Gym work?

[The Spider]

Anyone spend any regular time at the gym strengthening their legs?

Not required or fantastic life altering experience?

Done in off-season (deep dark winter) or all-year round?

How about the older (that's over 30) men out there - Anyone got tales of muscle loss (which is a valid physical change that occurs in the mature male specimen) and reversing it's effects through workouts?

Thanks in advance.

Stay strong, don't do drugs.

[William]

Here are some exercises/training tools that I use in the off-season. I use these in my combative arts training (making others do it in season ) as well as off-season cycling training.

My weight training program utilizes free weights and band (the JC type) training. I have lower and upper body programs. The lower body includes leg presses where I'm working up to 1,100+ lbs. for reps (spinning before & after with lots of stretching in between). I love making the roid boys shake their heads. I find, at least so far, that with a well balanced diet, I'm not really losing much muscle at all compared to when I was younger.

Other fun training tools I use:
One exercise for the lower body that hits all the major muscles is one I picked up from Eric Heiden, the Olympic speed skater. I simply call them "Heidens" (since I don't know the real name). It's a very good exercise for developing balance, strength and explosive power. It compliments footwork drills nicely (after you get passed the initial pain period) and they are effective when using them in conjunction with the rollers and/or a Concept II rowing ergometer. If you haven't done these before, and you do them right, be prepared to have trouble sitting or going down stairs for the next day or two. They will hit the glutes, quads, hamstrings, and calves.

Basically, start off standing with your feet together, about a shoulder length apart. Put your hands behind your back (rest your right wrist in your left hand). Your upper body leaning forward like a speed skater. Step out on a left 45 degree angle but keep your centerline facing forward (or only a slight turn). Make your step longer than a "normal" step. Stretch out a enough so that you come up on the ball of your right foot as you center weight over your left leg. Then press up to a standing position (a one legged press....remember to simultaneously lift your right leg as you press up). Now, push straight up...essentially doing a one leg squat. Now, here is the interesting part, you simultaneously lift your right foot off the ground as you push up on your left leg without letting it touch (you can let it drag lightly if you can't get it off the ground). As you get up to the top of the press, squeeze/tighten your glute muscles (*** cheeks ). To work in the calves, continue pressing up onto your tip toe and squeeze/tighten the calf muscle. Your right foot doesn't touch the ground until you step out on that side. From that point, step out to your right on a 45 and repeat.

For a visual: In a sense you are dry-land speed skating

When I was competing in crew, I worked up to doing these with an Olympic bar and two 45 lbs plates...up and down the floor. I really feel that doing this exercise as long as I have, is one of the main reasons that lower body strength has stayed high, and maintained my ability to move the way I do for someone my size.

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A piece of equipment that I like to use when training footwork is called a "Smart Vest". It's a neoprene & Lycra vest that has 16 pockets, each can hold a square, thin, flat one pound weight. Loading up to 16 lbs (double them up for 32lbs) doesn't sound like allot of weight, but you'll find that your doing more then carrying a little extra weight. The vest fits snug to the body so the weights don't flop around. The key is that when you are moving through your footwork (with or without striking) drill, this added weight is moving with you through all the stages of motion that your body will be going through...forward, reverse, sidestepping, etc...It does a great job of stressing your "core" muscles to compensate. Take it off and go through your movements again and you'll feel like you're flying. And then follow up with the "Heidens"...YEAH BABY!!!

For cycling, I'll use the "Smart Vest" for climbing intervals. Wear this on your repeated climbs. Then take it off and you feel like your flying up the hill. You get to the point where you can climb at a good pace with this on, and you'll be ripping without it.

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Another oldie but a goodie (the good type of pain ).
Work these in on the trainer or doing intervals on the erg.

Squat Jacks:

Start out doing a normal Jumping Jack with a double beat (meaning bounce twice instead of once between each movement). Once you get going, start to squat down while continuing the Jumping Jack movement. You don't have to squat far to really start feeling the burn . Hold that squat through the entire set keeping your head at a steady level.

Try doing a set of 100.

