Car Musings, need a new one... Mazda3, Subaru Impreza, etc.

[bikerboy337]

So I'm looking for a new car now... I've got a 2006 Saab 9-3 Aero Sportcombie (wagon) that I love, but have come to the realization that getting about 20mpg average just wont cut it for the family.

We ahve an SUV for the wife and thats the weekend driver/family car, so I'm looking for something smaller for my daily commute (20 miles) and for just getting around.

Thinking of the following.

Mazda3 (2013) hatchback for around 19k
Subaru Impreza hatchback for about 21500
Ford Focus hatchback for around 22000

Really thinking the mazda will be the car, but wondering if there are any other thougths out there...

Needs:
hatchback
good mileage
reliable
22K and under.

Thanks!

[AngryScientist]

as a euro snob, my vote would be for a golf.

[bikerboy337]

My first car out of college was a 99 new Jetta. Worst car ever, I spent more time in teh shop with that thing, had a rusted out catalytic converter at 4 years/65k, replaced the o2 sensors about a dozen times... so we have a no VW rule in my house... maybe in a nother 10 years, but for now, they're not allowed...

[William]

Just picked up an Element SC (= Street Custom, lol ). Amazing amount of room for the size of the vehicle and it ticks all the boxes. Our 6' 6" son already wants to drive it.... no way buddy!:D

5 speed manual, sport tune suspension, blacked out interior yada yada yada.... I guess they were trying to appeal to the tuner crowd.




William

[vav]

2013 hyundai elantra GT

[echelon_john]

The Aero only gets 20mpg!? Dang. My 2007 2.0T has been getting almost 30.

The three cars on your list were on my short list too. I like the 3 a lot; got a little spooked by reports of early/weird rust issues across the Mazda lineup from my repair guy; did some checking and found a lot of talk about it, but little info about whether it was resolved. They're nice looking IMO, and seem well setup for somewhat enthusiastic driving.

[bikser]

I've had a hatchback for several years, great car. Dependable, functional, fun to drive. Probably my 4th or 5th Mazda, next car will be too. Other cars on your list are excellent as well.

[Louis]

I ended up choosing the Impreza (Sport Limited) to replace my '97 Integra. They had to order one because I wanted a manual. I have about 4 more weeks to go before it gets here.

[bikerboy337]

[QUOTE=echelon_john;1421802]The Aero only gets 20mpg!? Dang. My 2007 2.0T has been getting almost 30.QUOTE]

Yup... 2.8L V6 with a turbo... the thing flies and is a lot of fun to drive, but lacks in the mileage department...

[JStonebarger]

Honda Fit Sport.

Four door hatchback.
Most reliable thing out there.
Mine gets 32-35 mpg without me even trying.
$17,000.

Oh, and it's fun to drive.

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

as a euro snob, my vote would be for a golf.

He said reliable, Nick. I owned a '91 Jetta, just about my favorite car, ever. Until just about everything electrical that could break, did.

Honda Accord Sport, 33MPG in real driving conditions, MSRP $24K (which means $22K is a realistic negotiable number). Very roomy, seats 3 adults in the rear. handles great, 189HP. Yes, no hatch, but large trunk, no leather, stick (on the Sport, at least) or sunroof (well, those are MY requitements, and the reason I don't own one), and reliable as sunrise.

[Louis]

He said reliable, Nick. I owned a '91 Jetta, just about my favorite car, ever. Until just about everything electrical that could break, did.

Reliability and antiquated external styling (inside was nice) are the two main reasons I dropped VW from my list of candidates.

[cmg]

Honda civic or toyota corolla, new or used. drive them until they explode. yep, boring cars but for reliability/longevity there's none better. If you want excitement disconnect the brakes.......:)

[FlashUNC]

The Mark VI Golfs and GTIs have been super reliable. (I know mine has over the last four years).

That being said, tough to go wrong with a Focus. Ford knocked it out of the park on those.

[JonSnow]

Subaru XV Crosstrek

[Hawker]

Hyundai Elantra Touring...especially if you want to carry your bike(s).

[bargainguy]

OK, it won't win any horsepower wars, but my Honda Fit can do one thing most subcompacts can't:

--Stuff five bikes in the back w/seats down, front wheels removed, each staggered front to back;

--and get 35+ mpg with manual tranny.

