TdF Stage 8 (Potential Spoilers)

[chengher87]

Now we're cooking with peanut oil!

[nooneline]

yup. i'm really interested in Quintana - I'm quite surprised that Sky let him go and can't wait to see what he can do.

[Lurch]

Hate to say it, but when someone climbs like that, blows by a guy like Voekler like he's standing still, and doesn't even look like he's breathing hard, makes me curious.

Hate that the sport has made me this cynical. Great stage though so far.

[chengher87]

Well, he is Colombian and being at altitude is a big advantage. Second, Voeckler isn't really a great climber and he was off the back immediately, so his attack really put him over the red zone. There was no way he was gonna keep pace.

[Lewis Moon]

Anyone got a line on a free feed?

[nooneline]

Anyone got a line on a free feed?

cyclingfans.com pulls them together.

[nooneline]

in other news, Sky is boring as hell.

[nbl78s]

What a great start to the Pyrenees!

[Elefantino]

in other news, Bradley Wiggins just threw a brick at the telly.

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

in other news, Bradley Wiggins just threw a brick at the telly.

Bradley who? ;)

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

in other news, Sky is boring as hell.

And so is their jersey.

[jr59]

in other news, Sky is boring as hell.


Maybe so, but if nothing else, they are effective in what they do.

[PQJ]

Postal gave Armstrong good support today and he is looking very strong. Almost unbeatable. I say he gets popped before the Tour is done.

[nooneline]

Hate to say it, but when someone climbs like that, blows by a guy like Voekler like he's standing still, and doesn't even look like he's breathing hard, makes me curious.

Hate that the sport has made me this cynical. Great stage though so far.

Satisfy your curiosity:
http://www.podiumcafe.com/2013/4/10/4206558/message-to-universal-sports-what-the-hell-is-wrong-with-you

[ultraman6970]

They did what they had to do, well looks like the tour is done. 1st and 2nd place will take more time in the next stages so pretty much the tour is done IMO. I totally see the two sky guys winning like for 10 minutes to 3rd place.

Quintana did great, the problem is that he lost all the air in the second climb. The one that surprised me more was Rodriguez and TJ.

[chengher87]

Wow! A few things from today's stage:

1. Tejay Van Garderen is a terrible climber. This climb looked exactly like his climb on the La Planche des Belles Filles.

2. Gotta question Movistar's strategy here. Using up Quintana so early on that first climb was a wasted bullet. That descent was too long and he lost half the lead he gained on the ascent (with which he probably wasted twice the energy). If Movistar was hoping that Sky would have to lead the chase for Quintana, I hate to tell them....Sky has been open about their desire to set pace. If Quintana saved his energy, he would have blistered the last 5km.

3. Andy Schleck actually looked respectable. He probably won't be in the top 10, but top 20 might be possible and a miracle considering everything that's happened.

4. Sky....1-2 again?

Granted, it's only the first "real" mountain stage and there are still two more TT stages left. But man....every team besides Sky and Movistar got shattered today.

[jr59]

Postal gave Armstrong good support today and he is looking very strong. Almost unbeatable. I say he gets popped before the Tour is done.


Try to remember that Armstrong never got "popped"!

I said it last year about Sky. They remind me of Postal. They go to the front and set such a pace that no one can stay there for long.

It wouldn't shock me to one day someone saying that they were dirty. I don't really care one way or another. Just like the Jamaican track team, they haven't been caught, but I believe they are dirty. Who cares? The tour entertains me and that is why I watch it! That and I always learn something about a part of the world that I did not know before.

[HugoBear]

They did what they had to do, well looks like the tour is done. 1st and 2nd place will take more time in the next stages so pretty much the tour is done IMO. I totally see the two sky guys winning like for 10 minutes to 3rd place.

Quintana did great, the problem is that he lost all the air in the second climb. The one that surprised me more was Rodriguez and TJ.

Yeah, I thought TJ would do better. Boy was I wrong.

[Len J]

Better living through chemistry.

Set tempo, bury yourself, blow up the peloton, and the recover and finish second.....lol

Fromme does 6.27w/kg (altitude adjusted)...even Ferrari is quoted as saying man couldn't due above 6 (un altitude adjusted) without help.

