Leipheimer Interview and Injury

[Hawker]

Wow...could easily have been killed. Too bad, he was having a great spring. Hope it doesn't affect the rest of his season too badly. Wonder if he was wearing his Road ID?

http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/04/news/leipheimer-i-could-be-dead-for-sure_211934

[Bob Loblaw]

Very scary. I guess that's every cyclist's biggest fear, the car that just runs you over from behind with no warning.

I am glad he wasn't more seriously hurt, and it sounds like his season won't be too badly affected. BUT he says he was looking for good roads on his smart phone at the moment of the accident. I would chalk that up as a contributing factor for sure. Do that stuff BEFORE you get on the bike.

BL

[harryblack]

Exactly. I'm glad Levi is OK but "no warning" = I obviously wasn't paying attention.

Driver is likely still at some fault but if he was paying attention to his environment... Curious to know if Levi also had headphones on or not, although I find serious riders who wear ipod buds are MORE attentive than those who jerk around answering and talking on their phones while riding.

Very scary. I guess that's every cyclist's biggest fear, the car that just runs you over from behind with no warning.

I am glad he wasn't more seriously hurt, and it sounds like his season won't be too badly affected. BUT he says he was looking for good roads on his smart phone at the moment of the accident. I would chalk that up as a contributing factor for sure. Do that stuff BEFORE you get on the bike.

BL

[MattTuck]

I wonder if he was wearing his RoadID...

[Keith A]

Wow...that was a close one.

I've been hit in the exact same manner and I was also fortunate that my injuries weren't too serious...just a tweaked back that a chiropractor was able to resolve. But I tell you, that was a very scary event. One minute you are riding along, and then you hear the car just before it hits you and then you are flying in the air. The driver that hit me was doing about 45mph, so it was I was hit pretty hard and was thrown off my bike onto the side of the road. My bike didn't fair as well, but the driver's insurance took care of it after initially balking at the price of the replacement.

But the thing that surprised me the most was getting over the mental aspect of being hit from behind. I've been riding on the road for a long time and have been hit twice before by a car and in both cases I saw it coming, but there was nothing I could do. Once I healed from those injuries, I was back on the road with not too much drama.

However, when I was hit from behind...this was a whole different story. Once my body was ready to ride again, I hopped on my bike and went for a ride and was feeling okay...that is until a car approached me from behind. All of sudden, I flashed back to my accident and it really freaked me out...so much so, I pulled off the road into the grass and let the car pass. It was so weird since I wasn't apprehensive about riding again, but the sound of the approaching car just flipped a switch in my brain and caused a reaction that I never expected. It took me quite some time before I was comfortable with a car passing me from behind.

[JStonebarger]

..."no warning" = I obviously wasn't paying attention.

How do you figure? Granted, it's dumb to be scanning a smart phone on the shoulder of a road, but still?

The second time I was hit from behind I was in the drops, paying full attention to the road ahead, riding a straight line 18" from the edge of a quiet country road, with a blinky red taillight flashing at noon on a sunny day. An F150 hit me at 55 mph (according to the police report) without so much as touching his brakes. Even with only a slight headwind I didn't hear a thing until I was thrown 30 feet into a ditch. The driver later stated that he hadn't seen me because he was picking something up off the floor of his cab. Was that somehow my fault for not paying attention?

From LL's recounting he was way off the road on the shoulder. How do you come up with "Driver is likely still at some fault..."?

[harryblack]

Well, I'm glad ** everyone ** here is OK!

And yes, I know it really can happen without warning at high speed--- the 'smart phone' is big red flag, however. Also, except while descending or in very high winds, we can usually hear engine sounds of approaching traffic. Still, I think it's wise to not use cell phones while riding on open roads (or riding period though there maybe separate, quiet bike path is OK.)

[billspreston]

I can definitively say that I do not hear every car that is approaching me from behind, not even close. Even when I do, it's often right behind me or passing me already before I would have had a chance to react. So you can hear a car approaching, now what? How can you tell the difference between a car that is going to pass you vs. one that is going to clip your rear wheel by sound alone?

Precautions can be taken for sure, but let's face it - we put our safety in the hands of perfect strangers every time we ride.

