OT: Does running compliment cycling?

[Andrewlcox]

All,

First, I'm not a runner or a competitive cyclist. I enjoy cycling to stay fit so I ride fast when I can but only for fun. I am training for a charity 5k run and was wondering if my running either hurts or helps my cycling. On the flip side, does having legs and lungs for cycling help me make it as a runner?

I'm really only curious and not concerned for any loss in wattage or race losing practices.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,
Andy

[henrypretz]

Years ago I read a paper that studied the running motion and its effect on climbing on the bike. I just now looked and looked, but couldn't dig it up again. Anyway, as I remember it was a small sampling, but the gist was that the biomechanics of the pushoff in running correlates with the downward/backward portion of the pedal stroke. The study seemed to imply that running benefits climbing.
Anecdotally, I was a longtime (20 yr) runner with 16 marathons and a ton of shorter races when I blew my knee up playing baseball :rolleyes:
I took up cycling and found that climbing was about my only strength on the bike. I still run a maybe 20 miles a week, but my knee won't let me put the training together to race effectively anymore.
All that to say, I don't think that running hurts cycling or vice versa.
That and a buck might get you a Powerbar.

Good luck in your 5K!
Henry

[carpediemracing]

I can't prove anything but it seems like the people that run and ride tend to be more steady freddy type riders, better at climbing, endurance stuff, but they lose the very top end stuff. It's the 38 mph surges that they lack. The 27 mph hammerfests in a crosswind on a false flat are their territory.

I've never seen a running cyclist who can sprint or make killer decisive moves. Well other than the edges of the bell curve racers, but even then I think they're not as jumpy as a jumpy cyclist.

I have seen running cyclists that can grind everyone into the ground on long grinding rides, on long grinding climbs, on long grinding dirt roads... you get my drift. I've been dropped plenty of times in group rides (99% of them) and races (fewer than 99% of them) by such riders.

Personally I can't run fast (my best in high school was about 6:30 for a mile) but my limiter is my legs. My cycling has helped my cardio enough that the 1-2 runs I do a year make my legs suffer. Aerobically I'm fine 5 minutes after I stop. Takes me 5 days to walk normal again though.

[MattTuck]

Running will make your body stronger, so in that way it will help as long as you don't injure yourself. Cycling is not a full body workout, it deconditions a bunch of muscle groups and has a limited range of motion and doesn't help with flexibility. For overall fitness and well being, running is a good addition to any fitness plan.

The best training for cycling is still going to be riding your bike.

[stev0]

I wouldn't say I'm a good runner but I used to be an avid one. Currently I spend a lot more time cycling. At one point, used to run about 50-60 miles a week and spent very little time cycling. Since then, I've gone back and forth from lots of cycling/little running to lots of running/little cycling in gearing up for mid-length running events (10k-half marathon) and multi-day bike rides (1k mi/1 wk - this ride made me realize that cycling probably doesn't have that much to do with overall strength and fitness).

My experience has been that, as MattTuck suggests, running benefits both running and cycling (not counting fatigue from training), but that amping up miles on a bike and spending less time running very quickly degrades my running form (speed/endurance).

I am definitely a grinder. But contrary to what carpediem's experience has been, I am consistently terrible at climbing and I only grind through long rides to roll in at the end of the day way off the pack. My strengths are probably rollers/sprints, though. I'm always good for a quick surge, it's the climbs that kill me.

[CunegoFan]

I found that cycling really helps my running, but my running is mostly trail running that involves a _lot_ of vertical. When training for 100 mile trail running events, I found that cycling is an good way to train at a high volume without the pounding caused by the massive running miles that most people do to prepare for such an event.

As for cycling performance, running helps to a certain level. It is a pretty high level, but beyond that you need more specificity. I have also found that I can get to a lower body weight with running than with cycling. Overall I feel like I am in much better condition when I do both than when I just do cycling. Cycling tends to leave me "wimpy" for anything other than cycling. Riding does not build any of the stabilization muscles that trail running does, so I feel my legs are a lot weaker.

[rockdude]

Running helps cycling about as much as Ping Pong helps tennis. You will get general aerobic fitness benefits but if you want to get faster on the bike use that time to ride more.

[oldpotatoe]

All,

First, I'm not a runner or a competitive cyclist. I enjoy cycling to stay fit so I ride fast when I can but only for fun. I am training for a charity 5k run and was wondering if my running either hurts or helps my cycling. On the flip side, does having legs and lungs for cycling help me make it as a runner?

I'm really only curious and not concerned for any loss in wattage or race losing practices.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,
Andy

If nothing else, running helps keep your weight down. When I finally saw the light, and stopped running, I think I gained 15 pounds the next day.

