old debate: older sram red vs dura ace 7900 or 9000

[whforrest]

Old debate I know:

I'm building my bike up again. Already sold campy stuff. I like the look of the older sram red with shiny parts. dura ace 7900 I know will be probably better in the long haul, but I'm also debating holding out a few more months for dura ace 9000. (However I am committed to building wheels with king hubs and I am uncertain if king will build a new hub or add a additional part to fit 11 speed.)

I'm leaning towards the older sram red with the knowledge that it may be noisier and have a shorter shelf life.

Your perspective is greatly aprreciated. (bye the way, my campy super record was awesome! I'm just inspired to go in a different direction.)

thanks, bill

[AngryScientist]

between them, i would opt for the 7900, but really, i've got my hands around the new sram red hoods, and i like them a lot, very comfortable. campy is always my first choice, but if that were out of the question, i would go for the:

1)new red
2)7900
3)old red

in that order.

[nightfend]

Do you really want to wait until October/November to get Dura-Ace 9000? And, most likely 9000 won't be available in any significant quanities outside OEM until early next year. Not to mention, most hub manufacturers won't have 11-speed hub bodies ready any time soon.

[whforrest]

thanks for the feedback. I do like the new sram red, I know there were some great improvements.

quick vanity disclaimer:

I am having my serotta painted pearl white by Joe Bell next month. The bike will be ridden with a limited addition brown brooks saddle. (potential big risk on saddle risk)

I'm trying to build this bike kinda old school so I'm purposely trying to find a grouppo that has more metal shiny parts vs the all black carbon look.

I was set on old sram red, than I switched to shimano 7900..............and of course shimano announces newer grouppo coming out soon. I just dont know if i want to wait.

thanks, bill

[whforrest]

Do you really want to wait until October/November to get Dura-Ace 9000? And, most likely 9000 won't be available in any significant quanities outside OEM until early next year. Not to mention, most hub manufacturers won't have 11-speed hub bodies ready any time soon.

Yes, you nailed my thinking.......................now im leaning towards 7900 again. thanks, bill

[Fishbike]

I too am planning / have been dreaming about a pearl white lugged frame with a brown Brooks Swallow saddle and brown (Handlebra) leather tape. My inspiration was a lugged Pegoretti -- white with light blue panels. Gorgeous.

IMHO such a combination NEEDS silver parts. So of your choices, 7900 comes the closest.

I am NOT going to tell you that your current project needs Athena and that you should save the 7900, 9000 or Red for a nice swoopy carbon wonder. (Or Ti. Ti works too).

[monkeybanana86]

if you're building with the older sram red there were some issues with the front derailleur not shifting as well as the force. you can search the forums or cyclingnews.com for pics of pros using force FD in an otherwise RED bike. just fyi

[sc53]

I love 7900 but not the crankset--too "carbony" looking for me. You can get all kinds of silver cranksets from TA, Velo Orange, Peter White, Sugino etc. that will work perfectly with 7900 and look quite retro. After all, the crankset is the biggest part in the drivetrain (unless you also use a "pieplate" cassette like I do), so if it's silver, it takes the focus off the carbon/black derailleurs.

[godfrey1112000]

Have both of them, almost equal, I do run Sram Red Cassettes on both, 11-28
very quite



between them, i would opt for the 7900, but really, i've got my hands around the new sram red hoods, and i like them a lot, very comfortable. campy is always my first choice, but if that were out of the question, i would go for the:

1)new red
2)7900
3)old red

in that order.

[godfrey1112000]

My Pearl White is being painted right now, the fork is going to be Red on the outside and the carbon finish on the inside with red decales

let me know

thanks for the feedback. I do like the new sram red, I know there were some great improvements.

quick vanity disclaimer:

I am having my serotta painted pearl white by Joe Bell next month. The bike will be ridden with a limited addition brown brooks saddle. (potential big risk on saddle risk)

I'm trying to build this bike kinda old school so I'm purposely trying to find a grouppo that has more metal shiny parts vs the all black carbon look.

