Stop me from doing something stupid - new steel fork for Marcelo

[reggiebaseball]

Hey,

I had a lovely steel fork crafted to replace the Ouzo on my Marcelo,
http://www.nycsportspics.com/moots/meatballsmarcelo1.jpg

but I am impatient to ride it soon rather than wait for paint (and paint code info from Dario).

While I wait for said info so the fork can be color matched to the frame....

I am seriously considering lubing up that bad boy with Fluid Film and running it sans paint this season.

The bike is a dry-weather only ride, the kind I wipe down after every ride anyway with alcohol free baby wipes. This fork is a very nice fork that I already love and don't want to mistreat.

Who can forsee some huge problem or mental error in my plan?

Should I:

1. be patient, wait a few weeks or months and get it professionally painted to match the red frame

2. Fluid Film and ride, worry about paint in the winter, look mean with a butchy raw fillet fork.

3. Have it quickly painted a matte (or gloss) black by a local paint pro and ride it that way?

4. Rustoleum that sucker myself in the driveway matte black and ride.

5. hit myself over the head with the fork until another option presents itself.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions

[pbarry]

Wait for paint from Dario, you'll love what he comes up with. Ride the Ouzo for the season. Life is good and you have a sweet present coming soon. :banana:

[christian]

4

[Louis]

The bike is a dry-weather only ride, the kind I wipe down after every ride anyway with alcohol free baby wipes.

I vote for #1.

What's the big rush? If you're so concerned about the bike to wipe it down after every ride, then it doesn't make sense to use the fork before it's properly finished. Seems contradictory to me.

[reggiebaseball]

the paint would not be by Dario,

I am hoping he has the paint code or color from this 8 year old bike, then someone here in the USA would handle the painting.

---
I don't necessarily see using the raw fork as "unfinished", I kinda like seeing the work of the builder, I like not having to worry about paint scratching.
I'll let you in on a secret. I wipe down my wife's bike with baby wipes almost every day too and she rarely even rides it, I just don't like garage dust on it.

-----

Christian - do you really advise #4, or are you teasing me, cause I am really considering it as a short term measure.
------

pbarry - I rode the Ouzo last season, I want newy newness this season.
The Marcelo is getting new single pivot (gold!) planet X brakes, this new steel fork, swapping out the carbon Pro Vibe bars for some Deda Newton Deeps (more reach), and the Lightweights are going on for the year, all as soon as I can figure out this forking dilemma.

[pbarry]

Rattle can and Pegoretti??? :help:

[fa63]

Another vote for #4. A good painter will have that stripped in no time, and can paint it whatever color you want.

[reggiebaseball]

Rattle can and Pegoretti??? :help:

actually I am technically considering rattle-canning a Dave Kirk produced fork, to put on the front end of my Pegoretti, to hold my Lightweight tubular wheels in place.

I think it would be ironic and show that I am more than just a complete tart, but rather a tart with a strange sense of humor.

[alessandro]

4 b. Rustoleum NeverWet.

[Louis]

If you must, how about a local powder-coat job?

[pbarry]

actually I am technically considering rattle-canning a Dave Kirk produced fork, to put on the front end of my Pegoretti, to hold my Lightweight tubular wheels in place.

I think it would be ironic and show that I am more than just a complete tart, but rather a tart with a strange sense of humor.

OK, there's more to the equation. ;) A DK fork is in the exact same league with the one coming from Dario.. You are set on a steel fork, sooner rather than later, quality paint be damned. I vote for the color of the 576 on the top tube. Make the DK fork work aesthetically for you. Preparation is more important than the finish. A good steel fork will perform/out ride/outlast any other material. +100 on the move to steel.

Tartness is very subjective. :eek:

[reggiebaseball]

I could do powdercoat, sure
though I am not sure if that can be matched to wet paint with the code, or if they would sorta just eyeball it.

I could do wet paint at a local place, short wait and they do some decent work, but the price they quoted me was so high IMO it pissed me off ($150).

I could try asking again while making it clear that the fork is raw from the builder and ready for paint, no stripping required.

[reggiebaseball]

I vote for the color of the 576 on the top tube.

this is an excellent idea. I have to look into how it would work and start experimenting in photoshop.

[JAGI410]

Frame saver or whatever on the inside of the fork, and let the outside get an awesome patina while you wait for Dario. It'll all get stripped anyways, and it'll take years before any damage is done. Patina'd steel looks badass, and the natural colors produced will match your frame.

