Herniated/bulged disc?

[bluesea]

Anyone recovered, recovering, or down and out from a bulged disc? I have one in my lower back (flexion), I've been battling for six years. When it goes completely out, I need two canes to brace my torso in order to walk.

Anyway they are hinting, recommending my cycling days as I know it are basically over. I will probably test that thesis thoroughly in good time, but hopefully not to my downfall. :cool:

[professerr]

If it has been six years of pain then I suspect it is unlikely you've been diagnosed with a herniation so bad that it is clear surgery is the best option.

If that is the case, then read this: http://www.amazon.com/Healing-Back-Pain-Mind-Body-Connection/dp/product-description/1559275871

[firerescuefin]

If it has been six years of pain then I suspect it is unlikely you've been diagnosed with a herniation so bad that it is clear surgery is the best option.

If that is the case, then read this: http://www.amazon.com/Healing-Back-Pain-Mind-Body-Connection/dp/product-description/1559275871

Prof have you read that book. IMO it's complete BS.

[thegunner]

happened to me back in college from rowing. they told me cycling would be fine, and in large part it is... but i still have moments in races where i legitimately have to stop because of unbearable pain in my upper back (feels like my shoulders are tightening up).

not getting surgery / conservative treatment is almost always ideal, but not always avoidable. if you want someone to chat with, don't hesitate PM'ing, i've dealt with this crap for 4 years now on-and-off.

[Andrewlcox]

Here is a book I have read and it makes sense.

http://www.rebuildyourback.com/back_pain_books.php

It's an easy read and not full of BS.

I considered going to a Chiropractor for a decompression machine until he quoted me the price for treatment. I instead started swimming and stretching my back. I have had almost no trouble since I got more active.

Every back is different and every back responds to different treatment.
Don't do surgery, your back will still hurt even after the surgery. Try joining a pool and swimming 3-4 miles per week. It's cheaper than decompression and surgery and more fun getting better on your own.

Good luck

[BurritoGuru]

I have been battling a bad back for over 20 years. I did not think I was going to be able to ride a bike again once I ruptured my l4-s1 in 2004. I have been feeling great since I found the right PT in 2009 or 10. Have been back on the bike but I had to change/lose the racing position. Fine by me. Stem and Saddle height are on the same level. I still have some pain every so often. Stretching and core strengthening was important in my recovery. This is a daily ritual that is not missed.
Hard thing for me was to quit trail running and basketball.
Best of luck in your recovery and don't give up no matter how bad the pain.

[CaptStash]

Been there, done that, survived and came out the other side.

I had a herniated disk (L4-L5) that was causing me extreme leg and hip pain. The first doc I went to explained I needed surgery right then. Immediately Post haste! I went home and my wife tlaked sense into me and got me to call the doctor who treated a friend (ex rower now world record holding track cyclist). That doctor was much moe intune with athletes, and also saw absolutely no reason to play with knives on my back. He gave me shot of cortisone to help things along, and then prscribed nine months of rest. And he meant rest! No running, not even a lot of walking at first and certainly no rowing. A year from the diagnosis I was competing (in rowing) again, and was back at full strength, and even winning races by a year and half out.

I suggest you find a doc who understands adult athletes. Feel free to call, PM or email.

Stash....

PS: I may be in town in a week or so. If so I'll drop you a line.

[alessandro]

^ Nine months of rest. Two things are impressive about this story:
1) A doc who is speaks truth, and
2) A patient who is willing to listen and had the patience to stick with it.

Very often, people want relief, and they want it quickly. Surgeons are people too, and they respond to those pressures.

These issues can and do resolve themselves with six to nine months of rest. The problem with surgery is that once you've gone down that road, there's scarring and other issues. It can be a good option for some people, but it all depends on your condition. Try the other options first and listen to the good folks upthread. :)

[professerr]

Prof have you read that book. IMO it's complete BS.


I have read it, and I hear you. I come from a family with a world-renown surgeon, and various other doctors and scientists. I have an advanced degree myself. I'm intensely skeptical of "alternative medicine".

I also had decades of back trouble and was ultimately diagnosed with a substantial L4-L5 herniation and told by the head of neurosurgery at Stanford that if I didn't have surgery immediately I was likely to develop drop foot or worse. I was subsequently told by the former head of neurosurgery at Walter Reed hospital that the Stanford doctor should never had made such a recommendation and that the real consideration had less to do with my well-being than with various financial incentives (obviously, I'm saying it nicely here). He pointed me to some relevant medical literature and said if I were his son he'd tell me to wait and see.

There is much in the book by Sarnoff that is written in the psychobabble vocabulary of the 1960s, but after exploring virtually every other type of treatment short of actual surgery, I respect the fundamental premise of the book -- that stress is the primary cause of most back pain and that for most people attempts to remedy physical defects (like herniations) are no more likely to alleviate pain than the passage of time. There is ample literature discussing this, and when I went back to the guy at Stanford he didn't dispute the accuracy, and was well aware, of the several studies I mentioned that concluded none of the treatments he proposed, including surgery, were likely to lead to a better outcome than just the passage of time.

I never had the surgery he recommended or any other type of medical intervention other than a couple days on some opiate which did little for the pain and just made me a basket case. I was in such pain that I could not walk 4 feet without support or sit up long enough to drive a car. A cough or sneeze or laugh would trigger a wave of pain involuntarily collapsing me to the ground several times a day. I took some time off, walked as much as I could, gradually started exercising more, and dabbled in various core-friendly, de-stressing techniques (e.g. yoga). I did my best to not let my fear of the pain fill my thoughts. I got better. It took over a year. It was bad. It has been 10 years since. I surf, rock climb, run, cycle, play soccer, chop wood and give exceptional shoulder rides. All with ease.

