Musings on imperfection

[Serpico]

So a bit of context here...

When I say "imperfection" I'm thinking of Grant Petersen's recollection of Richard Schwinn's conversation with an upset client. I'm thinking of e-Richie's "Imperfection is perfection" line of couture (:p). I'm thinking of a forum member who said that dirty tape is better than clean tape because it shows that you should be feared (I'm sure he was at least half kidding). The idea that human hands were involved in the creation of an individual piece of work, created for another individual--artisanry in the purest sense of the word.

The other context is my own. I'm finally nearing the end of a bike build that others, aside from fellow forumites, might consider a bit--well, obsessive. Having spec'ed everything on my rig, down to the very last part. Having spent hours upon hours on research. Having scoured the internet far and near, having driven six hours round trip to be fitted (even though there are two Serotta dealers in town). Etc, etc, etc--you guys know the routine.

Well I'm nearing the end, everything is perfect--everything... but, I just received a Brooks saddle in the mail (my first Brooks, btw :beer: ), that is not completely uniform in a purely aesthetic way (the "chamfering" on the edges of the B17 Special is different lengths).

And... although I realize it is somewhat absurd--okay totally absurd, this is the only part of the bike that isn't meticulously perfect and I'm having to embrace imperfection before my first ride.

Or is it that idea that I don't mind imperfection (scratches, etc)--as long as I put them there? ? ?

How do you embrace imperfection when perfection is so much of what we strive for? I don't even necessarily view this as a forum of Serotta fans, but rather a forum of people who appreciate the kind of craftsmanship that Serotta is known for--witness the amount of people here riding other handmade bikes made by other builders who are likewise committed to this same ethos of quality.

How do you embrace imperfection, and respect imperfection? What does it mean to you.

And please don't interpret this as a long whine about a small detail on a bike saddle--this is an issue I have been thinking about, and others have mentioned as well--I'd just like to hear some opinions.

thanks :)

[Jeff N.]

It ain't easy being a (bike) perfectionist, I'll say that much. It ain't CHEAP either! I've spent untold dollars buying certain things(bike stuff) that turned out to be less than perfect in one way or another, and wound up taking a bath selling them off for less than I paid, just to rid myself of them and replacing them with those that WERE perfect. Imperfection is something that...for me at least...needs to be corrected. Not embraced. I don't do well with, "Oh well, I guess I can live with it that way...." Sometimes I wish I could though. Sure would save some dough. And time! For example, I also agonize over other things, like when I install a new stem...it has to be absolutely, perfectly straight and in line with the front tire as I'm looking down. If its a fraction to the left or right I'll stop and make adjustments a dozen times or so until it's straight. Nuts or what? Jeff N.

[Needs Help]

If its a fraction to the left or right I'll stop and make adjustments a dozen times or so until it's straight. Nuts or what? Jeff N.
What's the best way to sight it in?

[Jeff N.]

I just keep trying to line it up until I'm satisfied its right on. Not easy sometimes! Trial and error. I know of no other way. Jeff N.

[Tmogul]

Hey nice to know others out there have the same sickness...... :p

If you are truly a perfectionist then you need to send that saddle back and ask for a perfect one. The problem with a bike that is perfect is that a single flaw will stick out like a sore thumb. I don't know if you saw that seinfeld episode where george bought elaine that white cashmere sweater that had one little red dot on it which was why it was priced so low. The only thing people could see was that spot on an otherwise perfect sweater. Now this all depends on the level of OCD that you have...(j/k)....but if you've spent that much time on it why settle for less now right before its maiden voyage.

A bike will never stay perfect. Its the nature of the beast....its a work horse that should deliver performance. However I do believe a perfectionist expects to at least start out with a perfect bike (in the eyes of the beholder) and any nicks, scratches, or marks that appear afterwards will be easier to deal with because you put it there and they simply add character and personality to the machine....in essence making it your very own. And when the battle scars start buildling up exponentially over the course of its life.....well at some point all good things must come to an end and a second generation of perfection will be born in the form of a new ride. :banana:

Such is the circle of life.

[David Kirk]

I fully realize that this doesn't answer the question but..........nothing is perfect. No object, no person, no idea.

I make things.....I am not perfect.....the things I make are not perfect. It's the striving for perfection that gets us up in the morning. It's the getting closer to perfection that is it's own reward.

The irony is that as we get closer to being able to make something perfectly our eye becomes all the better trained to spot the imperfection and the cycle continues.

If it appears to be perfect you are not looking close enough.

Dave

[Tmogul]

Jeff,

Me too on the stem thing. (someone suggeested a plumb bob) And to be even more personal...I've been adjusting my fixed shimano cleats since march of this year even taking a screw driver on my ride for easier adjustments as I tried to get it set perfectly (being fixed and all) and trying to get my lewedges angled and stacked right for my shorter leg. The bad thing is the body changes and adapts as well as the miles crank up. When you've found the sweet spot.....you get into a crash and smear the cleats on the ground and have to replace them......the set up process starts again. :crap:

Actually now I have a system to expedite things. (tape measurer)

[slowgoing]

There is a very fine line between being a perfectionist and being obsessive. I'm paid to be obsessive at work, but I let it all go when it's my own time. Life is too short and happiness is too elusive to obsess about the little things. Even with bikes.