7 marathons, 60-70 miles per week running, Jim Fixx LDS running camp, it really beat me up. Ran for 10 years, last ran in 1985(NYC marathon), now only run if chased.

[crownjewelwl]

no

[redir]

Keeps the weight down and is good for heart and lungs which is important for cycling but if you don't ride you can't expect to hop on a bike and go. A friend of mine is an excellent runner who places in marathons and other big running events. Get him on a bike and he cannot keep pace. He used to be a descent cyclist but he's naturally an excellent runner.

The two are separate disciplines that only slightly compensate for one another.

[Mr Cabletwitch]

Just started running a couple months ago and while I know it has helped my weight and aerobic fitness it hasn't done anything for my legs. I'm faster on my bike because I'm 35 lbs lighter but what used to be my limiting factor was my lungs, now its my legs. I don't know if I'm able to push my self harder because of my greater aerobic fitness or if the running is actually hurting my cycling muscles, but either way I weight less and as a result I'm still faster.

[sparky33]

Running helps cycling about as much as Ping Pong helps tennis.

Well said.

Running also helps me understand how much more fun it is to ride a bike.

[mcallen]

Just to mix up the discussion a bit, how does running fit into training for 'cross? I'm going into my second real season of racing cross this fall and I'm trying to figure out how to incorporate running.

[redir]

Well said.

Running also helps me understand how much more fun it is to ride a bike.

Ahhahah well said too!

Just to mix up the discussion a bit, how does running fit into training for 'cross? I'm going into my second real season of racing cross this fall and I'm trying to figure out how to incorporate running.

I think running is important for cross but it doesn't take much. It helps mostly in preventing injury but it also gives you a slight edge when having to run even short distances. Without the running training you can tire easier and you can pull muscles that you are not used to using. So having some running fitness gives you an edge.

[Climb01742]

as we age, it actually helps our body and bones to do some sort of weight bearing exercise. running can be that, as can other things. once i ran a lot. now just some. what i like about it as a break from riding is the simplicity of a run vs the more complex, time-consuming nature of a ride. some days a run is just a good break. that said, riding is much more fun.;)

[Gummee]

I usually tell people 'running helps my riding more than riding helps my running.'

Running is a more efficient use of time when you can't get a big riding workout in, but doesn't substitute for miles on the bike.

If you're not racing, go for it! If you are racing, nothing beats specificity.

AFA cross: hill sprints are your friend. After all, the only time you're getting off your bike are the barriers or hills too steep to ride.

M

[Andrewlcox]

Great discussion! Thanks for all of the input. I'm not going to run today but will instead ride a 20 mile sprint.

Thanks!:hello:

[cmbicycles]

I read somewhere that the similarity between the two, other than cardio conditioning, is when you are running uphill you work some similar muscles to cycling. That's all I can remember of the article, and why I only run hill repeats (I just roll back down the hill so I only use cycling muscles. ;))

When I started running a few years ago, as it was quicker to get a workout in, I dropped some weight and picked up a few mph average on the bike. That was a nice benefit. Still, I would much rather ride my bike. Running just keeps me from getting fat when the weather turns sour, or when I get too busy to have 45 min + for a decent ride.

[mhespenheide]

Just to add another point of anecdata, I'm a runner/cyclist or cyclist/runner depending on the month or year. Generally more running in the winter, less in the spring, summer, and fall. I started out by cycling in high school, switched entirely to running in college, hit 80-100 miles per week in my twenties, then gradually switched back towards cycling in my thirties.

Cycling and running are great partner sports up until a certain point. If you mix them, you can be far ahead of someone just coming off the couch. But if you want to truly maximize your performance in cycling, I wouldn't run very much -- maybe three to five miles a workout two or three times per week, if that. As a weight-bearing sport, running can help take off those last few pounds.

Conversely, unless you're biomechanically gifted and relatively young or at the very highest levels of competitive running, I'd recommend that most runners spend some time cycling. Spinning is a great way to recover from hard running workouts, and add more minutes of cardio per week without having to push into high (running) mileages per week. Personally I found that I had some good years working with 3-4 hard workouts per week of running (one long, one fast, one hills) and one long bike day on the roads, and 2-3 spinning sessions per week.

[azrider]

Running helps cycling about as much as Ping Pong helps tennis. You will get general aerobic fitness benefits but if you want to get faster on the bike use that time to ride more.

not sure if true or not but very funny nonetheless

a coach (cycling/triathlon) once said that the only thing that helps cylcing is cycling.

