Ripped off on Ebay sale

[realbikeguy]

A guy who I will not name yet, from San Pablo, CA an avid bike commuter and former member of Berkeley Wheelmen bought a new DeMarchi pink wool jersey from me on EBAY then complained about the sizing not being right. This after I sent him explicit measurements that he requested.
I refunded him Dec 21st and he has yet to return the jersey.
I have emailed him and messaged him on EBay and gave him bad feedback on EBAy but still not a word back from him.
I let the Dino Group on F B know about this and a few have done some research and put some word out...but still nothing.
Short of blowing his cover by posting his name on FB (he is a member but not actve) what else can I do to let this guy know his name and reputation with the cycling community out that way are about to get exposed.
Thanks,
:confused:
BG
author...The Jersey Project

[eBAUMANN]

sorry to hear that, hopefully things work out but i have one question - why did you refund his money before he returned the jersey?

i have returned items ive bought on ebay before and ebay wont issue a refund to the buyer until they have provided tracking information for the item to be returned.

[zmudshark]

Nice first post:eek:

[ultraman6970]

why did you refund his money before he returned the jersey? <-- +1 with this, naive move.

No idea if they can force the guy to send you the item.

[bluto]

These never end well

[CNY rider]

These never end well

Fuhgettabout it, this one didn't even START well.

[akelman]

I'm sorry you got ripped off. That really sucks. Having said that, given how much money you're out, is it really worth your time and aggravation to pursue a vendetta against the buyer -- who, yes, is acting like a jerk -- on various bike boards where nobody knows you? Seriously, you're out, what, $100-$120? No matter how much that stings, maybe your better bet is writing it off, learning a lesson about eBay, and moving on. Again, I'm sorry you got burned.

[bargainguy]

I have emailed him and messaged him on EBay and gave him bad feedback on EBAy but still not a word back from him.


That's interesting, since a seller cannot leave neutral or negative feedback on a buyer:

http://pages.ebay.com/services/forum/sellerprotection.html

[CaptStash]

Welcome to the forum. I'm sorry if you're getting a lot of negative feedback to your first post. Folks around here tend have strong opinions, and it's best to develop a thick skin.

As to your question, I would work through eBay and exhaust all of your options with them before taking a step as drastic as "outing" the guy. EBay's customer service is actually pretty good, and they are not difficult to get on the phone. Maybe try that and let us know how it goes?

Saul aka CaptStash....

[MattTuck]

I'm sorry you got ripped off. That really sucks. Having said that, given how much money you're out, is it really worth your time and aggravation to pursue a vendetta against the buyer -- who, yes, is acting like a jerk -- on various bike boards where nobody knows you? Seriously, you're out, what, $100-$120? No matter how much that stings, maybe your better bet is writing it off, learning a lesson about eBay, and moving on. Again, I'm sorry you got burned.

+1

I learned that lesson long ago and will only turn to eBay as a last resort (either to buy or to sell). Much better to meet in person, look at/inspect the product being offered, agree on price and exchange cash.

[AgilisMerlin]

relax,

breath,

it will swing in the other direction, soon enough


just a thought.

[mgm777]

relax,

breath,

it will swing in the other direction, soon enough


just a thought.

^This! Wisdom.

[cnighbor1]

which one do you open a case with eBay or PayPal. I done both and never quite sure which you start with
Charles
PS I would open a case with one of them for your non return of item

[billium]

Some educations cost more than others.

Some folks do the right thing immediately. Some need a friendly reminder. Other's, a 2x4 to the left frontal lobe makes no dent.

In the world of eBay, an education for the cost of a jersey could be considered a full-ride scholarship.

[Ahneida Ride]

Flea - Bay

[cfox]

sorry to hear that, hopefully things work out but i have one question - why did you refund his money before he returned the jersey?

i have returned items ive bought on ebay before and ebay wont issue a refund to the buyer until they have provided tracking information for the item to be returned.

Scumbay screws sellers. Scuzzy buyers have been known to send empty boxes back. As long as scumbay sees a delivery confirmed by a tracking number, they will refund the buyer.

