Inches or centimeters.....

[William]

Is it just me? I've noticed that when I see ads for used, higher end road bikes that show measurements in inches instead of centimeters, a little warning bell start going off in my head. Much of the time the ads for stolen road bikes are in inches is why. That, or maybe I've just been around the road scene that generally uses the metric system too long? :confused:






:)

William

[mktng]

No different from people selling high end bikes with no measurements. Some people do it differently or just don't care. But obviously after a few email exchanges you can easily get the vibe.

[MattTuck]

metric is played out. I'm hacking my garmin to show all measures in ancient Egyptian cubits.

[Lanterne Rouge]

metric is played out. I'm hacking my garmin to show all measures in ancient Egyptian cubits.

ha ha ha

[shovelhd]

Craigslist suggests inches.

[jr59]

Is it just me? I've noticed that when I see ads for used, higher end road bikes that show measurements in inches instead of centimeters, a little warning bell start going off in my head. Much of the time the ads for stolen road bikes are in inches is why. That, or maybe I've just been around the road scene that generally uses the metric system too long? :confused:






:)

William

Big William, are you looking for another high end bike?

[William]

Big William, are you looking for another high end bike?

No, just noticing on the occasions I browse classifieds.:)





William

[jmoore]

Inches put me off as well. Conversion is easy enough but the bike is sold with metric measurements originally.

[slidey]

To state the obvious, I've observed the discrepancy only when it comes to road/cross bike measurements (in cms) along side MTB measurements (in inches). I can't quite understand why the different bikes should follow different units of measurement. :confused:

[jvp]

If I were selling a nicer classic road bike that was originally sold in inch sized frames (paramount, raleigh pro, etc.) I would list the size in inches. Otherwise I would use cm.

[corky]

furlongs

[AngryScientist]

eh, most people in the US have no use for the metric system.

as an illustration of this go to home depot, or lowes, and browse the tape measure selection. at my home depot, there are probably 25 different styles of measuring instruments, and not a single one has a metric scale.

[Llewellyn]

Beats me why the US still persist with an outdated system :confused:

[reggiebaseball]

what I see is:

divorced wife if selling hubby's nice sh$t for a song and doesn't know how to measure it.

primed for lowballing and eBay flipping baby!

[gasman]

'Cuz saying 15 centimeters sounds better than 6 inches









That's what I tell my wife






Ducking

[Black Dog]

Beats me why the US still persist with an outdated system :confused:

Agree. The funny thing about the US and the metric system is that the US government specs all of its purchases in Metric as does the us military...or so I have been told.

It will be hard to find a metric tape in a hardware store in North America since all residential constructing still uses the imperial system. Commercial, and industrial construction in Canada uses metric and all of our codes are metric for all forms of construction. Everything else is metric here even though we still speak imperial for our height and weight.

[Villgaxx]

To state the obvious, I've observed the discrepancy only when it comes to road/cross bike measurements (in cms) along side MTB measurements (in inches). I can't quite understand why the different bikes should follow different units of measurement. :confused:

idk why, exactly, but i have found it oddly universal that folks who are serious mountain bike riders always use inches. how long is the tt? whats the standover? chainstay length? they throw out a figure in inches. i do, too. seems natural.

then, you go to folks who are serious road riders and racers and ask them--some of them those mountain bikers above--something about their road bike, and sure as the sunrise it is all metric system, tt, wheelbase, bb drop, whatever, all in centimeters.

i do it, and i think most people do it because the language of mountain bikes is inches and the language of road racing bikes is cms.

what's sort of off-putting at first is the newbie type dude who is branching out into the other discipline after boo coo time in the first when they don't yet speak the language and you can't translate because you never think of it like that. 'how many inches should my top tube be on a road bike if i ride a 24" top tube on my hardtail?' 'i have no idea. let's try this 59cm bike for fit and work from there...'

[A1CKot]

All the tools and hardware on the B-52 is standard. Not sure about the rest of the military ordering.

Everything road bikes is in metric except the steer tube. I guess 1 1/8 is easier than 2.8575cm.

[aaronf]

Or how about Italian BB's:
36mm diameter,
but 24 threads per inch.

Italian axles too:
10 or 9mm diameter but 26 tpi.

I guess we just have to be well versed in multiple units. Keeps us on our collective toes.

[esldude]

http://xkcd.com/927/

I think this answers it all.


