DIY chrome plating success -- update: first lug done!

[Gsinill]

As part of the restoration of my De Rosa Nuovo Classico frame, I need to fix the chrome on the DS chain stay. Thanks to zmudshark's recommendation here (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=1472235&postcount=16), I went to www.caswellplating.com and found their Plug N' Plate kits. Since the customer reviews were mostly very good and the price was OK, I thought I'll give it a try.
Ordered the stuff for copper, nickel and chrome on Wednesday and got it yesterday.

Here are pictures of the 3 stages (copper, nickel and chrome) test I did last night:

http://i40.tinypic.com/2vjvn7k.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/x273w8.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/ncy4jq.jpg

Worked like a charm, no mess, very limited fumes or smell.
Took me about an hour for all 3 applications , including sanding.
As you can see, there are still some imperfections/scratches but the plating result is perfect.
This was my first test and as pointed out by many: immaculate preparation is key.

Overall cost was $75 including shipping (I am using my own lab power supply) and given the amount of the 3 solutions I used up for the test, I am pretty sure I could do much more than just the chain stay with it.

Can't really speak to the mechanical durability etc. yet but so far I couldn't be more happy :banana::banana::banana:

[zmudshark]

That's great news. I've been tempted to buy one to do my Cinelli SC lugs before I have it repainted. I was quoted $600 to do the chrome on the Cinelli, and though I'm confident the chromers would do a good job, I'd rather do it myself.

What grit did you polish to between steps? Did you move up to compounds, rather than paper?

Keep us posted, looks promising.

[Anarchist]

That's great news. I've been tempted to buy one to do my Cinelli SC lugs before I have it repainted. I was quoted $600 to do the chrome on the Cinelli, and though I'm confident the chromers would do a good job, I'd rather do it myself.

What grit did you polish to between steps? Did you move up to compounds, rather than paper?

Keep us posted, looks promising.

I have a couple of bikes I want to get repainted as well. Would you not wait until after the repaint to do the lugs??

For me it isn't lugs though, it's fork legs and chain stays so admittedly the process flow could be different.

[kykr13]

Looks good! I've seen big industrial plating lines in action and had no idea this could be a DIY thing.

[Gsinill]

Started out with 220, went straight to 600, then 0000 steelwool with Simichrome (http://www.amazon.com/Simichrome-390050-Metal-Polish-Tube/dp/B0002YUQ4E/ref=sr_1_1?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1388354257&sr=1-1&keywords=chrome+polish) (best stuff ever) and finally buffed it with a lambswool wheel in the drill and Simichrome again.
Here's a picture of the polished area of chain stay which really comes very close to chrome finish so I hope once this is plated it will be pristine:

http://i39.tinypic.com/2di0oi1.jpg

(The duller area to the right is pre lambswool buffing…)

I am currently working on the frame lugs and the fork bridge - still lots of elbow grease required but knowing how it can turn out, I am willing to invest the time and effort.

That's great news. I've been tempted to buy one to do my Cinelli SC lugs before I have it repainted. I was quoted $600 to do the chrome on the Cinelli, and though I'm confident the chromers would do a good job, I'd rather do it myself.

I took pictures of the De Rosa frame all the way from beaten up when I got it, after media blasting etc.
I am actually thinking about a thread to document the whole restoration process, we'll see… If not I will post at least pictures/experience of the chrome plating results.

What grit did you polish to between steps? Did you move up to compounds, rather than paper?

Keep us posted, looks promising.

[Gsinill]

I don't think you could do it the other way around, there is way too much sanding, buffing etc. involved and it would be absolutely impossible to prevent scratching the painted areas.
Also, I remember watching a video posted by Zullo painting a frame. He didn't really worry too much about masking the chromed areas but simply took a razor blade at the end to scrap off any paint on the chrome.

I have a couple of bikes I want to get repainted as well. Would you not wait until after the repaint to do the lugs??

[Veloo]

Very cool! Very, very cool!
So you got 3 separate Caswell kits?

[distanc3]

Wow thats pretty awesome and affordable! I have a chainstay that need some rework. Thanks for sharing and congrats on the success :banana:

[Gsinill]

Well, depends on what you mean by kit…

What they call kit includes the power supply. Since I didn't need them - especially not 3 of them, I just ordered the 3 different solutions (copper, nickel and chrome), 3 wands and a bunch of their bandages.
I also added a bottle of chrome stripper to make sure all the chrome on the chain stay is gone since you can't chrome over chrome (didn't try that one yet but it's supposed to work the same way, just connecting it the opposite way, cathode vs. anode).