[the bottle ride]

I am in favor of outing him- it is one thing to not ship something back for reasons like a personal issue (as long as there is communication-"hey, my pet rock died yesterday- I am in mourning but will ship next week")

There is no excuse for bad communication... Or stealing for that matter.
The bike world is small and a family- lets keep it that way.

[beeatnik]

Scumbay screws sellers. Scuzzy buyers have been known to send empty boxes back. As long as scumbay sees a delivery confirmed by a tracking number, they will refund the buyer.

Goes both ways. I got this message from a seller after I left him negative feedback:

I hope you feel better little boy! Just because you didn't get your shirt, because someone pushed the wrong button doesn't mean you go off and leave negative feedback, I hope you sleep better now that you have this off your chest. Your the reason why there is no hope left in this world for man kind, because your not understanding and you have no patience etc.

Actually you should know I have your address, and I travel a lot. Instead of leaving feedback I'll just come sh$t on your doorstep. Have fun with the cleanup.

He followed that up with a message saying he would be in town the following week and that I messed with the wrong "hippie."

Anyway, it was a little disconcerting at first and I considered contacting the police. Why was the seller so upset you might ask? Well, I left him negative feedback because he tried to close an auction about 2 seconds before it ended. He had a $100 wool jersey listed and it was going to sell for $15. In fact, it did sell for $15 because he didn't end the auction in time. A week later I received a reminder from ebay to pay my seller. Sent the guy a friendly note asking him if he wanted me to proceed with the transaction or to cancel it on his end. The threatening messages followed.

wacky stuffs

[pdmtong]

I have learned to just let most things go, that is unless it is a threat of harm to me or my family (which has not come up)

Don't waste your time on the miniscule. Don;'t flip people off on the road and don't argue after texting your daughter in a theatre

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/13/justice/florida-movie-theater-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

[Joachim]

OP hasn't posted again so I guess it's one of those vendetta's.

Take it somewhere else.

[GuyGadois]

Well, I think we all know that there is no other option than hiring a hitman (http://findahitman.com/). Bummer it had to come to that. I think they take Paypal.

[realbikeguy]

Thanks :)
I prefer the oldboy network but I will keep this in mind

[Saint Vitus]

Goes both ways. I got this message from a seller after I left him negative feedback:

I hope you feel better little boy! Just because you didn't get your shirt, because someone pushed the wrong button doesn't mean you go off and leave negative feedback, I hope you sleep better now that you have this off your chest. Your the reason why there is no hope left in this world for man kind, because your not understanding and you have no patience etc.

Actually you should know I have your address, and I travel a lot. Instead of leaving feedback I'll just come sh$t on your doorstep. Have fun with the cleanup.

He followed that up with a message saying he would be in town the following week and that I messed with the wrong "hippie."

Anyway, it was a little disconcerting at first and I considered contacting the police. Why was the seller so upset you might ask? Well, I left him negative feedback because he tried to close an auction about 2 seconds before it ended. He had a $100 wool jersey listed and it was going to sell for $15. In fact, it did sell for $15 because he didn't end the auction in time. A week later I received a reminder from ebay to pay my seller. Sent the guy a friendly note asking him if he wanted me to proceed with the transaction or to cancel it on his end. The threatening messages followed.

wacky stuffs

So you forwarded the whole convo to eBay I trust?

[Saint Vitus]

Thanks :)
I prefer the oldboy network but I will keep this in mind

Did you contact eBay with this dispute?

[irideslow8401]

sorry to hear that, hopefully things work out but i have one question - why did you refund his money before he returned the jersey?

i have returned items ive bought on ebay before and ebay wont issue a refund to the buyer until they have provided tracking information for the item to be returned.

+1. I also asked the buyer to take couple pictures to make sure he/she sending back my stuff not those rags in the garage somewhere...who know if the Castelli Jersey turn out to be an old Performance shirt. Sorry to hear that you got ripped.

