1990 LeMond Team Z Edition Bike

[sales guy]

Hey there. I picked up a Z Edition steel frame-NOS. I would like to build it up to original. Anyone have any great pics or build spec on the bike? I have tons of pictures but nothing great. I know Winning Magazine used to show and list the builds, but I am not sure if anyone out there has something.

Anyone?

[redir]

Full Dura-Ace would be spot on for that bike.

Post pics, that's really incredible you found an NOS one.

[sales guy]

His bike for that year had C Record. But I am not sure of the rims, tires, spokes, and which model(year) of components.

Yeah, I found it in Europe. Was thrilled to find it. It isn't 100% my size but I can make it work. Couldn't pass up the deal and it being NOS!

[alessandro]

Have you searched the archives here?

Lots of pics in this thread:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=1111

And a different take over here:
http://www.bikecult.com/works/archive/06bicycles/lemondTVT90TdF.html

Or you could just put some Scott drop-in bars on it and call it good.:)

[sales guy]

Alessandro,

I saw the one thread on here. Problem is the build is MAvic and the real bike is Campy.

The bike cult images are grainy in some areas and I can't see certain details I want to be careful off.

Thanks for the links though.

[alessandro]

SG, I am mildly confused. You have two threads going about this bike. In this one you refer to your frame as a steel Team Z edition from 1990, and in the other you refer to it as a Worlds Edition TVT frame. Maybe those things are not mutually exclusive; I don't know. I take it that your frame is steel, not carbon. Can you post up a pic or two?

Are you trying to build this up to the original, as-sold spec, or to build it up with the components that Greg rode in 1990? I don't know if they were different, but there's often a difference between what the racer used and what was sold in stores to the general public.

[sales guy]

I have two different frames I am looking for answers on.

One is the TVT frame he used in the Worlds in 1989. The other is the Billato built steel frames the team used when he switched to Z in 1990. This thread is the 1990 Z frame. BUT, not in the Carbon Z edition. The steel one. Which I asume is build correct like the bike cult pics, but you never know. I was thinking of building this with the Paris Roubaix fork, not sure.

Hope that clears things up.

[Grant McLean]

This photo of one of Greg's 1990 bikes is from the Calfee factory
shows the team parts pretty clearly:

Campagnolo group,
Campagnolo rims,
Vittoria tires,
3TTT bars and stem
Selle San Marco saddle
(Time pedals)

[sales guy]

I have that image. I can't tell on a couple small items like 7 or 8 speed, which then changes the derailleurs and shifters and was it a freewheel or cassette. I am almost half tempted to just go visit Calfee and the Bike Hall when I am on a trip to CA.

[Grant McLean]

I have that image. I can't tell on a couple small items like 7 or 8 speed, which then changes the derailleurs and shifters and was it a freewheel or cassette. I am almost half tempted to just go visit Calfee and the Bike Hall when I am on a trip to CA.

That's easy. It would have been a 7 Speed freewheel,
Campagnolo didn't have 8 speed until 1991.

-g

[sales guy]

Where did you find that? Cause I have a 1990 campy catalog with 8 speed in it. Not 1991.

[Grant McLean]

Where did you find that? Cause I have a 1990 campy catalog with 8 speed in it. Not 1991.

It's from Frank Berto's article "sunset for suntour".

If you already know the answers to all these questions, why are you asking them?

[sales guy]

Cause I am trying to make sure on what was actually being used on the bike at that time so I can build it period correct.

Which type and color of chain?
Which hubset? Hole pattern?
Stem? Diameter? Bar?

All of those things can change easily and you can look at something and be wrong unless you know 100%. Hence the reason I am on here looking.

[redir]

Sorry I guess I was mistaken. My 89 Coors Light GL had Dura-Ace on it and now has 8-speed Campy. I thought those bikes had Shimano on them. I think the 8-speed ergo Campy came out in 92 but there were 8-speed DT groups available. Could be wrong again, I didn't get much sleep last night :D

[sales guy]

redir,

i know 8 speed DT was available but ergo wasnt. BUT he could have been using 7 speed for all I know. That's why i'm on here. trying to make a period correct build.

Like his Worlds Edition bike, was a 6 speed! Not a 7 speed. But most people would assume it is 7. That's what I mean.

[cnighbor1]

try a search on flickr LeMond Team Z Bike lots there

[pbarry]

Weren't the Calfee bikes used in the 1991 season? Same year as Merlin built the Team Z Ti frames. Iirc, each team rider had a Calfee and a Merlin, tho GL preferred carbon.

[Grant McLean]

Which type and color of chain?
Which hubset? Hole pattern?
Stem? Diameter? Bar?

All of those things can change easily and you can look at something and be wrong unless you know 100%. Hence the reason I am on here looking.