Except beer. Beer must be perfect.

[Serpico]

Well, I just got home from work and looked at the saddle--it doesn't bug me at all (I was cranky this morning, only four hours of sleep)--so I guess perspective definitely plays a role. Hope I didn't sound too anal in the original post.

And I just remembered that this is the saddle for my singlespeed errand bike--not the Serotta--hehe, oops. So I guess it isn't much of an issue anyway.

But back to the idea of imperfection... looking at the saddle tonight, it's almost funny--like "Hehe, looks like the guy cut this end a bit short."--and I guess thats what Richard Schwinn was talking about... the character that comes with imperfection. No one else has a duplicate of this saddle--even if they have the same model/color/etc.

Anyways, hope this doesn't sound too corny.

[shinomaster]

Only God is perfect. That is why Islamic artists consciously add an imperfection to their work.

Ok..Ok. that's what they say...My pottery is perfect.

[Climb01742]

we need the goal of perfection, or of something better. maybe it's like zeno's postulate. keep getting half way closer each time. we need the striving, the goal, the hunger.

but for our sanity, happiness and the happiness of those around us, we gotta accept that we may not get there, or that at this moment, we won't get there. pursue and let go. for some length of time, be completely commited and involved in the pursuit of something better (and probably be miserable or at least frustrated) and then let go, release, and accept that the outcome is less than perfect. relax, recharge, be happy. then dive back into the chase.

now, if i could just follow my own advice... ;)

[manet]

... It's the striving for perfection that gets us up in the morning.

the perfect cup of coffee lasts just so long

[Lifelover]

Some of these "aspirations of perfection" make me thinkful I'm not a custom bike builder.

Trying to please a customer who seeks the unreachable sucks.

[dirtdigger88]

Some of these "aspirations of perfection" make me thinkful I'm not a custom bike builder.

Trying to please a customer who seeks the unreachable sucks.

Yeah - you could be getting 100 emails a week right now- Wheres my Terraplane. . . .Wheres my Terraplane. . . .Wheres my Terraplane . . . . Wheres my Terraplane. . .Wheres my Terraplane. . . Wheres my Terraplane


Well you get the idea

Put the saddle on and go abuse the bike

Jason

[Fixed]

bro i.m.h.o. the little things that are off give soul to your bike ,If I had a perfect bike It wouldn't be as soon as I climbed on . and good luck with the bike I bet your goin to love it cos you put your soul into it bro. cheers :beer:

[Kevan]

you know what my wife would do as a response to such questions.

[e-RICHIE]

from an atc npr interview w eva zeisel:


LUDDEN: The Museum of Modern Art exhibited Zeisel's collection in 1946. It launched her American career which continues to this day at age 98. In her Manhattan apartment, Zeisel pulls out an all-white china set she designed a few years ago for that same Russian factory she worked at in the '30s. It's luminescent, made of bone china. Only two sets a month are being produced. Each set sells for $4,500. It is stunning, but true to what she's been teaching for decades, Zeisel will not call anything she's done perfect.
Ms. ZEISEL: If you try to do something perfect, I think this is the last time you do anything. If you feel it, this is you have now reached perfection, there can't be anything beyond it.


http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4510966

[chrisroph]

Strive for perfection but realize that it is unattainable.

[ti_boi]

Perfection is ephemeral.

[700 x 23c]

Happiness and the desire for perfection cannot coexist.

It is a bicycle. Eventually the paint will scratch or chip at the very least. Until then, I imagine most of us treat it like a new car. Once it gets a little scratch, we loosen up and accept the invariable wear and tear that goes with riding.

That being said, if you don't like the saddle, get a new one. :)

[Tailwinds]

Ride your bike. :)

[Samster]

How do you embrace imperfection, and respect imperfection? What does it mean to you.

General comment: Everything you get trades off against something you can't get (as in the "having your cake..." cliche.) You can't have everything. You can only prioritize.

About your Brooks saddle: If human hands are involved in its making at just about any step, then it'll be hard to get machine-like assembly line precision. However, breaking in that saddle will most likely render it totally perfect for you (someday) and completely unusable for just about everyone else. Thus, your human bum will create perfection over the miles, and things like chamfering will be irrelevant.