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Now, I believe in riding rollers during the off-season and I do. But the one piece of equipment that I feel is the all around best piece of equipment that you can have is a Concept II Rowing Ergometer. Used correctly, and rowing with proper form, this thing will hit the entire body (esp. the lower body). Doing sprint intervals, or balls to wall 2000 meter sprints will do wonder for maintaining/building your aerobic capacity. It's also great for working on building your anaerobic threshold. Like I said, it's all about how you use it. The base you can build on this transfers to almost any sport. These machines are "THE" standard for Collegiate and Olympic programs.
When I went from Crew to cycling (due to back injury), no one on the cycling team could stay on my wheel on the flats or in a sprint. I had the aerobic base/strength for climbing, but I had develop good form. Once I had that, no one was dropping me on anything but the steepest climbs, and I was carrying another 90-100 lbs in weight. My point is (not to sound like I'm pulling my own chain) just that I really believe in this machine and what it can do for you when used correctly.

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"Those with no name". They are hard to explain, but Beungood will attest, they are a Muther Bleep bleeper to do and blast your quads, glutes, hams, and calves. It also develops and relies on balance so it induces your core muscles as well.

*Stand on one foot, (start with right side) and bring your left leg up like your trying to touch your chest with it. Your right arm should be up, left arm down, just like you do when your running.

*As you squat down on your right leg, shift your left leg down and then behind you, simultaneously shifting your arms (like your running) to help keep your balance. You should be in a semi squat on your right leg, left leg behind you like a speed skater. Don't let your left foot touch the ground.

*Press back up and shift your whole body back to the starting position. You should strive to be able to smoothly flow from start to finish working through a set of 15 to 20 reps on each side....and not touch your other foot to the ground.

Basically you look like your doing a squat on one leg, and your upper body is doing a cross between running and speed skating.

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And last, but by no means least, the dreaded Jumpies. Some of the Crew alum here likely know what these are.

Start with feet shoulder width apart. Squat down until your thighs are almost parallel to the ground. Then explosively jump up into the air as high as you can. Land with feet shoulder width apart and smoothly go back to the starting position, and then blast off the ground again. Do 8 to 10 sets of ten. Preferably after you've done the other exercises. This was always a fun one to do right after a hard session on the water.

Beungood....you want to do Jumpies don't you. I know you do... :D

William

[cs124]

No.

Not required.

Never... any more.

No muscle loss yet, but the off season "comfort layer" got harder to shift at 30+.

Just ride in the big ring more. ;)

hmmmm....morphology

[Too Tall]

T.S. - Short answer, depends on what you want to accomplish and how well suited you are to lifting leg weights.

Following a well designed program of periodized weight lifting is usually a safe bet if you are motivated. I say safe because you will be under the hairy eyeball of someone who knows how to train you using tried and true methods yada yada. I've seen it go both ways with myself and athletes I've coached. Folks who do adapt well to lifting and LIKE to lift seem to benefit esp. true with masters athletes.

Not entirely unrelated and fer sher covered by Sir William of Bulk are benefits from floor exercises :) I've come to appreciate first hand how much more I get out of these sorts of leg workouts than several yrs. of leg press programs I've done...and that's my story.

I'm a BIG fan of on the bike powerwork / force or whatever you want to call it done year 'round. Specificity on the bike really REALLY works.

[Climb01742]

TT--what are some of the on-the-bike power workouts that you've found most effective? thanks.

[zap]

I normally do leg weights and some upper body work during the off-season. I do it for three reasons.

1 I like it

2 I get stronger

3 I'm getting older so it helps keep bones strong

I normally go through three phases. Adaptation/high reps w increasing weights/low reps max weight. I'll go through adaptation in about 2-3 weeks then spend 6 weeks for each of the following stages. I do it 3-4 times a week, depending on how much and how hard I ride.

When using free weights, technique is important but really is not that difficult to learn. When squating really heavy weights, a spotter is important. I'm not a fan of leg presses/sleds whatever since they are too easy and finding enough weights can be difficult in a gym. I still remember the evil looks I got from body builders at the local Bally club as I was scrounging for 45 lb plates.

I'm finding yoga to be helpful as well since one really needs to work the entire system.

[lnomalley]

the gym is better than dope. dead lifts, squats, individual leg press, plyometrics, and core work 3 times a week in three week cycles from now til the end of january.... (i'm 41).... i started doing a weight lifting program last year and it changed everything for me... especially because i am older and need to work harder to maintain and develop power. i swear by it.