Here is Ronan Pensec's bike, which looks pretty original.
It appears to have a Record 84 stem by 3TTT and a Scott drop-in handlebar.
Chain is likely by Regina. Hubs, 32 hole.

http://www.campyonly.com/images/retrobikes/2005/VELO_TVT_LEMOND_Z_16.JPG
http://www.campyonly.com/images/retrobikes/2005/VELO_TVT_LEMOND_Z_55.JPG

[Walter]

[QUOTE=Grant McLean;1404256]Here is Ronan Pensec's bike, which looks pretty original.
It appears to have a Record 84 stem by 3TTT and a Scott drop-in handlebar.
Chain is likely by Regina. Hubs, 32 hole.

Grant: Is this one your bike?

Walter in Tucson

[pbarry]

The above and the Calfee on the first page are nothing short of ART. Beauties. :hello:

[Walter]

Weren't the Calfee bikes used in the 1991 season? Same year as Merlin built the Team Z Ti frames. Iirc, each team rider had a Calfee and a Merlin, tho GL preferred carbon.

The black Calfee bikes were used in the '91 season. I own the one ridden then by Francois LeMarchand. 18 of them were built. The multi-colored Z Calfee was the first one done for GL to try.

The Ti Z bikes debuted in '91 at the Giro. Tom Kellog designed it and Merlin did the fab. TK did the finish work. I have the prototype of that series. After GL tested the first one 18 more were made and shipped to the team. LeMond's bike company decided against having Merlin build them for the company and the bike became the Merlin Extralight.

This is the post TK made on the ti bike: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=450106&postcount=53

A photo of my Calfee is attached (I later changed the stem to the correct one and put white tape on it) as well as a shot of LeMond on the bike in the Tour.

The ti GL photos are at post #296: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=90871&page=20

[sales guy]

Absolutely brilliant.

Thanks for the pictures and links. I just to try and get the bikes period correct. It's going to cost a fortune, but I am trying to do it all NOS cause I am super picky about things.

it would be incredible to find one of the Scott LiteFlite Drop Ins with the little inward turn to the front of the bike with the aero bar bridge.

[Grant McLean]

The Ti Z bikes debuted in '91 at the Giro. Tom Kellog designed it and Merlin did the fab. TK did the finish work. I have the prototype of that series. After GL tested the first one 18 more were made and shipped to the team. LeMond's bike company decided against having Merlin build them for the company and the bike became the Merlin Extralight.

This is the post TK made on the ti bike: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=450106&postcount=53

A photo of my Calfee is attached (I later changed the stem to the correct one and put white tape on it) as well as a shot of LeMond on the bike in the Tour.

The ti GL photos are at post #296: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=90871&page=20

What's incredible is that there are photos of the other Merlin built Ti bike for Greg is on another thread here:

And you can see the Merlin decal on the seat tube, being covered up with a Z decal,
just like Tom said!

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=1016763&postcount=34

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=1016764&postcount=35

-g

[Walter]

PS: This is an older thread on my Ti Team Z bike with more photos:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=90876&highlight=lemond+team

[sales guy]

Now I just need to get the other ones out there!

Coors Light Edition
Bottechia
Gan
Lotus Sport 110
Merlin
Calfee

I had a Gan one, period correct! Zap and all. But there was an issue with the frame and I had to return it. They told me I could get a replacement, but it would be either a titanium Clark Kent OR a carbon one from their new owners. I was like, what new owners? And the guy said we've been sold. But I can't tell you who. I was like, seriously? He then said, I will say it's the biggie of the bigs. I said are you focking kidding me? Trek!? He didn't say anything and proceeded to refund my money.

Bastards!

[pbarry]

The black Calfee bikes were used in the '91 season. I own the one ridden then by Francois LeMarchand. 18 of them were built. The multi-colored Z Calfee was the first one done for GL to try.

The Ti Z bikes debuted in '91 at the Giro. Tom Kellog designed it and Merlin did the fab. TK did the finish work. I have the prototype of that series. After GL tested the first one 18 more were made and shipped to the team. LeMond's bike company decided against having Merlin build them for the company and the bike became the Merlin Extralight.

This is the post TK made on the ti bike: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=450106&postcount=53

A photo of my Calfee is attached (I later changed the stem to the correct one and put white tape on it) as well as a shot of LeMond on the bike in the Tour.

The ti GL photos are at post #296: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=90871&page=20

Awesome historic info. Had never seen TK's post on that run. Thanks!

Greg did not get a proto type. His frame went through the que with the rest of the team. I split the Team Z build list with another shop mate at Merlin, and stayed late so I could build the GL frame, but forgot about LeMarchand... Went to work extra early the next day, and made sure everyone on the payroll did one machining operation on Greg's bike. Good times.

[Grant McLean]

Greg did not get a proto type. His frame went through the que with the rest of the team. I split the Team Z build list with another shop mate at Merlin, and stayed late so I could build the GL frame, but forgot about LeMarchand... Went to work extra early the next day, and made sure everyone on the payroll did one machining operation on Greg's bike. Good times.