--sam

[dirtdigger88]

reminds me of when I was rehabbing my house- as I would work on one thing - say the tile work- I would frret that a grout joint wasnt quite perfect- or when doing my moulding- maybe a mitered joint wasnt quite perfect-

When looking at that item by itself- the imperfection looked huge- but when the project was complete- the end result was perfect- not that there were no mistakes- but it was done- it looked nice - and i did it myself-

So it WAS perfect

go ride your bike

Jason

[shoe]

i do alot of designs that are symetrical which are drawn by hand and people frequently comment how it looks perfect. i just laugh and tell them how it isn't but atleast it looks that way...this one guy was being really neurotic about his design and one little thing was ever so slightly off. i told him that-that is how you know it was created by someones hand......i strive to do a good job but never to be perfect...as far as bike go---it is easy to obsess but then i think you just have to let it go.....ones entry into this world and ones departure and all in between ..now there is a perfect cycle...dave

[OldDog]

Perfection = Good Enough
Good Enough = Within Spec
Everything made, by hand or machine, has a tolorence. Even one off "artisan" pieces must meet a level of tolorence to please that artisan. Meet that tolorence and you have Perfection.

I would expect a Brooks saddle, though maybe handmade it is still a production item, to be evenly mounted on it's frame, pleasing to my eye. If not, it's a reject and should be returned. We all have a sense of what pleases us, we each need to determine our own level of perfection to aspire to, or settle for.

[Ahneida Ride]

Perfection is the enemy of done.

[ti_boi]

I like my Ti Swift, OK...but I just purchased an Aliante as an alternate seat. Brooks don't like rain all that much. Anyhow. Perfection is a mental game....if all of the synapes fire at once in a certain order then I guess we can say..."perfect!"

[tch]

that, like overfocus on any good goal, the obsession with perfection is bad karma. Not, as David Kirk and eRichie say, the drive of a dedicated artist towards it, but the focus on it to the exclusion of humanity. Hawthorne wrote a lot about this topic, if you want to consult a master.

On a much more material level, I agree with some here who say that a little imperfection reflects the human input. Only machines make things which look perfect.

And finally, on the most prosaic level, perfection depends upon the measure. Is it appearance, for instance, or utility? It's entirely possible to be perfect in appearance and rank low on utility -- or for something somewhat visually "imperfect" (your Brooks saddle) to look flawed but serve wonderfully.

[Climb01742]

ok, this may be too something but i suppose if one were enlightened, one might say that everything is perfect exactly as it is, because what else is there...but what something is. sorry. it's friday and i'm beat.

[bluesea]

Well I'm nearing the end, everything is perfect--everything... but, I just received a Brooks saddle in the mail (my first Brooks, btw :beer: ), that is not completely uniform in a purely aesthetic way (the "chamfering" on the edges of the B17 Special is different lengths).

And... although I realize it is somewhat absurd--okay totally absurd, this is the only part of the bike that isn't meticulously perfect and I'm having to embrace imperfection before my first ride.



Are you looking at an "imperfection" or sloppy workmanship, or perhaps you are looking at a level of workmanship consistent with its price point? Of course you have to take into consideration that the saddle is not exactly a high-ticket item handmade by an artisan whose name graces the said object, but is a product of artisans/workers/employees working within a more or less structured manufacturing environment.

[Jeff N.]

Only God is perfect. That is why Islamic artists consciously add an imperfection to their work.

Ok..Ok. that's what they say...My pottery is perfect.Comedian George Carlin once said, "Even God isn't perfect! It shows in his work: Everything he makes..............Dies." Jeff N.

[Serpico]

...

On a much more material level, I agree with some here who say that a little imperfection reflects the human input.

...

Yeah, I guess this is what I mean when I say that imperfections add character.

[Serpico]

...

I would expect a Brooks saddle, though maybe handmade it is still a production item, to be evenly mounted on it's frame, pleasing to my eye. If not, it's a reject and should be returned.

...

Nahh, the saddle is fine--it just got me thinking, re: "imperfection" and what we strive for.

[manet]

Comedian George Carlin once said, "Even God isn't perfect! It shows in his work: Everything he makes..............Dies." Jeff N.

so from this i may surmise that gods green thumb is from boogers

[dirtdigger88]

so from this i may surmise that gods green thumb is from boogers

no its from touching frogs in an inappropriate manner

http://www.sweet-sensations.biz/images/sak/Lily%20Frog%20005.jpg


Jason

[manet]

no its from touching frogs in an inappropriate manner

http://www.sweet-sensations.biz/images/sak/Lily%20Frog%20005.jpg


Jason

(just a little nature)

http://blog.iceline.org/media/porn.jpg

[jpw]

Think of a seemingly perfect pearl. Now think of the dirty bit of black grit.

Alternatively, think of a seemingly perfect bike. Now think of the rider.

[Too Tall]

Serpico - BEFORE I read what has been said thought I'd tell you what immed. comes to mind which is that imperfection in a handmade craft is a desirable element. We own a Navajo rug and typical of these beautiful works includes a "spirit path". This is an imperfection the weaver includes so that her spirit may leave and go on to create more. Persian carpets are similar. Artists include an imperfection into the carpet because only g-d is perfect.

Hold onto that saddle my bru-tah ;) It is a keeper.