Imagine a cycling inspired retreat (house)

[MattTuck]

As some of you may know, I live and work in a very nice area for riding. Rural New Hampshire and Vermont. The area has a pretty big variety of riding on lightly trafficked roads.

I am not sure that I'll be in this area all my life, as the job opportunities for MBA types are not that plentiful. However, it is an area that I love and could see myself coming to on weekends if I were living/working in Boston.

I've been thinking lately about buying something that works for me now with the intention of using it as a weekend house in the future, should I leave the area. I'd also like it to be a 'destination' where I could invite friends to visit and use as a base for riding.

What features would you consider important for a cycling 'retreat'? I was thinking of trying to do everything in one structure, but a better solution MIGHT be a house with a few extra bedrooms, and then building or renovating a barn to include space for bike storage and maintenance, as well as possibly a 'rec' room type of place with a couch and tv to watch races, relax.

A patio and/or deck would be important, as outdoor space to relax is vital. Also, it would be nice if there were a pond, river, stream big enough to take a dip in nearby.

Any thoughts from the cycling collective? If you were going to build a cycling retreat, what would you make a priority?


PS. How would you feel about a house with a nice view at the top of a hill? Pro: Nice view, stronger legs Con: Have to climb that hill at the end of every single ride.

[christian]

That all sounds lovely. You seem to have the right idea. A barn with a shop, bike storage, showers, and a rec room with table tennis table, tv etc. would be cool!

[William]

That all sounds lovely. You seem to have the right idea. A barn with a shop, bike storage, showers, and a rec room with table tennis table, tv etc. ....


And a ring for sparring!!:banana:



No??:confused: You people need to HTFU!!!!:p





William

PS: Sounds cool so far...:)

[Mr Cabletwitch]

If it was a vacation home I'd worry about keeping my bikes in a structure other than the house. Your bikes could be stolen and you wouldn't know it until you went back. I'd look for a place with an outside entrance to the basement for max security. It seems the backwoods type people are more apt to break into a "shed" than a home.

[AngryScientist]

i think the biggest three features are location, location, location.

beyond that, an outdoor shop typed space with electricity and plumbing would be key. when you have lots of cyclists over, all kitted up, having a bathroom that ISNT in your house would be key. ditto a place to shower after the ride without disturbing the whole household. even better if guests could set up tents outside on nice weekends and have a place to pee in the morning without tropping through the house. put a fridge out there for the beer your guests will bring. put a spigot for clean water outside for water bottle refills.

when am i invited??

[LesMiner]

I would like to do the same but in rural Minnesota or Wisconsin. Lots of low traffic roads and many miles between any stop signs or stop lights. I would add RV hookups for electricity and water to the other suggestions. Even a place to pitch a tent. Maybe a pole barn with running water and electricity to support amenities.

[jr59]

How about 1 in AZ? You know, where you could go all year long and not have to shut it down 5 months a year.

[MattTuck]

i think the biggest three features are location, location, location.

beyond that, an outdoor shop typed space with electricity and plumbing would be key. when you have lots of cyclists over, all kitted up, having a bathroom that ISNT in your house would be key. ditto a place to shower after the ride without disturbing the whole household. even better if guests could set up tents outside on nice weekends and have a place to pee in the morning without tropping through the house. put a fridge out there for the beer your guests will bring. put a spigot for clean water outside for water bottle refills.

when am i invited??

Yeah, I hear you about the plumbing for toilet/shower/cleaning/water bottle filling, but when I think of adding that to an existing barn, type structure, or garage, or I see $$$$$$. But I do agree it would be ideal. It would be rural, so there's always the chance for the guys and maybe the girls, to do their business away from the house.... if they were so inclined. But I'm not sure if you'd have to pour a specific type of foundation to make plumbing even possible in a barn. I suppose you'd have to heat it in the winter too, or drain the fluid in the fall.

Fridge is good. I was imagining a barn with bike stuff on the ground floor, and a nice sliding door so you could just roll out of the building and on down the drive way, and a 'rec room' on the second floor with a fridge, ping pong, TV, and vintage bike posters. Maybe put a trainer and rollers up there too.

The barn wouldn't have to be too big, and could be attached to the house via a mud room...

A man can dream.


