DA 9000 Mechanical - Who's Tried it?

[oldguy00]

I am thinking of upgrading.
I'm currently on 7900.

In recent years I've used 7800, 7900, SRAM Red and Force, and Campy Record 11.
Campy is out as I want all of my wheels to be Shimano compatible between my road & tri bikes.
I've never used a group that worked as well as 7800, no where near IMHO. 7900 shifting has always felt lousy in comparison.

So for those who have used 9000, is the shifting a big step up from 7900? Does it approach the smoothness of 7800? Or does the hidden cable design make that impossible??

Many times I've been very tempted to pick up NOS 7800 parts off ebay and do a 'roll back'...

[bcroslin]

I've ridden DA 9000 mech for about a week and loved it. Unfortunately, I don't have any experience with older DA but it's a huge step up from SRAM Red IMO. A friend told me he thinks it shifts a lot like the older DA and that the front shifting is a huge improvement. Front shifting is leaps and bounds better than the older SRAM.

[KidWok]

Since it seems all 11spd cassettes are cross compatible, no point in excluding Campy especially since you have it already.

That said, I too found it more worthwhile to move backwards instead of forwards. 7800 always fit best in my hand and worked better than I ever needed. I've already picked up several of them to stash away for future builds. For the money I would have spent buying a 9000 group, I've probably now got enough 10 spd DA to last another decade or two.

Tai

I am thinking of upgrading.
I'm currently on 7900.

In recent years I've used 7800, 7900, SRAM Red and Force, and Campy Record 11.
Campy is out as I want all of my wheels to be Shimano compatible between my road & tri bikes.
I've never used a group that worked as well as 7800, no where near IMHO. 7900 shifting has always felt lousy in comparison.

So for those who have used 9000, is the shifting a big step up from 7900? Does it approach the smoothness of 7800? Or does the hidden cable design make that impossible??

Many times I've been very tempted to pick up NOS 7800 parts off ebay and do a 'roll back'...

[oldguy00]

Do we know for sure that Campy 11 gear will work on Shimano 11 cassettes?
I seem to remember you could often do that with the 10 speed stuff..
Thx

[Black Dog]

Do we know for sure that Campy 11 gear will work on Shimano 11 cassettes?
I seem to remember you could often do that with the 10 speed stuff..
Thx

100% for sure. The cassette spacing is virtually identical. Leonard Zinn has been mixing them and racing the combinations with zero issues. These days 11 speed is 11 speed. Campy is still better because the splines are deeper and the cassettes do not jam into aluminum freehub bodies the way that shimano cassettes do.

[KidWok]

IIRC...it was 10 spd that didn't work so great between Shimano and Campagnolo. Never thought to try swapping out my 10s wheels to experiment, but supposedly a large enough difference to be noticeable. I use 9s interchangeably without any issues though.

Tai

Do we know for sure that Campy 11 gear will work on Shimano 11 cassettes?
I seem to remember you could often do that with the 10 speed stuff..
Thx

[PaMtbRider]

not to hi jack the thread but... does anyone have any idea if a 11 speed chorus derailleur would work on a shimano 11-32 cassette?

[weiwentg]

not to hi jack the thread but... does anyone have any idea if a 11 speed chorus derailleur would work on a shimano 11-32 cassette?

11 speed Chorus derailer with an 11s shifter, or 11s chorus derailer with a Shimano shifter? The latter won't work, I don't think.

[PaMtbRider]

11 speed Chorus derailer with an 11s shifter, or 11s chorus derailer with a Shimano shifter? The latter won't work, I don't think.

Chorus shifter and derailleur. Technically a 29 tooth cog is the max for a campy standard cage derailleur.

[bikser]

I've used virtually every version of Dura Ace, and I am currently running 9000 (had it on two bikes, one now). I've also used Campy 11, and the Red/Force 10 speed stuff. Regarding DA, the shifting is almost as smooth as 7800, has shorter throws (noticeably), brakes a little better, front shifter is incredible (if you get it setup right). I really did not care for 7900 or 6700, levers too big, throws too big, and not smooth at all. I also used Ultegra Di2, mechanical 9000 shifts almost as precise as the electric IMO. I'll be using it for awhile.

