Help me Decide - Dura Ace vs Super Record

[damocles]

So I know there's lots of good discussion all over this forum on the age old debate of Campy vs Shimano. That said, I'm hoping you all will indulge me in some banter and opinion on my specific situation. I've got a new project I'm putting together and am trying to decide on building it with Dura Ace 7900 vs Super Record.

Here's my background for some context:

I have 2 bikes, summer bike and a winter bike. Currently both have DA 7900.
I'm very happy with DA 7900 and own 3 wheelsets for use with it.
I've never owned Super Record or any Campy for that matter. Rode a bike with it a few months back and it seemed great, other than the obvious ergonomic differences which I totally wasn't used to.


The new build will be a Pegoretti, and will either end up being a 3rd bike, or will replace my summer bike. Questions that I'm asking myself in trying to decide between DA7900 and Super Record are:

Is is sacriledge to put Shimano on a handbuilt Italian frame???
I kinda like having all my bikes on the same kit and shifting feeling the same. How annoying will it be to have a mix of DA and SR? Will I just end up wanting to convert the rest?
If I do the Peg justice by putting Campy on it, do I really want to start buy different wheels or start monkeying around with changing freehubs?


I know these are definitely "first world problems", but any comments from those living with both Campy & Shimano, or those that have made a total switch from Shimano to Campy would be appreciated. Well, and I guess I shouldn't rule out some of you thinking I should just keep rolling on with DA...

Thanks!

[plugkev]

I have one Shimano, one Campy, and one Sram

#1: Yes

#2: I like that the bikes have different feels and get used to each after only a few miles.

#3. I think Campy is certainly worth the trouble for the Peg

Disclaimer: I like Campy the best for road and Sram for CX

[Black Dog]

Try something new. Life is too short to do the same thing over and over. You will like Campy.

[JLP]

Another Shimano bike makes sense to be consistent, but if you don't put Campy on the Pegoretti you won't be able to look yourself in the mirror.

[jr59]

Use the chours group instead!

[maxdog]

Before all the goofy brand chauvinism comes in, i will just say as owner of Record, DA and Red equipped bikes, that the differences in performance hardly justify the hassle of keeping so many wheels. I have the luxury of being able to do so, but if you don't, stay with DA. It's all good.

[christian]

It will be annoying. Might as well go all in straight away. Selling the summer bike, 7900 parts, and wheels should afford you another Campagnolo group easily!

[Tony T]

If it wasn't a Pegoretti, I would have said DA for consistency, however, with a Pegoretti, I would have to say Campy.

That said, if you do your own work (and it looks like you do), be prepared for additional costs for tools (the Campy chain tool alone is ~ $200, but there are a few cheaper alternatives: Pedro, Park).

Also, if you go SR, save the $ on the SR cassette, and get the Chorus cassette (only difference is weight, and the Chorus will last longer).

Tony

[rbtmcardle]

Use the chours group instead!


Agree with Chorus! best bang for the buck by a lot..

Try campy, but be careful, ultimately you'll end up with it on all your bikes.

[Rada]

If you do your own wrenching it could me new tools as well.

[slidey]

I've not used anything but DA/Ultegra, and I never will...not because I'm prejudiced against Campy, but because I've never had an issue with my setups. I'm sure as a DA user your experience is the same.

Also, consistency would be quite a big issue for me...I want to have the freedom to switch parts between my different bikes in case of an emergency, and not having to maintain a separate list of spare parts for each bike.

[damocles]

Try something new. Life is too short to do the same thing over and over.

Sage advice... And from a fellow Canadian nonetheless. :)

[damocles]

I can't actually disagree with any of the great valid points you guys have made so far. Unfortunately for the most part, they all contradict!

[Marcy]

I have some bikes with Shimano, some with Campy, and even a Rohloff -- no big problem getting used to the different systems. It's fun to experience various company's interpretations of how to shift a chain.

If I had to only own 1 group it would be Campy, 'cause it is so nice. Note I only have 10sp Record, haven't built up a 11sp Campy bike yet.

Also, as a former bike mechanic, I see the excuse to buy more tools as a good thing! :-)

[maxdog]

Sage advice... And from a fellow Canadian nonetheless. :)

If that's really your goal, and I doubt it is, try Sram. Much bigger difference than Campy vs Shimano.

