My First Rapha

[oldpotatoe]

Ok, so it was a draw string hat/neck gator and it was on sale.

BUT came with a free musette and my goodness, the packaging was really nice, as is the hat..bad mouth if ya like but Rapha has this stuff wired.

[roguedog]

I agree. I was surprised how much I liked the gilet.. and then the wind jacket. Fit is good. Function is good. And both with style that doesn't scream CYCLIST NERD.

[CNY rider]

The over/under for thread length on this one is 7 pages.
Place your bets.

[sg8357]

The over/under for thread length on this one is 7 pages.
Place your bets.

It is winter,
Baseball has the hot stove league, we have Rip on Rapha.

Rapha could play too, put out a "I'm too fat for Rapha" t-shirt.
We could start a kickstarter campaign to buy Rapha some razors and colour
cameras.

[FlashUNC]

Their ear-flapped winter hat is the jam.

[christian]

The best Rapha stuff (Winter tights, Pro Team bibs) is very good and worth the price. The middling Rapha stuff (club jersey, Belgian winter hat) is very middling and obscenely priced for what it is .

If I could reliably tell which is which, I'd probably buy more of their stuff. As it is, I'm always leery.

[AngryScientist]

The best Rapha stuff (Winter tights, Pro Team bibs) is very good and worth the price. The middling Rapha stuff (club jersey, Belgian winter hat) is very middling and obscenely priced for what it is .

If I could reliably tell which is which, I'd probably buy more of their stuff. As it is, I'm always leery.

you can add the softshell jacket and gilet to the "best" list, some of the best kit i own.

[wooly]

Ok, so it was a draw string hat/neck gator and it was on sale.



BUT came with a free musette and my goodness, the packaging was really nice, as is the hat..bad mouth if ya like but Rapha has this stuff wired.


Bwahahahaha - welcome to the dark side.

Jokes aside, their stuff is expensive but I like a lot of their items and resist the urge when their sales hit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[charliedid]

Ok, so it was a draw string hat/neck gator and it was on sale.

BUT came with a free musette and my goodness, the packaging was really nice, as is the hat..bad mouth if ya like but Rapha has this stuff wired.

What they have "wired" is that everyone thinks it's the stuff. They are selling emotion and desire not clothing.

Just sayin.

[Climb01742]

95% of cycling apparel is butt ugly and fits like a sack. Why?

There are fair critiques to make of Rapha, but I'm happy that they exist. And that they have sales.;)

[charliedid]

I'm wearing Rapha Jeans as I type this.

[firerescuefin]

What they have "wired" is that everyone thinks it's the stuff. They are selling emotion and desire not clothing.

Just sayin.

So you've owned it and used it?

[fiamme red]

Their ear-flapped winter hat is the jam.Which reminds me, that I need to place an order with Kucharik for a wool cap:

http://www.kucharikclothing.com/-c-43_66.html

100% wool, made in USA, no upcharge for marketing.

[oldpotatoe]

What they have "wired" is that everyone thinks it's the stuff. They are selling emotion and desire not clothing.

Just sayin.

Exactly!!! They sell lifestyle, kinda like RedBull...altho Rapha clothes actually work..but RedBull is a marketing company..that sells a energy drink.

They do it very well.

[oldpotatoe]

Which reminds me, that I need to place an order with Kucharik for a wool cap:

http://www.kucharikclothing.com/-c-43_66.html

100% wool, made in USA, no upcharge for marketing.

My Rapha hat was $35..still is BTW

http://www.rapha.cc/merino-drawcord-hat

I sold Kucharik for a while, these very wool hats..of the dozen I bought, 3 years later I had 5 left...think the Rapha ones would have 'turned' a little better, even at $50.

[AngryScientist]

They are selling emotion and desire not clothing.

Just sayin.

actually, they are, in fact - selling clothing. some of which works very, very well.

just sayin...

[fiamme red]

My Rapha hat was $35..still is BTW

http://www.rapha.cc/merino-drawcord-hat"Classic snood"? :p

Looks like a ski cap to me. You can't wear it under a helmet.

That's not the same as a wool cap, which Rapha sells for $80, is made in China, and, except for the lining, is mostly polyester: http://www.rapha.cc/deep-winter-hat.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Snood is the word of the day.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_s-ZlvEtKbFE/SwyggMpDSJI/AAAAAAAAAHQ/YrBf0aWB5rk/s1600/SNOODS.jpg

[fiamme red]

actually, they are, in fact - selling clothing. some of which works very, very well.

just sayin...It ought to work well, for what they charge. Just sayin'.

[FlashUNC]

I know my deep winter hat is a go-to for me the last few years of winter riding. And bought on sale at the San Fran Cycle Club for the same price as some of the other options folks have listed here. Keeps my ears nice and toasty, doesn't get too hot and still looks new even after a number of tumbles through the wash.

Let's not let reality get in the way of some good old fashioned hate though.

[Fixed]

Ralph Lauren = expensive well made looks good has style
Rapha = expensive well made looks good has style
I live next door to rapha the place is a like a club house for local cyclist
it is great to stop in on the way out or coming back from a ride ..cool place to sit read watch races ( shown all day on their large screen ).coffee and food jazz music
I love the place
Cheers

[MattTuck]

A couple weeks ago, I ordered a vacuum this one, actually. (http://www.amazon.com/Eureka-Smart-Vac-Upright-Cleaner-4870MZ/dp/B0015ASJIY)

$139.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/412oTe4YZIL.jpg

It is sometimes hard to reconcile the price of cycling clothing (not specific to Rapha, as Assos and many others are selling expensive stuff) compared to other things. I mean, that vacuum has engineering behind it, metal, plastic, moving parts...

What is cycling clothing? Some fabric, a chamois pad, sewing it together...

I can't imagine the differential in cost is all in the materials and manufacturing cost. It does make one scratch his head. Not saying it isn't good stuff, or it isn't worth it, just an observation on what you get for your money.

[gdw]

"I know my deep winter hat is a go-to for me the last few years of winter riding. "

Charlotte only has three seasons and winter isn't one of them.