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

Honda civic or toyota corolla, new or used. drive them until they explode. yep, boring cars but for reliability/longevity there's none better. If you want excitement disconnect the brakes.......:)

Plus 1. Have an '06 Civic, 169K miles, not a single problem, has only cost me regular maintenance (oil and fluid changes) and "consumables," IE tires and brake pads. It just goes and goes. Regularly get 38-42 mpg.

[druptight]

got a little spooked by reports of early/weird rust issues across the Mazda lineup from my repair guy; did some checking and found a lot of talk about it, but little info about whether it was resolved. They're nice looking IMO, and seem well setup for somewhat enthusiastic driving.

I have the first year of the Mazda 3 hatch. It's been fairly trouble free aside from the aforementioned rust problem. Mine has major rust issues particularly around the wheel wells. Based on consumer reports they fixed these issues after the 1st or 2nd year, I do not believe they exist beginning with about the 06 or so.

My '04 manual hatch has 142,000 miles on it, and is still rolling along on it's original clutch. I have a roof rack on it, but I can fit 2 bikes (54cm) in the back without taking the wheels off fairly easily. Plenty more with front wheels off. Rack only gets used when there's other cargo that prohibits the bikes going in the back. For a long time I was considering the impreza hatch, but the more I think about how hassle free the Mazda 3 has been, the more I lean towards another one.

[tch]

... and LOVE it. 40 mpg average across everything. Better if it's highway. And it's been realiable.

But... I understand that sometimes irrational prejudices are at work. Myself, I won't go near another Subaru for a long time. Of the cars mentioned that I've been in: Honda Fit or Hyundai Touring GT. I drove the Mazda 3 for a weekend as a rental and it just felt cheap.

[nmrt]

since we're talking about anecdotal evidence, I've got to come to VW's rescue.
I had a 1999 Jetta VR6 -- extremely reliable. Had gone to the dealer once for O2 sensor all the while I had it (170K miles). My next car was a 2005 VW GTI 1.8T. Never went to the dealer for anything apart from oil changes. Sold it at 100K miles. Of course, both cars went to the dealer for routine maintenance -- spark plugs, filters, fluid changes etc.

I dunno why some people have troubles with VW. But I would buy VW again in a heartbeat.

So, my recommendation to the OP -- VW Golf TDI.

[rice rocket]

Honda Fit Sport.

Four door hatchback.
Most reliable thing out there.
Mine gets 32-35 mpg without me even trying.
$17,000.

Oh, and it's fun to drive.

I have a Fit now too, I get 32 mpg driving like a twerp dodging jackholes on their phones. ~38-39 mpg on longer trips.


That said, the Fit is due for a refresh early next year, and should add direct injection (which is what Mazda/Subaru has been using to push up their MPG). If all else holds equal, you'd probably see 45-50 *actual* mpg.

Girlfriend has a new 2012 Impreza, the Fit is bigger on the inside. The Impreza is a nicer highway cruiser though, the Fit is a little buzzy. She averages 28 mpg combined, ~35 mpg on the highway.


Also, I like Mazda's ideals (fun-to-drive, inexpensive cars), but they very consistently suck at a few things. Our family has had two, an '01 626 and a newer '05 Mazda3, both had transmissions on their way out around 80k. They also fall apart on the inside around that time too and EVERYTHING rattles.

[JStonebarger]

If you don't already, subscribe to Consumer Reports online. The car reviews alone are worth the price. Detailed ratings on reliability could save you a lot of headaches.

[rice rocket]

I dunno why some people have troubles with VW. But I would buy VW again in a heartbeat.


I know why.

Overengineering at a company run by the accountants, and poor quality control.

Our family's '00 Passat was always seconds away from being in the shop. In 4 years, we had all sorts of little things fail, but thankfully nothing crippling. Coilpack failures were the year after, when they switched suppliers. :crap: But...what else failed... coolant temp sensor, A/C clutch switch, trunk microswitch, flasher relay, cupholders... Control arms were on they way out too.