[oldpotatoe]

Scumbay screws sellers. Scuzzy buyers have been known to send empty boxes back. As long as scumbay sees a delivery confirmed by a tracking number, they will refund the buyer.

What do you suggest? A delivery confirmation but empty box? What should ebay do? Assume the delivery confirmation is bogus?

All this about how bad paypal and eBay is, when the problem is liars and thieves.

[veggieburger]

Goes both ways. I got this message from a seller after I left him negative feedback:

I hope you feel better little boy! Just because you didn't get your shirt, because someone pushed the wrong button doesn't mean you go off and leave negative feedback, I hope you sleep better now that you have this off your chest. Your the reason why there is no hope left in this world for man kind, because your not understanding and you have no patience etc.

Actually you should know I have your address, and I travel a lot. Instead of leaving feedback I'll just come sh$t on your doorstep. Have fun with the cleanup.

Was this the seller "Koldfushen" by chance? Left him negative feedback on ebay and was harassed by him for over a year. He actually went through the trouble of opening up multiple new profiles so he could bid on my stuff and not pay. :help:

[blessthismess]

Yikes! I've been pretty lucky with all of my ebay transactions I guess.

(knocks on wood)

[flyhippy]

None of these "stories" about ebay experiences reflect the way that eBay actually works... Sellers can't leave negatives, sellers can't end auctions with 2 seconds left (if there are bids, and even if they could, how would a prospective buyer know?), etc. One thing that is certainly real is the ability to send a box with a bunch of crap in it back instead of the actual item purchased for a refund.

These are the risks of dealing in an online marketplace, and the reason why many bikes which would pull a few hundred extra bucks on eBay are sold on this forum instead. Sellers are bad, buyers are bad - its a crazy mixed up world out there folks, but I've never had a bad experience here :banana:

[nybikejunkie]

I still have to experience something this bad from selling/buying stuff on ebay... However, since the fee they are imposing on selling my gears are hard to swallow (different topic), I'm just going to stick with forums :)

[oldpotatoe]

I still have to experience something this bad from selling/buying stuff on ebay... However, since the fee they are imposing on selling my gears are hard to swallow (different topic), I'm just going to stick with forums :)

I guess, although it's free right now to sell. Hard to compare a relative few on a forum, even a 'big' one lik this one, vs a potential thousands on eBay.

Doubt I would have gotten $50+ for some empty, kind of knackered Campagnolo boxes.

[Saint Vitus]

Was this the seller "Koldfushen" by chance? Left him negative feedback on ebay and was harassed by him for over a year. He actually went through the trouble of opening up multiple new profiles so he could bid on my stuff and not pay. :help:

Time to open up your own new profile...

I'm with oldpotatoe, ebay has it's downsides because of thieves and liars but since I've only been really stung less than a handful of times in 15 years I'm satisfied with buying and selling there.

I sold off a grip of bike stuff a few months back and had little issue in doing so, sure the fees seem onerous at times (FVF on shipping????) but in the end I sold everything except a tattered seat, I lost on some hubs that I shouldn't have purchased in the first place and covered most of the cost of refurbishing my bike and enjoyed the whole process more or less.

Now if you guys want to discuss the perils of C/L...

[veggieburger]

Time to open up your own new profile...

I'm with oldpotatoe, ebay has it's downsides because of thieves and liars but since I've only been really stung less than a handful of times in 15 years I'm satisfied with buying and selling there.


Yeah, don't think I should have to...plus I'd be giving up a near perfect seller rating to start from scratch? That means limits on how much I could sell/month etc.

It annoys me that sellers used to be able to leave negative feedback, but no longer. In many cases you're at the mercy of the buyer. Also, many people have a buying profile and selling profile, so if you are dealing with a buyer who has 100% feedback, that doesn't mean they are honest. It might just mean sellers haven't been able to leave -- feedback.