[damocles]

If that's really your goal, and I doubt it is, try Sram. Much bigger difference than Campy vs Shimano.

I actually did have a Sram Red group a couple of years ago and totally hated the front shifting. "Downgraded" to a Force FD which was a bit better, but would never go back. DA is butter compared to Red based on my experiences.

[Black Dog]

If it wasn't a Pegoretti, I would have said DA for consistency, however, with a Pegoretti, I would have to say Campy.

That said, if you do your own work (and it looks like you do), be prepared for additional costs for tools (the Campy chain tool alone is ~ $200, but there are a few cheaper alternatives: Pedro, Park).

Also, if you go SR, save the $ on the SR cassette, and get the Chorus cassette (only difference is weight, and the Chorus will last longer).

Tony

Good advice but I would add it is better to get an 11 speed quick link instead of using the special chain tool. Much cheaper.

[mvrider]

But isn't 7900 obsolete?

;)


One more vote for Campy!

[Tony T]

Good advice but I would add is is better to get an 11 speed quick link instead of using the special chain tool. Much cheaper.

Good point. I went with the Campy Tool, but you could buy about 40 KMC links for the cost of the Campy tool :)

Also, to the OP: Have you thought about the DA and Campy electric groups?

[damocles]

Also, to the OP: Have you thought about the DA and Campy electric groups?

Yeah, I've ridden a buddies Di2 bike and have been drooling over it for some time. For some reason though, I feel like the Pegoretti needs a mechanical group still. Hence my short list being DA7900 (to match what I have/know) or Campy SR 11. I see an electric bike in my future at some point, just not sure it's on a Peg.

[bluesea]

I've not used anything but DA/Ultegra, and I never will...not because I'm prejudiced against Campy, but because I've never had an issue with my setups.


+1 That's me. The constant chase for the consumer high is in the end not very satisfying.

[Tony T]

For some reason though, I feel like the Pegoretti needs a mechanical group still. Hence my short list being DA7900 (to match what I have/know) or Campy SR 11.

Well, the good news is, you'll be very happy with either gruppo!

Enjoy

[slidey]

If you're after a slightly retro-feel, then I'd suggest putting DA7800 back on the table. And well...once DA 7800 is on any list of potential groupsets, the choice is but obvious :banana:

Yeah, I've ridden a buddies Di2 bike and have been drooling over it for some time. For some reason though, I feel like the Pegoretti needs a mechanical group still. Hence my short list being DA7900 (to match what I have/know) or Campy SR 11. I see an electric bike in my future at some point, just not sure it's on a Peg.

[Marcusaurelius]

I've tried shimano several times and I still use it on my touring and cyclocross bike but I've always found campagnolo works best for me on a road bike.

I found shifting with gloves is easier with campagnolo than shimano unless of course you are using bar end or downtube shifters.

The only weakness that I find in campagnolo is all the carbon bits. I prefer the polished alloy of the athena group.

[laupsi]

ah, too easy, SR of course

[beeatnik]

If you're considering SR, which means you can afford the best, get the best. End of story.

[Bob Ross]

I really have nothing to add that hasn't already been said, so I'm just contributing to the noise here... but fwiw, if I got a Pegoretti I would only outfit it with Campy. It just seems right.

...and fwiw, I don't even use Campy now!

[1centaur]

The "like butter" comment caught my eye, as a guy who owned a Campy bike and has done test rides on two other Campy bikes. IMO, Campy shifts fine, but the clunk is not "like butter" and you'll like one better than the other. I hate the clunk vs. "like butter." I rarely if ever read comments on these threads that say they really like both groups equally well, since the aesthetic difference is so extreme. I like the way Campy looks, I like the notion of Euro craftsmen, it's always great to like what cool kids and experienced veterans say they like, but ultimately you're a "like butter" guy, light action, Japanese engineering at its micromillimeter finest, or you're a Campy guy, it's rebuildable, you love the aural feedback; the other one is fine but not ideal.

And yes, Campy fans, the Campy was installed by top shops with plenty of Campy experience, and I rode the one I owned long enough to break it in.

So you end up with bikes you'll pick on the day based on the group, not on the frame, plus you'll have the wheel thing, which is annoying.

No, a Peg does not need Campy.

[merlincustom1]

To the OP, what is the paint scheme?

