Is it just me?

[jvp]

Or do others rarely encounter other riders going your way? I seem to pass many riders going the opposite way, but rarely my way, on my ~30-40 mile weekend rides. I don't think I'm all that fast, or slow. I expect to occasionally get passed, or "attack" someone, but it hardly ever happens. Is it because most riders going my way must be going about my speed most of the time?

[akelman]

If you're neither all that fast nor all that slow -- which is to say, you're riding at a speed that you think is average -- wouldn't it make sense that you would neither pass nor be passed very often (and only then by people at one end or the other of the speed curve)? Wait, I'm pretty sure this question was on the SAT.

[572cv]

If you're neither all that fast nor all that slow -- which is to say, you're riding at a speed that you think is average -- wouldn't it make sense that you would neither pass nor be passed very often (and then only by people at one end or the other of the curve)? Wait, I'm pretty sure this question was on the SAT.
+1 :) OP is a properly speedy guy!

[jvp]

I guess, but I would think a small group would pass me, or I would catch up to someone not up to my tempo more often. Just not that many riders out here I think.

[JAGI410]

Happens to me often. I like it that way!

[pinkshogun]

where i live, suburban rhode island, i rarely see 2 or more cyclists riding together. not quiet related to the opening post but rather a general observation that popped into my head

[sandyrs]

where i live, suburban rhode island, i rarely see 2 or more cyclists riding together. not quiet related to the opening post but rather a general observation that popped into my head

i noticed this as well. today i went on a ride with a group of 10+ cyclists (my collegiate team) and in over 80 miles of riding in some pretty populated places (providence and newport mainly) i think i only saw one other group of 2+ cyclists on the road! all those solo riders looked lonely. makes me glad i have a team :)

we did spend some time on the east bay bike path (where we were definitely out of place) and i saw a few more groups there but it was mostly parents with kids, not the sort of group i think we're talking about here.

back to the original post, this has been my experience as well. i think it probably has to do with being of average speed in an area with a lot of average riders.

[jvp]

haha I guess I'm watching too much race coverage where breakaways are usually caught before the end of the race, I must want to do likewise, chase down an imaginary breakaway. I do remember once climbing on the parkway near Asheville NC I got passed by 2 guys and had no response at all, I was happy to just keep at it.

[wc1934]

It's not just you - Sat and Sunday solo rides - never passed nor was passed - but did encounter a number of riders going the opposite direction.

[zmudshark]

I always ride the hard route, everyone else is riding the easy way. Rarely pass anyone, do get passed on the uphills by young guys with shaved legs. I hate that.

[Louis]

As Ari said, it's all due to relative speed.

Do the route at 28 mph or, 8 mph, and I bet over time there will be more people going in the same direction as you.

[1centaur]

What's your typical rolling speed?

Given the mix of young and old, men and women in my rural part of America, it would be impossible not to pass people if rolling along at 18-20 mph since so many less serious cyclists are going 14-16. My pass/passed ratio is probably 99 to 1 and I'm not a fast rider.

[benitosan1972]

When the world rides loops clockwise, some of us go counterclockwise! Rebels!

[monkeybanana86]

If you're neither all that fast nor all that slow -- which is to say, you're riding at a speed that you think is average -- wouldn't it make sense that you would neither pass nor be passed very often (and only then by people at one end or the other of the speed curve)? Wait, I'm pretty sure this question was on the SAT.

This is how I gauge how well I am riding haha.

Before I graduated, on my rides to school I would see many riders on the opposite side of the road and no one on my side. That bummed me out. Felt like I was the only guy not invited to a party. Do you live downtown as well?

[Climb01742]

you know who's always going in the opposite direction? all the cute women riders.

[MattTuck]

Imagine a 10 mile road, and let's say you're riding at an average speed of 18 mph. let's just say, there are people released each minute from the start gate, and they go in order, 14 mph, 16mph, 18mph, 20mph, then repeat again, in that order...

If you're going 18mph, you'll pass 3 and be passed by 1 person. And except for one person that you pass, the other people you see all left the starting line within 2 minutes of you.

This graph shows a graphic representation of where all the riders are at any given time. You are the pink line, in honor of the giro.

[MattTuck]

I apologize for the crude nature of my model/simulation. :cool:

[firerescuefin]

I apologize for the crude nature of my model/simulation. :cool:

Barbarian:no:

[jvp]

Well one memorable time someone was going in my direction, in the city - I was stopped at a light and some mtn. bike guy zipped between me and the curb and sailed across the intersection against the light of course. It startled me because I was fairly close to the curb. When the light changed I sprinted up to ~25mph or so and just before I blew past him...I coasted.

[MattTuck]

Barbarian:no:

For the record, I only was remarking that my solution was graphical in nature and thus lacked analytical rigor. I think you can actually solve the problem generically through a big mess of simultaneous equations. But my excel graphing skills are better than my high school algebra, so that is what you're stuck with. :banana:

[monkeybanana86]

you know who's always going in the opposite direction? all the cute women riders.

to go to that imaginary party.