[alessandro]

I could do powdercoat, sure though I am not sure if that can be matched to wet paint with the code, or if they would sorta just eyeball it.

I could do wet paint at a local place, short wait and they do some decent work, but the price they quoted me was so high IMO it pissed me off ($150).

I could try asking again while making it clear that the fork is raw from the builder and ready for paint, no stripping required.

The $150: What kind of a place is the local place? Is it an auto body shop? They may have just quoted you a stupid price because they don't want to deal with a small job, and figured you'd either go away or pay them enough that they'll decide it's worth it.

[reggiebaseball]

The $150: What kind of a place is the local place? Is it an auto body shop? They may have just quoted you a stupid price because they don't want to deal with a small job, and figured you'd either go away or pay them enough that they'll decide it's worth it.

It was the paint shop at Elliot Bay Bicycles,
I believe they do the paint work for Davidson bicycles, they also do resotrations and stuff.
They are in downtown Seattle and have high rent I am sure, but D@MN I almost passed out when he quoted me $150 casually.

Maybe on the phone they assume you are bringing in something from 1948 with 169 layers of paint.

I sent out some feelers to about 5 other places in Seattle, Portland, Eugene and Springfield OR to see what the deal is.

[Pars]

I've never dealt with it personally, but IIRC, powdercoat is harder to remove than paint (and may not rust proof as well), so you might ask around before you go down that road (if the thought was to PC it now, and get it painted later).

[Puget Pounder]

It was the paint shop at Elliot Bay Bicycles,
I believe they do the paint work for Davidson bicycles, they also do resotrations and stuff.
They are in downtown Seattle and have high rent I am sure, but D@MN I almost passed out when he quoted me $150 casually.

Maybe on the phone they assume you are bringing in something from 1948 with 169 layers of paint.

I sent out some feelers to about 5 other places in Seattle, Portland, Eugene and Springfield OR to see what the deal is.

I called both RE and Davidson a while ago for painting a fork. Rodriguez quoted me about 90 if the paint is already stripped. I believe Davidson was just about the same too. Maybe call back and specify?

[reggiebaseball]

yeah I will give it another shot

RE is really close to me, but their website at least says they are not painting bikes that they don't make until October 2013.

But it never hurts to inquire. $90 is more like it.

[sw3759]

in my experience $150 is about the going rate these days for a fork..unless its prepped and ready for paint it might be cheaper..

[onsight512]

do you have kids? give them some paint pens and let them have at it. when you're ready, have it stripped and painted.

or, if what the kids did came out well, have it clear-coated and ride, ride, ride.

[akelman]

Give them some paint pens and let them have at it. when you're ready...have it clear-coated and call it Ciavete.*

* NB: I often like Ciavete paint. In fact, I saw one on the road today that was really beautiful.

[Steve in SLO]

Chrome

[Louis]

Give them some paint pens and let them have at it. when you're ready...have it clear-coated and call it Ciavete.*


Or, he could have an elephant paint it, call it a Jackson Pollock, then sell it for $5 million.

http://www.ramonaspainting.com/PayaPainting.jpg

http://0.tqn.com/d/arthistory/1/0/9/h/jm-aa_08_08.jpg

[reggiebaseball]

That happens to be pdmtong's ciavete respo paint scheme,
and that elephant is a genius

[Louis]

and that elephant is a genius

And don't you forget it !

[pdmtong]

That happens to be pdmtong's ciavete respo paint scheme,
and that elephant is a genius

hmmm...hadn't thought of that but yea

my vote...get the fork painted properly and wait however long it takes.

[beeatnik]

Yo, Reg, have you ever ridden a Parlee, Crumpton, Tarmac, Time, Colnago C50-59, Canyon or Cannondale EVO. They're awesome!

[bluesea]

Unlike carbon forks, steels forks painted expedient black look tacky on an otherwise clean build. Do it right or go elephant.

[reggiebaseball]

Yo, Reg, have you ever ridden a Parlee, Crumpton, Tarmac, Time, or Cannondale EVO. They're awesome!

?

Plastic bikes don't thrill me for the most part.

Nor do bikes made in China, or companies that make their bikes in China sometimes.

Time bikes have loud TIME TIME SUPER NANO CARBON MICROTECHNOLOGY logos all over them,

and bikes with ST angles steeper than 72 degrees are not for me, though I have considered a Crumpton one time or another because they could be custom.