[Gummee]

I'm a wheel whore. I've got several extra pairs for this, that, and the other. Changing one bike out wouldn't do me any favors. The exception would be once I got everything up to 11sp. I hear that 11sp cassettes are 'mostly interchangeable.'

I really wanted to go C-Record on my PDM Concorde 'back when.' Saw the prices and ended up with a mish-mash of Shimano stuff on that bike, the next 10 bikes, and now I'm mostly SRAM.

Also 'back when' you couldn't find Campy in just any old LBS. Remember this was pre-innerwebs so if you wanted a Campy anything, you had to order one then wait till it showed up.

So, one vote for 'Campy is probably better, but if you've got lots of Shimano/SRAM compatible stuff laying around, stick with it.'

M

[damocles]

I really have nothing to add that hasn't already been said, so I'm just contributing to the noise here... but fwiw, if I got a Pegoretti I would only outfit it with Campy. It just seems right.

...and fwiw, I don't even use Campy now!

No, you're contributing on that topic too Bob! I think that's kinda one of the main issues. Thanks!

[damocles]

That's a different perspective to consider. Appreciate the take on that.

The "like butter" comment caught my eye, as a guy who owned a Campy bike and has done test rides on two other Campy bikes. IMO, Campy shifts fine, but the clunk is not "like butter" and you'll like one better than the other. I hate the clunk vs. "like butter." I rarely if ever read comments on these threads that say they really like both groups equally well, since the aesthetic difference is so extreme. I like the way Campy looks, I like the notion of Euro craftsmen, it's always great to like what cool kids and experienced veterans say they like, but ultimately you're a "like butter" guy, light action, Japanese engineering at its micromillimeter finest, or you're a Campy guy, it's rebuildable, you love the aural feedback; the other one is fine but not ideal.

And yes, Campy fans, the Campy was installed by top shops with plenty of Campy experience, and I rode the one I owned long enough to break it in.

So you end up with bikes you'll pick on the day based on the group, not on the frame, plus you'll have the wheel thing, which is annoying.

No, a Peg does not need Campy.

[damocles]

It's a Love #3 in Manovella

To the OP, what is the paint scheme?

[67-59]

If you're considering SR, which means you can afford the best, get the best. End of story.

This.

[pdmtong]

pegs must be campy. period.

dario would also insist on a setback post (not straight, ever) and a fork with slight curve. he dies not like the edge/enve aesthetic although he was 'stuck" bundling them for awhile after the demise of reynolds and prior to the availability of trigon and now falz

[merlincustom1]

It's a Love #3 in Manovella

In that case, Chorus 11. That horrid red crap in Record will clash with the frame. At this level, it's all aesthetics, baby.

[christian]

ultimately you're a "like butter" guy, light action, Japanese engineering at its micromillimeter finest, or you're a Campy guy, it's rebuildable, you love the aural feedback; the other one is fine but not ideal.
I think this is pretty spot-on. Shimano works just fine, but there's nothing like the tactile and aural feedback of snapping down a couple of gears as you crest a hill with Campagnolo. Kachunk, kachunk, kachunk, accelerate!

[Fishbike]

A Peg in Manovello requires a black Campy group.

[FlashUNC]

Whatever you want. If you're happy with Shimano, get it. Forget all these arbitrary and nonsensical "rules" that some bikes "must" have X or Y.

The parts compatibility across my other bikes alone would make me pick Dura Ace.

[thwart]

I think this is pretty spot-on. Shimano works just fine, but there's nothing like the tactile and aural feedback of snapping down a couple of gears as you crest a hill with Campagnolo. Kachunk, kachunk, kachunk, accelerate!Or, even better, one silky kachunk for a 3 cog upshift and...

... gone.

[christian]

Or, even better, one silky kachunk for a 3 cog downshift and...

... gone.Yes, of course. That's the way all mine (Record/Chorus/Centaur 10) work. Actually, I find the way I use it is "three-sweep, one-click, and Go!"

God, I freakin' love Campagnolo.

[Matthew]

Shimano fan myself. It just works. Plus you have it on all of your bikes now. I agree with a few others that Italian bikes should only have Campy groups is silly. Use what you like or want. Your frame won't know the difference!! Matthew.

[akelman]

Or, even better, one silky kachunk for a 3 cog upshift and...

... gone.

Now I really wish I could ride. Getting old blows.