Oh, a really neat trick is when the seal at the coolant temp sensor fails and the pressure pushes coolant past the broken seal. Over time, the wires will begin to corrode and if left unchecked, the corrosion will eventually reach the ECU and cause it to fail. Try explaining that to customers that don't know anything about cars. Happens to BMWs too. :)

http://www.meeknet.co.uk/E38/Damaged_ECU_Connector_1_LR.jpg

[Pelican]

Finally a thread topic that I know something about! I love cars almost (maybe more?) than bikes.

I would strongly suggest you wait for the new 2014 Mazda 3 unless you're very price sensitive. The new car is starting to hit dealer lots and will be selling at reasonable prices by November.

If you don't care to have the latest and greatest, you should still wait for the new car and get a smoking deal on a leftover '13 model.

Cheers,
Hong
p.s. feel free to email me if you need help, it's kinda of my business. hong@qarmic.com

[Sheldon4209]

My 2011 Toyota Prius gets consistently over 50 mpg. Put the seats down, take both wheels off and put a tandem in the back. Check the reliability in Consumers Report, they are at the top. We often take the Prius (with tandem in back) on a trip and leave our Toyota Sienna van at home. We save $250 in gas on a trip to Florida.

[I Want Sachs?]

hyundai elantra GT

Another vote for this.

[gomango]

Honda Fit Sport.

Four door hatchback.
Most reliable thing out there.
Mine gets 32-35 mpg without me even trying.
$17,000.

Oh, and it's fun to drive.

Excellent suggestion.

We enjoy ours and it has been a champ in the snow here in Minnnesota.

Blizzaks help quite a bit, but frankly, we have had good luck with the Goodyear Eagle ASs as well.

Great fuel economy and I can carry two mtbs inside no problem with the fold up rear seat.

We paid $15,000 even for ours when new and will certainly consider another in 10-15 years when this one croaks......

[kramnnim]

Subaru XV Crosstrek

You know nothing.

(Sorry, had to)

I recently bought a 2013 Focus hatchback...sticker was $22k, but it ended up being $18.2k out the door.

It's been getting ~32mpg just driving around, and seemed to average 38 on the interstate (8+ hour drive, ~70mph) Supposedly it gets better with time... (It has ~3k on the odometer)

My 2001 Jetta TDI gets at least 38mpg no matter what I do. Would've bought a new one instead of the Focus but they are a bit more expensive and diesel costs at least 10% more than gas...

[Benny Profane]

You know nothing.



He likes to drive in snowstorms. Try that with a Focus.


My criteria for buying a car last winter was (a) four wheel drive (I ski) , and (b) a bike fits easily inside. I wound up buying a Forester, which is my second one, and it fits those criteria well. Plus, I know it will operate trouble free (in snowstorms, especially) for at least 125,000 miles, and, with a few repairs, until 180-200,000. My bike lives inside most of the week, because I have no garage and I'm too lazy to take it out every night, and the Subaru comes standard with a great alarm system and dark windows. I also live around rich people, so, I trust them, but, you never know.
My only complaint, and, it's a big one, and makes me think of trading for a Crosstek, is that the roof is too high, which makes it a pain in the butt to put a bike up on the roof, and I'm 6 feet tall. This Forester is about six inches higher than my '03. I think that just wanted to give this little car with great clearance a more rugged SUV look and driver height. sheesh. Furgetabout my Thule box I use for skiing. I had to buy a small stepladder to get up and into that thing. If I had it on the Crosstek, I'd be looking down in it. I mean, basically the same car, with a ton of clearance and, I'm pretty sure a bike fits into the back of a Crosstek. Not as easily, but, it gets in there.

[Climb01742]

Just picked up an Element SC (= Street Custom, lol ). Amazing amount of room for the size of the vehicle and it ticks all the boxes. Our 6' 6" son already wants to drive it.... no way buddy!:D

5 speed manual, sport tune suspension, blacked out interior yada yada yada.... I guess they were trying to appeal to the tuner crowd.




William

William, may I ask the mileage and approximate price you paid (don't mean to pry so ballparks are cool). I've been tempted to check these out used. Always seemed like a great bike/dog/stuff car. Thanks!

[tkbike]

OK, it won't win any horsepower wars, but my Honda Fit can do one thing most subcompacts can't:

--Stuff five bikes in the back w/seats down, front wheels removed, each staggered front to back;

--and get 35+ mpg with manual tranny.