[OldDog]

Thanks...great advice. Copied, pasted and printed for my home gym wall.
Keep the good advice coming :D

Spidi - I'm pushing 50. I have always been a gym rat, playing with power lifting in my teens and 20's, along with cycling - club riding and touring. Never raced as no races were ever near my neck of the woods until the mtn biking boom, then enjoyed sport class racing and Rolling Rock carbo loading afterwards. Fat came and went with the seasons but for most part I maintained decent fitness.

Never experienced muscle loss, until the last 5 years. I injured my foot, keeping me from any real cycling or running/hiking, until 2004 when I have been working my way back. From 2000 - 2003, I had noticable muscle loss, due to inactivity. Noticable loss in my arms and thighs, flabby belly and sagging boobs :eek: Getting back into tone is not so bad, but regaining the strength I lost in those years is much harder, I am not so sure I will ever be at that level again but I am trying like heck.

I read somewhere (Ed Burks weight training for cyclist?) that all cyclists over age 50 (?) should weight train year round. I believe any athlete should weight train and stretch year round, though go easy on the legs in cycling season.

PS - who says over 30 is old??????

YoungOldDog

[Too Tall]

Climbingone - Dewd! Want me to give away all my secrets???? bannana
Here is one:
Big Gear Spin ups
1. After very good sweaty warm up in a huge gear (53X12) from <5mph
2. Seated, slowly and progressively apply force to the pedals focus on core muscles and using your hips.
3. Goal is to reach 90+ rpms in as short a time as possible.
4. Record your time.

Voila

[The Spider]

Oh I understand that we're all just big kids riding around...doesn't matter what the age.

Just that males suffer from muscle loss and bone thinning once past 30; probably because unlike everyone here...it's been a decade since they last did anything and their 'teenage' fitness can carry them through their 20's but not the 30's. Ed Burke also links the muscle loss to high blood acidity caused by liver inefficiencies I believe (and subscribes alkaline foods to combat such).

Speaking of the knowledge aqcuired about current alterations/phases with age...just like mortality rates we base of knowledge on the current generation and monitoring them...well I wonder what's going to happen to the obesity ridden generation...without the teenage fitness as a base will the inactivity and extra weight take their tolls early?

[Too Tall]

Yep. Check the stats on early onset of type II diabetes. But don't blame the school cafeteria :rolleyes:

[TimB]

I think I've also read that falling testosterone levels after about age 30 plays a role in muscle loss. If you Google, you'll get thousands of hits on this topic. One article from the Mayo Clinic is here: http://www.mayoclinic.com/invoke.cfm?id=MC00030

As for diabetes - and specifically type II - it's rate even among children is skyrocketing, so there's no need to wait for them to reach adulthood to start to see the effects of poor diet, obesity and lack of exercise.

And to that, a ramble - and this is just me talking - when I take Sophia (age 2.75 years) to the mall or whatever, she typically walks/runs with me all over. It amazes me how few other children her age or older (up to about 6!) are allowed to do this as most are confined to strollers. Of course it's almost always easier to have the kid in the stroller, and I do it too if I'm really in a hurry, or we're INSIDE a store where she could either break something or injure herself - but for the most part she's running around. In my mind, the idea of activity and fitness can and should start even at her age. Not in any formal way really, but I think that having her see my wife and me ride our bikes, go to the gym, etc. will imprint on her the importance we place on this and she's more likely to be involved with it as she grows. (She already knows we do these things to 'Take care of our bodies.')

Okay, sorry to go off on such a tangent....

[Ray]

Actually two words combined into a compound word:

Kettlebells.

Killer workout for the whole body. Will jack your heart rate like you wouldn't believe. Great for your core. And sort of fun, unlike any other weight type work I've done.

I don't work with them enough, but the little bit I do pays huge dividends.

-Ray

[Too Tall]

That's hilarious Ray. I LOVE Pavel's musings. Never tried the Kettleball workout. Looks brutal...what the heck I'm not racing...it's winter...try new things. F.W.I.I.W. Pavel also penned some good books on things like stretching.

[Ray]

That's hilarious Ray. I LOVE Pavel's musings. Never tried the Kettleball workout. Looks brutal...what the heck I'm not racing...it's winter...try new things. F.W.I.I.W. Pavel also penned some good books on things like stretching.
Yeah, I think those old Russians were onto something. Pavel is a heavy duty marketer and the attitude he takes in the videos are almost enough to make you want to just walk away. But if you can get through the BS, he knows his stuff. Just a few sets of two or three excersizes a few times a week just tightens EVERYTHING up. And then, of course, you can take it as far as you want. Me? - not so far. But I know a few people who have become total maniacs about this stuff.

