Mike's Bikes

[aatores]

Anyone live near a Mike's Bikes in Northern California who could facilitate a sale? They have great closeout prices but most are "in store only" -- here is their policy: "Or if you can visit a Mike's Bikes store to make the purchase, we can then ship this item to wherever you ask." I am looking for someone to buy a bike (after I send them the $, of course) and have them ship it to me in Colorado (then help rescue a Nigerian billionaire prince stuck in New York :) -- just kidding).

[hokoman]

I might be able to do it... Really contingent on my schedule. Most likely would have to wait until next weekend. What bike is it?

[cnighbor1]

I might be able to do it... Really contingent on my schedule. Most likely would have to wait until next weekend. What bike is it?

If he can't do it I could on Monday or tueday can't you just pay them direct and I pick up Use my name Charles f. Nighbor
Mikes bikes is just up the road
925 708 1295

[bargainguy]

Charles, I think this could be problematic for two reasons: 1. Might violate dealer agreement for out-of-state sales. 2. Might be used in an effort to circumvent CA state sales tax if Mike's doesn't have a B&M presence in the state of the buyer.

I know my LBS has some restrictions on what they can sell and where if it's not a direct point-of-purchase sale. It seems the larger the organization, say the big three (Specialized/Giant/Trek), the more restrictions.

If I'm totally off base here, perhaps a dealer could chime in.

[enr1co]

Is it still a good deal with CA tax of 9% and shipping? Shipping a bike sized box insured to CO can range from ~$80-$110?

[aatores]

Bargainguy is correct -- most dealer agreements that prohibit online sales state that a live customer must walk in and purchase the bike, pay tax, etc. Mikes tries to get around it by saying once that has been done, they can ship it anywhere the buyer wants to ship it. The bike I am interested in retails for $2100 and is on sale for $1500 so after tax and shipping, around $1750. I guess the question is whether I could find a local dealer that would match that price.

[hokoman]

Actually, if I walked into the store, purchased it (they physically swipe my card), and had them ship, they would not charge me sales tax, only shipping (unless MIKE's Bikes also has shops in the state they are shippig). I did it for my gf when I bought her ruby and shipped it to ny. It saved us because shipping was about $100, and tax would have been double. Idea is it would be similar to if I were on vacation in a city and saw a bike I liked and had them ship it to me, I don't think it is a big deal...

[bargainguy]

We're not talking online sales, we're talking point-of-purchase sales. I believe what you're stating is technically illegal. You have to pay tax if you buy in person unless you have a federal ID tax # for nonprofits.

Otherwise, on any big-ticket item - bikes or whatever - it would be too easy to purchase at a store, ship it across a state line (you're in SF - maybe to Reno), drive there & pick it up, and save a boatload of cash.

Don't think the tax people would be too happy about this, don't think the dealer agreement enforcement folks would be happy because now they get involved, any dealer in Reno might take offense if they found out, etc., etc. Slippery slope.

[likebikes]

We're not talking online sales, we're talking point-of-purchase sales. I believe what you're stating is technically illegal. You have to pay tax if you buy in person unless you have a federal ID tax # for nonprofits.

Otherwise, on any big-ticket item - bikes or whatever - it would be too easy to purchase at a store, ship it across a state line (you're in SF - maybe to Reno), drive there & pick it up, and save a boatload of cash.

Don't think the tax people would be too happy about this, don't think the dealer agreement enforcement folks would be happy because now they get involved, any dealer in Reno might take offense if they found out, etc., etc. Slippery slope.
no

you're wrong

if it's for out of state use sales tax is not applicable. i've bought things in person in states with high sales taxes (WA) and didn't pay sales tax; they were for out of state use. i did have to ship it out of state (pay for shipping) at the point of purchase though, I couldn't walk out of the store with the items i bought

[hokoman]

I used to work in luxury retail, it happens all the time as they don't physically take it out of the store, our pos system calculated the tax rate automatically.

[bargainguy]

So I can avoid state sales tax simply by shipping out of state? Damn!

[hokoman]

So I can avoid state sales tax simply by shipping out of state? Damn!