It appears most of the others performances are reasonable.....except sky's.

Len

[Ray]

I'm spending July in Italy (Amalfi Coast - NOT complaining!) with no TV and internet limited to a 3G wifi hotspot (provided by Movistar, interestingly enough). So I can't watch this year. But after reading the recap of today's stage, I don't have to wonder too hard about who's not clean in this Tour. Maybe they've found a way to do it and not get caught. Maybe they get popped later in the Tour or later in life. Don't know, don't much care. Cycling News referred to the "eyebrow-raising damage inflicted by Porte and Froome in the final kilometres" - yes, I think eyebrow-raising is pretty inevitable with this kind of domination...

Nonetheless, sounded like a kind of exciting show, so I used my ipad app to program my DVR back home to record it tonight. Better living through chemistry.... better living through technology!

-Ray

[malcolm]

I'm spending July in Italy (Amalfi Coast - NOT complaining!) with no TV and internet limited to a 3G wifi hotspot (provided by Movistar, interestingly enough). So I can't watch this year. But after reading the recap of today's stage, I don't have to wonder too hard about who's not clean in this Tour. Maybe they've found a way to do it and not get caught. Maybe they get popped later in the Tour or later in life. Don't know, don't much care. Cycling News referred to the "eyebrow-raising damage inflicted by Porte and Froome in the final kilometres" - yes, I think eyebrow-raising is pretty inevitable with this kind of domination...

Nonetheless, sounded like a kind of exciting show, so I used my ipad app to program my DVR back home to record it tonight. Better living through chemistry.... better living through technology!

-Ray

Better living through chemistry!!

For you I would recommend lots of red wine, prosciutto and local seafood.

[slidey]

The Chemical Brothers have a new hit it'd seem!

[ultraman6970]

The idea for movistar since they had the next good climber after the sky guys and contador. The idea was to force sky to blow up to pieces chasing quintana but looks like did not work hehe :)

Valverde if consistent, he might get 3rd place. I'm not counting contador, evans or rodriguez now... they just did like crap and later probably will be even worse.



Wow! A few things from today's stage:

1. Tejay Van Garderen is a terrible climber. This climb looked exactly like his climb on the La Planche des Belles Filles.

2. Gotta question Movistar's strategy here. Using up Quintana so early on that first climb was a wasted bullet. That descent was too long and he lost half the lead he gained on the ascent (with which he probably wasted twice the energy). If Movistar was hoping that Sky would have to lead the chase for Quintana, I hate to tell them....Sky has been open about their desire to set pace. If Quintana saved his energy, he would have blistered the last 5km.

3. Andy Schleck actually looked respectable. He probably won't be in the top 10, but top 20 might be possible and a miracle considering everything that's happened.

4. Sky....1-2 again?

Granted, it's only the first "real" mountain stage and there are still two more TT stages left. But man....every team besides Sky and Movistar got shattered today.

[Ray]

Better living through chemistry!!

For you I would recommend lots of red wine, prosciutto and local seafood.

Got that covered. Not to mention the olives and mozzarella! And both pizza and espresso were basically invented not far from here and they still seem to have THOSE nailed too.

Gonna need some sort of chemistry though - my daughter and I are gonna try walking the Path of the Gods on Monday, which takes about 2000 stairs just to get up to it. Not sure I'm up for it, but I'm gonna try... Some of the vertical staircase climbs they have around here make the toughest climbs I used to do on a bike seem easy in comparison. Although its a lot easier to just stop and take a short break on foot...

I'll keep checking in on the Tour but it almost seems a foregone conclusion after just one mountain stage. But you never know...

-Ray

[Wilkinson4]

Wow, total carnage. Richie Porte is awesome! TJ and Cuddles not so much. Surprised that Contador was not looking well at all.

mIKE

[MattTuck]

Perhaps the only hope for excitement on the GC will be of Richie Porte decides that he could be in yellow and him and Froome actually fight it out for yellow jersey honors.

[soulspinner]

It looked to me like Froome and sky feel they can decide this now. I wonder aloud if Froomes and Portes extreme effort today will cost them. Lens point about watts/kilo (and Froome not publishing his wattage prior to the Tour) are once again eyebrow raisers. Whats up with Pistolero??????