The weekend after I close on my 'cycling retreat', you're all welcome to come visit, if you help me move ;)

[echelon_john]

random thoughts:
- A secure outbuilding can be an asset, in that you can leave bikes/tools/personal stuff/booze/etc. in it if you ever decide to rent the house as a vacation/ski home
- The things that make a good cycling base are the same that make a good winter sport base; access to trails/xc skiing/mountain roads for riding, access to restaurants/bars/whatever amenities of civilization you value
- Good neighbors are critical for part-time ownership. There are a few part-timers on our road in VT and there have been MANY instances where having full timers around has been a good thing. Not theft/that kind of stuff even; just storms/fallen trees/heavy snow alerts/etc.
- Where you are, obviously, there's an advantage to buying on the VT side based on lower property taxes. Still higher for 2nd homeowners than full time residents, but cheaper than NH.
- Buy the land, not the house. With the right lot, you can always add on/rebuild/enhance as your financial situation and needs evolve.
- Make sure you have the septic looked over by a good/reputable engineer. Septic issues in VT can add up quick due to new laws, at least if you want the work done in daylight. I know a guy who can help you if you need.
- Generally speaking, hilltop will be better for resale than valley floor. It kills me to ride almost a mile up 14% every time I come home, but if we need to sell, it's better to be higher up. Plus, WWJD? (Jens)

[MattTuck]

How about 1 in AZ? You know, where you could go all year long and not have to shut it down 5 months a year.

For a retirement home, I'd agree. Though I can't imagine riding during the summers in AZ, unless you woke up at 4am.

I'm 33 now. So still a ways until I retire, and I'd have a hard time justifying weekly trips to AZ. Though I'm hoping to make a trip out there next Jan/Feb to kick off my season without having to spend 20 minutes getting dressed.

And, for the record, if one were so inclined, you could ride year round in New England, maybe not at the same mileage as the summer, but there's enough cold weather gear out there, and you'd have to pick your rides to be the warmer days of the week, during the mid-day sun, but it is POSSIBLE. I didn't say it would be enjoyable. But, I see the grizzled new england farmer as the closest spiritual American analog to the belgian hardman.

[benb]

If people are inclined to break in to summer houses/camps (and they do seem to be in NH/VT) you probably have a hard battle & need to keep the place really secure and/or not leave expensive stuff there..

My parents have a place in VT.. they pretty much empty it in the fall... nothing has really stopped people from repeatedly breaking in. They have an alarm but generally if it's rural enough the police can't get there fast enough. The police *did* catch someone who had broke in a couple years ago, but that's because they made the mistake of breaking into about 7 places in a row so they were around long enough for the police to arrive...

Heck the place has an above ground propane tank for heat/cooking and thieves have even stolen the propane before by transferring to their own tanks!

Maybe you could leave bikes in the barn if it had no windows.. but it sounds like a risk. The police would be able to detail what the risk was in a given area though.

Having lived and rode a lot in both NH & VT personally I'd probably pick VT.. depends if you like trees or farms I guess... certain regions of NH suck more then any region of VT (Affinity to build huge #s of big box stores and put in endless traffic lights), but both have great regions for riding. Other then that the chief difference seems to be VT has more farms, you get better views, but it is windier. NH seems to be more likely to have trees, blocking the wind and the view. The climbing is better in the Whites IMO then VT but both have lots of hills & mountains. :)

[djg]

They tore down my freshman dorm to expand Tuck's empire, but no hard feelings -- just went back for my . . . ack, 30th reunion. Awesome weather, and the trip reinforced a few things. Pertinent to you, is that (a) it's really a great place to ride (albeit not in winter, and, as I recall, there really is a winter) and (b) it's way effin' far from DC -- too far for a weekend place or, in practical terms (at least for those without their own plane), a long-weekend place, for anybody who lives south of NYC and/or west of . . . I dunno, maybe Rochester or Buffalo?

On the locale -- If you know you want to live in Boston, and that that's going to work out well long-term, then that's cool. Otherwise, with apologies to the way low interest rates, I guess I'd give it a few years to see how career and family things are shaking out. It's way too late to discover Hanover, and the larger upper valley area will feature lots of undeveloped property (and old houses, etc.) for many, many years to come.