[beeatnik]

None of these "stories" about ebay experiences reflect the way that eBay actually works... Sellers can't leave negatives, sellers can't end auctions with 2 seconds left (if there are bids, and even if they could, how would a prospective buyer know?), etc. One thing that is certainly real is the ability to send a box with a bunch of crap in it back instead of the actual item purchased for a refund.



IIRC, a seller may end an auction, for any reason, up to 24 hours before it closes. If you attempt to end the auction in the last 24 hours, there has to be a valid reason (lost item, broken item, etc). Ebay discourages the practice of last minute (or within 24 hours) terminations because the integrity of the whole process is damaged. If sellers were able to end auctions at will then fair market values would never be realized.

Anyhoo, my unbalanced seller denied me some cosmic equilibrium. A few days before, I listed a$350 saddle and it sold for only $75. I had been confident it would grab at least $150 since no saddle of the type had sold for less in the last 6 months. Also, I had a ton of watchers and bidding seemed to pick up in the last few hours. Of my 40 plus ebay sales, that saddle is the only item which I would call a super deal (all other items sold for "fair" market value). If I knew it would only sell for $75, I would have kept it. So, picking up a $100 plus Icebreaker jersey for only $15 seemed like the universe correcting a minor injustice. That is until I received those death threats.

Veggieburger, I'll PM you the seller's username.

[Saint Vitus]

Yeah, don't think I should have to...plus I'd be giving up a near perfect seller rating to start from scratch? That means limits on how much I could sell/month etc.

It annoys me that sellers used to be able to leave negative feedback, but no longer. In many cases you're at the mercy of the buyer. Also, many people have a buying profile and selling profile, so if you are dealing with a buyer who has 100% feedback, that doesn't mean they are honest. It might just mean sellers haven't been able to leave -- feedback.

I was only half serious (and not knowing your status or ID on eBay...).

The thing about sellers not be able to leave negative feedback, is that recent? I seem to recall that ability as recently as September when I had sold a number of items, I could be mistaken I sell sporadically there. I have to say that it was a bad decision (without knowing the reasons behind it) for the seller, because the transaction is a two way street. Maybe it had been abused? I dunno...

[Bkat]

The wheels of justice can be slow but are inexorable. If someone did bad, it will catch up with them in one form or another. You may not get to see it, but sooner or later it will catch up with them.

[cfox]

What do you suggest? A delivery confirmation but empty box? What should ebay do? Assume the delivery confirmation is bogus?

All this about how bad paypal and eBay is, when the problem is liars and thieves.

Ebay should allow the seller to confirm that the returned package contained the actual item before taking money out of the seller's bank account (which is what they do if a buyer "opens a case" against a seller). The complaints about ebay and paypal are because they offer almost no protection to the seller. There are liars and thieves on both sides, but the smart liars are buyers who have figured out the game is rigged in their favor.

[oldpotatoe]

Ebay should allow the seller to confirm that the returned package contained the actual item before taking money out of the seller's bank account (which is what they do if a buyer "opens a case" against a seller). The complaints about ebay and paypal are because they offer almost no protection to the seller. There are liars and thieves on both sides, but the smart liars are buyers who have figured out the game is rigged in their favor.

I sell something, it's returned, I tell ebay the box was empty...it wasn't....

I maintain it's not a bad system, considering it's really the only one there is. Vast majority of transactions work just fine. There is always 1%, either mistakes or thieves and liars. I think making ebay or paypal the bad guy when the real culprit is the thief or liar, is misdirected is all.

[billium]

There is always 1%, either mistakes or thieves and liars. I think making ebay or paypal the bad guy when the real culprit is the thief or liar, is misdirected is all.


Agree that we're the problem (as well as the benefit) of that community, not eBay or PayPal.

Have a couple hundred transactions with them over a decade. Only one bad experience........which was my fault (hastily sent item to buyer without tracking - he claimed never received).

But I do have an opinion on eBay's system change to not allow Sellers to leave negative feedback. Although it hasn't been a problem (yet), I hold my breath awaiting the Buyer's feedback - knowing I have little to no recourse. So far, been unfounded. But, boy, from the stories I've heard/read...........