If I bought a ring from Tiffany's in California and sent it to ny, I would still pay the sales tax in the zip I am shipping to since they operate business in ny. If I bought something from billy joe bob's that only has one retail store in sf, and I shipped to ny, I wouldn't owe anything. But for the most part, you can get out of paying for sales tax, but is it worth the hassle? Depends on the cost and shipping cost.

[likebikes]

So I can avoid state sales tax simply by shipping out of state? Damn!
yes

[likebikes]

it happens all the time as they don't physically take it out of the store, our pos system calculated the tax rate automatically.
i dont know what this means

[hokoman]

i dont know what this means

Pos - point of sale. The register calculates the tax automatically when you ring up the sale as a shipment as long as people do not take the merchandise they are buying out of the store.

[Pelican]

So I can avoid state sales tax simply by shipping out of state? Damn!

Also works with cars*. Talk about tax savings!

-Hong
*you should have a residence where you'll register it, and use it in that state obviously.

[sokyroadie]

Also works with cars*. Talk about tax savings!

-Hong
*you should have a residence where you'll register it, and use it in that state obviously.

I TOTALLY disagree with this statement, any item that you must register with the state (car,boat etc) you WILL be caught, perhaps not immediately - but you will be caught. Ask me how I know.:no:

Jeff

[godfrey1112000]

Walked in the Michigan avenue "salon"

30 minutes $2800 a purse, wallet and the wallet strap($120):eek:
Shipped to kc no tax
But we got two free glasses of champagne

And you guys think assos and Rapha is expensive




QUOTE=hokoman;1419336]If I bought a ring from Tiffany's in California and sent it to ny, I would still pay the sales tax in the zip I am shipping to since they operate business in ny. If I bought something from billy joe bob's that only has one retail store in sf, and I shipped to ny, I wouldn't owe anything. But for the most part, you can get out of paying for sales tax, but is it worth the hassle? Depends on the cost and shipping cost.[/QUOTE]

[oldpotatoe]

Also works with cars*. Talk about tax savings!

-Hong
*you should have a residence where you'll register it, and use it in that state obviously.

If I sell over the phone and ship outta state-no sales tax. If the person is 'in person', regardless of shipping out of state-normal sales tax..the ONLY way to keep from being scrutinized by the tax people.

But TiDesigns might be a better source for tax issues, cuz, ya know...

[bargainguy]

FWIW, I was at my LBS yesterday and the subject came up.

Manager said the restrictions on selling bikes through any non-point-of-purchase sale applied to current model years only per his dealer agreement. Once we start talking about last year's and older models, pretty much anything goes. The reasoning is that when one dealer starts to undercut another on current year stuff, we start getting into turf wars.

He cited the case of a shop in San Diego that was selling current-year GT bikes at ridiculous prices, almost half off. So he called his rep to find out what was going on, because one of his customers wanted the LBS to match that price. Turns out the San Diego shop wasn't even an official GT dealer. GT apparently took action to protect their local dealer network.

[josephr]

Also works with cars*. Talk about tax savings!

-Hong
*you should have a residence where you'll register it, and use it in that state obviously.

not anymore it doesn't....people were buying cars in GA or TN for a long time until the state of Alabama wised up and started collecting sales tax themselves at time of vehicle registration for all out-of-state purchases. At an in-state dealership, folks have the option of paying there or paying at registration since they may want to include that in part of a car loan.

I'd think Mike's Bikes is gonna charge you tax as if you were a local buyer. If it were my shop, I would. Still, a good savings after you pay taxes/shipping though.

I'd try and find a local dealer first though...if you don't have a good relationship with an LBS, this might be a good way to start one. They don't have to be your one-and-only for everything, but its there when you need it.
Joe

[Pelican]

I TOTALLY disagree with this statement, any item that you must register with the state (car,boat etc) you WILL be caught, perhaps not immediately - but you will be caught. Ask me how I know.:no:

Jeff

I think you need to re-read my post. I am saying you can buy a car anywhere, but you pay tax where you register it. My parents live in Delaware and we buy cars for them anywhere in the United States. The dealership doesn't charge me tax on their cars. Obviously I pay (a lot) of tax on my cars.