I had a Look 595 that did everything ok, but was not for me, perhaps the geometry was the culprit, though it was quite smooth.


To be honest, I would have, and have had, a hard time getting anything other than another Pegoretti.

[reggiebaseball]

Unlike carbon forks, steels forks painted expedient black look tacky on an otherwise clean build. Do it right or go elephant.

I have spoken with the elephants representatives and indeed elephant only charges $90 if the fork is bare metal and ready for paint.


I will call some other local wet paint shops as I would prefer to get the fork painted burgundy to match the base color of the frame. I dont mind paying the premium if someone can get it done ASAP and match the color properly.
I am hoping by going local I can bring in the bike and say "see, this color" and not have to wait for a paint code that may never come from Vincenza.

[Peter B]

It was the paint shop at Elliot Bay Bicycles,
I believe they do the paint work for Davidson bicycles, they also do resotrations and stuff.
They are in downtown Seattle and have high rent I am sure, but D@MN I almost passed out when he quoted me $150 casually.

Maybe on the phone they assume you are bringing in something from 1948 with 169 layers of paint.

I sent out some feelers to about 5 other places in Seattle, Portland, Eugene and Springfield OR to see what the deal is.

I dunno, the guy's presumably a pro who's going to clean the raw fork, mask the unpaintables (steerer, maybe crown race seat), move into spray booth, wipe down w/ tack-free rag, set up primer & spray. Clean spray rig. Let dry, wet sand. 1 coat at least. Round 2 (after procuring your custom color): Mix paint/set up gun, check masking, tack-free wipe down, fire up booth & color spray. Clean rig. Let dry, wet sand, possibly repeat. Potential round 3: Repeat as above w/ clear. Oh, and did you want that nice crown contrasted?

So give a guess as to his net time & materials, assume he pays rent, utilities, insurance and wants a wage. And maybe dental care for his kids.

$150 does not seem unreasonable to me.

BTW, what do you do for a living and how do you feel when folks balk at your wage/salary/estimate. (That's really meant as a rhetorical question).

Nice Marcelo by the way.

[soulspinner]

The $150: What kind of a place is the local place? Is it an auto body shop? They may have just quoted you a stupid price because they don't want to deal with a small job, and figured you'd either go away or pay them enough that they'll decide it's worth it.

I had a local body shop paint my Teesdale steel. 150 bucks and it gets more compliments than my Strong(powder) or my plastic painted bike. A good body shop painter can rock a paint job, its what he does all day every day.

[AngryScientist]

id didnt read the other responses, but painting a fork yourself, especially for a temporary fix really isnt that hard, and is absolutely the way i would go.

you'll want to hang the fork by the masked steerer tube from something. hit it with a light coat of auto primer, and then paint. forget rustoleum, takes too long to dry and is overkill for a project like this. get duplicolor auto stuff from ANY auto parts place. few bucks and you can have a very very decent paint job for a few hours of work.

when the time comes, any paint shop can media blast the fork clean as a whistle and paint it to your specs.

http://www.autowares.com/images/product/DUPLICOLOR/dup-truckvansuv-400.jpg

[christian]

Don't powder it. It's a bitch to get off when you want to paint proper.

I was deadly serious about #4. Rattle can it and go.

[srice]

Rattle cans paint jobs are fine to get you on the road. I rattled my Sachs after a repair - ended up painting about 1/2 the frame - with a can of primer and red Rustoleum from Walmart. It actually was a decent match as far as the color goes. When the time came that I could afford some downtime on that frame, I shipped it off to JB for a proper paint job.

[alessandro]

I dunno, the guy's presumably a pro who's going to clean the raw fork, mask the unpaintables (steerer, maybe crown race seat), move into spray booth, wipe down w/ tack-free rag, set up primer & spray. Clean spray rig. Let dry, wet sand. 1 coat at least. Round 2 (after procuring your custom color): Mix paint/set up gun, check masking, tack-free wipe down, fire up booth & color spray. Clean rig. Let dry, wet sand, possibly repeat. Potential round 3: Repeat as above w/ clear. Oh, and did you want that nice crown contrasted?

So give a guess as to his net time & materials, assume he pays rent, utilities, insurance and wants a wage. And maybe dental care for his kids.

$150 does not seem unreasonable to me.

BTW, what do you do for a living and how do you feel when folks balk at your wage/salary/estimate. (That's really meant as a rhetorical question).

Nice Marcelo by the way.