"What is cycling clothing? Some fabric, a chamois pad, sewing it together... I can't imagine the differential in cost is all in the materials and manufacturing cost. It does make one scratch his head. Not saying it isn't good stuff, or it isn't worth it, just an observation on what you get for your money. "

+1

[CPP]

Peter,
Could you post a picture of you wearing the hat?
Please?

[FlashUNC]

"I know my deep winter hat is a go-to for me the last few years of winter riding. "

Charlotte only has three seasons and winter isn't one of them.

"What is cycling clothing? Some fabric, a chamois pad, sewing it together... I can't imagine the differential in cost is all in the materials and manufacturing cost. It does make one scratch his head. Not saying it isn't good stuff, or it isn't worth it, just an observation on what you get for your money. "

+1

Thanks. I'll be sure to tell Mother Nature that when it's 25 Saturday morning when I roll out. Or when it was 9 during the cold snap last week.

Where by chance do you ride? Greenland?

Never mind the ridiculous notion that what keeps some people warm is total overkill for others.

Seriously dude, go punch a pillow.

[gdw]

Lighten up. I spent a few years in your area and 25 is far from the average temperature.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

Everybody remembers their first time 😜

[FlashUNC]

Lighten up. I spent a few years in your area and 25 is far from the average temperature.

And the last few winters have been colder than average. Really cold actually.

And no, I won't lighten up over a cheap shot that tries to score some Internet tough guy points over the weather for Pete's sake. So yeah, piss off.

[gdw]

OK Francis, I'll go pound my pillow or piss off. Please ignore my sarcasm and enjoy your classic style hat beloved by Belgian hardmen, you obviously need it.

[Birddog]

I have a lot of Rapha stuff, all bought on sale or were gifted, so prices were very reasonable. Their Classic Bibs are great and they wear and wear and wear some more. The little pocket in the back is useful too.

I happen to like the Club style jerseys which I use for 3 seasons, they are just too hot for summer in this area. I really like some of the features like the small zipper pocket and the pump pocket. The ability to put a water bottle in the middle pocket is also a major plus. They also wear pretty well although a little prone to pilling.

Rapha caps are the best, expensive yes but again on sale. I wear a cap under my helmet with the bill forward to cut down on the reflection produced by my glasses with the RX insert. Rapha has the correct length of bill (2" or less). This allows you to see without flipping the bill up and losing the shade. I also like that most of their caps aren't "beanie" cut, they fit better. Their fine cotton cap is great and keeps me cool in hot weather. The winter cap with the ear flap is also good. If some other company had some of these features I'd give them a whirl too, but so far the imitators are leaving the features I like out. I don't buy for the vibe or the image, though I do like the absence of garish logos.

[572cv]

Caps....I am particularly fond of the Ibex caps, also pricey, but really durable and keep looking nice.

I wasn't really going to say so to the vast and exacting forum of the Paceline, but after years of reading comments of forumites, I, like OP the o.p., succumbed to the winter sale from Rapha. My indulgence was the gillet, as I had an actual need for a vest. You're right OP, very impressive packaging, and a nice touch on the musette. The gillet fits very well, seems to have nice touches; I'm looking forward to trying it out on actual roads.

[fiamme red]

Lighten up. I spent a few years in your area and 25 is far from the average temperature.But it feels like 25 for those who have a thin skin. ;)

[tribarbet]

This thread is making me buy some Rapha stuff. I've never had any, but I'm tempted now.

[Elefantino]

Made one Rapha purchase, a Galibier jersey thanks to a connection discount. Super quality; nice packaging. Never wore it but fully intended to. Then a year later saw what they were selling for and let it go at a nice profit.

Love Rapha!

[TheEnglish]

I will admit that I have a few Rapha pieces and I actually really like them. They are expensive, but they are my favorite pieces of kit (not because of emotion, but fit, materials, and finish). I just bought a kit from Kitsbow (for those not familiar, they are kind of the Rapha of mountain biking); my impression of Kitsbow is that their fit, materials, and finish is slightly better than Rapha. I will ride around in my new gear this weekend and report back.

The other worthwhile feature of these companies is their customer service. I have had a few issues with Rapha and they have taken care of me each and every time with a pleasurable interaction and quick turn around. Kitsbow is similar in their efforts to make sure their customers are taken care of. I am of the mindset that I would rather spend more money on one piece of great gear that lasts and has a company that backs it up, than many pieces that last a year or two and have no customer service.

That's all just my opinion and if you don't like Rapha or Kitsbow or Assos or chamois creme, that's awesome too. Just ride your bikes and have fun.

Hope everyone has a great long weekend.
cheers,
-e

[PQJ]

This thread is making me buy some Rapha stuff. I've never had any, but I'm tempted now.

It's good stuff (fit, form and function). If you can afford it, knock yourself out; if not, fear not for other stuff will do you just fine.

Don't be swayed by the naysayers. For some unknown reason, they see "Rapha," their knickers self-knot, and the whole world has to know.

[christian]

Don't get me started on Kitsbow. I had to have my IT department block access to the site so I couldn't buy it. That stuff looks great, and the fabrics they use are amazing. If they have the fits right, it's world-class gear.

[blantonator]

I try not to pay full price for rapha or ask for it as gifts. That being said, the pro team stuff is really really nice. Far nicer than the Capo my team uses.

[rwsaunders]

I love the Rapha branding and merchandising efforts and it sure appears that they really do support the cycling culture. Looking at their offerings has actually pushed me to purchase some similar items (jerseys and caps) from Cedar Cycling, Rothera Cycling and Road Holland.

[Louis]

A couple weeks ago, I ordered a vacuum this one, actually. (http://www.amazon.com/Eureka-Smart-Vac-Upright-Cleaner-4870MZ/dp/B0015ASJIY)

What kind of filter does it use?

I dislike the reusable HEPA filters, because cleaning them is a huge PITA, but they are easy to remove and replace. The "bag" type don't have to be cleaned because they just get tossed, but I doubt they filter very well and typically they aren't very easy to install.

So, are there any designs out there that offer the best of both worlds?