[shovelhd]

The proof will come in the harder mountain stages. If Froome and/or Porte continue to dominate, then their performance should be questioned, but up until now, they really haven't done a whole lot of work. Chalk it up to a great one day performance and we'll see what happens from here. Dope is about recovery and they haven't had much to recover from yet until today.

Contador looks human without the juice.

[T.J.]

Anybody know where they lost the time cut for today? Some boys were 1.5 hrs + behind

[Vientomas]

Contador looks human without the juice.

I agree.

[denapista]

So it's been confirmed that Froome's time was the 3rd fastest in the history on that climb, sliding in right between Armstrong and Ullrich. Not a group I'd want to be amongst. Kind of like breaking McGwire and Sammy Sosa's HR records.

I agree, Sky is like the San Antonio Spurs of cycling. Fundamentally sound, but oh so boring to watch. Where are all of the other teams with ferocious climbers? Do all of the other teams just suck that badly, no one can match Team sky? Is sky that stacked with the absolute best team in peloton?

I think it sucks that a suspicion of doping surfaces anytime someone puts in an amazing effort. I think it's well known that Froome has been on a mission for the last few seasons, putting in some super hard work for Wiggins. I get the angle, considering he's doing things only dopers have done in the past.

[cmg]

Wow! A few things from today's stage:

1. Tejay Van Garderen is a terrible climber. This climb looked exactly like his climb on the La Planche des Belles Filles.

2. Gotta question Movistar's strategy here. Using up Quintana so early on that first climb was a wasted bullet. That descent was too long and he lost half the lead he gained on the ascent (with which he probably wasted twice the energy). If Movistar was hoping that Sky would have to lead the chase for Quintana, I hate to tell them....Sky has been open about their desire to set pace. If Quintana saved his energy, he would have blistered the last 5km.



If Quintana had sat on Sky's wheel then attacked on the last climb. a big if.... It would make for boring stage except for the last climb but things might have been different. I bet there's a lot of armchair coaching at the Movistar dinner table later.

[e-RICHIE]

Anybody know where they lost the time cut for today? Some boys were 1.5 hrs + behind

On G.C. maybe, but on the day not much more than a half hour atmo.

ps

arrange disorder

:cool::cool::cool:
:cool::cool::cool:
;):rolleyes::cool:

[ultraman6970]

Not defending the guy but he has struggling since last year's world championships or last year's vuelta. Those are the last good rides he got, everything after that the guy looks like his butt was way too heavy, just like tired.

Maybe he needs to take a 100% rest of cycling or something, never seen him that thin anyways.



Contador looks human without the juice.

[1centaur]

For a while, for some of us, TdFs were predictable but exciting, because it was a US hero story and we didn't know if our guy was going to be able to keep it up.

In the Sky version, post universal doping revelations, the same game plan is deathly dull and freighted with the statute of limitations on belief. If a non-US team rides like this and wins predictably with no real challengers, no Ulrich or Basso but just a string of whomever trailing in minutes down, while we wonder if the British program will get figured out this year or next decade, the sporting aspect of it will just get crushed. Watching Richie Porte's impassive face blasting up a mountain while Contador's and Valverde's faces strain constantly behind him was depressing, then seeing Froome just rocket away with no sense of exceptional strain over several K, knowing that he's a better TTer than the people in his wake, made me think 2 things: Riccardo Ricco and 10-minute stage recaps over full stages. If Sky has found a better way to train so that the history of doped VAM and watts/kg are now possible naturally (without revealing the secrets), then shame on the rest of the peloton. It's fair to say this isn't about character or motivation but about physiology and what's possible. For now, Sky is leaving a place marker for what history will reveal was possible in 2013. Imagine if every sporting event ended with "Results Subject to Confirmation Within the Next Decade Or So".

If Froome wins GC by 8 minutes from Porte and 10 minutes from Bauke Mollema, I'm not sure how good the ratings will be in the US next year. Maybe we'll be able to get an authorized Eurosport feed after all.

[Elefantino]

Not defending the guy but he has struggling since last year's world championships or last year's vuelta. Those are the last good rides he got, everything after that the guy looks like his butt was way too heavy, just like tired.