Scary stuff. Hoping further tests reveal that Levi is not seriously injured.

(Been hit by a car before)

[JStonebarger]

...the 'smart phone' is big red flag, however...

Dumb, sure, but no reason to blame the vicitim. At least LL is stupidly using a smart phone on a bike, mainly endangering himself, instead of while driving a car, thereby endangering pretty much everyone.

I'm not sure why you're invested in the idea that this was somehow LL's fault -- maybe hoping that it can't happen to you if you're careful? -- but even the argument about engine noise is long way from "[the victim] obviously wasn't paying attention."

The first time I was hit from behind it was by a driver who had seen me, and whom I had seen. I was in a rotary, and he entered behind (to the left of) me. We saw each other, and I could hear his car's engine, and fully expected him to overtake me in the rotary. Instead he hit me when he turned to leave the rotary while assuming that I was turning to leave like he was. I wasn't. I knew he was there, but still had no warning that he was about to hit me. Again, I had no warning even though I was paying attention.

The sad fact is every time we ride on the roads we're gambling that some driver nearby won't do something stupid. This despite the fact that increasingly they do. Nothing in this story so far makes me think LL was to blame, or that he could have prevented this accident short of staying off the bike. And I won't blame him for opting to ride.

[Bob Loblaw]

Do you think he might have been more aware of things going on around him if he hadn't been focused on the mapping app on his phone? I do.

I am not suggesting that by focusing on what's going on around him he will always be safe and never have an accident. Not all accidents are avoidable. However, I do believe most of them are.

I have been hit from behind too, and it was my fault. I was turning left out of a parking lot. Looked left: clear. Looked right: Car screaming around the corner. I nailed the brakes, while the woman driving the car behind me decided she could get out in front of that same car, instead of reacting to me, and floored it.

BL



The sad fact is every time we ride on the roads we're gambling that some driver nearby won't do something stupid. This despite the fact that increasingly they do. Nothing in this story so far makes me think LL was to blame, or that he could have prevented this accident short of staying off the bike. And I won't blame him for opting to ride.

[Tom]

When I got hit very much like this, the corner of the bumper destroyed my rear wheel, just barely grazing the left seatstay and bending down the end of the QR skewer. My left leg was at the top of the pedal stroke so they went right under it, you could tell by the pattern of bruises on each leg from where I hit the top tube on the way out. It was pretty cool, it tore the cleat right off my shoe. I've always wondered how bad it would have been if I had been somewhere else in the circle. I guess I know but I would be willing to wager I was going a lot slower than Leipheimer. I was going up a hill, the car was likely doing at least 45mph based on how far from the last stop light we were.

I don't remember anything of the last 200 yards or so before the strike, I have no idea whether I knew something was about to happen.

What's my point? Hell if I know, except this:

Looking at maps on the phone is pretty dumb, and maybe somebody with bike awareness like Leipheimer would have sensed something if he was paying full attention but somehow I doubt it. If I'm that far over on the shoulder I know I'm not on full alert and I don't do anything to distract myself except listen to the voices in my head.

BTW, a Legend is a pretty durable bike. It wasn't even knocked out of alignment.

[sc53]

I didn't get from his quote that he was actually using the smart phone at the moment of the accident, but that he had used it earlier to find some good roads to ride on. He was 5 km from his hotel when he was hit, on the way back, and I assumed he was thus no longer looking up roads on his smart phone because his ride was over. If you read his quote, it's not clear that he was using the phone when hit. So no need to bash him for inattentiveness.

[JStonebarger]

...I have been hit from behind too, and it was my fault. I was turning left out of a parking lot...BL

The driver behind you hit you because you braked and she didn't? That was your fault how? What are you, a bug on her windshield? If she rearended a car in the same situation no one would have doubted that she was at fault.

[tiretrax]

He stated that he was way off road on the shoulder. The driver was an old man who couldn't control the car. I doubt LL was even a scintilla at fault. LL is lucky that he wasn't hurt worse.

What surprises me is that he's flying. I broke a leg skiing and flew two days later. My leg was so badly swolen that the cast had to be replaced. The pain was worse than the fracture - I shattered my tibia in 10 places. I hope he puts lots of ice on it while in the air.