Here's the list of items I ordered (including Caswell's part# that you can search by):


Anodize & Chrome Stripper Solution (STRP5) - $5.99
8 oz Plug N' Plate® Nickel Solution (PNPNS9) - $12.99
8 oz Plug N' Plate® Copper Solution (PNPCS9) - $12.99
8 oz Plug N' Plate® Copy Chrome™ Solution (PNPCC9) - $12.99
Copper Wand for Plug N' Plate Kit (WANDC4) - $5.99
2x Stainless Wand for Plug N' Plate Kit (WANDS4) - $5.99
50x Brush Plating Wand Bandage (BPBAND2) - $0.15



Very cool! Very, very cool!
So you got 3 separate Caswell kits?

[ultraman6970]

Saw this product long time ago but I never tried...

You were doing chroming, you had to use the copper and the anodizing before or you went straight to chrome?

Second, looks like you did a stay already, what did you use for this? a very deep can or something?

Thanks.

[zmudshark]

Caswell stuff is really good. They've been around for awhile. I've used their other products, but not their plating stuff.

I'm impressed with your results. When things get settled around my life, I'd like to PM you for more info.

I still have the parts you were interested in, but wouldn't blame you if you went straight to a nice Chorus 11s group for that when you're done ;)

[Gsinill]

From my initial post: "...3 stages (copper, nickel and chrome) test I did last night"...

The stay is not chromed yet, just polished steel.

Saw this product long time ago but I never tried...

You were doing chroming, you had to use the copper and the anodizing before or you went straight to chrome?

Second, looks like you did a stay already, what did you use for this? a very deep can or something?

Thanks.

[Gsinill]

Anytime :)


I'm impressed with your results. When things get settled around my life, I'd like to PM you for more info.

I know, I am still undecided on what I should do…



I still have the parts you were interested in, but wouldn't blame you if you went straight to a nice Chorus 11s group for that when you're done ;)

[ultraman6970]

Thanks!

[Gsinill]

So, after hours (and I mean HOURS) of filing, sanding and polishing, I finally chromed the first lug of the frame.

Here's the result:

http://i44.tinypic.com/35jy1wj.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/23gz4zq.jpg

Don't normally tend to pat myself on the back but it looks good. :banana:

As expected, 99.9% of the effort is prep work; once you get the steel to mirror finish, applying the copper and chrome is nothing.

I am also working on a blog to capture the progress of the overall restoration, once it's ready for the public, I will post a link.
Might be better than convoluting this thread or ThePacline in general.

Cheers,
GS

[wallymann]

Nice work!!!

[kykr13]

Looks great! Prep work is a labor of love. Or is that a love of labor!?

Paid off nicely, however.

[zmudshark]

Giving me hope for my much loved Cinelli. I'll be e-mailing you at some point. That looks fantastic, and yes, good prep is way more than half the battle.

[ultraman6970]

Can you apply that over chrome? :P

[choke]

That looks great! Well done.

And it gives me crazy ideas.....

[ais99spoke]

oh me oh my. i want to do this so bad... thanks for carefully documenting!

[jtakeda]

That looks fantastic. I would've never thought DIY chrome plating would look good or was even possible.

[Gsinill]

Quite a bit of conflicting info out there.
It mostly says you can't, but on somewhere on Caswell's website they mention fixing scratches in chromed surfaces like bumpers as one the use cases for this process. Still have to try myself…

Made an interesting observation with the lug though: before doing the lug itself I was trying whether I could apply chrome to the pantograph on the top section of the seat stay.
When I then did the copper on the lug, I must have touched this surrounding chromed surface and the copper I applied right after turned somehow dull.
The chrome in the 2nd step also looked a little darker in that area but I was able to polish it to mirror shine after I was done. So long story short, I assume there could be an issue…

I am afraid I will figure it out when I do the chain stay and get close to the dropout since I am not planning to strip the existing chrome :eek:


Can you apply that over chrome? :P

[oliver1850]

Looks great. Man, could I keep you busy....

[zmudshark]

copper>nickel>chrome

No exceptions, no matter how ultra you are.

[ultraman6970]

Interesting, if this thing can repair nicks it could be really attractive for anybody trying to save stays and forks.

[Dale Alan]

Looks great,you give me hope. I had no idea the results could be so good doing this at home.

[gomango]

I've been following this pretty closely.

