Worlds over on Fiesta Island.

M

[maximus]

Highlight of my week. ...right next to Thurs Night Worlds over on Fiesta Island.

This looks pretty amazing.

[Gummee]

This looks pretty amazing.

Be ready to hit 40+ (mph) on the downwind leg

M