I will admit, I think metric much more rational. Yet, having grown up with English measurements, I am pretty fluent with metric, but always by knowing conversions from English which I know intimately, to metric. 2.54 is the only exact conversion between the two and is your friend.

But then hey, I have a French bike with 27x1 tires. Yet only a too metric obsolete French bottom bracket.

[flydhest]

My father retired from a long career at NIST and likes to quip that the US is inching its way to the metric system.

[fuzzalow]

All the tools and hardware on the B-52 is standard. Not sure about the rest of the military ordering.

That aircraft has been in continuous service since the 1950s. In the '50s, metric wasn't invented yet, right? ;) If there ever was a Grande Dame that earned her standard tooling eccentricities, it would be the '52. Sneaky stealthy boom boom is where it's at nowadays but I suppose Uncle Sam likes to have the option to carpet bomb in his back pocket.

All the new military stuff surely must be metric to meet compatability in NATO.

[Bruce K]

I know I'm dating myself here but.....

Right, what's a cubit?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bputeFGXEjA

BK

[Terry Williams]

I work in a bike shop and had the same question:
How come that documentation for one bike is in the metric system and another one is imperial?
I googled a lot looking for documentation in the metric system for some bikes.
Then I gave up and begun convert it all manually online here: https://oneconvert.com/unit-converters
It takes time, but It is worth it.

[Mark McM]

idk why, exactly, but i have found it oddly universal that folks who are serious mountain bike riders always use inches. how long is the tt? whats the standover? chainstay length? they throw out a figure in inches. i do, too. seems natural.

This mostly comes down to the origins of MTBs. MTBs were first developed in the US in the 1970s, when the US was even more entrenched in US Customary Units (an offshoot of English Engineering Units). Furthermore, MTBs originated from "Klunkers" built from old balloon tire bike parts - those balloon tire bikes having been largely made in the US using US measurement units (for example, 26" wheels).

US/English measurement units are still pervasive in the industry, even for new standards, and often simply translated into metric units. Examples include:

Newer standards:
1 1/2"/1 1/8" tapered steerer tubes
1 1/4" handlebars (31.75mm, often rounded to either 31.7mm or 31.8mm)

Older standards, translated into metric units:
12.7mm pitch chains (1/2")
28.6mm stems (1 1/8")
28.6mm, 31.8mm, and 34.9mm derailleur clamps (1 1/8", 1 1/4", 1 3/8")

[Mark McM]

All the tools and hardware on the B-52 is standard. Not sure about the rest of the military ordering.

Everything road bikes is in metric except the steer tube. I guess 1 1/8 is easier than 2.8575cm.

The Soviet Union's Tupolev Tu-4 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-4) was an exact duplicate of the Boeing B-29, built by reverse engineering a few B-29's that had made emergency landings in the USSR and were interred during World War II. The B-29 was built using imperial measurements while the USSR was using the metric system, and aluminum sheets and other parts in imperial dimensions were not available in the USSR. So they ended up importing much of the raw material and parts to build the Tu-4.

And no, many other standard parts of road bikes are still built in inches, including chains (1/2" pitch), handlebars (1 1/4" at the clamp, and 7/8" where the levers mount), pedal threads (9/16" x 20tpi), and even spoke threads (56 tpi)

[Bob Ross]

the bike is sold with metric measurements originally.

Is that true of all brands? I have this vague recollection that the Schwinn Varsity Sport I bought in 1970 was sized in inches. Certainly the wheels were.

Then again, OP did mention "high-end bikes" so maybe that's a moot point.

[Bob Ross]

go to home depot, or lowes, and browse the tape measure selection. at my home depot, there are probably 25 different styles of measuring instruments, and not a single one has a metric scale.
It will be hard to find a metric tape in a hardware store in North America since all residential constructing still uses the imperial system.

Thread Drift: I find ^^^that absolutely perplexing, because it is completely opposite my experience:

We own at least four different tape measures in this house, all of which were purchased in person from the local Home Depot, Lowe's, Ace Hardware, or whatever the neighborhood hardware store was called, in both the New York metropolitan area and Tucson AZ, and all four of them are dual gradation -- Imperial and Metric scales. Wasn't even difficult to find them, just walked to the Tape Measure aisles and grabbed the one marked "Metric"

I suppose if we'd been looking for one that was only Metric perhaps we might have encountered some difficulty?
:shrug:

[BRad704]

Reviving an 11 year old thread. Nice find Terry. :eek:

Also I keep IKEA tape measures around my office/shop for the cheap price and dual systems. Only problem is that the black casing on the tapemeasure means they are very easily lost.. err... misplaced temporarily.