Maybe he needs to take a 100% rest of cycling or something, never seen him that thin anyways.
He looked pretty good at the Vuelta. Not dominator good, but good enough to win a competitive grand tour.

He must've had a crappy offseason because so far this year has sucked, mostly.

[FlashUNC]

Good to see the escarabajos riding again.

[MattTuck]

There was a point in history when cycling doctors' ideas of nutrition included smoking and eating huge amounts of meat... I guess at the time, the idea of not smoking and eating mostly carbohydrates would have been counter-intuitive and certainly led to big gains in performance.

Maybe they did the equivalent of that today.

If Sky has found a better way to train so that the history of doped VAM and watts/kg are now possible naturally (without revealing the secrets), then shame on the rest of the peloton. It's fair to say this isn't about character or motivation but about physiology and what's possible.

[akelman]

Maybe they did the equivalent of that today.

Sure, anything is possible. But today's stage looked a lot like business as usual to me: a grand tour designed for riders assisted by chemicals, and riders who know that the only way to compete for the podium is by any means necessary. Make no mistake, I think Froome is a brilliant athlete, but based on the watts he put out and the time he put up, I find it impossible to imagine that he rode clean.

[ultraman6970]

Well, i want to believe they are really clean. A lot of guys related (even in the past) with doping went out of the team. As for the watts, well they have estimations but who knows because so far I doubt they will give the real numbers to anybody. I was contador and I was putting like 350 watts and I see that Froome is doing like 550 watts I would be more than depressed because there is no way to win to that but maybe stick a water bottle in his front wheel.

There is a secret (no chemical I want to believe) they are keeping for themselves to make them go that fast, the other option is wait and see if they go down in performance as wiggo did because at some point the body will implode and wont take no more training neither performance improvement.

The other thing is that contador has an ex sky team, so wonder why nobody have asked him about the real power numbers or what they do to go that fast, he should know something about it, right?

[pbarry]

For a while, for some of us, TdFs were predictable but exciting, because it was a US hero story and we didn't know if our guy was going to be able to keep it up.

In the Sky version, post universal doping revelations, the same game plan is deathly dull and freighted with the statute of limitations on belief. If a non-US team rides like this and wins predictably with no real challengers, no Ulrich or Basso but just a string of whomever trailing in minutes down, while we wonder if the British program will get figured out this year or next decade, the sporting aspect of it will just get crushed. Watching Richie Porte's impassive face blasting up a mountain while Contador's and Valverde's faces strain constantly behind him was depressing, then seeing Froome just rocket away with no sense of exceptional strain over several K, knowing that he's a better TTer than the people in his wake, made me think 2 things: Riccardo Ricco and 10-minute stage recaps over full stages. If Sky has found a better way to train so that the history of doped VAM and watts/kg are now possible naturally (without revealing the secrets), then shame on the rest of the peloton. It's fair to say this isn't about character or motivation but about physiology and what's possible. For now, Sky is leaving a place marker for what history will reveal was possible in 2013. Imagine if every sporting event ended with "Results Subject to Confirmation Within the Next Decade Or So".

If Froome wins GC by 8 minutes from Porte and 10 minutes from Bauke Mollema, I'm not sure how good the ratings will be in the US next year. Maybe we'll be able to get an authorized Eurosport feed after all.

What's most unfortunate about the "EPO era", with some teams using as early as 1988, is that any improvements in cycling sports physiology in the last 20+ years, e.g.: Diet, improved training techniques, and equipment advances, etc., are indistinguishable from the doping advantages.

I really hope Team Sky is on the level. Times up the hardest cols should be better than LeMond's or Hinault's, who were both known to "ride into shape" during the early part of the season, and even into the Tour, suffering a lot during the first week. The top riders today take little time off comparably.

[tsarpepe]

For a while, for some of us, TdFs were predictable but exciting, because it was a US hero story and we didn't know if our guy was going to be able to keep it up.