[krismac23]

9000 was the step that everyone felt 7900 should've been. It shift's smoother, the lever feel is better, and the brakes IMO are similar to the EE Cycleworks design so the seem to give a huge improvement in power and modulation.

If wheel compatibility is a concern between your bike and their exsisting wheels be careful about 11spd compatible. The freehub body for 11spd is slightly longer (1.5mm?) so your 10spd won't work with 11 but any new 11spd hub will requires a spacer to run 10. All the more reason to run campy:). 9/10/11 all use the same freehub :) but to each his own.

[buddybikes]

Love it! Simple as that if you can do the 11 speed transition.

[oldguy00]

Hey guys, does the 9000 crankset work with previous BB cups? I have a Chris King BB now that I use with 7900. Will the 9000 work with it?
Thx!

[oldpotatoe]

Hey guys, does the 9000 crankset work with previous BB cups? I have a Chris King BB now that I use with 7900. Will the 9000 work with it?
Thx!

Think so..

BUT one other thing that peeves me is the cups of 9000 do not have the same dimension, OD, for current BB tools..yes, the group comes with the insert but buy these things from whomever in Southern UK, in plastic bags and you may not get it ...then get first 6800 group..and the cups are different AGAIN..yep, with tool but holymoly, why can't shimano just make them consistent??

I know the answer..

[Ryun]

I'm running a king bb with a 9000 crank
No issues

[poff]

Let me make sure I understand correctly - I can use Campy 11 speed cassette with DA 9000 FD, RD and shifters without any issues? THX.

[austex]

Let me make sure I understand correctly - I can use Campy 11 speed cassette with DA 9000 FD, RD and shifters without any issues? THX.

Lennard Zinn (http://velonews.competitor.com/2013/09/bikes-and-tech/drivetrain-compatibility-hidden-in-plain-sight_303199) recently did some extensive cross-compatibility testing among Campag, Shimano and SRAM 11-sp road set-ups and found excellent wheel/cassette interoperability swapping wheels among the bikes- perhaps one of the best things about 11-sp. - grab any rear wheel.

So, yes, it would seem that you can do as you ask.

[Liharvy]

I recently switched to the 9000 from Campy R10 and it is great.
Drivetrain is very quiet, perfect shifts every time even under heavy load, and front shifting is light and positive. The extra front derailleur trim is nice if you need to go cross gear and is something I really liked about the Campy.

I have no comparison to 7900 as my last DA setup was 7700 (9sp) so can't help there.

[faryab]

Love it, simply the best

[SpeedyChix]

Left Shimano when they went 10 as I didn't care for the lever shape/hoods/shift feel. SRAM for years. Tried DA9000 mechanical and I've returned to Shimano. Using both Ultegra and DA. Nice. Short throw at the levers, great hood size/shape and light action. Smooth and quiet. Makes me want to try Di2

[2wheelwill]

I've used every shimano and most campy groups dating back to the early 80s. The 9000 is the nicest overall group I've ever tried. Campy 11spd still has more comfy hoods tho!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[oldpotatoe]

Love it, simply the best

shimano is the big dog but I rankle about the lack of compatibility between 9000 and everything else shimano, including their own, high end, DA 10s wheels.

Now 6800 has arrived so there is come intercompatibility but holy moly, such a shout when Campagnolo went from 8s to 9s...and the hubs weren't compatible anymore.

BUt like I said, big dog..yep, it works well, and does the things Campagnolo have done since 2009 with 11s...

[bcroslin]

I've been on Ultegra 11 sp for about a month now and I absolutely love it. Same design as DA but 250g heavier. Shifting is effortless and the front derailleur alone is worth every penny. IMO the 6800 group is the best bang for the buck going.

