Shimano Ultegra Electric / Meh

[dana_e]

I tried it and found the shifting to smaller cogs (big gear) OK

but going the other way, there is now a new sliver of a lever between the back lever and the brake lever

the brake pivot, I mean lever, does not pivot

I did not like it.

seemed smallish

no wonder fabian uses mechanical

maybe the remote buttons add something

to me interesing since I thought I would be more impressed

meh.

[gavingould]

Fabian wouldn't be caught dead using Ultegra.

guess they gotta leave some performance differences to justify the cost diff between Ultegra/Dura-Ace

[oldpotatoe]

I tried it and found the shifting to smaller cogs (big gear) OK

but going the other way, there is now a new sliver of a lever between the back lever and the brake lever

the brake pivot does not pivot

I did not like it.

seemed smallish

no wonder fabian uses mechanical

maybe the remote buttons add something

meh.

The close proximity of the two shifter 'paddles' have been mentioned by some as somewhat hard to 'find, particularly on bumpy roads(Roubaix).

'Brake pivot doesn't pivot' doesn't compute.

Fabian has big......hands....

In terms of lever/shifter/shift button ergonomics, Campagnolo EPS is much better, IMHO. As are their regular, mechanical levers, again, IMHO. Add the reliability and function, pretty easy choice, In My Mind( IMM).

[SoCalSteve]

IMHO, Ultegra DI2 works incredibly well. You need to get used to the shifters. Give it a few rides before you judge. It's truly good stuff!!!

Can't speak about EPS except its big $$$ and the battery pack is HUGE. When I think of electronics, I think of the Japanese...

Oh yeah, there is this little box/plug/cable that plugs into your shifters and computer and let's you program and reprogram up shifts, down shifts, speed of shifts,etc....pretty cool stuff!

It works, it works well and it's here to stay. Period.

[vqdriver]

sounds like test ride impressions. i wouldn't write off a group, shimano or otherwise, unless you've owned it. i tried campy on two bikes for three years before i jumped ship, even tho my first impressions were mixed. i feel i gave it a fair shake.

granted, "trial" ownership of an electronic group is pricey. but hey, it is what it is.

[OtayBW]

IMHO, Ultegra DI2 works incredibly well. You need to get used to the shifters. Give it a few rides before you judge. It's truly good stuff!!!

Can't speak about EPS except its big $$$ and the battery pack is HUGE. When I think of electronics, I think of the Japanese...

Oh yeah, there is this little box/plug/cable that plugs into your shifters and computer and let's you program and reprogram up shifts, down shifts, speed of shifts,etc....pretty cool stuff!

It works, it works well and it's here to stay. Period.
Glad you like it...

[10-4]

Oh yeah, there is this little box/plug/cable that plugs into your shifters and computer and let's you program and reprogram up shifts, down shifts, speed of shifts,etc....pretty cool stuff!

I'm not sure you can vary the speed of the shifts with the diagnostic program, but it sure can do a lot.

[thirdgenbird]

I know it's not an issue for most, but I've got limmited feeling/dexterity in the fingers on my right hand. I can't easily distinguish the buttons on DI2. Wearing gloves would likely render it impossible. I wouldn't expect the same issue with eps. Mechanical Campagnolo isn't an issue.

[SoCalSteve]

I'm not sure you can vary the speed of the shifts with the diagnostic program, but it sure can do a lot.

With the later firmware, you can when it comes to adding the multiple shift options.

[soulspinner]

With the later firmware, you can when it comes to adding the multiple shift options.

Anybody have a go at 9000 DI2 yet?

[oldpotatoe]

I'm not sure you can vary the speed of the shifts with the diagnostic program, but it sure can do a lot.

Di2 does have a page where you can dictate the speed of shift. 'Fast' is what most do, 'Very Fast' is almost too fast if you also program multiple shifts.

It also will show if any of the components are in need of a software update.

Pretty neat, as long as you have a laptop or computer.

For above Di2 11s, installed one on a Cannondale. Ultegra Di2 will be 11s 'next year'. I don't know if the present Ultegra 10s will be programable to 11s.

[znfdl]

I was highly skeptical of electronic shifting, but when I had new frame built, I decided to go Ultegra Di2.

My impression is this; how can I justify upgrading my other bikes to Di2 without getting divorced. Yes, it is that good.

It did take a couple hundred miles to get used to the change in electronic shifting and the location of the paddles.

[SoCalSteve]

Di2 does have a page where you can dictate the speed of shift. 'Fast' is what most do, 'Very Fast' is almost too fast if you also program multiple shifts.

It also will show if any of the components are in need of a software update.

Pretty neat, as long as you have a laptop or computer.