[RedRider]

Rapha are the smartest guys in the cycling business.

[etu]

my first were 3/4 bib shorts which have been great for the SF bay area late fall/winter riding.

[nmrt]

At this point I would comfortably wear Rapha if it did not say Rapha.
:-)

[edl]

Thanks guys. I really didn't need more clothing, but I can't resist a sale and there was a 10% Rapha coupon in my inbox begging to be used.


I live next door to rapha the place is a like a club house for local cyclist
it is great to stop in on the way out or coming back from a ride ..cool place to sit read watch races ( shown all day on their large screen ).coffee and food jazz music
I love the place
Cheers

I went to the Rapha SF store back in 2011 to try on their bibs (my first Rapha purchase) - like you said, a great place staffed with nice people where you can hang out all day.

[FlashUNC]

OK Francis, I'll go pound my pillow or piss off. Please ignore my sarcasm and enjoy your classic style hat beloved by Belgian hardmen, you obviously need it.

https://images.encyclopediadramatica.es/c/c6/YOU_MAD.jpg

[St2946]

Country hat is wickedness.

[oldpotatoe]

"Classic snood"? :p

Looks like a ski cap to me. You can't wear it under a helmet.

That's not the same as a wool cap, which Rapha sells for $80, is made in China, and, except for the lining, is mostly polyester: http://www.rapha.cc/deep-winter-hat.

I guess that sound is the point whizzing over your head. "Kucharik" might be 'made in USA' and 'don't spend money on marketing' but ask 10 cyclists who Kucharik is and probably 7 won't know...now repeat with 'Rapha', report back.

[zmudshark]

I still have my Protog wool hat. I am old.

[stackie]

A couple weeks ago, I ordered a vacuum this one, actually. (http://www.amazon.com/Eureka-Smart-Vac-Upright-Cleaner-4870MZ/dp/B0015ASJIY)

$139.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/412oTe4YZIL.jpg

It is sometimes hard to reconcile the price of cycling clothing (not specific to Rapha, as Assos and many others are selling expensive stuff) compared to other things. I mean, that vacuum has engineering behind it, metal, plastic, moving parts...

What is cycling clothing? Some fabric, a chamois pad, sewing it together...

I can't imagine the differential in cost is all in the materials and manufacturing cost. It does make one scratch his head. Not saying it isn't good stuff, or it isn't worth it, just an observation on what you get for your money.

Matt, I guarantee that your Rapha or other nice cycling clothing will outlast that vacuum by a factor of 10, that is in years. If we considered hours of use, the equation would favor cycling clothing even more. Additionally, your enjoyment of the cycling clothing will be far greater than that of vacuum.

Sure, there is some significant engineering in the vacuum, probably done twenty years ago. The only engineering done now on that product is how to make part AB10 slightly cheaper and failure prone, so that they can make $0.01 more per unit and cause the unit to fail that much sooner so you have to buy a new one.

Just my 2 cents.

Jon

[ik2280]

I was given a Rapha classic jersey for my birthday. Haven't ridden in it yet (don't see the point of getting it dirty if it's just under my jacket), but the attention to detail seems pretty impressive.

[OtayBW]

What they have "wired" is that everyone thinks it's the stuff. They are selling emotion and desire not clothing.

Just sayin.
Yup - they are clearly marketing sizzle first, steak second. They may make the greatest 'steak' in the world that will last years, but for me, they just don't offer value. There is plenty of other stuff stuff out there that I own (or lust after) that works extremely well for what I want, and for less.

[Marz]

It's good stuff (fit, form and function). If you can afford it, knock yourself out; if not, fear not for other stuff will do you just fine.

Don't be swayed by the naysayers. For some unknown reason, they see "Rapha," their knickers self-knot, and the whole world has to know.

Exactly. No gun to anyone's head.

[Louis]

Don't be swayed by the naysayers. For some unknown reason, they see "Rapha," their knickers self-knot, and the whole world has to know.

This goes both ways - I tease the Rapha-lovers because they seem to be a pretty sensitive bunch themselves. Just raise one eyebrow at the product and they go into full self-defense mode.

You want yak leather cycling shoes? Knock yourself out, but do admit that that's going a bit far.

http://blog.jonahkessel.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/yak.jpg

[charliedid]

So you've owned it and used it?

Yes, I was endorsing it not criticizing it.

[charliedid]

actually, they are, in fact - selling clothing. some of which works very, very well.

just sayin...

You seemed to have missed my point.

You don't "sell" a pair of pants, you sell all the great things you will do and all the beautiful people you will meet while wearing said pants.

[AgilisMerlin]

haven't had my first rapha yet

do not know if i ever will


just a(my) thought(s)

[Lionel]

put me in the "meh" category. Did not like the bibs, did not like the softshell. Long sleeve jersey is nice, short sleeve jersey is ok, nothing special.

[charliedid]

What kind of filter does it use?

I dislike the reusable HEPA filters, because cleaning them is a huge PITA, but they are easy to remove and replace. The "bag" type don't have to be cleaned because they just get tossed, but I doubt they filter very well and typically they aren't very easy to install.

So, are there any designs out there that offer the best of both worlds?

Look here if you want a vacuum

Miele (http://www.mieleusa.com/products/index.asp?oT=26&cat=1&active=Our%20Products&subm=Vacuum%20Cleaners)

[charliedid]

Yup - they are clearly marketing sizzle first, steak second. They may make the greatest 'steak' in the world that will last years, but for me, they just don't offer value. There is plenty of other stuff stuff out there that I own (or lust after) that works extremely well for what I want, and for less.

Actually I think they are both first.

[Wilkinson4]

I guess that sound is the point whizzing over your head. "Kucharik" might be 'made in USA' and 'don't spend money on marketing' but ask 10 cyclists who Kucharik is and probably 7 won't know...now repeat with 'Rapha', report back.