Incompatibilities with older non-11 sp is a drag but I came over from SRAM and needed new everything anyhow.

[sw3759]

keep seeing a mention of a new dura ace shifter coming out in the near future.anyone know what this new issue of the 9000 shifter is updating or improving?

updated/found more info. http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=119603&p=1024680

[oldguy00]

keep seeing a mention of a new dura ace shifter coming out in the near future.anyone know what this new issue of the 9000 shifter is updating or improving?

updated/found more info. http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=119603&p=1024680


Looks like it is worth hunting down a set of the 9001's instead!

[Uncle Jam's Army]

keep seeing a mention of a new dura ace shifter coming out in the near future.anyone know what this new issue of the 9000 shifter is updating or improving?

updated/found more info. http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=119603&p=1024680

Shifter cables were being snapped quite frequently right where the cable inserts into the 9000 shifter. This new shifter design is supposed to cure that.

[bcroslin]

Any idea if 6800 has the same problem?

[Uncle Jam's Army]

Any idea if 6800 has the same problem?

The new 9001 design change is patterned after the new 6800. I believe only 9000 had the problem.

Here's a link to a discussion of the issue: http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=119603&sid=f38f05266d8da6aa939bc7a4bba0fad1&start=15

[tsampson]

front shifting is almost electric. rear is superb as well. Although racing cross on it i find the lever shape of campy or sram better. and button placement of sram better. But that aside, ill take reliable shifting of shimano any day

[buddybikes]

So those that have 9000 today and have put good mileage on it, have you had the cable break problem? Do I need to take apart my cables every few months?

thx

[oldpotatoe]

So those that have 9000 today and have put good mileage on it, have you had the cable break problem? Do I need to take apart my cables every few months?

thx

Like 7800/6700, these do tend to eat cables. I would check the cables periodically since if it breaks at the head and the spool is rotated, it is gonna be a bear to get the remnant out.

Kinda weird, the way the 9000 cables make that 90 degree turn in the lever.

[John H.]

I love the group but I killed a cable within 3 months.
My bike went from perfect shifting to ···· in about 2 shifts.
Then it was stuck in the 11 cog.
I stopped and managed to unstick it- I put the rear derailleur up on the 28 cog- then shifted the shifter to release cable tension- popped the cable head out at the shifter, then it worked fine for the remaining part of ride.
I went home thinking I just needed to lube the cable head- when I pulled the cable out of the shifter it was done- all frayed.
I have about another month to go before I am at 3 months on this cable.
If it happens again I will try to warranty the shifter for a 9001 model.

[oldpotatoe]

I love the group but I killed a cable within 3 months.
My bike went from perfect shifting to ···· in about 2 shifts.
Then it was stuck in the 11 cog.
I stopped and managed to unstick it- I put the rear derailleur up on the 28 cog- then shifted the shifter to release cable tension- popped the cable head out at the shifter, then it worked fine for the remaining part of ride.
I went home thinking I just needed to lube the cable head- when I pulled the cable out of the shifter it was done- all frayed.
I have about another month to go before I am at 3 months on this cable.
If it happens again I will try to warranty the shifter for a 9001 model.

Good luck warranting the lever for the above.

[buddybikes]

what did you use for a cable to replace? I can't even find 9000 inner cables.

Has anyone talked to Shimano when it frayed? if so what was their answer.

[bfd]

what did you use for a cable to replace? I can't even find 9000 inner cables.

Has anyone talked to Shimano when it frayed? if so what was their answer.

I recently had a rear der cable frey on my Campy ergo shifter. I called around and found a LBS that was selling 1.2mm Yokozuna cables made for Campy ergo shifters for $3 each! According to the guy at the shop, he likes Yokozuna cables alot and thought they were better than Campy cables that were $8 each - and he emphasized that they're an authorized "Campy Pro shop!"

Imagine that, better quality and cheaper?! What's not to like?! :banana::eek::butt::confused: Good Luck!