Nice work!

My beloved Sintesi has developed a hairline crack in the chainstay, but I've been too "frugal" to have it done.

I might try brazing in a new one myself and giving this a try this spring.

Thanks for the pics.

[shovelhd]

Wow.

[old_fat_and_slow]

Very interesting thread !

Do you intend to clearcoat over the chrome (maybe just the lugs) when done?

Thanks for posting

[Gsinill]

Not planing to... Not even sure this would work.
The way it turned out so far, I don't see a need for it anyway since this probably won't turn into my "bad weather" bike ;)


Very interesting thread !

Do you intend to clearcoat over the chrome (maybe just the lugs) when done?

Thanks for posting

[ultraman6970]

Well, you can clear over whatever you want, the problem is that the chrome is so smooth that the clear dont have anything to stick to so it will start peeling off after some time (cromobelato paint jobs for example), he needs to cover the lugs with paper at the time of clearing.

[cachagua]

Very, very beautiful! I'm going to have to teach myself how to do this.

Let us know when the blog's up, I'd like to keep following your project--

[Scooper]

Several months ago I bought the Caswell plating manual thinking I'd try chrome plating the head lugs and seat lug on a stripped frame. After reading the manual, I had doubts I could do a reasonable job.

This thread is encouraging, giving me confidence my first attempt could probably be acceptable.

[ultraman6970]

Scooper what you got maybe was the triple plated method that use bath tubs and stuff (PITA), what he is using is a wand that do deposits of chrome over the surface little by little probably is not even 100% chrome.

The only thing I want to know because nobody looks like has the answer is if this can be done over a surface that is already chromeplated, looks like it can be done (descriptiion of the product) but can't find a single reference to somebody actually doing it or done a repair of chrome using this kit.

[ultraman6970]

Casswell has another fluid that is lighten the color, wonder if that could help to the problem you found with the color.

Quite a bit of conflicting info out there.
It mostly says you can't, but on somewhere on Caswell's website they mention fixing scratches in chromed surfaces like bumpers as one the use cases for this process. Still have to try myself…

Made an interesting observation with the lug though: before doing the lug itself I was trying whether I could apply chrome to the pantograph on the top section of the seat stay.
When I then did the copper on the lug, I must have touched this surrounding chromed surface and the copper I applied right after turned somehow dull.
The chrome in the 2nd step also looked a little darker in that area but I was able to polish it to mirror shine after I was done. So long story short, I assume there could be an issue…

I am afraid I will figure it out when I do the chain stay and get close to the dropout since I am not planning to strip the existing chrome :eek:

[wasfast]

So, after hours (and I mean HOURS) of filing, sanding and polishing, I finally chromed the first lug of the frame.

As expected, 99.9% of the effort is prep work; once you get the steel to mirror finish, applying the copper and chrome is nothing.

You should actually tell the audience how many hours that really is......because I can guarantee you that some will grossly underestimate how big a job laborwise it is.

The parallels to painting are quite similar. BTW, I always thought "painting" was a misnomer. It should be called "sanding" with a little portion of material application included. Plating isn't much different.

[Gsinill]

Couldn't agree more. Hard to tell how much time I actually spent on that one lug since I didn't keep track and worked on it whenever I felt like it, sometimes maybe only for 15 min. My guess is probably 5 - 6h. This of course also includes the time of trying different tools and approaches. I guess I could now do it in 4h.
I will keep track of the time when I do the next one.

BTW, I was a little surprised how "raw" and unfinished the lug actually was, kind of amazing that the paint job covered all this.

You should actually tell the audience how many hours that really is......because I can guarantee you that some will grossly underestimate how big a job laborwise it is.

The parallels to painting are quite similar. BTW, I always thought "painting" was a misnomer. It should be called "sanding" with a little portion of material application included. Plating isn't much different.

[ultraman6970]

Gsinill, italians in general use a type of primer that is white (generaly) and is like a thick plastic, that will cover everything. accelerates the production line a lot if you want to see it in another way because they dont waste time fixing stuff. Generally italian frames w/o paint looks very bad sometimes.

[Gsinill]

Oh no! Are you telling me that I am spending my time on the 2 wheeled equivalent of an Alfa Romeo? ;)

Gsinill, italians in general use a type of primer that is white (generaly) and is like a thick plastic, that will cover everything. accelerates the production line a lot if you want to see it in another way because they dont waste time fixing stuff. Generally italian frames w/o paint looks very bad sometimes.