[cfox]

I sell something, it's returned, I tell ebay the box was empty...it wasn't....



No, for the seller, it doesn't work that way: you never get the chance to tell ebay the returned box was empty. Once they get a tracking confirmation, they refund the buyer, case closed. Sorry seller. Only the buyer gets the "the box was empty" protection. It's not just outright scammers, the buyer has myriad ways to wiggle out of the transaction. You can check a box on your listing saying "no returns", yet ebay allows buyers to return anything for any reason by allowing a buyer to "open a case" against you. The only protection offered to sellers is they get their auction fees reversed if a buyer doesn't pay.

[oldpotatoe]

No, for the seller, it doesn't work that way: you never get the chance to tell ebay the returned box was empty. Once they get a tracking confirmation, they refund the buyer, case closed. Sorry seller. Only the buyer gets the "the box was empty" protection. It's not just outright scammers, the buyer has myriad ways to wiggle out of the transaction. You can check a box on your listing saying "no returns", yet ebay allows buyers to return anything for any reason by allowing a buyer to "open a case" against you. The only protection offered to sellers is they get their auction fees reversed if a buyer doesn't pay.

So....the problem is the liar..I get that. If ya don't think the system is fair to sellers, stick to forums or CL to sell..that's a much better place anyway(being sarcastic, CL is a joke).

[cfox]

So....the problem is the liar..I get that. If ya don't think the system is fair to sellers, stick to forums or CL to sell..that's a much better place anyway(being sarcastic, CL is a joke).

??You keep saying that...I get it...the liar is the one who cheats you, not ebay. But ebay now makes it really easy for a buyer to scam a seller, and leaves the seller with no recourse. What's so awesome about that? That's not what I think, it's a fact. And it's crap. So, yeah, simple risk/reward; I don't sell anything on ebay anymore (after getting screwed by a few loser buyers).

[josephr]

I don't sell anything on ebay anymore (after getting screwed by a few loser buyers).

I don't buy anything on ebay anymore after getting screwed by a few loser sellers. Seriously -- it used to be a flea-market atmosphere, but its all professional retailers now marketing their stuff. I saw some v-brakes on ebay that were being sold by the same online retailer on amazon for less $ with free shipping.

That being said...I've been watching this thread and agree with Zmudshark --- the OP logs on to vent about a ebay transaction gone bad and says he knows they're a member here and is threatening to out him? That's stalker crap in my book.

Joe

[Keith A]

... the OP logs on to vent about a ebay transaction gone bad and says he knows they're a member here and is threatening to out him? That's stalker crap in my book.

JoeI don't think he was saying that they are a member of The Paceline, I thought his statement was that he was on Facebook, but not active on there :confused:

[josephr]

I don't think he was saying that they are a member of The Paceline, I thought his statement was that he was on Facebook, but not active on there :confused:

thanks...probably read that too fast. still, tracking him down on FB and then outing the guy??? creepy....

[CunegoFan]

A guy who I will not name yet, from San Pablo, CA an avid bike commuter and former member of Berkeley Wheelmen bought a new DeMarchi pink wool jersey from me on EBAY then complained about the sizing not being right. This after I sent him explicit measurements that he requested.
I refunded him Dec 21st and he has yet to return the jersey.
I have emailed him and messaged him on EBay and gave him bad feedback on EBAy but still not a word back from him.
I let the Dino Group on F B know about this and a few have done some research and put some word out...but still nothing.
Short of blowing his cover by posting his name on FB (he is a member but not actve) what else can I do to let this guy know his name and reputation with the cycling community out that way are about to get exposed.
Thanks,
:confused:
BG
author...The Jersey Project

Remember that Seinfeld episode where Jerry shows up at someone's work to heckle a heckler...

thanks...probably read that too fast. still, tracking him down on FB and then outing the guy??? creepy....

Yeah, much better to let the guy rip someone else off.

[zmudshark]

Well, the OP is up to two posts now. Can we just lock this and let it fade away?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WB8pUZVLEzA