As for the house and riding . . . it's location, location, location . . . and maybe then some other stuff. Nearly any extra room in a house could work for bike storage and/or a workshop, unless it's tiny, or unless you're really ambitious for lots of bikes and major projects. For that matter, a garage could work, although an unheated garage in the upper valley obviously can get pretty darn cold in the winter, and may not be what you'd consider enough year-round (or 9 months-round either). So one extra room of a decent size for bike stuff; an extra bedroom (or 2) for guests; an extra bathroom for guests . . . I guess my point is that if you're really talking about a weekend house, with room for some guests, rather than an Inn or a rental property, then many, many things can do just fine -- or can be made to do just fine, with a bit of work -- if you have the right location: the locale you like, a setting you like, etc.

On the hill location -- I think it's all good if the road is good -- that is, if the combination of the road and driveway are workable, for a bike, in all or most of the weather in which you're likely to use the place. In that regard, you might want to be a little conservative, just because some things that look fine dry can get washed out and because you may have a range of guests, not all of whom are as adaptable as you.

[MattTuck]

In that regard, you might want to be a little conservative, just because some things that look fine dry can get washed out and because you may have a range of guests, not all of whom are as adaptable as you.

Well, then I tell them to H.T.F.U. :banana:


Good points all of them. Hanover is too expensive. I'd be looking a little ways out. Which is fine, as there is good riding all over the area. Probably Lyme or Orford if on the NH side, which has tax advantages if I continue to work in NH (high property tax, but no income tax).

Right on about those River dorm buildings, but I had heard they outlived their original 'mission' by about 3 decades anyway, as they were built originally as overflow capacity. I lived in the older of the two new Tuck buildings while I was a first year there, and overlooked the demolition of the dorm to make way for the new building. Lots of time to get the asbestos out, and separate brick from steel, which was mostly reused for the new Tuck building.

[fungusamungus33]

Summer time in New England is humid and an outdoor shower is so refreshing (if you can't go swimming) after a ride. Simple and cheap are other desirable attributes. Be creative with privacy and you can set up a couple of "stalls" to accomodate efficient wash up for the group... 'cause we're going to want to come visit!

CCB

[Louis]

.

[merlinmurph]

How about 1 in AZ? You know, where you could go all year long and not have to shut it down 5 months a year.

In NH/VT/ME, you just break out the skis and that takes care of winter. Which brings up the point others have made - location. If you have a place where you can both ride and have some kind of access to skiing, that's great. A 30-45 minute ride to skiing would be too bad and gets you away from the pricey real estate close to the mountains.

After playing in New Engalnd for the last 35 years, I've found that NH seems to have better 4 season stuff, but that may just be me. NH has a lot more access to lakes and swimming holes than I've found in VT which is key in the summer. Much better hiking in NH, also - VT hiking is fairly boring with very little above-treeline hiking.

I hang out a lot in the Bristol NH/Newfound Lake area a lot because we have good friends with places there, and we're considering getting a place, too. There's a good mix of stuff to do with ski areas ~45 minutes away.

Good luck with whatever you do. It's always fun just thinking about it. ;-)
Murph

[Louis]

http://idiotflashback.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/animal_house_deltas.jpg

[summilux]

Ever thought about a retreat in the Adirondacks? Kick ass cycling. Pretty good alpine skiing at Whiteface.

I'd guess that MBA type opportunities would exist in Burlington, VT, Syracuse or Albany NY.

[jmoore]

If there is easy access to cold beer and a fire pit then everything else becomes secondary.

[schwa86]

As someone with the granite of New Hampshire in various parts of my body, a keg tap? :beer:

[Louis]

As someone with the granite of New Hampshire in various parts of my body, a keg tap? :beer:

And of course a ping pong table in the basement. (sticky floor optional)

[tch]

...a lot of folks will want a hilltop house, I'm not one of them. Give me a flat property with cleared land around so I can see mountains, etc. I lived 1/2 way up a hill for 18 years and now in a town that is essentially at the peak of the Connecticut hills. I have grown to hate riding uphill at the end of every ride. I say an old farmhouse on a flat piece of property on a quiet road with a barn for possible improvement into usable space. Flat also simplifies issues like maintenance, mowing, plowing, etc.

[Louis]

I have grown to hate riding uphill at the end of every ride.

