Campy expertise needed!

[OperaLover]

Recently moved over to Record 11 from Record 10. I am riding the Whistler Gran Fondo next weekend and last night I tried to install the Record 11 cassette on my climbing wheels, a set of 1998 Electron tubulars. These are from the short lived 9-speed period and the lock ring is an odd size; 1mm smaller than the 10-speed (as I recall). The cassette stacked on just fine, but I could not use the new 11-speed lock ring. Okay I thought just use the old one. Well I could not tighten it without having the entire freehub lock down so it would not spin. Installed it twice. It's like the cassette is pressed down against the hub body. It seemed like the lockring turned several more times that it would normally and I did not get that feeling of engagement when that one normally feels when the lock ring tightens down; it just seemed to keep turning. No issues with the 10-speed cassette on the Electron.

Is it the lock ring? Are the carriers on the 11 speed large cogs different so that they are rubbing against the hub shell? I think its the lock ring, but I don't know why.

Other wheels are Neutrons and the 11 speed cassette fits fine. As far as I can tell, the hub shells are the same width, although the lip or rim where the spokes are retained on the drive side is thicker on the Electron, but should that make a difference if the 10 speed cassette fit fine? I'm stumped

Is there a fix?

Thank you! I appreciate the wisdom of the collective.

[buldogge]

You may need to put a .8mm spacer behind the cassette, or between the free hub and the inner bearing/hub.

-Mark in St. Louis

[Mark McM]

The bottom (largest) sprocket in Campagnolo 9spd cassettes sit flush with the bottom of the freehub splines, but the bottom sprockets of 10spd and 11spd cassettes overhang the bottom of the splines, closer to the hub flange (i.e. 10spd and 11spd cassettes are offset to the left). On some 9spd hubs, the flange already had little clearance with the cassette for 9spd cassettes, and 10spd or 11 speed cassettes will rub against the hub. 11spd cassettes have slightly more overhang than 10spd cassettes, so flange/cassette interference may be more likely with 11spd cassettes.

Depending on the freehub and lockring (and also on the frame drop-out design), you may be able to fit a spacer below the cassette (i.e. put the spacer on before the cassette), which may move the cassette away from the flange. 1mm spacers are made which will fit on the freehub body. Howevever, this may introduce clearance issues on the other side of the cassette - you may have to try it to find out.

[thwart]

I have the very same wheelset (love that 22 mm wide rim!).

I run 9 and 10 spd cassettes on this wheel.

Had some free time this AM ;), so tried to mount a 12-25 11 spd cassette on it. I could tighten down the 9-spd lockring (the one for 12-13 cogs, not the 11) specific to this era of wheels and have the splines (just barely) engage the 12 cog, but the lockring probably would have rubbed on the dropout when mounted, and perhaps also not allowed enough depth on the 12 cog for the chain to engage the teeth correctly. See pics.

It did spin freely however...

However, no 11 spd bikes currently in the stable... therefore no test ride to be sure about the above. :rolleyes:

[OperaLover]

I did not event think about the clearance for the dropout. Funny that your cassette spun freely when mine did not. What level casette? I'm thinking that the carrier on the record might be a lighter material and therfore more lateral deflection into thehub(?). My 11-speed cassette is a 12-25 so the the 9-speed Electron specific lock ring should work in theory.

I will try again this weekend. It was pretty late last night when I did this, so maybe there is something I missed.

[thwart]

It's a Chorus 12-25 cassette (I think so anyway, 2 sets of 3 cogs on carriers, the rest loose, all steel)... I'm wondering whether these hubs are just not going to work out for 11 speed.

Well, as you know, the Neutrons are fine wheels as well. And there's only a 100-150 gm weight difference.

[OperaLover]

It's a Chorus 12-25 cassette (I think so anyway, 2 sets of 3 cogs on carriers, the rest loose, all steel)... I'm wondering whether these hubs are just not going to work out for 11 speed.

Well, as you know, the Neutrons are fine wheels as well. And there's only a 100-150 gm weight difference.

I think you might be right and these wheels will not work for 11-speed. I will be bummed if I can't use these wheels anymore. They climb so well and roll beautifully with a fine tubular tire.

The Neutorns are great, but these Electons are pretty special in my book!

[thwart]

these Electons are pretty special in my book!

Yep. You're preaching to the choir here... :)

If you decide to stick with 11 spd exclusively, they do tend to bring decent $$$ on eBay (or here, for that matter).

[oldpotatoe]

Recently moved over to Record 11 from Record 10. I am riding the Whistler Gran Fondo next weekend and last night I tried to install the Record 11 cassette on my climbing wheels, a set of 1998 Electron tubulars. These are from the short lived 9-speed period and the lock ring is an odd size; 1mm smaller than the 10-speed (as I recall). The cassette stacked on just fine, but I could not use the new 11-speed lock ring. Okay I thought just use the old one. Well I could not tighten it without having the entire freehub lock down so it would not spin. Installed it twice. It's like the cassette is pressed down against the hub body. It seemed like the lockring turned several more times that it would normally and I did not get that feeling of engagement when that one normally feels when the lock ring tightens down; it just seemed to keep turning. No issues with the 10-speed cassette on the Electron.

Is it the lock ring? Are the carriers on the 11 speed large cogs different so that they are rubbing against the hub shell? I think its the lock ring, but I don't know why.

Other wheels are Neutrons and the 11 speed cassette fits fine. As far as I can tell, the hub shells are the same width, although the lip or rim where the spokes are retained on the drive side is thicker on the Electron, but should that make a difference if the 10 speed cassette fit fine? I'm stumped

Is there a fix?

Thank you! I appreciate the wisdom of the collective.

Some of the early HPW type hubs, from 1997/8, are not 11s compatible, and I think yours is an example. Problem was then inset the FH body way into the hub shell...

[OperaLover]

Yep, no 11-speed for the Electrons! Fortunately I am still running 8-speed on my Colnago Tecnos. The 8-speed cassette slides on and locks no problem. The vintage rr. FIR rim on the bike died last Friday when the rim cracked around an eyelet. It was a long ride home with the wheel rubbing!

Switched the wheels back in business. Colnago loves the tubies!