[Andrewlcox]

When I started running a few years ago, as it was quicker to get a workout in, I dropped some weight and picked up a few mph average on the bike. That was a nice benefit. Still, I would much rather ride my bike. Running just keeps me from getting fat when the weather turns sour, or when I get too busy to have 45 min + for a decent ride.

+1 In fact, I ran in the rain the other day and it was actually fun. I have already (3 weeks of running) started to shed a pound or two as noticed in my pants waistband.

[jmoore]

running sucks.

[GScot]

I think it can't possibly hurt unless you are missing riding time to run. Which is what I have done for the last couple of years. I have a dog that needs to go for a run not a walk at least every other day or he will wear out everyone playing and pestering. In fact I blame him for getting me into running but I learned to like it. If time limited I can run for an hour and feel the workout was productive, a one hour ride seems way too short.

[christian]

Sure!

"You look really nice there, gliding along, as I pound around down here."
"Say, that's a fine vehicle! I'm just a pair of squishy shoes."

um, ok, I'm out of compliments.

[weiwentg]

Running complements my cycling in that I no longer have the time for multiple long workouts. I would be less fit if I didn't run. I would also be less of an all-rounder (and I am trying to cultivate overall fitness, as we cannot count on having road bikes and the associated logistics tails available when the zombie apocalypse occurs). However, I do definitely prefer cycling to running from zombies.

[ckamp]

My personal experience:

I ran a lot prior to riding this season and I noticed a significant cycling improvement in performance and how I feel.

Overall, I think if you run, row, swim or whatever, keeping active helps tons when transitioning from the off season.

[zott28]

All,

First, I'm not a runner or a competitive cyclist. I enjoy cycling to stay fit so I ride fast when I can but only for fun.

I'm the same runner/rider as you. I've been running for about 8 months now. I'm up to two or three 4 mile runs a week and one 10+ miler every 2 weeks. I alternate between bike and running on lunch breaks, getting 15 miles rides and a 50 plus every other weekend.

To answer your question, I'm getting way more fit from an 30 minutes of running vs an hour of riding, and this is helping my cycling. Climbing has become much easier on the 10+ minute climbs as I feel running has me at a better mental limit than before I ran. I stay in higher gears and push myself more just due to the fact that running is harder.

[earlfoss]

Running is fun! I like to run in October after the bike season is over. At that time of year I am not concerned so much with how impacts my performance on the bike. Running is a nice change and can give you a heck of an intense workout in a short amount of time. As long as you're careful, I'd think a modest amount of running in the off season would help to toughen ligaments and such. It can be a pretty easy thing to overdo though and yeah I'm guilty of that from time to time.

[mgm777]

I've been a runner for most of my life...HS, college, and as an adult. Started when I was 10, am now 48, and haven't ever stopped. Started cycling in the late 80s. Now, unless I am training for a specific running event, I use running to supplement my overall fitness. The bulk of my running mileage gets logged in the Fall, Winter and early Spring. I prefer running when it is cool to cold outside. I don't feel cycling helps my running, in fact, I feel it is counterproductive. When I focus exclusively on cycling, for a lengthy period, and then try to run, it feels as if I need to re-learn proper running form. My legs tend to feel heavy and tight. On the other hand, I do feel that being in top running form aids my cycling, especially my climbing ability, and that's something we do a lot of around here.
Like others have said, it has also been my experience that possessing a high level of running fitness aids with those grind-type endurance cycling workouts (i.e. long climbs and rollers). Also, running for me is almost meditative...zen like...simple. I can easily get lost inside my head on a long trail run. I don't feel I can do that on the bike...too dangerous.

[MattTuck]

Sure!

"You look really nice there, gliding along, as I pound around down here."
"Say, that's a fine vehicle! I'm just a pair of squishy shoes."

um, ok, I'm out of compliments.

Figured it would be you or Louis.... I need to get out and ride more.

[fiamme red]

Sure!

"You look really nice there, gliding along, as I pound around down here."
"Say, that's a fine vehicle! I'm just a pair of squishy shoes."

um, ok, I'm out of compliments.That was my reaction too when I saw the thread title. :D

[wc1934]

....
To answer your question, I'm getting way more fit from an 30 minutes of running vs an hour of riding, and this is helping my cycling. Climbing has become much easier on the 10+ minute climbs as I feel running has me at a better mental limit than before I ran. I stay in higher gears and push myself more just due to the fact that running is harder.

+1
Runner for about 30 years - riding for 10, after burning out from running - for me, running is a more physically demanding sport - riding a fixed gear closes the gap.