For above Di2 11s, installed one on a Cannondale. Ultegra Di2 will be 11s 'next year'. I don't know if the present Ultegra 10s will be programable to 11s.

I was told through the software and 11 speed rear der. that you will be able to make the upgrade to 11 speed...

[dana_e]

and not a test ride

just seemed odd to have a thin lever

I ride campy mechanical

I like the shape of the hoods

[cfox]

I tried it and found the shifting to smaller cogs (big gear) OK

but going the other way, there is now a new sliver of a lever between the back lever and the brake lever

the brake pivot, I mean lever, does not pivot

I did not like it.

seemed smallish

no wonder fabian uses mechanical

maybe the remote buttons add something

to me interesing since I thought I would be more impressed

meh.
Why would they keep the brake lever sweep action for e-shifting? That's the point: to remove the mechanical action and have shifting at the tap of a button. This is precisely why I like Di2, but everyone is different.

[thirdgenbird]

I was told through the software and 11 speed rear der. that you will be able to make the upgrade to 11 speed...

So you need a rear derailler, chain, cassette, hub, and crankset (chainrings)?

I would hardly call saving the FD, battery, and levers "upgradable".

[jimmythefly]

and not a test ride

just seemed odd to have a thin lever

I ride campy mechanical

I like the shape of the hoods

bwahahahha!

So you're completely familiar with a different lever shape and action because you use Campy, and you didn't even straddle the bike to try the Ultegra, let alone ride it for a few miles? *** did you expect it to feel like?

Are you serious, or did I just get trolled?

[SoCalSteve]

So you need a rear derailler, chain, cassette, hub, and crankset (chainrings)?

I would hardly call saving the FD, battery, and levers "upgradable".

Why crankset? Just chain,rear der and cassette and a reprogramming of the shifters...oh, not hub...freehub...DT already makes an 11 speed freehub, I'm sure others do too.

[garysol1]

Why crankset? Just chain,rear der and cassette and a reprogramming of the shifters...oh, not hub...freehub...DT already makes an 11 speed freehub, I'm sure others do too.

I am not even "sure" that the rear deraileur will not be compatible. The deraileur throw is more than enough to sweep the 11 speed casette. It all comes down to what type of a motor is being used and I have not found anyone who can commit either way whether the motor will work in 11 "steps" or not.

[oldpotatoe]

Why crankset? Just chain,rear der and cassette and a reprogramming of the shifters...oh, not hub...freehub...DT already makes an 11 speed freehub, I'm sure others do too.

Yes CR cuz electronic is very sensitive to CR spacing. You can probably get away with a 11s CR/crank on a 10s electronic but not the other way around, or else you get some rubbing at the 'extremes'.

[doomridesout]

The RD is reprogrammable for 11- I would keep an eye out for 11s Ultegra within a year... I tried Ultegra Di2 and found that it was possible to miss shifts the same way you can not click a mouse hard enough for it to register the click. I can feel the shift in the lever on mechanical and the cable stuff works so well I don't see a need either.

[dana_e]

yes lever pivot is a thing of the past with electric

i thought i was looking at mechanical at first

I am sure you can get the feeling and the touch for the electric

I just thought I would be more wowed, more impressed

maybe the front shifting is more impressive

the rear, for me, with a limited time using it, seemed meh, there ya go

[cfox]

yes lever pivot is a thing of the past with electric

i thought i was looking at mechanical at first

I am sure you can get the feeling and the touch for the electric

I just thought I would be more wowed, more impressed

maybe the front shifting is more impressive

the rear, for me, with a limited time using it, seemed meh, there ya go

Didn't mean to come across rough. Yes, the front shifting is where most of the oohs and aahs come from. It's super fast and works well under any load. E-shifting is not life changing, but I really like how it never needs adjustment, is always perfect and quiet in any gear, and I like the tap-to-shift aspect. All that said, I would never recommend e-shifting over a nicer set of wheels if budget were a factor.

[doomridesout]

And quietly, DA9000 has front shifting as good as any electric....

[thirdgenbird]

Why crankset? Just chain,rear der and cassette and a reprogramming of the shifters...oh, not hub...freehub...DT already makes an 11 speed freehub, I'm sure others do too.

Yes crankset/chainrings see info from OP above. I also don't care that there are some shimano 11 hubs out there. That doesn't distract from the fact that many people, most noteably those with shimano produced hubs, will need an upgrade to run 11.

Call it upgradibe if you want, but from a cost perspective, it still won't save you much of anything over upgrading mechanical groups. Knowing shimano, the aesthetics will differ so much that you will want to swap the whole group anyway.