I was set on old sram red, than I switched to shimano 7900..............and of course shimano announces newer grouppo coming out soon. I just dont know if i want to wait.

thanks, bill

[PaulE]

A pearl white paint job by Joe Bell is the best! I had my http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=47504"]CSI (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=47504) repainted by Joe Bell four years ago, and it has the original SRAM Red on it. I also have a couple of bikes with 7800 Dura Ace and I like the Dura Ace better.

Since these pictures of my CSI were taken, I've put on red bar tape, a 34.9 clamp front derailleur instead of the braze-on version, a Red San Marco Regal and Dura Ace quick release skewers.

One thing that really makes a difference in the noise level of the original SRAM Red drive train is the oil used on the chain. I have had really good luck with Chain-L No. 5 in that regard, it smells like rear differential oil though.

[nightfend]

If you do get SRAM, I recommend using Shimano or KMC chains and Ultegra/Dura-Ace cassettes. Will make the drive train much quieter.

[bfd]

If you do get SRAM, I recommend using Shimano or KMC chains and Ultegra/Dura-Ace cassettes. Will make the drive train much quieter.

Further, I've been told by a couple of friends who ride Sram Red that if you get the older version, 2011 or earlier, to either get the new 2012 Sram Red front derailleur OR a Sram Force front derailleur. Early Sram Red ft ders are supposedly not very good and to stay away from it. Good Luck!

[oldguy00]

Can't speak for new 2012 Red, but I'd take anything -other- than old Red. I hated it. Same with Force. I'd rather ride 105 (which, works perfect) than red.

So I guess my choice would be 7900, which is what I currently use. Campy would also be great, but you didn't list it.

[rnhood]

Can't speak for new 2012 Red, but I'd take anything -other- than old Red. I hated it. Same with Force. I'd rather ride 105 (which, works perfect) than red.

So I guess my choice would be 7900, which is what I currently use. Campy would also be great, but you didn't list it.

Absolutely agree! Nothing performs worse than the old Sram Red....nothing. In fact the new 2012 Red still doesn't quite do the trick for me. Its much better and I like the crank stiffness, the front shifting, the drive train is relatively quiet now, and the hoods feel good (just like DA 7900)......but it still doesn't exude the shifting refinement as DA. Just not as smoothly consistent. Maybe the next generation. As they say, the third time is usually the charm.

In the meantime, DA rocks. Put Gore cables on 7900 and nothing performs better. I see no reason to wait for 9000 but your milage may vary. The throw on 9000 will be less and more desirable if that means something to you.

[bart998]

I have bikes equipped with both Campy Record and Sram Red. While I prefer the Campy, the Sram works just fine, looks great, and is super light. The front derailleur took a little finessing to dial in, but is now performing like a champ. I haven't put CHEAP-mano on anything I ride in 30 years.

[Gummee]

I have one bike with a Rival front der. and Red shifters/rear derailleur. I have another with an XTR front der and Rival shifters and a Force rear der and another with Rival shifters and rear derailleur w/ a D/A front.

Except for the slightly quicker (zero loss on the right too) shifts on the Red, they all seem to shift about the same.

I rode 4 hrs just now on the Rival/Rival bike. Seemed to work OK. The engine was missing a bit tho. Needs a tune up.

Oh, just a heads up for those in the DC area: Carter's Run Rd is more fun going from Marshall TO Warrenton than the other way.

M

[oldpotatoe]

Old debate I know:

I'm building my bike up again. Already sold campy stuff. I like the look of the older sram red with shiny parts. dura ace 7900 I know will be probably better in the long haul, but I'm also debating holding out a few more months for dura ace 9000. (However I am committed to building wheels with king hubs and I am uncertain if king will build a new hub or add a additional part to fit 11 speed.)

I'm leaning towards the older sram red with the knowledge that it may be noisier and have a shorter shelf life.

Your perspective is greatly aprreciated. (bye the way, my campy super record was awesome! I'm just inspired to go in a different direction.)

thanks, bill

7900 or wait for 9000. It took how long for CK to do Campag hubs? Don't hold yer breath for 9000 compatible hubs. Nothing wrong with 9000 hubs, BTW-shimano makes some wonderful hubs.