I still have 2 Kucharik jerseys, tights and arm warmers in rotation but the arm warmers are done. I have had Sergel leg warmers for 25 years now!

mIKW

[Louis]

Look here if you want a vacuum

Miele (http://www.mieleusa.com/products/index.asp?oT=26&cat=1&active=Our%20Products&subm=Vacuum%20Cleaners)

I'd have to clean way more often to justify spending that kind of $$$ :)

[charliedid]

I'd have to clean way more often to justify spending that kind of $$$ :)

I'm not planning to buy another vacuum, and it literally was night and day from the Eureka we had. It took us 5 yrs to actually plunk down the scratch but damn it is the real deal.

Sorry for the vacuum drift.

[rando]

Ok, so it was a draw string hat/neck gator and it was on sale.

BUT came with a free musette and my goodness, the packaging was really nice, as is the hat..bad mouth if ya like but Rapha has this stuff wired.

Not surprised to see you bought one of the best practical items they make. The merino arm/knee/leg warmers are in that same class.

When it comes to cool weather, the deep Winter bibtights have to make the more exclusive shortlist for their hard riding performance. Even if the hard part is the confined to conditions faced on a mile ride to the neighbors.

I doubt you are going to stop finding reasons to like Rapha leaving a package on your doorstep occasionally.

[technicolor]

You want yak leather cycling shoes? Knock yourself out, but do admit that that's going a bit far.

Specialized makes a pair out of kangaroo leather that cost $400.00. Yak "a bit far", but kangaroo, ok? Or, is kangaroo a no go too? Haven't heard anybody complaining about those with the same zeal that they harp on Rapha.

Specialized 74 shoes (http://www.specialized.com/us/en/ftr/shoes/road-shoes/74-road)

[Louis]

I think most folks would consider Tibet and yaks to be more exotic than Australia and kangaroos, but that's probably splitting hairs (or hides, as the case may be). But you have a point - Specialized doesn't take the flak Rapha gets (except for the copyright infringement fiasco) but I imagine that's because their approach to marketing is significantly different, and just not as "epic" as Rapha.

In my case, if a given animal's hide (or the plastic equivalent) is good enough of Sidi it's good enough for me.

[jtolive]

This thread inspired me to also get some Rapha gear. Based on advice here I got the hat and a gillet.

Now just waiting for delivery...

BTW - how is gillet correctly pronounced? Like it's spelled (i.e. like skillet) or like french (i.e. like gill-lay)? I'd guess it's the latter.

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

Everybody remembers their first time ��

And most are forgettable. Or at least want to be forgotten.

Castelli and Santini, just about across the board, in the bike wardrobe for me. Never tried/owned Rapha, and I've never said never. Their little "movies" are a guilty pleasure of mine. But, like shoes/sunglasses/steel bikes/10S alloy Campy/music/etc, I have too many of those. I like the font on their bibs.

Life is short, do/wear what you like.

[weisan]

My first and probably last Rapha purchase is their wool jersey, bought at a special sale price, which is still more than what I usually spent on bike clothing. I have loved it, it was the perfect winter jersey for Melbourne and now Texas with more days that has temperature ranging from 45-65 degrees than freezng or below freezing. In the colder temp, I just pair it up with with a base layer or warmers and it would be just right without too much layers. For anything above 55, I just wear it on its own, it's perfect.

The reason I say I probably won't buy again, mainly is the price and secondly, the durability. This thing is going to last me a looooong time. I had it for three years now, and it still looked new.

http://alicehui.com/AUS/pics/mini-P1120505.JPG

[Black Dog]

BTW - how is gillet correctly pronounced? Like it's spelled (i.e. like skillet) or like french (i.e. like gill-lay)? I'd guess it's the latter.

It is pronounced vest. :rolleyes:

If you were to say it in french it would be pronounced jill-eh with the first sound ½ way between j and z. BTW I am french and say vest. it is the Brits that call it a gillet. In french it is veste or gilet.

Non the less, rapha is a marketing monster and there is nothing really wrong with that unless you do not like the message they market. That is what gets stuck in most peoples craw. Personally I find the black and white epic hard-man message too much and like a lot of good marketing it creates cults. Their stuff, while being very good, is a bit too pricey for chinese made clothing. But I suppose that the price is part of the marketing.

[r_mutt]

It is pronounced vest. :rolleyes:

If you were to say it in french it would be pronounced jill-eh with the first sound ½ way between j and z. BTW I am french and say vest. it is the Brits that call it a gillet. In french it is veste or gilet.

Non the less, rapha is a marketing monster and there is nothing really wrong with that unless you do not like the message they market. That is what gets stuck in most peoples craw. Personally I find the black and white epic hard-man message too much and like a lot of good marketing it creates cults. Their stuff, while being very good, is a bit too pricey for chinese made clothing. But I suppose that the price is part of the marketing.



Good post. The price is also about exclusiveness. The more expensive something is the more exclusive it is- and the more desirable it becomes. Is a Pinarello worth almost twice what an Supersix Evo costs?

[Black Dog]

Good post. The price is also about exclusiveness. The more expensive something is the more exclusive it is- and the more desirable it becomes. Is a Pinarello worth almost twice what an Supersix Evo costs?

True. Exclusive status is always expensive.

[ptourkin]

A couple weeks ago, I ordered a vacuum this one, actually. (http://www.amazon.com/Eureka-Smart-Vac-Upright-Cleaner-4870MZ/dp/B0015ASJIY)

$139.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/412oTe4YZIL.jpg

It is sometimes hard to reconcile the price of cycling clothing (not specific to Rapha, as Assos and many others are selling expensive stuff) compared to other things. I mean, that vacuum has engineering behind it, metal, plastic, moving parts...

What is cycling clothing? Some fabric, a chamois pad, sewing it together...

I can't imagine the differential in cost is all in the materials and manufacturing cost. It does make one scratch his head. Not saying it isn't good stuff, or it isn't worth it, just an observation on what you get for your money.

I just replaced my Dyson with a Shark out of the Amazon warehouse at a very low cost and it works like a charm. That said, I can't bring myself to do the same with my Assos bibs. It does work very well and for the amount of hours I'm wearing it, the cost breaks down to not so much compared to some of the components we obsess over. Every time I ride my uber-expensive road rig, I'm wearing a set of those bibs.