Edit:I'm in no way trying to make any negative remarks about di2, I just wouldn't hold my breath that an upgrade to 11 will be cheap. If shimano lets you repurpose your RD, that would help tremendously, but there will still be cost associated with the upgrade. Hopefully a 3rd party steps up and offers some good 11spd chairing options for existing shimano cranksets.

[SoCalSteve]

Yes crankset/chainrings see info from OP above. I also don't care that there are some shimano 11 hubs out there. That doesn't distract from the fact that many people, most noteably those with shimano produced hubs, will need an upgrade to run 11.

Call it upgradibe if you want, but from a cost perspective, it still won't save you much of anything over upgrading mechanical groups. Knowing shimano, the aesthetics will differ so much that you will want to swap the whole group anyway.

Edit:I'm in no way trying to make any negative remarks about di2, I just wouldn't hold my breath that an upgrade to 11 will be cheap. If shimano lets you repurpose your RD, that would help tremendously, but there will still be cost associated with the upgrade. Hopefully a 3rd party steps up and offers some good 11spd chairing options for existing shimano cranksets.

I never said it would be cheap...just less expensive than if you couldn't reprogram it....make sense, yes?

[thirdgenbird]

I never said it would be cheap...just less expensive than if you couldn't reprogram it....make sense, yes?


Sorry, I likely misinterpreted your intent.

Yes, less expensive than not being able to reprogram. I just don't see DI2 being our "salvation" from expensive upgrades as some claim. I would still anticipate it costing the same (or more) than what it cost to go from 8 to 9 or 9 to 10 using mechanical groups, despite the fact that there are fewer parts involved.

Between 8-10 speed there were quite a few constants. New shifters, cassette, chain, and inner chainring (outer with campy) would go a long ways.

[oldpotatoe]

And quietly, DA9000 has front shifting as good as any electric....

The chainrings for 6700 and 7900 and now 9000 are the single biggest reason shimano front shifting is so good. A stiffer(or more expensive) big ring doesn't exist. When it comes to aluminum forging, there are none better in the bicycle industry than shimano.

It's amazing to me that nobody blanches when a $2500 8 piece mechanical group is mentioned, let alone one for almost twice that for some electronic.

NOR $900 if ya fall and kill a rear der or $250 for a powerpack, or other really expensive replacement parts. Lots of $ into the frame/fork/wheels/bike fit..particular attention to where you 'touch' the bike, pedals, saddle, handlebars, IMHO, are much more important than how the chain is moved around.

[jr59]

particular attention to where you 'touch' the bike, pedals, saddle, handlebars, IMHO, are much more important than how the chain is moved around.

truer words could not have been spoken, but, That would not sell many bikes!!!

[shovelhd]

NOR $900 if ya fall and kill a rear der or $250 for a powerpack, or other really expensive replacement parts. Lots of $ into the frame/fork/wheels/bike fit..particular attention to where you 'touch' the bike, pedals, saddle, handlebars, IMHO, are much more important than how the chain is moved around.

No argument with your premise. However, if all the basic stuff is all set, Di2 has value to a racer. To be able to shift in the drops in a full tilt sprint and shift without hesitation can make the difference between 1st and 5th. I want it. I will have it someday.

[oldpotatoe]

No argument with your premise. However, if all the basic stuff is all set, Di2 has value to a racer. To be able to shift in the drops in a full tilt sprint and shift without hesitation can make the difference between 1st and 5th. I want it. I will have it someday.

However, for first gen Di2, one gear at a time, it is actually slower than Campag mechanical that can dump multiple gears to higher.

I've always said index, lever mounting shifting is essential for

-Racers(cuz they all have it)
-MTB riding(bouncing around, hard to use friction)
-Beginners(same reason some beginning drivers have an automatic transmission. It brought a LOT of people back or into cycling in the 80s

To all else it's firmly in the 'nice to have' category but certainly not essential in order to ride a bicycle.

Some 'need' paddle shifters on their Subaru rally car lookalike too but not really essential.

[shovelhd]

However, for first gen Di2, one gear at a time, it is actually slower than Campag mechanical that can dump multiple gears to higher.

True, but I was mainly referring to shifting down the cog into a higher gear. I want to do that one shift at a time, from the drops, using a thumb shifter, with shifts lightning quick and consistent. With DA7900, I always have to hesitate a little between shifts in order for my finger to flick the lever. I'm talking about a full tilt sprint, approaching 40mph, shoulder to shoulder, where the win is determined by a few thousands of a second.

[Bob Ross]

I tried Ultegra Di2 and found that it was possible to miss shifts the same way you can not click a mouse hard enough for it to register the click.

Huh? Twenty-five years of using computers with mice and I've never experienced a mouse-click that didn't register

...unless the mouse was broken, or the software had already hung.