[tsarpepe]

Yep, the idea of being obliged do deck an Italian frame in Campy is the romanticized American idea of some perfect Italian marriage. In my experience, the Italians themselves are much more pragmatic. In fact, I had a chance to purchase a used Peg last year in Milano. It was full Dura Ace.

[choke]

Is is sacriledge to put Shimano on a handbuilt Italian frame???No.


It's actually blasphemy.
:D

[jr59]

Nothing like a good Campy vs Shimano thread to break us away from the all-lance blues!

:banana::banana:

[jbl]

Is is sacriledge to put Shimano on a handbuilt Italian frame???
I kinda like having all my bikes on the same kit and shifting feeling the same. How annoying will it be to have a mix of DA and SR? Will I just end up wanting to convert the rest?
If I do the Peg justice by putting Campy on it, do I really want to start buy different wheels or start monkeying around with changing freehubs?




No. See Rabobank.
Might be annoying. Might be a non-issue. You might want to switch. Try it because you want to try something new, not because you think it'll be better. Campy and Shimano both make great stuff, especially at the DA and SR levels.
Use a Jtek Shiftmate?

[oldpotatoe]

If that's really your goal, and I doubt it is, try Sram. Much bigger difference than Campy vs Shimano.

My employee, who is very, very good, just installed a new red group on a Blue..heard to say, "I wish sram would just close their doors'(not in a good way)..as he heard the thing run..noisey, cluncky, brakes were powerful but way too complicated....at least it was expensive,

IMHO-

Just get Campagnolo, SR, Record or Chorus or mix and match..SR crank, Record cups, SR levers, Chorus FD and RD, cogset and chain...SR brakes, or whatever.

[harryblack]

A late vote for Campy... I 7700 Dura Ace for years and it was bomb-proof, excellent, with possible quibble of the DA bottom bracket...

I sold those two bikes (Pegoretti Fina Estampa, Caad 5), got a new one (Caad 10) with Campy Athena (+ Hollowgram crank, thus obviating need/decision for Campy carbon)... If I had $$$, I'd maybe get another bike with Chorus but for now make do riding the gf's cross-bike with Veloce.

If you like how Super Record looks, go for it and don't look back.

[zandrrr]

Is is sacriledge to put Shimano on a handbuilt Italian frame???
I kinda like having all my bikes on the same kit and shifting feeling the same. How annoying will it be to have a mix of DA and SR? Will I just end up wanting to convert the rest?
If I do the Peg justice by putting Campy on it, do I really want to start buy different wheels or start monkeying around with changing freehubs?


1. No matter what anyone says, you will not go to hell for putting the "wrong" brand of components on a certain brand of frame. IMO Shimano components on a classic steel frame look better than Campy components on a modern carbon frame, and my opinion is as worthless as everyone else's.
2. If you like DA, go with DA.
3. For me, hub compatibility woes preclude ever going with Campy but maybe that doesn't matter to you. If you only ever ride one bike with one set of wheels then it's not a big deal. If you want to swap wheels around it's a legitimate concern. If you want to try something different and have wheel cross-compatibility, SRAM might be worth a shot.

Use whatever you like and whatever you are most comfortable with. Life is too short to worry about getting cool points from this dumb forum because you use Campy. SR is great, DA is great, Red is great. Record is great, Ultegra is great, Force is great. Chorus is great, 105 is great, Rival is great. Etc etc etc. They all move a chain between sprockets and chainrings and squeeze brake calipers on a rim.

[TopQuark]

If you started with Shimano, I would say keep it that way - or an SRAM or Campy.

I started from scratch and I was faced with the same hard decision. In the end I ended up with that one with a more pronounced "click" when shifting derailleur.

[soulspinner]

Why not put the new 9000 Dura Ace on it. All early reports are its a big improvement. Then upgrading to electronic will be less expensive down the road as you have some of the 9000 series components. This from a Campy guy but you are used to Shimano and all your wheels will work without having to buy compatible ones. If this has already been suggested, forgive me, didnt read evey post.

All that said I have Record 8 speed, Chorus 10 speed and Chorus 11 and love the way it lasts and works when properly set up........

[damocles]

Why not put the new 9000 Dura Ace on it. All early reports are its a big improvement. Then upgrading to electronic will be less expensive down the road as you have some of the 9000 series components. This from a Campy guy but you are used to Shimano and all your wheels will work without having to buy compatible ones. If this has already been suggested, forgive me, didnt read evey post.