I look at it as just another component for that rig - if you will, part of the saddle interface. I don't think many of us would replace our saddle of choice with something cut rate from Nashbar based solely on price.

[Fixed]

I just replaced my Dyson with a Shark out of the Amazon warehouse at a very low cost and it works like a charm. That said, I can't bring myself to do the same with my Assos bibs. It does work very well and for the amount of hours I'm wearing it, the cost breaks down to not so much compared to some of the components we obsess over. Every time I ride my uber-expensive road rig, I'm wearing a set of those bibs.

I look at it as just another component for that rig - if you will, part of the saddle interface. I don't think many of us would replace our saddle of choice with something cut rate from Nashbar based solely on price.

My girlfriend has a Miele vac and washer/ dryer .
She loves rapha on me
Cheers

[572cv]

I'm amused that this thread morphed from a discussion of Rapha to one of vacuum cleaners...yeah!

[PQJ]

I'm amused that this thread morphed from a discussion of Rapha to one of vacuum cleaners...yeah!

Moral of the story?: Rapha sucks.

[pdmtong]

Moral of the story?: Rapha sucks.

Good one but No points awarded for a way too easy snicker

[charliedid]

I'm amused that this thread morphed from a discussion of Rapha to one of vacuum cleaners...yeah!

I wonder if people on the vacuum forums ask OT questions about what the best cycling clothing is?

:-)

[oldpotatoe]

The over/under for thread length on this one is 7 pages.
Place your bets.

Bing, bing, bing, we have a winner!

[jmeloy]

Wife surprised me with a Hard Shell she picked up for me on sale and really impressed with it after a couple of very cold rides. Don't care about the marketing, just the performance.

[rustychisel]

I think most folks would consider Tibet and yaks to be more exotic than Australia and kangaroos, but that's probably splitting hairs (or hides, as the case may be). But you have a point - Specialized doesn't take the flak Rapha gets (except for the copyright infringement fiasco) but I imagine that's because their approach to marketing is significantly different, and just not as "epic" as Rapha.

In my case, if a given animal's hide (or the plastic equivalent) is good enough of Sidi it's good enough for me.


We can get to 7 pages. no worries.

Louis, don't you worry about those oversized rats, there's no shortage of them down here and it gives the gun nuts something to massacre, although I suspect more kangaroo are mown down by outback drivers in 4WD than anything else. Come to think of it, a bit like cyclists...

[Fixed]

Not more than two miles from the rapha store I saw the biggest coyote I have ever seen it was as big as a wolf
Cheers :)

[rustychisel]

Not more than two miles from the rapha store I saw the biggest coyote I have ever seen it was as big as a wolf
Cheers :)


there's a moral to that story somewhere, maybe

"I was told by someone to knows someone that Rapha keep their own animals at the store, fatten them up then kill them in exquisite agony to make the shoes and feed the guts to coyotes."

It's true! It was on the internet.

[rustychisel]

Not more than two miles from the rapha store I saw the biggest coyote I have ever seen it was as big as a wolf
Cheers :)


there's a moral to that story somewhere, maybe

"I was told by someone who knows someone that Rapha keep their own animals at the store, fatten them up then kill them in exquisite agony to make the shoes and feed the guts to coyotes."

It's true! It was on the internet.

[fuzzalow]

Good post. The price is also about exclusiveness. The more expensive something is the more exclusive it is- and the more desirable it becomes. Is a Pinarello worth almost twice what an Supersix Evo costs?

True. Exclusive status is always expensive.

Big difference between status created by marketing and status conferred by superior qualities of the good being sold. The best products often play to a bit of both as far as hype and quality because one aspect reinforces the other - kinda like as in a good lie always has a kernel of truth in order to be convincing.

IMO junky products that drive to market on marketing hype always have to keep the heat up because the product can't stand or survive on its own merits. For example SRAM has always left this impression with me. The diametric opposite to what SRAM hasn't or must do is Ferrari - this marque does not require marketing to survive or prosper. Keep in mind that most of the brands we have in cycling will make as many of the item as they can sell so the brand must create exclusivity by perception instead of by, well, exclusivity. Enzo Ferrari had always said that he wanted to make one less Ferrari than he could sell.

Rapha plays the game well. If it were a brand devoid of any credibility or substance it would fade away to anonymity like Ginsu knives do when the TV set is turned off.

[oldpotatoe]

Big difference between status created by marketing and status conferred by superior qualities of the good being sold. The best products often play to a bit of both as far as hype and quality because one aspect reinforces the other - kinda like as in a good lie always has a kernel of truth in order to be convincing.

IMO junky products that drive to market on marketing hype always have to keep the heat up because the product can't stand or survive on its own merits. For example SRAM has always left this impression with me. The diametric opposite to what SRAM hasn't or must do is Ferrari - this marque does not require marketing to survive or prosper. Keep in mind that most of the brands we have in cycling will make as many of the item as they can sell so the brand must create exclusivity by perception instead of by, well, exclusivity. Enzo Ferrari had always said that he wanted to make one less Ferrari than he could sell.

Rapha plays the game well. If it were a brand devoid of any credibility or substance it would fade away to anonymity like Ginsu knives do when the TV set is turned off.

There was a guy hyping these at the grocery yesterday!! Ginsu.by a set, get 2 free!!

I agree..like Rolex..true premium brands don't need a lot of marketing and even if they do, it's not the 'ours is better than theirs', type...make them compete with you, not the other way around.

[Black Dog]

Big difference between status created by marketing and status conferred by superior qualities of the good being sold. The best products often play to a bit of both as far as hype and quality because one aspect reinforces the other - kinda like as in a good lie always has a kernel of truth in order to be convincing.

IMO junky products that drive to market on marketing hype always have to keep the heat up because the product can't stand or survive on its own merits. For example SRAM has always left this impression with me. The diametric opposite to what SRAM hasn't or must do is Ferrari - this marque does not require marketing to survive or prosper. Keep in mind that most of the brands we have in cycling will make as many of the item as they can sell so the brand must create exclusivity by perception instead of by, well, exclusivity. Enzo Ferrari had always said that he wanted to make one less Ferrari than he could sell.