In the Sky version, post universal doping revelations, the same game plan is deathly dull and freighted with the statute of limitations on belief. If a non-US team rides like this and wins predictably with no real challengers, no Ulrich or Basso but just a string of whomever trailing in minutes down, while we wonder if the British program will get figured out this year or next decade, the sporting aspect of it will just get crushed. Watching Richie Porte's impassive face blasting up a mountain while Contador's and Valverde's faces strain constantly behind him was depressing, then seeing Froome just rocket away with no sense of exceptional strain over several K, knowing that he's a better TTer than the people in his wake, made me think 2 things: Riccardo Ricco and 10-minute stage recaps over full stages. If Sky has found a better way to train so that the history of doped VAM and watts/kg are now possible naturally (without revealing the secrets), then shame on the rest of the peloton. It's fair to say this isn't about character or motivation but about physiology and what's possible. For now, Sky is leaving a place marker for what history will reveal was possible in 2013. Imagine if every sporting event ended with "Results Subject to Confirmation Within the Next Decade Or So".

If Froome wins GC by 8 minutes from Porte and 10 minutes from Bauke Mollema, I'm not sure how good the ratings will be in the US next year. Maybe we'll be able to get an authorized Eurosport feed after all.

Dude, you should write for a cycling journal. Enjoyed your post!

[Black Dog]

Froom's Climb Data (http://www.sportsscientists.com/2013/07/froomes-first-mountain-performance-cue.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+blogspot%2FcJKs+(The+Science+ of+Sport))


He was also removed from bike pure's list of clean riders (http://velonews.competitor.com/2013/06/news/bike-pure-removes-froome-ahead-of-tour_292019).

I will be surprised if SKY are clean. Here we go again and again and again. :help:

[kurto]

Today may have bored some, but lots of guys are going to have to attack in the coming days. Should be fun. Sky can probably take it, but let's see what happens when somebody like Purito takes off with 100k left some day with multiple climbs. Then when they reel him in, Contador goes, and on and on.

[pbarry]

Froom's Climb Data (http://www.sportsscientists.com/2013/07/froomes-first-mountain-performance-cue.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+blogspot%2FcJKs+(The+Science+ of+Sport))


He was also removed from bike pure's list of clean riders (http://velonews.competitor.com/2013/06/news/bike-pure-removes-froome-ahead-of-tour_292019).

I will be surprised if SKY are clean. Here we go again and again and again. :help:

The Bike Pure idea was a good one, but unless it becomes a universal standard and is recognized by the UCI and IOC, it has no bearing legally or otherwise. Froome has not been an active participant for over a year. Not defending him, just stating the facts.

FWIW, I was rooting for the Columbian today. Since Herrera, Columbians deserve a TDF champion. :)

[ultraman6970]

Is not going to happen, at least not with 100K to go no way, the reason is that sky will pace fast enough in the climb again and nobody will be able to attack. And from what I saw today they dont even need to go full gas to control the race.

I see maybe other riders that have nothing to lose to go for the stage but after what they showed today, sure the top 8 in the classification are just thinking in not losing more time tomorrow because from what I saw today, they will lose at least a minute tomorrow again.


Today may have bored some, but lots of guys are going to have to attack in the coming days. Should be fun. Sky can probably take it, but let's see what happens when somebody like Purito takes off with 100k left some day with multiple climbs. Then when they reel him in, Contador goes, and on and on.

[FlashUNC]

No way these Sky boys are racing clean. Froome hasn't had a bad day in, what, two years now?

[Climb01742]

Today's stage actually makes me more inclined to watch other mountain stages, beginning with tomorrow. The tour has officially begun. I want to see how many climbers had the typical bad first climbing day. I want to see how other teams respond to getting spanked today. There's some serious talent and ego that got spanked today. How will they react?

Is it like the Heat-Spurs finals, where blow outs are followed by 180 blow outs?

Or maybe Sky is that good (doped)?

Whatever the answer, the first mountain stage is just act 1. I'll be glued to the tube tomorrow. I may be totally @ss backwards but somehow I see fortune getting reversed once or twice over the next two weeks. The alps are a different kettle of Vo2 max.

[ultraman6970]

This is the explanation

http://cdn.meme.li/instances/300x300/37528855.jpg

[pbarry]

Today's stage actually makes me more inclined to watch other mountain stages, beginning with tomorrow. The tour has officially begun. I want to see how many climbers had the typical bad first climbing day. I want to see how other teams respond to getting spanked today. There's some serious talent and ego that got spanked today. How will they react?

Is it like the Heat-Spurs finals, where blow outs are followed by 180 blow outs?