Just out of curiosity, what size bike do you ride?
I am an average size rider(6'2.5") for the group I ride with and there is no way we can fit 5 bikes in the Fit.

[gomango]

Just out of curiosity, what size bike do you ride?
I am an average size rider(6'2.5") for the group I ride with and there is no way we can fit 5 bikes in the Fit.

I've done three large mtbs inside, three on the back and two on the roof.

At the same time.....

Only for six miles though after a race in southern Minnesota.

[christian]

I'm in the process of looking too. After a lifetime of crazy cars, I think I'm going to get....

A Chevrolet Cruze Eco.

[gasman]

I'm in the process of looking too. After a lifetime of crazy cars, I think I'm going to get....

A Chevrolet Cruze Eco.


You are too funny

[christian]

Not at all. Have a long commute, lots of highway driving. Looking for a high-quality appliance with a quiet interior. (Edit: Automotive press seems unanimous that the Cruze is superior to the Civic/Corolla. Going to test drive one this weekend.)

[bargainguy]

Just out of curiosity, what size bike do you ride?
I am an average size rider(6'2.5") for the group I ride with and there is no way we can fit 5 bikes in the Fit.

I should take a pic next time. Every time I head to a swap, I take five bikes inside - and for good measure, sometimes an extra three on a Saris Bones rack on the hatch. Yes, it's a tight fit, but with front wheels removed and five full-size bikes in there, I can even cram a workstand and some other goodies back there. MTBs are worse than road bikes, the bars are generally wider and harder to position.

I've done the following so many times I've lost count - I often buy two, three, four bikes at a time. The seller sees my little car and asks how I'm going to get them home. I say watch me, then the Fit swallows them, I wave and go on my merry way.

BTW, I take a 46cm, but I'm rarely transporting my own bikes.

[carpediemracing]

So I'm looking for a new car now... I've got a 2006 Saab 9-3 Aero Sportcombie (wagon) that I love, but have come to the realization that getting about 20mpg average just wont cut it for the family.

We ahve an SUV for the wife and thats the weekend driver/family car, so I'm looking for something smaller for my daily commute (20 miles) and for just getting around.

Thinking of the following.

Mazda3 (2013) hatchback for around 19k
Subaru Impreza hatchback for about 21500
Ford Focus hatchback for around 22000

Really thinking the mazda will be the car, but wondering if there are any other thougths out there...

Needs:
hatchback
good mileage
reliable
22K and under.

Thanks!

The only drawback - diesel. You can't fill both cars on the same transaction, need two different transactions. With all the "gas points" things nowadays this can be significant. We fill both our cars plus a 5 gal extra and typically save $20-30 total. With gas and diesel we couldn't maximize our savings.

If that's not a factor then read on.

Not sure about prices at this moment but we have two VW TDi, a Golf and a Jetta Sportswagen. With the Jetta we just drove to Maine and back. On the way up, with a bike on the roof, AC going, moderately loaded car, 43mpg, 65mph avg (so in reality we spent a lot of time in the 75 mph range), 6h22m "engine on" time. After some local trips (45 minutes to get to the grocery store up in the boonies etc) and the drive back (including a long detour to visit my brother, and a lot of time sitting in stand still traffic due to construction), 1057 miles, 56 mph, 41.8 mpg. We really pushed on the way back due to the time - we finally got home at 1 AM, and I basically did a time attack kind of thing, trying to beat the GPS prediction (I shaved 25? minutes off the GPS's first guesstimate from my brother's house even factoring in our stops).

The TDi has 230+ lbs-ft of torque. It made my 350Z feel not so fast (287? lbs-ft). Granted, the TDi needs to be going 20 mph before it feels fast due to the lack of HP (140), but it'll go up the long I-84 hills around here at 75 mph no problem, 2 bikes on the roof, at 18-20 mpg. In fact, having been a Civic owner, I know that they can't accelerate up hills so I'll wait for hills to get rid of annoying tailgaters in Civics.