I know what you mean, but overall I think it makes you a tougher rider. The main drawback for me is that unless I put the bike in the car and drive down to the bottom of the hill, there's no such thing as an "easy" ride (which I might otherwise consider doing if I'm not feeling 100%).

[Steve in SLO]

How about a different direction:
Plop a 10x20 prefab house or two down and add a few more as needed.
Array them in a nice semi-circle around a deck with a firepit/BBQ. There's common area and privacy for everyone. One could be more secure and be your lockup house for gear when you leave.
Some cool ideas for small houses are all around. Here's a cool site:
http://tinyhouseblog.com/tag/woods/

[Frankwurst]

If there is easy access to cold beer and a fire pit then everything else becomes secondary.

This is True. I know. I put both to the test last night. :beer:

[HenryA]

I think you have a good idea.
Maybe it could be a Cycling B&B?

I used to go to Florida and stay in a monastery. Very basic accommodations, no distractions - just riding, showering, laying around in the sparsely decorated rooms. Had to go out to eat. Sounds a bit spartan but it was great (better than great) for a week of riding in the winter.

I'd think the key might be to make the basics of cycling as easy and nearly thoughtless as possible. Maps to handout, maybe a guide! One shower per 2-3 guests, couple three work stands in a small shop with basic supplies, secure storage, availability of excellent cook or chef to make great cyclist style suppers. Essentially remove all work and responsibility from your guests.

Seems like June through leaf season would be full every week.
Whoops! You now have a new job - or a job for someone.

[craptacular]

I'll cook.

[Louis]

Well, since someone has to do it, I'll be the taster.

[54ny77]

Come on over to the 'hood in CT and pick up a little shack. Plenty of room to throw a party for your Paceline friends. Runs a little over $13mil or so.

http://dm.nrtwebservices.com/Thumbnail.ashx?p=http://media.nrtwebservices.com/TriStates/Properties/JPG_Main/592/2621592_2.Jpg&nif=http://www.coldwellbankermoves.com/NRTProducts/include/images/NoPropertyPhoto.gif

And in winter, you could set up this room with a fan and stick your bike (no, make that, "bikes!") on a computrainer. Laugh and wave at the schleps who have to bundle up and pedal outdoors, toss 'em some hot cocoa and a pack of instant toe warmers as they pass by.

http://dm.nrtwebservices.com/Thumbnail.ashx?p=http://media.nrtwebservices.com/TriStates/Properties/JPG_Main/592/2621592_8.Jpg&nif=http://www.coldwellbankermoves.com/NRTProducts/include/images/NoPropertyPhoto.gif

[beercan]

one day when i retire, my retreat will be my aunt's place in Maine, nice rolling hills with Acadia national park a good days ride away, I also like the Oneonta area in New york, was there for a few days but really liked the land

[oldfatslow]

If it was a vacation home I'd worry about keeping my bikes in a structure other than the house. Your bikes could be stolen and you wouldn't know it until you went back. I'd look for a place with an outside entrance to the basement for max security. It seems the backwoods type people are more apt to break into a "shed" than a home.

My wife and I recently purchased a home outside of Austin which we are using as a weekend house. A huge part of our criteria was great riding right from the house and it's beating all our expectations. The last miles off the main road to the house punch hard with the final mile at 4.8% and the final 1/4 mile something 10%+.

Our house has an alarm system with monitoring and all of the bikes are kept inside the house. To get the bikes they'd have to trip the alarm -- I guess I'd have plenty of notification that they were being stolen.

[krhea]

Here ya go Matt...

It looks kinda weird in this neighborhood and every time I ride by it I wonder what the neighbors really think but it could look cool in the right setting and it sure could be built for a whole lot less.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204262304577068260202452078.html


KRhea

[Louis]

one day when i retire, my retreat will be my aunt's place in Maine, nice rolling hills with Acadia national park a good days ride away

My sister (who is not a cyclist) lives about an hour north of Portland, and maybe she just doesn't show me the good roads, but based on what I've seen Maine would not be my first choice for a cycling vacation. Lots of great scenery, but cr@ppy, narrow roads loaded with potholes. And crazy tourists who don't know where the h3ll they're going.

Enlighten me, where are the good areas to ride?