That's what I'm talking about. How many hours for that? Add in the time for deciding on the right color with you. I know $150 sounds like a lot, but maybe not when you look at from the painter's perspective. Good luck, tho--I'm sure it'll be awesome for the next couple of months.

[FlashUNC]

You've got a perfectly good fork on the bike. Wait for it to get painted proper.

[SamIAm]

$150 is a quite reasonable.

The one lesson I have been taught over the many years of custom bicycle anything is patience. I don't mind waiting for the good stuff. I would wait until you can paint that fork right the first time.

[jr59]

The one lesson I have been taught over the many years of custom bicycle anything is patience. I don't mind waiting for the good stuff. I would wait until you can paint that fork right the first time.


SamIam speaks the truth here!

It also applies to most things in life!

[jt2gt]

Did you email Dario direct about the paint code. He should be able to get it to you fairly quickly. He did for me when I inquired about a paint code for a fork. JT

[reggiebaseball]

hi, thanks for all the replies

I emailed Gita and I think they can get it for me, if it exists, from Dario.

I have about 16 nice weeks where I am in good enough shape and the weather is nice for me to ride this bike, so I don't want to spend more than 4 of them getting it ready to go.

I don;t think $150 for a fork is terrible, but since a whole bike is $300 and requires the majority of the paint and masking on the frame part, well I just figured a fork alone- brought in ready for paint, would be less than $150. It was high enough to make me seek other estimates and consider other options - when coupled with the fact that it will take an extra 3-4 weeks away from my riding window.

I would like it wet painted to match the frame in an ideal world, and ultimately that is what I will do-

Right now I have a pile of other things to change on this bike- brakes, which require different brake pads that I have to acquire for Lightweights, new bars, etc. that I dont want to do all that, then break it down again and change the fork, I just want to get it all lined up and do it once for the year.

There are enough changes that I don;t need to ride it as-is either, I know I would prefer the Luigino's set up. Part of this switch is to bring in longer reach bars and single pivot brakes to the Marcelo, both of which I prefer.

Til then, the bike wont be ridden, but I have others to ride so no harm.



So, I doubt I would rattle can it. If there was a rattle can clear I might do that so I could see the fillets and lugs. Because it is a pretty fork.

[christian]

If there was a rattle can clear I might do that so I could see the fillets and lugs.Won't work - fork will rust. Clears are porous and intended to be used with a base paint.

[ColonelJLloyd]

I'm not familiar with Fluid Film, but if you're itching to ride it now (and obviously that's the case) just go with #2. Install it and ride. Have it painted when you're ready.

[druptight]

...since a whole bike is $300 and requires the majority of the paint and masking on the frame part, well I just figured a fork alone- brought in ready for paint, would be less than $150.

From the local options around here, $300 is highway robbery for a wet paint job. I wish I could find someone to paint me a frame for that little.

[PoppaWheelie]

Hey, I know that bike. Looking good.

My $0.2 is that even if/when you get the paint code, there's a good chance that a fresh coat of red won't match the older, oxidized paint on the frame. Who knows what was happening the day it was painted..a little of this, a little of that...may be more than just a matter of getting a code. I've painted forks after-the-fact with the "correct" paint code, with top-tier painters, and you could see the difference from 5 feet out.

Given this, I'd suggest paying a decent painter a little extra to do an exact color match anyway. The results will probably be better....with no wait from Gita.

[reggiebaseball]

this makes sense,
it doesnt hurt to look at the bike for a color match.


one thing I do notice is that the primer or undercoat is a white color, I suppose that also influences the tint of the top color applied.

paint is over my head,

I am going to go local, wet, color matched, from the shop that provided the initial quote of $150.

[bluesea]

My $0.2 is that even if/when you get the paint code, there's a good chance that a fresh coat of red won't match the older, oxidized paint on the frame. Who knows what was happening the day it was painted..a little of this, a little of that...may be more than just a matter of getting a code. I've painted forks after-the-fact with the "correct" paint code, with top-tier painters, and you could see the difference from 5 feet out....



Yup

[alembical]

I have a rattlecan spray job on a Sacha built fork on my single speed cross bike. It was a temporary fix years ago that I never got around to having done. No regrets.

[Anarchist]

It was the paint shop at Elliot Bay Bicycles,
I believe they do the paint work for Davidson bicycles, they also do resotrations and stuff.
They are in downtown Seattle and have high rent I am sure, but D@MN I almost passed out when he quoted me $150 casually.