Rapha plays the game well. If it were a brand devoid of any credibility or substance it would fade away to anonymity like Ginsu knives do when the TV set is turned off.

No one is denying that Rapha stuff is very good. It is. However, there is no limited supply of Rapha gear. There are no old world artisans with callused hands that sew the items with hand drawn Yak sinew in an old black and white factory in the hills of the Ardennes carefully making one pair of shorts a week. They are mass produced in an "epic sweat shop" in China and they could ramp up production by an order of magnitude in a month or two if needed. Even Epic® is made in a factory and shipped in volume in black and pink barrels.

[Auk]

No one is denying that Rapha stuff is very good. It is. However, there is no limited supply of Rapha gear because the old world artisans that sew the items with hand drawn Yak sinew in an old dirty black and white factory in the hills of the Ardennes are carefully making one pair of shorts a week. They are mass produced in a sweat shop in China and they could ramp up production by an order of magnitude in a month or two if they had the sales.

ANd how is this different than any other non-bespoke clothing maker? you either like the product and the way it functions or you don't. The fact that the marketing of it makes you cringe is just an aside.

[Black Dog]

ANd how is this different than any other non-bespoke clothing maker? you either like the product and the way it functions or you don't. The fact that the marketing of it makes you cringe is just an aside.

It is not different than most, who said it was? However, there are some other makers that do make great stuff and do not outsource to china and not marketed to in such a way. When you by from them you are paying living wages to a worker in, at least, semi democratic country. Buying stuff is not always a like it or not decision. What and how we buy things has a profound effect on the world we live in, more than our votes often do.

[cfox]

No one is denying that Rapha stuff is very good. It is. However, there is no limited supply of Rapha gear. There are no old world artisans with callused hands that sew the items with hand drawn Yak sinew in an old black and white factory in the hills of the Ardennes carefully making one pair of shorts a week. They are mass produced in an "epic sweat shop" in China and they could ramp up production by an order of magnitude in a month or two if needed. Even Epic® is made in a factory and shipped in volume in black and pink barrels.

Getting old re: China. I feel compelled to point this out every time the China thing comes up on a Rapha thread (which is every single time): most of their stuff is not made in China. Their bibs, which make up the vast majority of their sales, are made in Italy. Most of their merino goods are made in Portugal, and so on. Yes, some stuff is from China, but the majority is made in Europe. It doesn't matter to me, but it should be pointed out for those for whom it matters.

[charliedid]

No one is denying that Rapha stuff is very good. It is. However, there is no limited supply of Rapha gear. There are no old world artisans with callused hands that sew the items with hand drawn Yak sinew in an old black and white factory in the hills of the Ardennes carefully making one pair of shorts a week. They are mass produced in an "epic sweat shop" in China and they could ramp up production by an order of magnitude in a month or two if needed. Even Epic® is made in a factory and shipped in volume in black and pink barrels.

I'm fairly certain that a portion of those barrels are light blue.

[Black Dog]

I'm fairly certain that a portion of those barrels are light blue.

Sorry, you are right. That shade of blue is made from the egg shells of endangered Himalayan robins.

[rando]

Or a single batch of tempura made of ultramarine and eggs from the worlds most fashionably extinct black bird. A little bit goes a long ways but the price is astonishing.

[AJosiahK]

Some of their products hit the spot 100%, others completely fail.

Pricey yes, depending on what piece youve hit gold.

Im lucky enough to at least the the body type of their "target market"

pro team bibs are amazing, lightweight bibs however wore through after a no more than 2 months of medium use.

[enr1co]

OK, I guess Rapha "resistance is futile" when if one hangs around this forum enough ;)

Late to the party but finally succumbed and took the plunge with placing an on-line order after trying on a few items at the SF store and liking the fit, function, looks. Will add that the guys at the SF store were friendly and helpful. :banana:

Their videos with Hampsten and Lemond can also be blamed for inciting curiosity and appealing to the fan boy in me.

http://www.hampsten.com/the-rapha-continental-santa-rosa-california-with-andy-hampsten/

http://vimeo.com/52880703

Was conservative and went for the staple "classic" shorts and jersey in black for the slimming effect :) Ended up being the most I've ever spent for those items but relying on the + comments and feedback of the quality and durability to qualify the "investment" and amortizing the total cost of ownership over a few years.

Now I just need to not shave for a few months to further accentuate the Rapha look ;)

[pdmtong]

OK, I guess Rapha "resistance is futile" when if one hangs around this forum enough ;)

Late to the party but finally succumbed and took the plunge with placing an on-line order after trying on a few items at the SF store and liking the fit, function, looks. Will add that the guys at the SF store were friendly and helpful. :banana:

Their videos with Hampsten and Lemond can also be blamed for inciting curiosity and appealing to the fan boy in me.

http://www.hampsten.com/the-rapha-continental-santa-rosa-california-with-andy-hampsten/

http://vimeo.com/52880703

Was conservative and went for the staple "classic" shorts and jersey in black for the slimming effect :) Ended up being the most I've ever spent for those items but relying on the + comments and feedback of the quality and durability to qualify the "investment" and amortizing the total cost of ownership over a few years.

Now I just need to not shave for a few months to further accentuate the Rapha look ;)

The bib shorts are fantastic and you will get YEARS of use from them. The classic jersey is a very nice piece but IMHO too warm for SFBA between april - september. you are in walnut creek/LAMORINDA? time to buy a rapha SLW or PT jersey too. Congrats on the hampsten BTW...sweet.

[bcroslin]

I took advantage of the 20% coupon for filling out the Rapha survey a few weeks back and bought a pair of the light weight bibs and I have to say they're very nice. Best part was I originally purchased a medium but they were too small so I simply shipped them back for free and exchanged them for a large. Painless.

[ZOOMZOOM123]

What really sold me were the interactions between Rapha and my cycling buddies. One friend sent in his bibs because they started to fray after a year. They knowingly credited him the full amount for a new pair of bibs and not for the sale amount he had paid previously. Rapha also replaced another friend's jersey as it started to discolor with no questions asked. Expensive as their clothing may be, I respect their no-questions-asked return policy and also that you can send in your clothing for repair.