If you enjoy driving/tinkering like me then the Golf isn't the best handling car. It feels way too mushy (relative to the Z, '09? Civic Si, a heavily modded Focus, a slightly modded Mazdaspeed3). I'm leaving it for now but I'd put stiffer springs and sways if I had my druthers.

Sweet spot for the TDis are in the 45-55 mph range on non-highways. It's a 45-55 mpg kind of drive when it's like that. City, not so great (36-38 mpg with our 1-3 mile trips in town). Highway, once you hit about 70-75, it starts to tail off quickly. At 80 (speed limit way up north) the car is at 28-32 mpg.

For some reason the JSW gets better mileage than the Golf, consistently, maybe by 10%. JSW best mileage was in the low 50s for a 5+ hour trip (no roof rack), Golf on similar drives 45 mpg at best (no roof rack).

We have the 2010 JSW and the 2011 Golf. 44k and 21k miles. I think you could get the Golf for 21k-ish, the JSW you may be able to get in the 22-23k range.

We drove both in the snow, and the first big snow day for the Golf was a drive up to Maine a couple years ago. Even the Maine folks were talking about how bad it was. The 6.5 hour trip was closer to 10-12 hours (it started snowing 3 hours in) but the car was great with snow tires. Max speed on the under-plowed roads (I-95 mostly) was 45-50 mph but totally within my risk-averse comfort range.

We actually bought our cars in preparation for our first/only kid. He's 18 months old now, and we wanted to have good, solid vehicles that were essentially interchangeable. Prior to this we had a 2002 Civic EX (terrible air cleaner case design, anemic, but otherwise fine) and the Z (for a 28-33 mpg car it was super fast/fun but only two seats, massively expensive tires/brakes/etc, and... well I sorta wish I'd kept it). We've been very happy with the two TDis.

JSW with bike, 4 hours from "The Outpost" (in-laws) in Maine, 5 hours from home. We were visiting my brother and his wife and two kids. This is our 41.8 mpg trip, end of August 2013.
https://scontent-b-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/1237829_10151926112413824_1904910815_n.jpg

Golf the day after we got there, after the snow stopped. 2011.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-oj16mPDJ61M/TtJOdgLpDdI/AAAAAAAADxU/pTYd1IgUHr0/s800/2011-11-23_14-06-03_601.jpg

[gasman]

Not at all. Have a long commute, lots of highway driving. Looking for a high-quality appliance with a quiet interior. (Edit: Automotive press seems unanimous that the Cruze is superior to the Civic/Corolla. Going to test drive one this weekend.)

Let us know what you think but the Eco trim just barely increases the mpg from 26 to 27.

[Louis]

Ferrari FF, which I believe stands for F'n Fast.

1) It is a hatchback.
2) Don't worry about the gas mileage. It will be so much fun to drive, the time will literally fly by.
3) Um, it comes with it's own mechanic - is that good enough?
4) Well, at $370,000, maybe it's a bit over your limit. But did I mention the 660 hp?

Needs:
hatchback
good mileage
reliable
22K and under.

Thanks!

http://forums.thepaceline.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=81607&stc=1&d=1305410732

[christian]

Let us know what you think but the Eco trim just barely increases the mpg from 26 to 27.Will do. Apparently the bump in highway mileage is from 38 mpg to 42 mpg. If it reliably gets near 40mpg the purchase cost savings over a Golf TDI would take me 10+ years to recoup. (My commute will be 90+% highway.)

[jeffreng58]

is there any question?
go with the impreza. best4 wheel balance in class

[Hank Scorpio]

Not a mini clubman! I have more problems in the last year than with any other car I have owned and that includes two vw's that were both pretty crappy. I am looking at the crosstrek as well I just wish they had a manual with a sunroof from the factory.

[Tom]

Volvo C30, manual. Oh, wait, the morons stopped making that model.

Volvo S40 wagon. Oh, wait, the morons aren't selling it in the states.

Never mind.

No, I'm not angry. Just annoyed watching somebody with a good product hit their thumb with a hammer over and over.

[oldpotatoe]

So I'm looking for a new car now... I've got a 2006 Saab 9-3 Aero Sportcombie (wagon) that I love, but have come to the realization that getting about 20mpg average just wont cut it for the family.