'Noisier and have a shorter shelf life'? YGBSM...what's to decide?

[oldpotatoe]

I have bikes equipped with both Campy Record and Sram Red. While I prefer the Campy, the Sram works just fine, looks great, and is super light. The front derailleur took a little finessing to dial in, but is now performing like a champ. I haven't put CHEAP-mano on anything I ride in 30 years.

but, but, but you just said you have sram?????????

[bart998]

but, but, but you just said you have sram?????????

Yep, tried Shimano once too...

[BdaGhisallo]

I'll come out and say that 7900 is the worst Dura Ace level group that Shimano ever made, in that it's the only generation that was not an out and out improvement on the generation that preceded it. Too many compromises were made in an effort to get the shifter cables under the bar tape. Early word is that Shimano have got it right with 9000 and that it represents a great improvement on 7900 and is more like an evolved 7800.

I would wait for 9000.

[LegendRider]

This is a helpful review:
http://redkiteprayer.com/2012/06/shimano-dura-ace-9000-a-closer-look/

[sandmonstersand]

i really like my older sram red, when using with a force front mech. hood shape is far more ergonomic than the shimano

[whforrest]

with pearl white finish, new decals, if possible he will try to outline the serotta stamp on the titanium with blue paint, also paint the handlebars pearl white. there is much detail i'm asking. how about you?

My Pearl White is being painted right now, the fork is going to be Red on the outside and the carbon finish on the inside with red decales

let me know

[whforrest]

7900 or wait for 9000. It took how long for CK to do Campag hubs? Don't hold yer breath for 9000 compatible hubs. Nothing wrong with 9000 hubs, BTW-shimano makes some wonderful hubs.

'Noisier and have a shorter shelf life'? YGBSM...what's to decide?

I really like the look of the 9000 group. I am sure that the 9000 hubs will be great, but I have wanted chris king hubs for years and this is my opportunity.

remember when building a bike rationality is sometimes only half the equation.

I will probably go with 7900 shimano and in a few years look at 9000. I called chris king and they will either re-design the hubs. Since I know shimano is the biggest part of their road hub business I am sure they will attack this project much sooner than the campy project.

[damocles]

I rode the old Red for the past 1.5 years, and had nothing but problems with it. Particularly with the FD shifting... I've been on DA 7900 for a month now and am in heaven. Never going back to Red.

[saab2000]

No brainer - Shimano.

If you're actually paying your own money for it and like your stuff to work it's the obvious choice.

[oldpotatoe]

thanks for the feedback. I do like the new sram red, I know there were some great improvements.

quick vanity disclaimer:

I am having my serotta painted pearl white by Joe Bell next month. The bike will be ridden with a limited addition brown brooks saddle. (potential big risk on saddle risk)

I'm trying to build this bike kinda old school so I'm purposely trying to find a grouppo that has more metal shiny parts vs the all black carbon look.

I was set on old sram red, than I switched to shimano 7900..............and of course shimano announces newer grouppo coming out soon. I just dont know if i want to wait.

thanks, bill

Athena all silver.

[palincss]

I'm leaning towards the older sram red with the knowledge that it may be noisier and have a shorter shelf life.


Once you put the parts into service, what difference does "shelf life" make? I'd think service life and availability of wear items and replacement parts, coupled with actual performance would be all that would matter.

[boxerboxer]

7900 makes the most sense to me. Great parts that will begin to be cheaper soon, and definitely easier to get your hands on that older Red.

[bluesea]

Is Dura Ace 7900 that much better shifting than Red?

My 2011 Red shifters and Force front derailleur are shifting perfectly at the moment, but based on past experience it seems that adjustment may or may not be repeatable. I have about 15 min total time on Shimano, so should probably give it another try.

[CaptStash]

A little confused here. If you are looking for a silver look, why not go for DA 7800? The cost is dropping like a rock and it is great stuff. That way the investment is less and it doesn't hurt as much if you pop for the 9000 in a year or so. Or...if you are just curious about Red, then I totally get it, as I am getting ready to build a bike up with SRAM Red for just that reason.

Stash....