Sew-up/ tubular tires vs.tubeless w/ Stan's tires

[Erik_A]

Just finished watching "Jeremy Powers Cross Camp" DVD with my daughter before we both race the Tacchino Ciclocross race in Maryland tomorrow morning. http://www.jeremypowerscrosscamp.com

It was a really good short primer; mainly for beginners (like us). He made a very good case for using sew-up/ tubular tires over clinchers. He didn't mention tubeless, like Stan's.

I was thinking of going with Velocity A23 rims with a Stan's tubeless tire setup. For a big guy (6'-4" - 220 lbs) will I be able to run Stan's tubeless at the same lower pressures as tubeless?

If not and sew-up/ tublular rims are better; where would I start looking for a decent priced, strong/ reliable, CX tubular rim (that would hold up to my weight)?

[mike p]

Your much better off with tubulars. Tubeless tires have a tendency to burp air when cornered hard with a heavy rider and lower pressure tires.

Mike

[martinrjensen]

what was the case he made for sewups?Just finished watching "Jeremy Powers Cross Camp" DVD with my daughter before we both race the Tacchino Ciclocross race in Maryland tomorrow morning. http://www.jeremypowerscrosscamp.com

It was a really good short primer; mainly for beginners (like us). He made a very good case for using sew-up/ tubular tires over clinchers. He didn't mention tubeless, like Stan's.

I was thinking of going with Velocity A23 rims with a Stan's tubeless tire setup. For a big guy (6'-4" - 220 lbs) will I be able to run Stan's tubeless at the same lower pressures as tubeless?

If not and sew-up/ tublular rims are better; where would I start looking for a decent priced, strong/ reliable, CX tubular rim (that would hold up to my weight)?

[JeffS]

I suspect the risk of burping a tire is higher than flatting a tube.

Tubes or tubular is my vote.

[fogrider]

the reason for low pressure with cross is traction...with clinchers, pitch flats. with tubeless there are very few to select from, they depend on the pressure to keep the seal and then there's the weight. for tubulars, there are many to choose from with no problems with low pressure...just make sure they are glued on well.

[oldpotatoe]

Just finished watching "Jeremy Powers Cross Camp" DVD with my daughter before we both race the Tacchino Ciclocross race in Maryland tomorrow morning. http://www.jeremypowerscrosscamp.com

It was a really good short primer; mainly for beginners (like us). He made a very good case for using sew-up/ tubular tires over clinchers. He didn't mention tubeless, like Stan's.

I was thinking of going with Velocity A23 rims with a Stan's tubeless tire setup. For a big guy (6'-4" - 220 lbs) will I be able to run Stan's tubeless at the same lower pressures as tubeless?

If not and sew-up/ tublular rims are better; where would I start looking for a decent priced, strong/ reliable, CX tubular rim (that would hold up to my weight)?

Depends on the course. heavier riders, lower pressure and tubeless may = burping, or rolled off the rim in corners=loss of all the air.

Major Toms, normal hubset, 36h/3 cross, double butted spokes, would be Ok for you and cross...see a decent local wheelbuilder or email me.

Tubulars in most applications, including cross and road, are generally 'better' in most if not all aspects AND the gluing on thing is really no big deal.

[ljklassen]

Depends on the course. heavier riders, lower pressure and tubeless may = burping, or rolled off the rim in corners=loss of all the air.

Tubulars in most applications, including cross and road, are generally 'better' in most if not all aspects AND the gluing on thing is really no big deal.

Agree that tubulars are probably the best way to go for cx if it is an option, but not sure why you would say the same for road, given it is more difficult to deal with a flat and the advantage for cx being able to run lower pressures for traction don't apply. I run tubular for cx, clincher for road.

Haven't tried tubeless for either (swear by it for mtb), from what I've read tubeless for road is great but for cx it risks roll-off or burping with low pressures. I'd be interested to hear from others with experience on tubeless for cx.

[djg]

Erik, how did you like our race man?

I thought it was a great day, although a long one for me and a bunch of other folks (including a couple -- not me -- who were working solid the last few days). Cool to see JP race (and to get a stupid middle-aged man fan pic with him).

People have all sorts of tire combinations that they like, but if you are starting out, and have only one dedicated cross wheelset, you might find something like a Challenge Grifo tubular to be a great all-around tire for courses throughout the season -- not cheap, but it doesn't break the bank, and it should hold up pretty well (especially if you dose it with cafe latex). Yes you can take these on pavement just fine, but no you should not do lots of miles on the pavement on these all season long because of tread wear. Ideally you'll have some other wheels/tires to ride during the week.

Old tater made what seemed to me to be a perfectly good and reasonably priced suggestion. I'd think that a well built 32 spoke wheel would be just fine, but really, 36 -- as he suggests -- won't add that much weight and might give you a more stable wheel. And I'm not a wheel builder and he is. Also, there are used wheels popping up on the mabra list serve nearly every day (and not a few on this board too) -- you should be able to find a decent set of cross wheels at a pretty good price if you want to look over some used options. Some of the factory wheels are really pretty sturdy, and once you walk away from MSRP and look at used prices they might offer some good values.

[oldpotatoe]

Agree that tubulars are probably the best way to go for cx if it is an option, but not sure why you would say the same for road, given it is more difficult to deal with a flat and the advantage for cx being able to run lower pressures for traction don't apply. I run tubular for cx, clincher for road.

Haven't tried tubeless for either (swear by it for mtb), from what I've read tubeless for road is great but for cx it risks roll-off or burping with low pressures. I'd be interested to hear from others with experience on tubeless for cx.

Road tubies, ride great, are safer, more comfy, corner better(all IMHO, of course). Flat less often, particularly if you put Stan's in the tubie's tube...Get a flat? Take old tubie off, put preglued tubie on..really no big deal. Certainly less mess than putting a tube into a tubeless with goop in it.

BUT IMHO. I like tublulars for the road, don't think it's any big deal to glue them, like their advantages AND...I'm out, not going to participate in a tubular vs clincher discussion, not cold enough outside for that.

[FlashUNC]

I'd go with tubulars just for the variation in tire choice alone.

Thought about trying tubeless road wheels, and was a surprised at how few tires are out there for it these days. Choices are basically Hutchinson, Hutchinson, or Hutchinson.

[redir]

Tachino? I thought that one was around Thanksgiving day. Dang cross season starts earlier and earlier these days. Speaking of which I still need to mount my A wheels.

I friend of mine who is very light burped a tubless tire in a race last year, he's gone back to tubular. I don't understand why they work so well on mountain bikes but not cross bikes.

But a tubeless tire is still a clincher so they wont give you that nice squishy feel that tubulars have.

[Charles M]

Depends on the course. heavier riders, lower pressure and tubeless may = burping, or rolled off the rim in corners=loss of all the air.

Major Toms, normal hubset, 36h/3 cross, double butted spokes, would be Ok for you and cross...see a decent local wheelbuilder or email me.

Tubulars in most applications, including cross and road, are generally 'better' in most if not all aspects AND the gluing on thing is really no big deal.

+1...


Tubeless is a half measure for cross.


Tubeless casings are stiffer in general and it means that you have to run even lower pressures than tubulars to get close to the ride benefit.

At those lower pressures tubeless can burp, the bead can come off (rare unless youre running really silly low pressure) and are still more prone to pinch flat or impact rim damage than any similar tubular counterpart.

And they'll weigh more which can be important in the constant go/stop/go/stop of cross...