Tom mentioned that a second frame was built for Greg,
and there are two different 'Greg' bikes in the photo threads above,
his name is in a different font on them.

From your info, clearly they weren't built at the same time.

-g

[WickedWheels]

Awesome historic info. Had never seen TK's post on that run. Thanks!

Greg did not get a proto type. His frame went through the que with the rest of the team. I split the Team Z build list with another shop mate at Merlin, and stayed late so I could build the GL frame, but forgot about LeMarchand... Went to work extra early the next day, and made sure everyone on the payroll did one machining operation on Greg's bike. Good times.

So which frame is which? They are both Greg's geometry.

I ask because the one that said "LeMond" rather than "Lemond, Greg" is hanging up in my shop. It's the one with ser# 4123. According to TK he got 2 frames, both look very used. It doesn't look like either was just a "spare" bike.

[pbarry]

I re-read TK's thread. He was mystified about the other frame's missing records. It was not built on my watch, but probably after I left in the summer of '91, or, it may have been sent through as a custom with a random name; totally plausible. The second image has a sticker, (not a decal that was clear coated over like the team bikes). The difference in font is intriguing. All the bikes in the team run had the more stylized font.

[pbarry]

So which frame is which? They are both Greg's geometry.

I ask because the one that said "LeMond" rather than "Lemond, Greg" is hanging up in my shop. It's the one with ser# 4123. According to TK he got 2 frames, both look very used. It doesn't look like either was just a "spare" bike.

You got me. 4124 is missing from Tom's list. We built in alphabetical order, not by serial number. Spectrum dropouts had different numbers than Merlins. The team bikes in that run had last names only.

[WickedWheels]

PS: This is an older thread on my Ti Team Z bike with more photos:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=90876&highlight=lemond+team

Walter,
What's the serial number on your Ti LeMond?

[Grant McLean]

I re-read TK's thread. He was mystified about the other frame's missing records. It was not built on my watch, but probably after I left in the summer of '91, or, it may have been sent through as a custom with a random name; totally plausible. The second image has a sticker, (not a decal that was clear coated over like the team bikes). The difference in font is intriguing. All the bikes in the team run had the more stylized font.

I'm sure Walter will post more details, but in his earlier post he summarized
what Tom had told him, that his frame was apparently built in Nov of 1990,
not April of 1991 like the rest of the batch that included the LeMond serial #4123.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=942856&postcount=1

[Walter]

The serial # on mine is 2144. My prior post (see the link Grant posted) details what Tom K told me.

The sticker difference may be due to the fact that mine was the early one and the rest were to look like what the production versions would have been sticker-wise. They match what was on the other production bikes in the line. There is no Merlin sticker that I can see under the Campy sticker on mine either.

My bike shows way more signs of use than does WickedWheels bike. My bike condition envy coming out here! The TVT World Ch. Replica that I have that GL used also shows signs of heavy use.

It is great to be able to get more history on these bikes.

Grant: I was curious about the photo of the Pensec bike you posted. I lost the auction for that one!

[sales guy]

Sadly my biggest issue is I can never get an ACTUAL team bike. There's nobody racing that I know of using a 60cm bike! Everyone was always 58 or under. So I am stuck, unlike many of you. You guys are seriously lucky. Best I could do is owner one and hang it on the wall.

[redir]

Sadly my biggest issue is I can never get an ACTUAL team bike. There's nobody racing that I know of using a 60cm bike! Everyone was always 58 or under. So I am stuck, unlike many of you. You guys are seriously lucky. Best I could do is owner one and hang it on the wall.

I hear ya but then again what do you plan on doing with this bike if you build it up all NOS? I'm not sure I would want to ride it. I ride my 63cm GL Coors Light bike a lot and have no worries ;)

[sales guy]

I think I am going to ride them. Not a ton, but every so often for the thrill of it. Been wanting these things forever. Maybe I can find an extra steel framed one around in my size as an everyday beater. But I would love to collect them all. I know the Bottechia ones are a pretty easy find online. Even in the TdF color way.

[aptivaboy]

Sadly my biggest issue is I can never get an ACTUAL team bike. There's nobody racing that I know of using a 60cm bike! Everyone was always 58 or under. So I am stuck, unlike many of you.

They are out there. You just have to keep looking and looking and looking. I have one. It was Kim Andersen's bike and is a 60. It has a fairly checkered past, being up on Craigslist and Ebay several times in the past two years. I got it on Ebay, where it was up for a week with a Buy It Now option before I pulled the trigger. Its damaged and will require some braze ons replaced and and a new paint job, but given its very custom geometry, number tab, and COA, I'm satisfied that its a genuine Team Z issue Lemond frame. Whether it was actually raced or was just a training frame, I don't know. However, domestiques didn't typically get new rides very often so I tend to think that it was raced at least a little bit in 1991.

[sales guy]

Send some pics. I'd love to see it. I have never seen the 60's up there. Usually 57's and below.