Obviously, YMMV and I'm not a medical doctor etc. But that's my story.

[TomNY]

30+ years ago I was in a crushing motorcycle accident that injured my back etc. Being early 20s I recovered, with occasional crippling flare ups that last two weeks or so. Later in my 30s during second childhood phase, I fell snowboarding and broke my tail bone and woke up my other spine issues. I had a micro discectomey which trimmed off a herniated section of a disc, I was immediately better, pain free. Returned to physical activity, but MD said the disc material looks like an 80 year old, this is an old injury. OK for 5 more years until a ski accident, guy took me out from above. Next morning legs were screaming agony. Back pain is not disc related IMHO. Two surgeries to fish out the bone chips and disc framents that w swimming around from that motorcycle accident. Another 5 years of good activity, again my spine betrays me. This time cause my discs have been reduced, the procedure is fusion. Removal of disc, titanium spacers, bone putty from Illium, screws into vert L3/4/5 thread a rod until bone graft heals [ about 6 months - two years].

Frankenstein results for months, but determination got me back again, like the last times. I do everything. Ski, Golf, bike, run, swim. Since I spend a ton of time doing PT maintenance I have become somewhat of an asshole expert with real PT books. Check out book on Stability of Spine. It has assessments and exercizes for back patients. Two years post PT vs surgery PT patients are better without surgery complications. There is no cure, merely pipe clamp repairs. You and your body will repair most of what is going on with your back with proper guidance. If I had it to do over knowing what I know now - I would have taken the PT. Saying that today I am pain free, and just rode 66 miles in kick ass mountains. Keep light BMI! Stay hungry if you can.

[Lewis Moon]

I'm on the front end of a congenital L4/L5 problem. I react VERY badly to cortical steroids (you do NOT want to be around me) so those are out. I've found that good, basic core work, along with ALWAYS wearing good, shock absorbtive (aka: running) shoes and always being observant of long term body position (driving in the car, sitting at work, TV chair, bed...bike) has helped stave the problem off. Do everything.
I also have a great Chiro who started out as a PT.

[CNY rider]

My 2 cents:

1. I had sciatic pain 2 years ago. I've never experienced anything so awful. I can clearly remember spending entire nights awake, lying in a pool of sweat, trying to find a comfortable position but afraid to move and set off another tidal wave of pain.
I ultimately got better, and it was Physical Therapy that did it. I still do my core exercises every day, no matter where I am or how busy I am.
I would do anything to never feel that pain again.

2. I see lots of patient who have had spine/disc surgery in their past. Most of them still have chronic pain and many are on long term disability. Make what you will of that.

[OldCrank]

<<< find a doc who understands adult athletes >>> X 200.

I bounced around many chiropractors for years.
They worked hard on extending treatments.
Sometimes the disc bulged out so far it pinched the nerve and my leg just stopped responding.
I almost had the disc sliced out by a respected surgeon.

Then HALLELUJAH I was put in touch with a doc who worked intensively with Olympic teams- running, swimming, etc. He worked on rebuilding the muscles around the spine, especially near the herniated disc. Plenty of physical therapy and icing after. What a difference.

[bluesea]

Thanks much. I had an Ulnar Nerve transposition surgery almost two years ago, and pretty much don't heal well. I plan to take my PT seriously, and will stay off the bike for at least 3-6 mo., possibly longer.

After the above surgery was really looking forward to getting back on the water ocean paddling, but sit-down athletics are apparently a no go for now. Need to look into stand up activities in the meantime.

[TBDSeattle]

I herniated a disk last summer. I had pain like some here have already described. Horrible, debilitating pain that pierced my hip and leg in bolts of pain. On bad days, like professorr, I would literally fall down from pain.

After an especially bad bout that left me on my back for 5 days (laying on the floor and trying to tell myself that it would get better) I saw a sports med doc at my local university. She walked me through my options, including surgery. Thankfully she strongly suggested that I start with PT.

I did, and it changed my perspective entirely. I now have a morning routine that I never miss. I stretch, and do a little core work every morning without fail. I have completely changed the way I sit at work, and changed my activity level. I've been pain free for about 3 months, and my goal is to stay that way.

+1 to what CNY Rider said: I would do anything to never feel that pain again

I'm not a doctor; I work in benefit cost and risk analysis. For me the calculation was that I could always try PT and if it worked great, if not then I'd do surgery. But I can never undo surgery, so I might as well try the alternatives first.

Good luck on your recovery.

[Louis]

I now have a morning routine that I never miss. I stretch, and do a little core work every morning without fail.

When I wake up in the AM I'm tight, tight, tight.

That may be a sign that I should stretch, but I've taken the opposite approach - I don't stretch, and let my body slowly work things out during the day. Right now the only time I do stretch is after workouts. I'm not sure if that's stupid, or not, but it seems to be working for me.

[bluesea]

When I first had this injury I was bedridden for about 1.5-2 weeks.

[ariw]

I had a herniated disc at L5-S1, was treated non-surgically for a few years, then debilitating pain and possible nerve damage led to surgery. I had 2 minimally invasive discectomies and finally a cage fusion about 3 years ago. Surgery isn't the only answer, neither is PT the only answer. I was back on the bike about 2 months after fusion, had a great PT to help me get back on track. Other than stiffness in the morning and occasionally twinges which are most likely muscular, I work, play, and live pain-free.

Surgery is an option that may or may not apply to you, getting properly evaluated, especially including an MRI, is the first step. If you can manage the herniation and prevent it from getting worse using non-surgical techniques, go for it. There is no way for anyone to know in advance how and if it will progress. But if you cannot get back on track using these methods, seek out a spinal surgery specialist, NOT a general orthopedic surgeon, that uses minimally invasive techniques. Spend the time to find out what options they would recommend and why.

Feel free to PM me.

-Ari