Yeah, DA9000 sure does look interesting... My understanding however is that with the jump from 10 speed to 11, the hubs are not compatible, so mixing 7900 with 9000 creates a similar challenge as going to Campy, at least as far at the wheelset compatibility issue goes.

[Steelman]

If I had the money, it would be Super Record, especially on an Italian bike.

It is just cooler. Well, at least I am honest.

[jimcav]

Yeah, I've ridden a buddies Di2 bike and have been drooling over it for some time. For some reason though, I feel like the Pegoretti needs a mechanical group still. Hence my short list being DA7900 (to match what I have/know) or Campy SR 11. I see an electric bike in my future at some point, just not sure it's on a Peg.

But I think all the it's a Peg it needs campy is total BS. If you just like campy or there is some aesthetic you are going for, and campy meets it, fine. I put the green sram red (I got from a guy who pulled it off a new cdale EVO) on my catch the spider peg because it matched the paint very well, and was cheaper than DA or Record/chorus. I rode campy record almost exclusively (2 bikes were chorus) for several years, and on SEVERAL bikes. I liked the hoods and i liked being able to dump gears cresting a hill. I now have 2 sram Red and a Di2. If I could mix/match I'd go with campy hood shape. I agree sram is tougher to set up on the FD, but my SV with Red is very crisp--the only thing I have used better is Di2. My Peg, I did not spend as much time on the FD set-up and it is not as perfect, but it works fine.
I just ordered the new Red group aero/exo/yaw stuff. I like the sram shifting so hope the new hoods are a little better shape for me.
It was a pain selling all my campy wheels (at one time i had 13-14 wheels). I now have 5 shim/sram wheels, 3 being high end carbon, and have no interest in a flat or anything else keeping me off a particular bike--having everything interchangeable is nice.
All that said, if you plan to go to 2 bikes, and one is campy, then it is not as big a deal to convert the other to campy if you like it more

jim

[harryblack]

Agreed... when I bought my Pegoretti Fina Estampa in 2003 it came stock with a MIZUNO fork... so so much for 'purism'!

and since I had another DA 7700 bike at the time, switching to Campy wasn't a consideration. Lotsa people admired the Peg, nobody (that I know of) gave me guff for DA.

But I think all the it's a Peg it needs campy is total BS. If you just like campy or there is some aesthetic you are going for, and campy meets it, fine. I put the green sram red (I got from a guy who pulled it off a new cdale EVO) on my catch the spider peg because it matched the paint very well, and was cheaper than DA or Record/chorus. I rode campy record almost exclusively (2 bikes were chorus) for several years, and on SEVERAL bikes. I liked the hoods and i liked being able to dump gears cresting a hill. I now have 2 sram Red and a Di2. If I could mix/match I'd go with campy hood shape. I agree sram is tougher to set up on the FD, but my SV with Red is very crisp--the only thing I have used better is Di2. My Peg, I did not spend as much time on the FD set-up and it is not as perfect, but it works fine.
I just ordered the new Red group aero/exo/yaw stuff. I like the sram shifting so hope the new hoods are a little better shape for me.
It was a pain selling all my campy wheels (at one time i had 13-14 wheels). I now have 5 shim/sram wheels, 3 being high end carbon, and have no interest in a flat or anything else keeping me off a particular bike--having everything interchangeable is nice.
All that said, if you plan to go to 2 bikes, and one is campy, then it is not as big a deal to convert the other to campy if you like it more

jim

[thwart]

Lotsa people admired the Peg, nobody (that I know of) gave me guff for DA.It's what people are thinking that really matters:

C'mon, dude... Italian super bike... and then hang that stuff on it...

;) :D

[Tony T]

Well, whatever he chooses, good luck with the build.
...and he won't go wrong with either choice (as long as he stays away from Sram ;))

[Grant McLean]

Are Pegs still Italian thread BBs?

One of my favourite things about shimano is that there is a compatible
Chris King bottom bracket, but they only do only english threading and some
PF30 options, no italian threads.

-g

[damocles]

Well, whatever he chooses, good luck with the build.
...and he won't go wrong with either choice (as long as he stays away from Sram ;))

Thanks Tony! Lots of good opinions here and some good entertainment too... I think I'm leaning towards putting some Campy on it, mostly because I've never owned a Campy bike. We'll see. I'll figure it out this week.