[oldpotatoe]

I recently had a rear der cable frey on my Campy ergo shifter. I called around and found a LBS that was selling 1.2mm Yokozuna cables made for Campy ergo shifters for $3 each! According to the guy at the shop, he likes Yokozuna cables alot and thought they were better than Campy cables that were $8 each - and he emphasized that they're an authorized "Campy Pro shop!"

Imagine that, better quality and cheaper?! What's not to like?! :banana::eek::butt::confused: Good Luck!

Jag wire. 1.1 to boot. I sure wouldn't say that Jagwire or Yokozuna are better, just I'd say equal but cheaper. Made in Asia vs made in Europe.

Obtw, Vecchio's has the super slick, 9000/6800 inner wires, I think $20 per, yep, that's right. Another gripe I have for 9000/6800.....we killed a 6800 inner wire, didn't have another, tried a Jagwire and it felt noticeably poorer. An entire system that relies on an expensive and hard to find thing, but minor at the same time.

[dvs cycles]

So those that have 9000 today and have put good mileage on it, have you had the cable break problem? Do I need to take apart my cables every few months?

thx
Mine started fraying at a disappointing 5000 miles for a $20 cable.
By comparison my 7800 sets usually started to go at 10,000 miles.
Waiting to see if this one gets more life or just plan on a proactive approach and replace at 5000 intervals.

[BdaGhisallo]

Shimano has modified the 9000 STI levers to address these issues. Look for the 9001 levers. I don't know when they'll hit the streets but keep your eyes peeled.

I found out about them over on weightweenies:

http://imageshack.us/a/img33/7591/9xi.JPG

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=119603&start=0

Scroll through as there's a diagram showing the difference between 9000 and 9001 STI levers and also some pics of the new ones in the flesh. In addition to correcting the cable routing, Shimano have made some minor ergonomic changes to the levers and hoods.

[buddybikes]

do you thin Yokozuna would work as well as original 9000s? Anybody try it?

thx

[BdaGhisallo]

I used Yokozuna as an upgrade from 7900 cables when I was still using mechanical and they made a HUGE difference. I don't know if they are as much of an improvement, friction wise, as the 9000 cables when compared to 7900 cables. But, they don't have any issues with their coating fraying.

They'd be worth a try and they're a good bit cheaper than 9000 cables.

[John H.]

I replaced my frayed 9000 cable with another 9000 cable.
I am building up my "rain" bike with 9000 this weekend.
I was considering installing a set of Gore fully sealed cables as they have always worked well for me on winter bikes.
Stayed tuned for the report.

[buddybikes]

Again where do people buy them, my local store doesn't have them

thx

[John H.]

I just installed a 9000 drivetrain with Gore Professional Fully sealed cables. Seems to work 100% as god as with the Shimano Polymer cables.

I replaced my frayed 9000 cable with another 9000 cable.
I am building up my "rain" bike with 9000 this weekend.
I was considering installing a set of Gore fully sealed cables as they have always worked well for me on winter bikes.
Stayed tuned for the report.

[oldpotatoe]

I just installed a 9000 drivetrain with Gore Professional Fully sealed cables. Seems to work 100% as god as with the Shimano Polymer cables.

god doesn't care about your cables...........KIDDING.

Thought Gore was outta the cable biz...NOS kit?

[John H.]

I went deep a year ago when they announced that they would stop making them.

god doesn't care about your cables...........KIDDING.

Thought Gore was outta the cable biz...NOS kit?

[sw3759]

i called shimano tech support today to ask about the 9000 and 9001 shifters.he told me the revision is to address a "rattle" with the 9000 shifter.
i've not of heard of any complaints about a rattle with the st-9000.he also said they haven't heard of any issues with premature cable wear with the st-9000.really hard to believe

[oldguy00]

i called shimano tech support today to ask about the 9000 and 9001 shifters.he told me the revision is to address a "rattle" with the 9000 shifter.
i've not of heard of any complaints about a rattle with the st-9000.he also said they haven't heard of any issues with premature cable wear with the st-9000.really hard to believe

lol.....nice....I bet they'd have a huge amount of 9000's to replace if word got out..