We ahve an SUV for the wife and thats the weekend driver/family car, so I'm looking for something smaller for my daily commute (20 miles) and for just getting around.

Thinking of the following.

Mazda3 (2013) hatchback for around 19k
Subaru Impreza hatchback for about 21500
Ford Focus hatchback for around 22000

Really thinking the mazda will be the car, but wondering if there are any other thougths out there...

Needs:
hatchback
good mileage
reliable
22K and under.

Thanks!

Pre owned Jetta TDI Sportwagen.

Mine new was about $2500 more than your $22,000 tho

[fkelly]

You might want to check out the 2014 Mazda3 line. They are starting to arrive in dealer inventory now. There are some incremental improvements over the earlier years ... slightly larger with a larger engine available as an option.

[Veloo]

I just got a 2013 Impreza wagon (Canadian Touring model) at the end of 2012. I'm coming from a 1998 Honda Civic EX sedan.

Nice thing about the Honda was that I could fit the bike and wheels in the trunk totally out of site and even have room for helmet, shoes and bag of clothes.
It was great on gas with a 40 L tank.

The Impreza is a 55 L tank. The AWD had me consuming over 13 L/ 100 km this past winter with the snow tires on it. I do realize it was the break in period of the vehicle so that didn't help. Driving in downtown Toronto I averaged about 10 L/ 100 km this summer. If I am under 10 then I am very happy. This is based on the reading on the dash. I also log my consumption on fuelly.com. I didn't find a huge difference with the AWD this past winter even with very good winter tires but I do live in the city where they tend to plow a lot.
As for bike friendliness, the trunk on the wagon is 16 cm shorter than the Impreza sedan. That means a frame and wheel will not fit in the trunk and you will have to lower the back seats which leaves the bike totally visible. And of course takes away seating.
I'm trying to avoid a roof rack cuz of cost and horror stories. The roof on the Impreza is rack ready with integrated bolting. I'm looking into an in-car system by Minoura called the Vergo Excel. It's not available in North America and the rep wasn't even aware of it until I talked to him on the phone.

[kramnnim]

I also have a 2002 Civic, and the trunk is the perfect width to fit a bike with wheels removed. The Focus hatch "trunk" is much narrower inside, which is frustrating...like the above poster, I have to fold the seats down to get it to fit.

[zap]

Looking for a high-quality appliance with a quiet interior. (Edit: Automotive press seems unanimous that the Cruze is superior to the Civic/Corolla. Going to test drive one this weekend.)

We rented a Corolla last year in Toronto and a Cruze (gas engine) here in the USA.

The Corolla was a disappointment.......it felt cheap in many regards.

The Cruze was a pleasant surprise. It felt solid with decent handling and quality looked ok. Not up to VW standards but certainly superior to the Corolla.

[jh_on_the_cape]

I'm in the process of looking too. After a lifetime of crazy cars, I think I'm going to get....

A Chevrolet Cruze Eco.

To quote my Italian wife, "There is a reason I don't wear sweatpants all the time, and it's the same reason I will not drive a [insert boring car here]"

Sweatpant cover your legs, keep you warm, get the job done at a small cost. And some people wear them all the time, whilie leaning on a shopping cart trolling through Wally World.

http://static.someecards.com/someecards/usercards/1333391701859_2953705.png

[dancinkozmo]

You might want to check out the 2014 Mazda3 line. They are starting to arrive in dealer inventory now. There are some incremental improvements over the earlier years ... slightly larger with a larger engine available as an option.
they switched production for the 2014 from japan to a new plant in mexico...i would avoid, at least until second model year

[gavingould]

i was in this similar dilemma a year ago, though with a higher price range.

went with the TDI Sportwagen brand new. wife and i had narrowed it down to this based on efficiency, creature comforts (her), bike capacity (me) and greyhound capacity (he loves the cargo area)

it's actually in for its first yearly service today, oil change and tire rotation at just under 10k miles.
no issues other than the DSG trans takes a little getting used to; there are points that it can't decide what gear you want based on throttle position so it hesitates or repeatedly up/downshifts. had a slight creaking from the pano roof that dealer took care of quick and easy with adjustment.
efficiency has been great on the highway, not super impressive in the city, but only a hybrid really would be IMO. has plenty of power and still great mileage with bikes on the roof rack.

all that said, we did look briefly at the various Prius models (the V big one being the option for a dog our size) and the Focus.
Fit, Focus, Mazda3, and Subaru all seem to be fine choices.