[jds108]

If you decide to go campy, look seriously at chorus rather than record or SR. The differences are trivial and are pretty much just weight. Use the saved cash for a fancier set of wheels or a second set...

[xeladragon]

Is is sacriledge to put Shimano on a handbuilt Italian frame???
I kinda like having all my bikes on the same kit and shifting feeling the same. How annoying will it be to have a mix of DA and SR? Will I just end up wanting to convert the rest?
If I do the Peg justice by putting Campy on it, do I really want to start buy different wheels or start monkeying around with changing freehubs?



Sacrilege? I wouldn't go that far. But aesthetically, Campy looks best on a Pegoretti IMO. I had a Goze Respo for about a year with SRAM Red on it (because that's what I had on the Indy Fab that it replaced)... looked fine. Sold it to wooly who's a Campy guy... looks waaaaay better now. Pics are in the gallery.
Can't help you too much here. Both my geared bikes are SRAM.
If you can afford a Pegoretti, then you can afford another wheelset. :) If your current wheelset(s) have DT Swiss hubs, then it's pretty easy and affordable to swap freehubs. You can pick one up in the classifieds for ~$50, shouldn't take more than a few minutes to swap, no special tools required if I remember correctly, no re-dishing required, etc.


Love the Manovella BTW. If I were in your shoes, having never ridden DA 7900 or any Campy, I'd go with the latter. Or I'd go DA 9000. G'luck!

[Tony T]

Here's a good comparison chart from Campy's Revolution 11: (http://www.r11.campagnolo.com/en/index/index.jsp)
COMPARE 11S GROUPS (http://www.r11.campagnolo.com/en/confronta/item_compare-11s-groups.jsp)

[soulspinner]

Yeah, DA9000 sure does look interesting... My understanding however is that with the jump from 10 speed to 11, the hubs are not compatible, so mixing 7900 with 9000 creates a similar challenge as going to Campy, at least as far at the wheelset compatibility issue goes.

Aww heck, didnt realize Shimano 10 wheels not compatible, stick SR on that thing..:rolleyes:

[rickbb]

I had the same issue with my Peg Palasanto, purchased from the Forum. 7800/Ultegra were my standard (and on all my wheelsets) but I couldn't stand the look of the science-over-art DA cranks on the frame. I installed an alloy Chorus crank and it satisfied the aesthetic issue for me.
Don't know if there are crankset compatibility concerns with 7900/Campy, though.

[oldpotatoe]

I had the same issue with my Peg Palasanto, purchased from the Forum. 7800/Ultegra were my standard (and on all my wheelsets) but I couldn't stand the look of the science-over-art DA cranks on the frame. I installed an alloy Chorus crank and it satisfied the aesthetic issue for me.
Don't know if there are crankset compatibility concerns with 7900/Campy, though.

Well, well adjusted front ders with Campagnolo cranks, 11s shift better than 10s spaced cranks. A well adjusted FD with 11s...three clicks and the chain leaps onto the big ring.

[mirko]

I rode dura ace for a decade and found it to be great. But a few years back, when given the opportunity to build up a Pegoretti, I chose Campagnolo.

Admittedly, heritage was part of the decision but a key influence was local bike shop owner and expert mechanic who said, "I've known a lot of people who have gone from Shimano to Campy, never to return. But I can't think of many who have gone from Campy to Shimano and loved it as much."

[mirko]

jds108 says, and I second: "If you decide to go campy, look seriously at chorus rather than record or SR. The differences are trivial and are pretty much just weight. Use the saved cash for a fancier set of wheels or a second set..."

[mirko]

If you decide to go campy, look seriously at chorus rather than record or SR. The differences are trivial and are pretty much just weight. Use the saved cash for a fancier set of wheels or a second set...

Agreed.

[soulspinner]

Well, well adjusted front ders with Campagnolo cranks, 11s shift better than 10s spaced cranks. A well adjusted FD with 11s...three clicks and the chain leaps onto the big ring.

+1
The front shifting on my chorus 10 is nowhere near the 11 speed (chorus) shifting. That and the brakes are more powerful. With front and rear shifting this good, Im really thinking Im not spending DI2 money when the difference could go into another wheelset.....