-Hong

[aatores]

So here's how this scenario went down: An awesome forum member went into Mike's in SF and bought the bike I wanted, asking them to ship it to me in Colorado. They agreed, only charging him the shipping fee -- no tax. The only catch was that the bike was in another store so it would have to be shipped from there. I paid the forum member and waited for the bike to arrive.

Upon arrival, the first thing I noticed was very sub-par packing job -- in fact, one of the disc calipers was sticking out of a hole in the box on one side and the rear quick release skewers was sticking out of a hole on the other side as was the end of one of the shifters. I pulled the bike out and noticed the tires were fairly dirty and had obviously been on a few test rides. The saddle and bar tape were dirty, there was a six-inch scratch down the drive side seat stay, the left shifter had another nice scratch and there was some scuffing in the paint at the top tube and seat tube junction and the drive side crank was all scratched up. I didn't even remove most of the protective material because I knew I'd be sending it back so I didn't see the full extent of the damage.

Needless to say I was very disappointed so I called and was told that the bike had been on display for almost a year and had most likely been on many test rides. When I asked why this hadn't been disclosed at the time of purchase, the manager said they didn't know. I said I wanted to return the bike for a full refund, the manager said they had another bike in stock that they would swap out. I asked if they could guarantee that the bike was a "new bike" and they said yes and I asked why that one hadn't been sent instead of the "demo." Again they said they didn't know.

They sent a call tag for the demo bike and have sent the second bike which is scheduled to be delivered Monday. I will report back once it has arrived.

Bottom line: I saved a couple hundred bucks by going this route but in the end I'm afraid it wasn't worth it. Whether or not this kind of service is endemic to Mike's Bikes is still a big question in my mind. Many thanks to the forum member who facilitated the process!

[pdmtong]

Doesn't reflect well on probably the #1 specialized consortium in the country

[bloody sunday]

Doesn't reflect well on probably the #1 specialized consortium in the country

no it doesn't. I generally like Mike's, too.

[n_maher]

no it doesn't. I generally like Mike's, too.

Mistakes happen, seems like they are stepping up and making it right.

[Fixed]

I have not been to mikes bikes yet .since I don't drive here I walk or ride my bike now ,but I would love to help if I can . I am in San Francisco if that helps
I might be able to talk my girl friend into driving me there .
Cheers

[aatores]

The shipper at Mike's forgot part of my address on the shipping label so now I have to wait another day for the second bike to arrive. What a waste of time this all has been!

[bloody sunday]

The shipper at Mike's forgot part of my address on the shipping label so now I have to wait another day for the second bike to arrive. What a waste of time this all has been!

when it rains...

sorry about all this. Hopefully you get some money back after this

[BobbyJones]

FYI- "If the retailer does not collect the sales tax, the purchaser has the obligation to pay the use tax directly to the state where the property is used as long as the item is taxable."

[pcb]

Ditto this, though I suppose the rules may differ from state to state. Here in NJ the retailer is not obligated to collect sales tax if item is shipped out of state, whether the buyer is present or not, unless the item is shipped to a state where retailer also has a physical presence. Physical presence can be another retail outlet or warehouse; maybe even corporate offices or data processing? If shipped to a state where the retailer has a physical presence, the tax rate for that state is charged at point of purchase.

In NJ individuals are supposed to declare all purchases from out-of-state with their local tax officials and pay applicable sales tax, unless they are buying for resale and have a state tax id. This means all the stuff we buy mail-order/internet from other states is supposed to be declared, and we're supposed to pay sales tax on it.

This is near-universally ignored, which is why some states are pushing for laws requiring retailers to collect sales tax on all purchases shipped anywhere. Some online retailers are getting ahead of the curve and already charge applicable sales tax on all shipped items.

FYI- "If the retailer does not collect the sales tax, the purchaser has the obligation to pay the use tax directly to the state where the property is used as long as the item is taxable."