-Ray

[ti_boi]

Oh I understand that we're all just big kids riding around...doesn't matter what the age.

Just that males suffer from muscle loss and bone thinning once past 30; probably because unlike everyone here...it's been a decade since they last did anything and their 'teenage' fitness can carry them through their 20's but not the 30's. Ed Burke also links the muscle loss to high blood acidity caused by liver inefficiencies I believe (and subscribes alkaline foods to combat such).

Speaking of the knowledge aqcuired about current alterations/phases with age...just like mortality rates we base of knowledge on the current generation and monitoring them...well I wonder what's going to happen to the obesity ridden generation...without the teenage fitness as a base will the inactivity and extra weight take their tolls early?


I'm 39 with the legs of a 28 year-old....but your question is fascinating.
I went into teaching about 3 years ago after a career in the fun-filled world of technology (2 IPOs Later....) and noticed that kids are limited now as their parents often would rather them sit inside (where it is 'safe') and play video games rather than run or ride wild like we all did and possibly get abducted or hit by a car.....my legs thank me daily for a youth lived 'on the edge'....

[ashwinearl]

I'm working on a several part article on my BLOG about off season training which includes strength training.

I follow the plan of a coach named Dave Morris who used to be at the Olympic Training Center and recently finished his PhD in physiology. His book is called Performance Cycling. It describes more of a framework for training that needs to be really customized for an individual. But I have found a lot of the concepts to really work for me especially being married, with children, full time job, etc.

The strength training is particularly time efficient and lasts about 11 weeks. And the strength gains are amazing. But you have to continue following the program to make the most of it and transition those weight room strength gains into usable cycling strength/power

Anyway here are the articles. Parts 1-3, more to follow:

http://ashwinearl.blogspot.com/2005/10/off-season-training-pt1-intro.html
http://ashwinearl.blogspot.com/2005/10/off-season-training-pt2-macro-view.html
http://ashwinearl.blogspot.com/2005/10/off-season-training-pt3-strength.html
http://ashwinearl.blogspot.com/2005/10/how-to-do-intervals.html


*note, I am not a coach, or even that good a racer. And am just speaking from personal experience. But I've found that I am riding the best ever in my life, with almost half the amount of time I used to put in. And am able to maintain a balance in my life between racing and my family, job, coaching soccer, home improvement, vacuuming, putting the dishes away, cleaning the litter box, etc....

[beungood]

"Beungood....you want to do Jumpies don't you. I know you do... "

After yesterday ,I just want to lie down and whimper..... :butt:

[The Spider]

Those Kettlebells sound great!

Ashwinearl: nice blog, I'm thinking about continuing my weights as a permanent fixture. I'm really tall and heard that good strong joints are very important due to the length of limb deal.

TimB: great work mate, wasn't a rant, very helpful! great to hear people putting effort into raising great human beings!

Thanks everyone!

[William]

Don't forget getting enough rest to recoup. Most people tend to over train and never get enough sleep. Adhere to the training triangle:

1.) Training
2.) Proper nutrition
3.) Rest

People tend to focus on #1. Yes it is important, but if you aren't eating right and letting your body rest (=rebuild time), then you won't be getting the gains or peak results from your training.

In my opinion, and this is just my opinion, actual training only entails about 10 - 15% of the process. Sleep and good nutrition make up the other 85 - 90%.

Train hard and train smart. Eat well. Go to bed. :banana:

William

[Climb01742]

Yeah, I think those old Russians were onto something. Pavel is a heavy duty marketer and the attitude he takes in the videos are almost enough to make you want to just walk away. But if you can get through the BS, he knows his stuff. Just a few sets of two or three excersizes a few times a week just tightens EVERYTHING up. And then, of course, you can take it as far as you want. Me? - not so far. But I know a few people who have become total maniacs about this stuff.