[robt57]

metric is played out. I'm hacking my garmin to show all measures in ancient Egyptian cubits.


Noah: Right ... What's a cubit? God: Well never mind. Don't worry about that right now. After you build the ark...


That said, my guess be non enthusiasts in US who might think one size fits all break out the SAE tape measure after 1st reply to their ad. ;)

[robt57]

I know I'm dating myself here but.....

Right, what's a cubit?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bputeFGXEjA

BK

Your beat me to it. I figure lots of cyclist my age are gunna get that one.. ;)

[EB]

In the mountain bike world we use imperial or metric depending on some arbitrary point in time as to when the particular component in question stopped being made or marketed in imperial sizes. It makes absolutely no sense and its glorious (-ly dumb).

So for example up until about 2016 or so, shocks were made and sold mostly in imperial sizes. Now they're all metric.

However, mountain bike tires are still marketed in imperial widths... but almost never inflate at the actual width they were marketed at.

Steerer widths? Imperial. Headsets? Metric. Does this make any sense? Does it have to? Dunno.

Wheel sizes? Imperial of course. But the imperial sizing doesn't actually measure anything - 29ers aren't actually 29 inches in diameter, 27.5" is actually something else... etc.

Then you've got brake rotors, which Shimano still sells in an imperial size (8 inches) that they market as metric (203mm) even though everyone else has moved to a metric size that makes more sense (200mm), thus making Shimano's rotors incompatible with other brakes without the use of an adapter and/or washers.

Thankfully, frames are sold using t-shirt sizes, which are awesome because they are also about as consistent as actual t-shirt sizes, leading to endless threads on MTBR of the flavor of "I am x tall which size Specialized should I buy" that result in 63,000 answers, none of which are consistent with each other.

[BdaGhisallo]

Agree. The funny thing about the US and the metric system is that the US government specs all of its purchases in Metric as does the us military...or so I have been told.

It will be hard to find a metric tape in a hardware store in North America since all residential constructing still uses the imperial system. Commercial, and industrial construction in Canada uses metric and all of our codes are metric for all forms of construction. Everything else is metric here even though we still speak imperial for our height and weight.


What's even funnier is that the US has been on the metric system for quite some time with few realizing it, as all of the imperial units the US uses are defined in terms of metric units.

One yard is defined as 0.9144 meters, for instance.

[JMT3]

Yep, that is why setting your computer to metric is best. 40 kph sounds way faster than 24.8 mph.

[cmbicycles]

eh, most people in the US have no use for the metric system.

as an illustration of this go to home depot, or lowes, and browse the tape measure selection. at my home depot, there are probably 25 different styles of measuring instruments, and not a single one has a metric scale.

As a matter of fact, I just went looking for a metric tape. My tape I keep on my bike stand broke the catch to keep it locked open so went to find one locally... nada at HD and Lowes. I then ordered a luftkin online with metric and inches, only to realize when it arrived that it's an engineers tape, so metric yes... feet yes, but then 10ths/100ths of a foot. I laughed and ordered another.

[BRad704]

Thankfully, frames are sold using t-shirt sizes, which are awesome because they are also about as consistent as actual t-shirt sizes, leading to endless threads on MTBR of the flavor of "I am x tall which size Specialized should I buy" that result in 63,000 answers, none of which are consistent with each other.
Most accurate description ever.

[Spdntrxi]

metric for bike... just used to it.

[9tubes]

This mostly comes down to the origins of MTBs. MTBs were first developed in the US in the 1970s, when the US was even more entrenched in US Customary Units (an offshoot of English Engineering Units). Furthermore, MTBs originated from "Klunkers" built from old balloon tire bike parts - those balloon tire bikes having been largely made in the US using US measurement units (for example, 26" wheels).


Yes, it was more of a choice though. There was a feeling among some framebuilders back then that since mountain bikes were an "Murican invention then dangblamit, the measurements should be in good old 'Murican as well. I thought it was an odd POV, as the MTB thing started in the SF Bay area, hardly a bastion of redneckdom. Yet that was the attitude there and then, and here we are, 40 years later...