[enr1co]

The bib shorts are fantastic and you will get YEARS of use from them. The classic jersey is a very nice piece but IMHO too warm for SFBA between april - september. you are in walnut creek/LAMORINDA? time to buy a rapha SLW or PT jersey too. Congrats on the hampsten BTW...sweet.
Thanks PDM! Yeah, will save the classic jersey for more mild days especially since its also black. Will have to save up and sell few more food stamps for a Rapha lighter weigh jersey. In the meantime, will use my regular light weight/lycra bike club kits for the current toasty weather :)

[pdmtong]

Thanks PDM! Yeah, will save the classic jersey for more mild days especially since its also black. Will have to save up and sell few more food stamps for a Rapha lighter weigh jersey. In the meantime, will use my regular light weight/lycra bike club kits for the current toasty weather :)

its hard for me to reconcile food stamps with a EPS colnago :)

Teasing you man...you have a great set up and that you rode P-R earlier this year...living the life!

[enr1co]

I took advantage of the 20% coupon for filling out the Rapha survey a few weeks back and bought a pair of the light weight bibs and I have to say they're very nice. Best part was I originally purchased a medium but they were too small so I simply shipped them back for free and exchanged them for a large. Painless.

Yes, that survey coupon was a nice incentive-helped a little with swallowing the big price tag :)

I also ordered set of the pro bibs as I liked the extra compression feel but wasnt completely sure which fit I preferred more between the classic bib. Figured I could return one of them easily unless I end up keeping both :eek:

[enr1co]

its hard for me to reconcile food stamps with a EPS colnago :)

Teasing you man...you have a great set up and that you rode P-R earlier this year...living the life!

Lol- didnt think I'd get any violins playing from anyone with that line. Perhaps, I should use the " need to pull my daughter out of private school" line :D

[pdmtong]

Yes, that survey coupon was a nice incentive-helped a little with swallowing the big price tag :)



I also ordered set of the pro bibs as I liked the extra compression feel but wasnt completely sure which fit I preferred more between the classic bib. Figured I could return one of them easily unless I end up keeping both :eek:


The classic are no issue 100/10,000' feet. Nice comfy no sagging. I have a pair on year five mans the pad is still good an no see through.

The pro bibs fit great once I'm on the bike. The pad seems thinner so haven't taken beyond 60 miles. They do fit more pro for sue

[chasea]

The classic are no issue 100/10,000' feet. Nice comfy no sagging. I have a pair on year five mans the pad is still good an no see through.

The pro bibs fit great once I'm on the bike. The pad seems thinner so haven't taken beyond 60 miles. They do fit more pro for sue

Rapha is a one-chamois company (in each gender, anyway). The difference in shorts is the pad placement, and the material its sewn into.

-C

[JWDR]

I have two pair of classic bibs. I really should break down and buy two to three more pairs, it would cut down on my laundry. I've given away almost all of my other bibs since I really only want to wear my Rapha ones.

[pdmtong]

Rapha is a one-chamois company (in each gender, anyway). The difference in shorts is the pad placement, and the material its sewn into.



-C


Thanks for the confirmation. It must be the placement then. I'm a modestly aggressive 7.5-8.0cm drop at 75cm saddle and eTT 56.0 so the PT pad placement does feel good. I'll experiment with longer and longer versus jumping from 60 to 100 miles to put my anxiety to rest

[oldpotatoe]

Finally got around to wearing the jersey, and it is very, very nice...

Sized pretty small for my dough boy shape but I like it lots.

[mktng]

I only knock Rapha because it's out of my price range. BUT. I did have the awesome opportunity to pick up a cap off here. Let me say... I love my cycling caps... Rapha one takes the cake for best quality and fit. Something so small out of the range of clothing they offer... Yet such good quality... Kinda makes me want to splurge on a kit. With that being said. Maybe when I sell a bike or two... I'll buy a kit. Hahha

[druptight]

Just got my first pair of their bib shorts. Was perusing ebay the other AM, and someone had listed a set of XL classic bibs allegedly tried on and never used and noticed they were 2 towns over. Pinged him and made an offer to meet up and avoid fees and we made it happen. He definitely lied about never being worn before on the bike, but they mustn't have been used more than a time or two.

Anyways, only ridden them once so far but they seem nice. Looking forward to logging some miles on them.

[mktng]

I've heard only good things about their clothing. Remember someone here made a legit point to justify the price. It'll last longer than two cheap kits. Maybe three? So I guess the price is worth it.

[FlashUNC]

Rapha is a one-chamois company (in each gender, anyway). The difference in shorts is the pad placement, and the material its sewn into.

-C

Is this a recent running change? The classic bibs I have -- admittedly a couple years old at this point -- have a different chamois from my Pro Team bibs. Seems a bit thicker with a tad different shape in the classics.

[nathanong87]

i think my classic from 3 years ago have the same chamois as the pro team.

what i dont think are the same is the SLW bibs, and the classic/pro team.

rapha bibs are very good though. I am hyphy about them, but i have like 6 sets. I dont buy team bibs anymore, just wear black rapha for whatever team top i need to wear.

[bobswire]

Another jersey I can only lust after..... http://www.rapha.cc/us/en_US/shop/kings-of-pain-jersey/product/KOP01XXBLKMED

[fiamme red]

Another jersey I can only lust after..... http://www.rapha.cc/us/en_US/shop/kings-of-pain-jersey/product/KOP01XXBLKMEDIt would a lot be more useful if they put some hi-viz stripes on this solid black jersey rather than the "Convicts of the Road" stripes. :rolleyes:

[Dired]

Another jersey I can only lust after..... http://www.rapha.cc/us/en_US/shop/kings-of-pain-jersey/product/KOP01XXBLKMED

That's bad ass.

If anyone is looking for a nice alternative, Cafe Du Cycliste stuff is also top notch.