[merlinmurph]

+1
Runner for about 30 years - riding for 10, after burning out from running - for me, running is a more physically demanding sport - riding a fixed gear closes the gap.

Each activity is as physically demanding as you want to make it. You can ride/run as hard as you'd like, or you can slack off as much as you'd like.

Running is definitely more punishing, but I'm not sure that's a good thing. The pounding takes a toll on the body and there are many ex-runners that have converted to cycling because of the punishment.

They do complement each other nicely, though, using different muscles.

Enjoy your ride/run,
Murph

[zott28]

Each activity is as physically demanding as you want to make it. You can ride/run as hard as you'd like, or you can slack off as much as you'd like.
Murph

Totally agree, that's where my 'mental' statement came in. Since I started running I slack off on the bicycle way less. I power thru the top of climbs and push harder on the downhills than I did before.
Running is the equivalent to having a fast riding partner, or riding a fixed gear. It helps you to realize you should still be pedaling.

[rugbysecondrow]

I think it is a nice compliment to riding, especially based on the OPs stated goals and riding style.


Running helps cycling about as much as Ping Pong helps tennis. You will get general aerobic fitness benefits but if you want to get faster on the bike use that time to ride more.

I also 100% disagree with this statement. Crosstraining is an integral part of athletics and the notion that the only way to improve at sport A is to only perform sport A is false. Elite athletes in all sports cross train. Lance, the best (arguably of course) cyclist of his day cross trained like a mofo.

I will likely step into a pile of poo on this one, but here goes: I think most cyclists are a one trick pony and anything off the bike shows their lack of fitness and athleticism. They are haters primarily because they can't perform off the bike.

For me, likely the OP and most other riders, fitness, mobility and a healthy lifestyle are the goals. With those goals stated, running, rowing, swimming, strength training, pick up basketball games, crosstraining etc ought to be part of your lifestyle.

[laupsi]

weight lifting compliments cycling. yoga compliments cycling. Pilates compliments cycling. Pushups compliments cycling. Crunches complements cycling. I can go on... Running? Perhaps if makes you stronger. But if you're a cyclist it really shouldn't. Does it make you a better cyclist? I'd say no more than any of the other disciplines listed above. And yes I do know everything! :)

[fiamme red]

Elite athletes in all sports cross train. Lance, the best (arguably of course) cyclist of his day cross trained like a mofo.I don't think he ever cross-trained during cycling season, only during the off-season.

[Gummee]

weight lifting compliments cycling. yoga compliments cycling. Pilates compliments cycling. Pushups compliments cycling. Crunches complements cycling. I can go on... Running? Perhaps if makes you stronger. But if you're a cyclist it really shouldn't. Does it make you a better cyclist? I'd say no more than any of the other disciplines listed above. And yes I do know everything! :)
Don't forget underwater hockey! That compliments cycling too! (at least it does for me!)

M

[twangston73]

I think the variable answers are interesting and may reflect different styles and aptitudes in each activity, even different body types. I am not great at either event but probably a "better" runner than cyclist. I find running to be more about aerobic fitness and less about strength than cycling, and I tend to run for shorter amounts of time than I bike because I find that running does not let you take breaks. (Yes, I am sure some would say biking shouldn't either but that is just the way I ride, so to speak!) Where cycling is concerned, I tend to be a better climber than sprinter. Flip side, i find that cycling a lot builds leg strength that helps on the hills and also helps build the type of endurance you get from 2-3 efforts. Just my 2 cents.

[beercan]

I think running interval training helps a lot on and off the bike, it keeps your legs honest and your lungs as well. Running definitely helps you deal with suffering on the bike and it helps with bone density for cyclists. I love riding my bike but I love playing sports even more. My friends who are amazing cyclists can of course have me eating dust on the bike but when it comes to "ball" sports, they struggle to catch their breath.

[djg]

I think you might get very different answers depending on your goals in either cycling or running. If you're trying to optimize your training to be all that you can be in a particular sport you'll have a program of very specialized training -- say, in cycling, moving up (and maybe through) an elite team so that you can earn a pro contract -- then you need to spend boatloads of time on the bike and the question what else to do at what time of year is part of a particular training and recovery plan. I'm not equipped to design that plan for anybody, which is fine, because that person already knows more than I do and may very well have a coach (who does too) besides.

The OP described a very different case. For a recreational cyclist -- including one who might do a few races here and there . . . or not -- sure, why not? Lots of folks see benefits from one or another type of cross training, and running can be a pretty efficient way to manage one's weight, give the lungs a good workout, provide a change of pace keeps things fresh, etc. Different types of running might pay more particular benefits. But as long as there are not impact/stress related issues, it's all good, yes?