Someone above mentioned the oddity of threadcount being done in inches even in Europe. Someone knowledgeable told me that after WW2 the U.S. helped the European countries rebuild their factories. When it came to steel production the machines were brought from the U.S. so the dimensions were in inches, and that even today EU sheet steel is made in inch thickness. Can anyone confirm? Is that why the threadcount is done in inches?

[EB]

as the MTB thing started in the SF Bay area, hardly a bastion of redneckdom.

Don't confuse the SF Bay of today with the North Bay, particularly Marin and Sonoma county, of the mid-1970s.

Even in the early 1980s there used to be a store in Sausalito where you could buy weed and guns.

[72gmc]

Yep, that is why setting your computer to metric is best. 40 kph sounds way faster than 24.8 mph.

For sure. Just look at the number and feel good about yourself! Feeling good is one of my top reasons for doing this in the first place (the other top reason is fetishizing components)

[Spaghetti Legs]

The main reason for using the metric system is so you can pronounce centimeters as “sont-a-meters”. Makes you sound super smart.

[martl]

The metric system is based on powers of 10, because a Neanderthal had 10 fingers. Can't get any more outdated than that.

10 is a ****ty base to start a numbering system, because it has only two factors, 5 and 2. A system based on 12 would make many kinds of math easier :D

[yarbsr02]

Just saw a newly listed C50 on the 'bay with an effective tube length 22-23". So in units I cannot comprehend, and a significant range.

[9tubes]

A Colnago C50 advertised in inches is just another way of saying "this bike is stolen."

[FriarQuade]

There's two different types of countries in this world. There's all the ones that use sillimeters and then there's the one that's BEEN TO THE MOON!


And before anyone want's to retort, NASA switch to metric after the Apollo program. Also, the moon landing was real.

[PacNW2Ford]

There's two different types of countries in this world. There's all the ones that use sillimeters and then there's the one that's BEEN TO THE MOON!


And before anyone want's to retort, NASA switch to metric after the Apollo program. Also, the moon landing was real.

Decimal inches rule! :)

[PacNW2Ford]

In the mountain bike world we use imperial or metric depending on some arbitrary point in time as to when the particular component in question stopped being made or marketed in imperial sizes. It makes absolutely no sense and its glorious (-ly dumb).

So for example up until about 2016 or so, shocks were made and sold mostly in imperial sizes. Now they're all metric.

However, mountain bike tires are still marketed in imperial widths... but almost never inflate at the actual width they were marketed at.

Steerer widths? Imperial. Headsets? Metric. Does this make any sense? Does it have to? Dunno.

Wheel sizes? Imperial of course. But the imperial sizing doesn't actually measure anything - 29ers aren't actually 29 inches in diameter, 27.5" is actually something else... etc.

Then you've got brake rotors, which Shimano still sells in an imperial size (8 inches) that they market as metric (203mm) even though everyone else has moved to a metric size that makes more sense (200mm), thus making Shimano's rotors incompatible with other brakes without the use of an adapter and/or washers.

Thankfully, frames are sold using t-shirt sizes, which are awesome because they are also about as consistent as actual t-shirt sizes, leading to endless threads on MTBR of the flavor of "I am x tall which size Specialized should I buy" that result in 63,000 answers, none of which are consistent with each other.

FWIW: Metric wheel sizes don't actually measure anything either, "700" refers to ancient tire diameters related to the alphabetic suffix.

[tomato coupe]

There's two different types of countries in this world. There's all the ones that use sillimeters and then there's the one that's BEEN TO THE MOON!


And before anyone want's to retort, NASA switch to metric after the Apollo program. Also, the moon landing was real.

No they didn't. All the calculations for the Apollo mission were done using the metric system. The results were converted to imperial for the displays in the spacecraft to make it easier for the astronauts, as they were used to using imperial units as pilots.

[572cv]

It’s not just millivanillimeters versus imperial, it’s feet versus feet.

https://xkcd.com/

If you have too many standards, are they standard?:)

[NHAero]

I can't find it, but many years ago, in Coevolution Quarterly or maybe Whole Earth Review, J. Baldwin had a one pager that was two columns. One column was the advantages of the Imperial system, and the other was the advantages of the metric system. The second column, in its entirety, said, “everything is divisible by 10.

Baldwin also wrote an article way back when, should bicycles have suspension, and his answer was a resounding yes.