[enr1co]

Thanks for the confirmation. It must be the placement then. I'm a modestly aggressive 7.5-8.0cm drop at 75cm saddle and eTT 56.0 so the PT pad placement does feel good. I'll experiment with longer and longer versus jumping from 60 to 100 miles to put my anxiety to rest

I just received my Rapha order containing both Classic and Pro Fit shorts and the chamois pad shape and thickness does look and feel identical. The Classic lycra material feels just a tad thicker, softer and stretch-ier than the higher compression, stiffer Pro material which may contribute the thicker pad feel?

Found that the more stretchy Classic material also allows the bib straps to be put on easier. Side by side, the Pro looks to be cut slightly smaller than the Classic and combined with the stiffer material makes it harder to pull on so went ahead and re ordered the next size up. Figure that even when I lose some weight in the next few months the compression fabric will still be snug.

I do really like the poly wool feel of the Classic jersey which feels very comfortable and soft against the skin.

Hope to be able to take advantage of their "jersey downsize" program in the next year to look a little more "Rapha" versus my current "Rapha-t" :o

[bobswire]

That's bad ass.

If anyone is looking for a nice alternative, Cafe Du Cycliste stuff is also top notch.

Very nice looking quality wear, still too high for my wallet. http://www.cafeducycliste.com/en/shop/men

I've settled on Torm, nice quality and material at a price I can rationalize. http://torm.cc/

[Dired]

Very nice looking quality wear, still too high for my wallet. http://www.cafeducycliste.com/en/shop/men

I've settled on Torm, nice quality and material at a price I can rationalize. http://torm.cc/

Cafe had a 15% off coupon and free shipping for fathers day, so it worked out to less than rapha per jersey.

Does torm offer any promos? How does quality compare?

[pdmtong]

I just received my Rapha order containing both Classic and Pro Fit shorts and the chamois pad shape and thickness does look and feel identical. The Classic lycra material feels just a tad thicker, softer and stretch-ier than the higher compression, stiffer Pro material which may contribute the thicker pad feel?

Found that the more stretchy Classic material also allows the bib straps to be put on easier. Side by side, the Pro looks to be cut slightly smaller than the Classic and combined with the stiffer material makes it harder to pull on so went ahead and re ordered the next size up. Figure that even when I lose some weight in the next few months the compression fabric will still be snug.

I do really like the poly wool feel of the Classic jersey which feels very comfortable and soft against the skin.

Hope to be able to take advantage of their "jersey downsize" program in the next year to look a little more "Rapha" versus my current "Rapha-t" :o

i suspect you are correct...I am confusing the thicker feeling overall of the classic for the pad alone.

it is a bit of a squirm to s-l-o-w-l-y get into the pro team. but once on, I dont feel I need to be hunched over when off the bike. I am same size in both. if I move up a size in PT the bottom sags since too big and each time I move the bib is like a bellows blowing air across my rear. sorry for the visual. :eek:

[enr1co]

if I move up a size in PT the bottom sags since too big and each time I move the bib is like a bellows blowing air across my rear. sorry for the visual. :eek:

Unfortunately, never have to worry about bottom sag- got too much junk in the trunk :o Its usually the last part of me that reduces when losing weight so best to size up.

More props to Rapha customer service though! I called to arrange an exchange and thought that I would have to wait until I shipped the smaller size back before they would ship out a larger pair in exchange but they went ahead and shipped (no charge) out a size XL today so the new pair would arrive before the weekend! They just asked me to ship back the pair in exchange back using the prepaid UPS label this week. For me this is worth at least $40 of time, shipping and convenience. So far the service after the sale has been a good experience :)

[Saguaro]

I've got a Rapha Club jersey I bought about 6 months ago and it is without a doubt the best fitting, best crafted, and well designed piece of cycling wear I own. The Sportwool fabric is excellent and the perfect weight for our hot Arizona summer climate. I wish I had three more!

[pdmtong]

I've got a Rapha Club jersey I bought about 6 months ago and it is without a doubt the best fitting, best crafted, and well designed piece of cycling wear I own. The Sportwool fabric is excellent and the perfect weight for our hot Arizona summer climate. I wish I had three more!

Very surprised to hear club weight ok there. In SF Bay Area too hot for me in summer

[Birddog]

Very surprised to hear club weight ok there. In SF Bay Area too hot for me in summer
Same here in central OK. Mid September through Mid May in this climate, maybe it's the humidity here.

[druptight]

Cafe had a 15% off coupon and free shipping for fathers day, so it worked out to less than rapha per jersey.

Does torm offer any promos? How does quality compare?

I've never seen a Torm promo, but their prices are rather cheap so a promo isn't really necessary.

Even more than my Torm jerseys, I am a huge fan of my Shutt VR stuff. Quality is top notch, they have deals from time to time, and I like the styling.

[druptight]

Also noticed this on ebay, which I think is hilarious:

http://www.sellinsta.com/products/1693305.png

[Saguaro]

Its still pretty dry here in Arizona, that makes a difference in comfort. The monsoon should kick in pretty soon and that will all change.

I was surprised how well the club jersey performs here as well. The wool blend feels light to me, and wool seems to naturally cool as opposed to the all synthetics I have that seem to hold heat when the sun is on my back. Hard to describe.

I have a couple 100% Merino Wool jerseys from Ibex that are nice in the Fall, but too heavy for this time of year.

[soulspinner]

Big difference between status created by marketing and status conferred by superior qualities of the good being sold. The best products often play to a bit of both as far as hype and quality because one aspect reinforces the other - kinda like as in a good lie always has a kernel of truth in order to be convincing.

IMO junky products that drive to market on marketing hype always have to keep the heat up because the product can't stand or survive on its own merits. For example SRAM has always left this impression with me. The diametric opposite to what SRAM hasn't or must do is Ferrari - this marque does not require marketing to survive or prosper. Keep in mind that most of the brands we have in cycling will make as many of the item as they can sell so the brand must create exclusivity by perception instead of by, well, exclusivity. Enzo Ferrari had always said that he wanted to make one less Ferrari than he could sell.

Rapha plays the game well. If it were a brand devoid of any credibility or substance it would fade away to anonymity like Ginsu knives do when the TV set is turned off.

Some would say Ferrari markets effectively in f1........