[JeffWarner]

Shimano has modified the 9000 STI levers to address these issues. Look for the 9001 levers. I don't know when they'll hit the streets but keep your eyes peeled.

I found out about them over on weightweenies:

http://imageshack.us/a/img33/7591/9xi.JPG

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=119603&start=0

Scroll through as there's a diagram showing the difference between 9000 and 9001 STI levers and also some pics of the new ones in the flesh. In addition to correcting the cable routing, Shimano have made some minor ergonomic changes to the levers and hoods.

Has anyone gotten a hold of the revised 9001 levers and compared the cable routing to the original 9000 levers? I've seen the picture comparison and its clear the lever design is different to give a bit more coverage to the internals ... but what about the cable routing?

The 9001 parts diagram is posted on the Shimano Tech site. The 9001 has a different shape "cable cover" (same as the 6800), but the cable guide (the curved piece, part # Y63X63000 (right) and Y63X55000 (left)) are the same. This seems to indicate, to me at least, that the cable routing between the 9000 and 90001 is the same.

Interestingly, the 6800 shifters use the same cable guide so chances are its got the same routing (and any issues with snapping cables) as the 9000/9001 shifters.

9000 STI parts http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/ev/EV-ST-9000-3331.pdf
9001 STI parts http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/ev/EV-ST-9001-3647.pdf

[John H.]

I have installed 6800- cable path is better.

Has anyone gotten a hold of the revised 9001 levers and compared the cable routing to the original 9000 levers? I've seen the picture comparison and its clear the lever design is different to give a bit more coverage to the internals ... but what about the cable routing?

The 9001 parts diagram is posted on the Shimano Tech site. The 9001 has a different shape "cable cover" (same as the 6800), but the cable guide (the curved piece, part # Y63X63000 (right) and Y63X55000 (left)) are the same. This seems to indicate, to me at least, that the cable routing between the 9000 and 90001 is the same.

Interestingly, the 6800 shifters use the same cable guide so chances are its got the same routing (and any issues with snapping cables) as the 9000/9001 shifters.

9000 STI parts http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/ev/EV-ST-9000-3331.pdf
9001 STI parts http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/ev/EV-ST-9001-3647.pdf

[JeffWarner]

I have installed 6800- cable path is better.

Interesting. What's causing the "improvement" .. parts, design, cable angles,other????

[John H.]

Angles are different. The "door" that covers the cable is different too.
Even the hood peels back better.

Interesting. What's causing the "improvement" .. parts, design, cable angles,other????

[JeffWarner]

Angles are different. The "door" that covers the cable is different too.
Even the hood peels back better.

Thanks. Better cable angles sounds tangible....is this the entry into the lever body? I've read many theories on the 9000 shifter "snapped" cable issue and I thought it was sharp bend in the lever body that was causing it. You think the 6800 will suffer the same issues?

I've got a set of the 9000 Shifters picked up on sale over the holidays. Since 9001 shifter (might have different cable routing) does not seem to have entered this seller's inventory ..... I'm weighing the time-cost-pain of returning the 9000 and waiting for the 9001. I can live without the new body shape; but if the cable routing is improved, I'd like it.

[John H.]

If they are new I'd return them.
My plan is to get 9001 as soon as possible.

Thanks. Better cable angles sounds tangible....is this the entry into the lever body? I've read many theories on the 9000 shifter "snapped" cable issue and I thought it was sharp bend in the lever body that was causing it. You think the 6800 will suffer the same issues?

I've got a set of the 9000 Shifters picked up on sale over the holidays. Since 9001 shifter (might have different cable routing) does not seem to have entered this seller's inventory ..... I'm weighing the time-cost-pain of returning the 9000 and waiting for the 9001. I can live without the new body shape; but if the cable routing is improved, I'd like it.

[Mnm1945]

I have lots of miles on my 9000 and no issues with the cables yet. Keeping my fingers crossed

[John H.]