[BruceVelo]

metric is played out. I'm hacking my garmin to show all measures in ancient Egyptian cubits.

Cubit? What's a cubit?
-Bill Cosby

[Carbonita]

A system in which the mass measurement is (I'm not making this up!) SLUGS, is a freedom (from rationality) unit indeed. ;) Not to mention lb_m versus lb_f. Didn't NASA miss a planet due to conversion error between SI and imperial? :eek:

[Mark McM]

A system in which the mass measurement is (I'm not making this up!) SLUGS, is a freedom (from rationality) unit indeed. ;) Not to mention lb_m versus lb_f. Didn't NASA miss a planet due to conversion error between SI and imperial? :eek:

Using lb_m as a unit of mass is just a convenience - just as kg_f as often used as a force unit (particularly in the bike industry, where spoke tension is expressed at "kg" and aerodynamic drag is expressed as "grams").

If you are referring to the Mars Climate Orbiter, you kind of have it backwards - rather than missing the planet, it was destroyed when it got too close and was destroyed in the atmosphere; and the cause wasn't a conversion error, but a lack of conversion - the system that calculated rocket thrust used English units, but the system that calculated expected trajectory based on the rocket thrust expected SI units.

[72gmc]

No they didn't. All the calculations for the Apollo mission were done using the metric system. The results were converted to imperial for the displays in the spacecraft to make it easier for the astronauts, as they were used to using imperial units as pilots.

I read The Right Stuff. I may be mis-remembering but I'm pretty sure their primary metric was Corvette-per-groupie.

[OtayBW]

IDK - I've been recording my mileage over time in furlongs/fortnight....

[tomato coupe]

I read The Right Stuff. I may be mis-remembering but I'm pretty sure their primary metric was Corvette-per-groupie.

A real astronaut would use Groupie-per-Corvette.

[BRad704]

A real astronaut would use Groupie-per-Corvette.

#anythingbutthemetricsystem

[Flinch]

Beats me why the US still persist with an outdated system :confused:

Metric is for those who can't count by 12 or 16... :fight:

[EB]

FWIW: Metric wheel sizes don't actually measure anything either, "700" refers to ancient tire diameters related to the alphabetic suffix.

Thank you for fact-checking my elaborate dumb joke. :)

[Repack Rider]

I once asked Tom Ritchey why he used American measurements instead of metric.

He said, "Isn't this America?"

[makoti]

I read The Right Stuff. I may be mis-remembering but I'm pretty sure their primary metric was Corvette-per-groupie.

Certainly you could get more than one groupie per Corvette, so wouldn't it be Groupie per Corvette?

[9tubes]

There's two different types of countries in this world. There's all the ones that use sillimeters and then there's the one that's BEEN TO THE MOON!


There's two different types of countries in this world. Those in the 95%, and the 5% desperately trying (and failing) to sell their screwy-sized products to the 95%.

[9tubes]

Boeing is inch. John Deere is metric. Enough said.

[72gmc]

Certainly you could get more than one groupie per Corvette, so wouldn't it be Groupie per Corvette?

I’m pretty sure you are correct. I’ll have to watch the movie again to check.

[Mark McM]

Boeing is inch. John Deere is metric. Enough said.

International civil aviation around most of the world still predominately uses American/British units, and this is recognized by ICAO (International Civil Avation Organization). ICAO has recommended using SI units, but they still allow American/British units. By current standard convention, altitudes are measured in Feet, distances are measured in Nautical Miles (unless it is visibility, in which case it is measured in Statute Miles), speeds are measured in Knots, pressures are measured in Inches of Mercury.

[EB]

International civil aviation around most of the world still predominately uses American/British units, and this is recognized by ICAO (International Civil Avation Organization). ICAO has recommended using SI units, but they still allow American/British units. By current standard convention, altitudes are measured in Feet, distances are measured in Nautical Miles (unless it is visibility, in which case it is measured in Statute Miles), speeds are measured in Knots, pressures are measured in Inches of Mercury.

Mark - isn't this primarily because of the correspondence of nautical miles and knots with meridian distances? Meridians are much more convenient in a marine and aeronautical navigation context, so having measures of distance that easily translate is important - or at least it was in the era of paper navigation, but most marine navigators (I can't speak to air) are required to be able to fall back on paper.

[tomato coupe]

Boeing is inch. John Deere is metric. Enough said.

I think Boeing made the transition to metric a few years ago.