[wc1934]

What's your typical rolling speed?

Given the mix of young and old, men and women in my rural part of America, it would be impossible not to pass people if rolling along at 18-20 mph since so many less serious cyclists are going 14-16. My pass/passed ratio is probably 99 to 1 and I'm not a fast rider.

i am serious - i am just slow.

[SPOKE]

start riding with one of the groups in the area.....beats riding alone:banana: (most of the time)

[Louis]

I think you can actually solve the problem generically through a big mess of simultaneous equations.


Actually not that messy. You only need to solve two pairs of equations at a time. (One pair of equations for each pair of riders.)

Di = Ri x Ti

Where Ri is the speed of each rider, the Ti deltas are set according to when the various riders leave the starting gate, and you then solve for Ti and Di, where Ti and Di are the time and distance at which the slower rider is passed

Example:

Matt = 1
David Zabriskie = 2

Matt rides at 18 mph and DZ rides at 28 mph

Matt starts at T = 0, DZ starts 5 minutes later, so he has less time to ride, or T2 = T - 5/60 (also convert minutes to hrs)

Eq 1) D1 = R1 * T1 or D1 = 18 * T

Eq 2) D2 = R2 * T2 = 28*(T - 5/60)

Set D1 = D2 (distance at which DZ catches Matt) and we have one equation and one unknown:

Which we can solve for T:

18*T = 28*(T-5/60)

Solving gives us T = 0.2333 hrs, or 14 minutes

So DZ catches Matt 14 min after Matt started. We can plug back into (1) to find that D = 18* 0.23333 = 4.2 miles into the course.

If we calculate a D that is > 10.0 then DZ would not have been able to catch Matt on the 10 mile long TT course.

I haven't double-checked, but I believe the numbers are correct.

[Ginger]

Yes. It's just you.

[MattTuck]

Well played, Sir. Well played. It is messy in the sense that you wouldn't know how many equations you needed to solve without the graph. In other words, the graph shows 17 riders but you would only need to solve 4 sets of equations in order to find all the solutions. However, you wouldn't know ex ante which of the possible 17 other riders you would need to solve. ;)

This post made my day and made me laugh Louis! POTD as far as I'm concerned. Mainly because I was in danger of being the biggest nerd on this forum, but you have pulled ahead ;)


Actually not that messy. You only need to solve two pairs of equations at a time. (One pair of equations for each pair of riders.)

Di = Ri x Ti

Where Ri is the speed of each rider, the Ti deltas are set according to when the various riders leave the starting gate, and you then solve for Ti and Di, where Ti and Di are the time and distance at which the slower rider is passed

Example:

Matt = 1
David Zabriskie = 2

Matt rides at 18 mph and DZ rides at 28 mph

Matt starts at T = 0, DZ starts 5 minutes later, so he has less time to ride, or T2 = T - 5/60 (also convert minutes to hrs)

Eq 1) D1 = R1 * T1 or D1 = 18 * T

Eq 2) D2 = R2 * T2 = 28*(T - 5/60)

Set D1 = D2 (distance at which DZ catches Matt) and we have one equation and one unknown:

Which we can solve for T:

18*T = 28*(T-5/60)

Solving gives us T = 0.2333 hrs, or 14 minutes

So DZ catches Matt 14 min after Matt started. We can plug back into (1) to find that D = 18* 0.23333 = 4.2 miles into the course.

If we calculate a D that is > 10.0 then DZ would not have been able to catch Matt on the 10 mile long TT course.

I haven't double-checked, but I believe the numbers are correct.

[1centaur]

Without modeling the optionality of route density/feeder roads/popular routes, along with season (summer cyclists average less hard core than winter cyclists) and time of day (early afternoon cyclists average less hard core than early morning cyclists on weekends) this equation is like a grain supply/demand model without substitutability, protein cycle or climate variables - useless to the OP!

[David Kirk]

The math says you should see fewer riders going your way or more going the other. Your 'closing speed' on a rider going your way may only be 3-4 mph so the chances of two of you being on the same road at the same time going the same way are very small.

On the other hand......you have a very high closing speed on riders going the other way - say 30 mph - so you will in effect cover more ground and have a better chance of seeing someone.

What do you think?


Dave

P.S. - why so many don't give a wave 'hello' is another matter altogether!

[Joachim]

P.S. - why so many don't give a wave 'hello' is another matter altogether!

I only wave to people riding steel bikes with a tubular under the saddle. Definitely not if they ride a Cervelo while wearing a sleeveless shirt... I keed, I keed!

[Louis]

What do you think?

Yup.

I agree that relative speed is the easiest way to think about it intuitively.

[Tom]

That's also why there will always be more large trucks going the other way and whacking you with their headwind than going along with you and giving you a big draft as they pass. I've thought about this a lot in the mornings on Route 5S when they're heading to the gravel pits and quarries out west of town.