[christian]

To quote my Italian wife, "There is a reason I don't wear sweatpants all the time, and it's the same reason I will not drive a [insert boring car here]"I own a St. Andrews-made Battistoni dinner suit, and I've owned and driven a few of the equivalent cars. I'm ok with sweat pants for this commute.

(Besides, all cars are boring. Lean the wrong way in corners, too.)

[Aaron O]

We have an older Focus station wagon - an 06' - and it's VERY underpowered. I've been thrilled with the mileage, maintenance costs, and dependability, but the power is an issue, especially with the A/C running. It also has a sort of stiff feeling to it - you really feel the bumps.

Overall, I like the car, especially for the city, but I'm not so fond of it for longer drives or drives up hills in summer.

[gasman]

Not at all. Have a long commute, lots of highway driving. Looking for a high-quality appliance with a quiet interior. (Edit: Automotive press seems unanimous that the Cruze is superior to the Civic/Corolla. Going to test drive one this weekend.)

I own a St. Andrews-made Battistoni dinner suit, and I've owned and driven a few of the equivalent cars. I'm ok with sweat pants for this commute.

(Besides, all cars are boring. Lean the wrong way in corners, too.)

Boring even with Travis driving ? Esp in Colorado ?

[jlyon]

They are due out any day now and in my book should be a cross between a Honda element which is much larger, and a very small wagon like you are thinking about.

If the 2014 upgrades don't interest you they should at least drive down the prices on the remaining 2013s.

[Veloo]

I did have a Ford Focus wagon as a rental for a few days at CX Worlds in Louisville. Was not impressed at all. Felt cheap, did not like the layout and it was small.

[Aaron O]

I did have a Ford Focus wagon as a rental for a few days at CX Worlds in Louisville. Was not impressed at all. Felt cheap, did not like the layout and it was small.

Well - in its defense, it is pretty cheap ;)

I can't disagree with the rest, and I know exactly what you mean by feeling cheap.

I was looking at Subaru and Honda, but the parts cost is much higher...we like the Focus because it's just so easy and inexpensive to keep going (MUCH cheaper than our VW jetta wagon). If we move to the burbs we'll probably get something new and much nicer - having a nice car in Philly, with no garage, is not very sensible.

[kramnnim]

The current generation of Focus might not be as cheap feeling. Doors feel solid, etc.

[staggerwing]

Since my wife and I have two of the vehicles discussed in this thread, I'm going to put a couple of words in.

I have a 2005 Mazda 3s, that I bought new 8 years ago. About that time, I was starting to cycle commute daily, and was losing my affection for automobiles. Just wanted a fairly inexpensive "box on wheels" that didn't outright suck to drive. There is only 56K on the odometer, and by all accounts, she has performed her original task well. However, the is a definite economy feel in general construction...the seat upholstery is thin, the manual gear shift boot soft cover cracked within two years, the sheet metal seems extra thin, and has numerous divots from falling acorns that didn't affect our Toyota Sienna sitting even more in the path of fire, the sound system isn't very good, the paint is thin and fragile, and the best fuel economy I can obtain, trying hard, is 25mpg. On the other hand, there is plenty of power, my 13yo twin daughters and 17yo son can fit in the rear comfortably, there is plenty of room in the hatch, and I haven't had any mechanical failures. Just recently, we spent some time looking for a new ride for my better half, and came to the realization that handling on the 3 was "off'. Some $1200 later, I have some new Koni FSD's all around, a pair of front sway bar links, and 4-wheel alignment, all from a gentleman that knows his way around suspensions. WOW, totally different car to drive. What was loose, and noisy is bolted down and snug, but at the same time, she is very light on her feet. Was feeling a bit jealous of my wife, getting a new rig, but have now been cured. Oh yeah, she is showing significant rust, enough that I anticipate full perforation within the next year. It is particularly heavy in the rear wheel wells, where the metal rear quarter meets the plastic bumper, and oddly, on the flat black b-pillar. If it wasn't for the rust I would give her a solid B+.