Maybe on the phone they assume you are bringing in something from 1948 with 169 layers of paint.

I sent out some feelers to about 5 other places in Seattle, Portland, Eugene and Springfield OR to see what the deal is.

You want to paint match and are seriously complaining about $150 for Elliott Bay to paint the fork?

At the very least you know it will be done perfectly.

[reggiebaseball]

I didnt talk to them about paint matching, I hope that doesnt get more expensive.

Their pricing is quite reasonable, I just didnt know how much it would be until I got a few quotes.

I am not complaining about their price and in the end I am having them do the work, I was just asking around about options for a day or two to work out some thoughts and do my due diligence.

[InspectorGadget]

... I kinda like seeing the work of the builderUntil you can have it painted right, have the fork clear-coated so you can ride the bike and see the builder's work.

Winning!

[alessandro]

From the local options around here, $300 is highway robbery for a wet paint job. I wish I could find someone to paint me a frame for that little.

Um, hello New England--Circle A, Providence:

PAINT AND RESTORATION PRICES
One color, fork alone: $100
One color, frame alone: $400
One color, frame & fork: $425
Discount if bike comes in stripped of paint: subtract $100

What constitutes highway robbery for you?

http://www.circleacycles.com/2013_repair_and_paint_prices.pdf

Reggie, this means your fork job should cost $0.;)

[reggiebaseball]

Reggie, this means your fork job should cost $0.;)

sold!

[Ken Robb]

It would be a shame not to paint the windows on the fork a contrasting color.

[reggiebaseball]

you think?

I am not sure,

Since the bike itself is TIG and has so much graphic design,

I thought I might just do a single color on the fork and not highlight the windows.

The other alternative was to pick a color of one of the numbers (or the orange logo) and use that for the window.

I suppose if I am talking to the paint shop I can ask them what the damage would be for the second color.



Not to start another debate, but I intend to add approx 2-3cm of spacers and use a -17 stem now that I have more steerer tube to work with. I don't mind a 4-5cm spacer stack and a level stem I think, it looks fine since I still have 12cm+ of drop.

[reggiebaseball]

ok some additional learning,

exact colormatching is pricey (say double what painting alone costs) and will have higher gloss coat than a worn in bike.

thinking of bringing the bike in and having Bill eyeball one of the accent colors and painting the fork that. This way it would not be apparent if the color was not exact- because the scale is so different.

So, I present some color options. I would assume that I keep a white saddle and tape forever on this bike. White is right.

And yes, in my head I think the burgundy of the frame backgound if it matched would be the best color for the fork, but I am trying to think of options to spending big bucks and still not having it match enough for my OCD.

What follows are bad photoshops trying to show the scale of a steel fork, in the colors of the different numbers and words on the frame itself.

Finally, I have a gold ano CK headset in there, and I am adding gold Ano brakes. This may may the orange and yellow options not as appealing.

[Peter B]

Orange or frame match IMHO.

[BCS]

Match the frame color or keep the carbon fork. The other choices do not appeal to me.

[alessandro]

I'm with Peter B. Frame match or orange--the headset color, while close, does not bother me--they are different enough because of the shiny anodizing.

[Louis]

I don't get it. Why make this into a big project, if you're just going to turn around and in a while have the fork repainted to match the frame color exactly?

[cash05458]

I think you are overthinking this...just get it painted close as you can...I don't mean to insult...not at all...I know from my own builds I can get very obsessed about having things perfect via parts, via match, via everything...but it can get abit obsessive...I do that certainly and have to tone myself down...just find a good solid painter who paints the fork and for a decent price...or even paint it yourself as others have suggested...no point in overworrying it and the only thing that does is keep you offa riding an awesome bike for more time...

[reggiebaseball]

Like everything else in life, this turned into a big project!

I should have rattle canned it. I still may say f it and do that.
MEantime I continue to make everything harder and more expensive than it has to be.

now I am most likely going to end up paying $400 to get it color matched.

I am not painting this fork more than once in my life, I suspect, so might as well do it as well as I can the first time.


just got my shiny planet x brakes in gold today, sweet. anybody know if I can swap on my campy pad holders so I Can stay with campy pads and not use shimano?

[mister]

$400 to get a fork painted?
just get them to paint it the color code of your frmae and buy some nice tubs with the rest of the money
you'll have headset cups at the transition so a slight color difference won't matter

btw elliot bay does some of the nicest paint work out of anyone