-Ray

ray,

what weight kettlebell did you start out using? 35 pound? to me, feels a bit heavy to learn the moves. pavel's book on stretching has helped me a lot.

as an aside, my daughter is into figure skating. at her rink is a russian dude who was a very high level ballet dancer in russia and now helps skaters with the "dance" part of figure skating. he's been helping my daughter with developing strength in her feet and legs. his methods are all very low tech...and VERY effective. he said the biggest difference between russian and u.s. athletes is in russia, they don't have tons of $$$, so their solutions are ingenious and low tech. fascinating stuff.

[Ray]

ray,

what weight kettlebell did you start out using? 35 pound? to me, feels a bit heavy to learn the moves. pavel's book on stretching has helped me a lot.

as an aside, my daughter is into figure skating. at her rink is a russian dude who was a very high level ballet dancer in russia and now helps skaters with the "dance" part of figure skating. he's been helping my daughter with developing strength in her feet and legs. his methods are all very low tech...and VERY effective. he said the biggest difference between russian and u.s. athletes is in russia, they don't have tons of $$$, so their solutions are ingenious and low tech. fascinating stuff.

I have three of 'em, 26, 35,and 44 pounds. I started off doing most of the one armed maneuvers with the 26 and the two armed swings with the 35. By the end of each winter, I'm usually doing the one armed stuff with the 35 and the two armed swings with the 44. This isn't a lot of weight by traditional weightlifting standards, but get 'em moving around and it feels heavier than it is. Then again, I have NO upper body, so I'll probably never go to any of the heavier kettlebells.

-Ray

[surfbikeswim]

I'm working on a several part article on my BLOG about off season training which includes strength training.



Nice work on the blog -added it to my RSS feeds. Know anyone who has used the Ibike power meter or seen a review?

Ian

[davep]

Nice work on the blog -added it to my RSS feeds. Know anyone who has used the Ibike power meter or seen a review?

Ian

I contacted the Ibike company last week after seeing a piece from Interbike. The units are not shipping yet. They expect to have them out by Christmas.

[ashwinearl]

I contacted the Ibike company last week after seeing a piece from Interbike. The units are not shipping yet. They expect to have them out by Christmas.

I had asked them a few questions regarding reviews and how it would work off road. Here is their response:
Thanks for your inquiry. Independent testing by Cooper Institute of Dallas TX will be conducted later this month. We will post the results on our website as soon as they are available.


There are a number of unique features that make the iBike an interesting product for mountain bikes. First, the iBike's ability to measure hill gradients will help mountain bikers understand much more about the terrain they travel. These measurements are stored and downloaded to our software.


Second, using our coast down procedure it will be possible to determine how much of the power applied by the biker is soaked up by the terrain. Our iBike uses proprietary technology to determine terrain change characteristics and it compensates its power calculations accordingly.

[fiamme red]

Dumbbells and barbells are cheaper and better than kettlebells -- they allow you to increase weight in small increments, for one thing. Read "Kettlebells : An Antidote to the Hype (http://ejmas.com/pt/ptart_brennan_0103.htm)."

[Ray]

Dumbbells and barbells are cheaper and better than kettlebells -- they allow you to increase weight in small increments, for one thing. Read "Kettlebells : An Antidote to the Hype (http://ejmas.com/pt/ptart_brennan_0103.htm)."
Depends on what you want to do with them. For traditional dumbell lifts, there's no advantage to kettlebells or any reason for them. But a lot of the kettlebell excersizes involve a lot of swinging of the bell and the combination of the shape and the distance of the weight from the handle changes the dynamic considerably. I tried kettlebells a few times before I bought them and then tried to replicate some of the most basic moves with dumbells, hoping to avoid the expense. In some cases, you lost a lot of the benefit of the excersize because the bell didn't swing at the end of the handle - in others it was just plain impossible. So I strongly disagree with the author of the critique that ANY excersize you can do with a kettlebell can be done just as well with a dumbell - not evenclose.

He is right that kettlebells can be dangerous in the hands of a beginner who tries to do too much too soon. The first time I ever tried them, I learned to respect them VERY quickly. And yup, they're crazy expensive for what they are (big old metal bowling balls with a handle attached). And he's right that the marketing overhypes the living cr@p out of them, but what is that NOT true of? Regardless, I like the workout I get more than I ever like more standard weight lifting routines. So I use them more. Which makes them worth the money to me (a mere small drop in a huge bucket compared to what I/we spend on cycling gear). YMMV.

-Ray