Recently, we jumped back into our love/hate relationship with VW, and bought a 2013 Sportwagen TDI with the DSG tranny. Simply couldn't find one left with the manual within 500 miles, and my better half really like the DSG. Still the honeymoon phase, but it has the buttoned down, imperturbable, "bank vault" feel, but is still fun to drive. My wife, who has spent the last 14 years driving a 2000 Sienna, smiles every time she gets behind the wheel. Note: I've been trying to get her to look at vehicles for a couple of years, but the Sienna was unbelievably reliable and cheap to own. Not thrilled that the DSG needs an almost $300 oil change every 40K miles, but at the rate we drive, that will be six years on. In the past, we've had an 80 Rabbit and a 94 VR6, 5spd Passat, and came in knowing that VW can be a little more fickle, but neither of those cars left us in a terrible lurch. We do love the overall packaging, road manners, and incredible fuel economy of the Sportwagen. Hope we made a reasonable purchase. Time will tell. I do feel better that is a local independent enthusiast garage that specializes in VW/Audi vehicles.

[gavingould]

i would've gotten a manual trans sportwagen, but the wife don't drive stick. if we move somewhere where we each need a car, i could see picking one up for myself and she can drive the DSG... i'd probably skip the pano roof and nav if picking one for myself too and save a bunch of $.

[bargainguy]

I know there was a little skepticism I could fit five bikes in the back of my Honda Fit.

Well, this morning's haul only had four, but as you can see, no problem getting them all in there, as well as a rack & pannier set. Didn't have to stagger front to back with four, but would with five. FWIW, 2nd from the left is a 50s Motobecane w/fenders!

[Hawker]

I'm impressed with your effort and the size of the FIT but doesn't that scratch the daylights out of everything?

[OtayBW]

I know there was a little skepticism I could fit five bikes in the back of my Honda Fit.

Well, this morning's haul only had four, but as you can see, no problem getting them all in there, as well as a rack & pannier set. Didn't have to stagger front to back with four, but would with five. FWIW, 2nd from the left is a 50s Motobecane w/fenders!
Note to self: Ixnay on the itfay for emay.

[bargainguy]

I'm impressed with your effort and the size of the FIT but doesn't that scratch the daylights out of everything?

These bikes are all used with scratches anyway. For anything newer and prettier, however, I'll do things like carefully insert wheels between the frames, or some cardboard dividers or whatever.

The rear seats have not been up since I bought the car used with 10K miles (88K mi. now). For me, it's a microvan. Right after purchase, I bought a 3x5' piece of carpeting with rubber backing, and turned it upside down so the rubber backing faces up. The car's original carpeting underneath is still in great condition and not eaten up by tears, grease and whatnot.

[Ralph]

I was in the market a year or so ago to buy a new economical small car. It had to be a fork mount bike hauler and replace a 2010 Honda Element. Element hauled the bikes great, but that particular year model had the seat belts coming from tops of seats, and I was never comfortable in that car. Wife hated driving it occasionally also. Otherwise loved it's practicality. One good thing, after owning it 2 years, got almost all my money back when I sold it. Resale was great on the Element. So, being spoiled by the Element, I made incredibly good resale value another goal of next car.

Honda Fit was on my short list, it hauls bikes good, but just couldn't get comfortable in it. No adjustable seat height. It may be perfect for others. Cheap price also.

After testing out many terrific smaller economical cars, none really bad, and measuring them all inside, I settled on a Honda CRV EX-L. With it's lower floor than outside, it will haul my bikes (56 C) fork mount. It drives decent, seats decent, Electronics (back up camera, handsfree phone, XM, NAV) decent but not great, was able to buy it at invoice from Internet so price good, and resale is outstanding. So met my goals for a cheaper second car bike hauler. None of these bike haulers would be my first choice as an economical fun driver, but bike hauler more important for this car. As usual....Honda products bought right resale very well.And this car was made in America, parts and Engine made in America, American workers, plant owned by Honda of N America which pays American taxes, workers pay American taxes, etc, etc. This car very American. More Americans own shares of Honda Motor Company, where profits ultimately go, one way or another, than Japanese do. As you can tell....I wanted to buy from Americans.