Or maybe Sky is that good (doped)?

Whatever the answer, the first mountain stage is just act 1. I'll be glued to the tube tomorrow. I may be totally @ss backwards but somehow I see fortune getting reversed once or twice over the next two weeks. The alps are a different kettle of Vo2 max.

+1

Ultraman is running at the mouth. First (moderate) mountain stage. Let's see what everyone does tomorrow..

[echappist]

This is the explanation

http://cdn.meme.li/instances/300x300/37528855.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-ppPnCtIH7NQ/UPib5gT-tJI/AAAAAAAACEQ/ZQloypkbjb8/s428/_st_.jpg

[pbarry]

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-ppPnCtIH7NQ/UPib5gT-tJI/AAAAAAAACEQ/ZQloypkbjb8/s428/_st_.jpg

Pile on, want to bees...

[Ray]

There was a point in history when cycling doctors' ideas of nutrition included smoking and eating huge amounts of meat... I guess at the time, the idea of not smoking and eating mostly carbohydrates would have been counter-intuitive and certainly led to big gains in performance.

Maybe they did the equivalent of that today.

Yeah, the Sky guys have taken up smoking and grilling steaks. The results have been staggering!

-Ray

[soulspinner]

Today's stage actually makes me more inclined to watch other mountain stages, beginning with tomorrow. The tour has officially begun. I want to see how many climbers had the typical bad first climbing day. I want to see how other teams respond to getting spanked today. There's some serious talent and ego that got spanked today. How will they react?

Is it like the Heat-Spurs finals, where blow outs are followed by 180 blow outs?

Or maybe Sky is that good (doped)?

Whatever the answer, the first mountain stage is just act 1. I'll be glued to the tube tomorrow. I may be totally @ss backwards but somehow I see fortune getting reversed once or twice over the next two weeks. The alps are a different kettle of Vo2 max.

Spanked is the right word. I never thought I would see this carnage the first time the road pointed up. The Alps are way different, and doesn't the tour usually do them first?

[jpw]

If Sky are cheating one would assume that Michael Rogers has the inside information on how they do it, but it didn't seem to help Bertie yesterday.

[PQJ]

Spanked is the right word. I never thought I would see this carnage the first time the road pointed up. The Alps are way different, and doesn't the tour usually do them first?

Maybe that was the strategy as no one would have been expecting that kind of attack this early in race.

Organizers usually alternate clockwise and anti clockwise each year.

[nooneline]

+1

Ultraman is running at the mouth. First (moderate) mountain stage. Let's see what everyone does tomorrow..

an HC climb followed by a Cat 1 summit finish is moderate?!

[firerescuefin]

Sky has the highest payroll of World Tour Teams (it isn't even close)
..i.e they pay for the best talent
Going into the race, many thought it could be a Sky 1/2 with Froome and Porte.

....and the other protagonist are all reformed dopers...their past performances can't be used as a baseline for what they should be doing in this tour...those of you that were expecting Contador to "fly" should be willing to accept that Contador on 87 octane vs the nitromethane he was on in the "golden years" is going to look different.

[avalonracing]

I wish they would stop saying "RichiePorte" as one word again and again and again and again. Why don't they just occasionally call him "Porte"?

[goonster]

Hate to say it, but when someone climbs like that, blows by a guy like Voekler like he's standing still, and doesn't even look like he's breathing hard, makes me curious.
Quintana is not an entirely unknown quantity. He did win the Tour de l'Avenir in 2010, for example.

Here (http://www.cyclinginquisition.com/2013/04/who-is-nairo-quintana.html) is a great intro to this little guy making a big splash at the Tour.

It's a great story. Read all the way to end for some Cinzano-style shenanigans done to the Colombians.

When the Eurosport commentator said something about him being "born at 3000 metres," Alps-centric Eurosnob that is me thought "yeah, right." Well, I'm the doofus, because that appears to check out.

Quintana can time-trial a little bit too. In the 24 km final-stage ITT (http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/vuelta-ciclista-al-pais-vasco-2013/stage-6/results) at the Tour of the Basque Country, he finished second, behind only Tony Martin. It's not a 40+ km TT, it's not in a three week stage race, but still . . .

I'll be rooting pretty hard for this guy.