Lucky you- I am on my 3rd rear derailleur cable.

[oldpotatoe]

Lucky you- I am on my 3rd rear derailleur cable.

Is the little guide thingy there? Not the plate but there are supplied ferrule looking things, with a wee tube on the end, to guide the cable out of the lever..lacking that can cause broken, VERY EXPENSIVE, shift cables.

[tribarbet]

Great thread. I've been looking to upgrade my 7900 for 9000. I have 7800 on another bike and I also think it's better (smoother). I have no plans of getting rid of my 7800. Can't wait to upgrade the 7900.

[AJosiahK]

I frequent a shop outside of boston, who has two demo bikes with both 6800 and 9000. The 9000 is fantastic, with the few changes they've made really are nice. The group looks great too, very easy to dial in. Of course 6800 has trickle down tech from 9000. Not many options for 11spd road disc currently though.

[JeffWarner]

I frequent a shop outside of boston, who has two demo bikes with both 6800 and 9000. The 9000 is fantastic, with the few changes they've made really are nice. The group looks great too, very easy to dial in. Of course 6800 has trickle down tech from 9000. Not many options for 11spd road disc currently though.

If you check on slowtwitch.com ... some folks are finding success by taking one cog and spacer out of the 11 speed cassette to get it to fit on a 10 speed hub body. You loose a gear, but its cheaper than a new disc rear!

Once I upgrade to 11 speed, I plan to do the same to keep some older wheels in the mix.

[wooly]

I just made the switch from Campy SR to DA 9000. When ordering from Ribble I spec'd the new 9001 shifters.

Gotta say, the shifters take some getting used to, coming from years on campy. Still reaching for the thumb shifter... But I have to say, the group is mighty fine. Shifting is flawless, smooth and exact. Campy has the distinct shifting feel but no better or worse. All in all I am happy so far. I'm just hoping I can get used to the ergonomics of the hoods as compared to campy. Campy just got that part right.

[RacerJRP]

The cable routing on these two shifters is identical. It is purely cosmetic changes under the hood and with the head of the lever. 9000 is open and 9001 will be finished on the inside of the lever like 6800 is.

As for those breaking cables, it is a must to use the ferrules that are supplied with the levers in the specified locations, as well as use the correct Shimano cable. to be exta buttery smooth one could even apply SP41 lube to the lever body where the cable contacst it.

[denapista]

I just made the switch from Campy SR to DA 9000. When ordering from Ribble I spec'd the new 9001 shifters.

Gotta say, the shifters take some getting used to, coming from years on campy. Still reaching for the thumb shifter... But I have to say, the group is mighty fine. Shifting is flawless, smooth and exact. Campy has the distinct shifting feel but no better or worse. All in all I am happy so far. I'm just hoping I can get used to the ergonomics of the hoods as compared to campy. Campy just got that part right.

I'm running SR11 on my Speedvagen and I recently built a Signal with 6800. Oh man the first thing I noticed were the HUGE hoods and shifter difference. WHOA! The jump from Campy to the new Shimano hoods is taking me some time to get used too. I did a 60 mile gravel climb and my hands wee super cramped from the huge hoods and I actually have very large hands. Maybe muscle memory from riding skinny Campy hoods for the last 2 years.

I must say that the new Shimano 11 speeds groups shift like nothing I've ridden before (7800, 7900 and SRAM Red). The shifting is electronic like. You click and it just happens. My CX bike is super smooth and doesn't make a sound. My buddy on the gravel climb commented that he never heard a sound from my bike the entire ride. I'm anxious to try to 9000 and see if there's a huge difference from 6800. I'm running a Campy T11 rear wheel with 11-25 SR Cassette, and I have noticed the rear changes have gotten a little tiny sloppy almost like a long shift feeling. Could be the new cables stretched and I need to click a few notches on the barrel. That's my only gripe which is pretty minimal. It's weird how the new Ultegra Di2 parts are almost lighter than SR11 individually...