Best wishes to Levi. He's had a tough spring - seconds out of the lead at P-N and then three crashes on the penultimate stage.

[Bob Loblaw]

All true, but on a bike the stakes are too high to rely on drivers to do the smart thing. Being right doesn't mean bupkis if you end up in a chair you drive with your lips.

When I say it was my fault, I mean I wasn't doing a good enough job of managing the situation to protect myself. I should not have stopped, should have swung around to the right and stopped in the gutter and waited till the situation resolved itself. Lesson learned.

BL

The driver behind you hit you because you braked and she didn't? That was your fault how? What are you, a bug on her windshield? If she rearended a car in the same situation no one would have doubted that she was at fault.

[oldpotatoe]

How do you figure? Granted, it's dumb to be scanning a smart phone on the shoulder of a road, but still?

The second time I was hit from behind I was in the drops, paying full attention to the road ahead, riding a straight line 18" from the edge of a quiet country road, with a blinky red taillight flashing at noon on a sunny day. An F150 hit me at 55 mph (according to the police report) without so much as touching his brakes. Even with only a slight headwind I didn't hear a thing until I was thrown 30 feet into a ditch. The driver later stated that he hadn't seen me because he was picking something up off the floor of his cab. Was that somehow my fault for not paying attention?

From LL's recounting he was way off the road on the shoulder. How do you come up with "Driver is likely still at some fault..."?

Got hit from behind by a woman in a pickup truck who FELL ASLEEP at 10 am on a Saturday morning. When I hit her windshield with my face(I think i was thrown up, upside down, face into windshield-knocked out have no memory of the crash, nor the 40 hours after-knocked out about 15 minutes), I woke her up. Slammed on the brakes, spit me into a ditch, she was half off the road. She drove about 200 feet, I think thinking about leaving but there were witnesses.....Yep, I think the driver with LL is 'likely still at some fault'.

Totaled her truck, my bike, 5 days in the hospital, broke L1, L3, C5...luckily not in a wheelchair. Had a Dodge Dakota grill mark on my arse.

[Tom]

Had a Dodge Dakota grill mark on my arse.

Yeah, my wife did the CSI:Schenectady thing holding up the Mustang mirror we recovered from the road side to the bruise on my butt and snapping a picture.

[harryblack]

All true but I'll maintain ** IF ** Levi is on the phone... he shouldn't be, period. We'd also have to know if there was shoulder on the road and where he was in relation to it but I've seen way too many dip****s who think they can talk/text in bikes (AND of course cars/SUVs/trucks etc) to and ride (drive) safely to just saw awww... poor Levi.

[tiretrax]

All true but I'll maintain ** IF ** Levi is on the phone... he shouldn't be, period. We'd also have to know if there was shoulder on the road and where he was in relation to it but I've seen way too many dip****s who think they can talk/text in bikes (AND of course cars/SUVs/trucks etc) to and ride (drive) safely to just saw awww... poor Levi.

Read the article.

[flydhest]

All true but I'll maintain ** IF ** Levi is on the phone... he shouldn't be, period. We'd also have to know if there was shoulder on the road and where he was in relation to it but I've seen way too many dip****s who think they can talk/text in bikes (AND of course cars/SUVs/trucks etc) to and ride (drive) safely to just saw awww... poor Levi.

From the article, quoting Levi

I could be dead, for sure. I flew into Bilbao on Saturday night before the Vuelta al País Vasco. I wanted to get here early, relax and go for a ride. I was returning from a light ride, about two hours, at about 12:30. I was using my (smart phone) to find some good roads. I was about five kilometers from the hotel. At that point, I was on a big road, with a big shoulder. There was a white line and I was over on the far right side of the shoulder. I was just riding along. I didn’t hear or see anything. The impact was straight in from behind.

[tiretrax]

At that point, I was on a big road, with a big shoulder. There was a white line and I was over on the far right side of the shoulder.

Need a picture? Levi was riding as far off the road as he could get on the shoulder.

[tiretrax]

.

[benitosan1972]

All true but I'll maintain ** IF ** Levi is on the phone... he shouldn't be, period. We'd also have to know if there was shoulder on the road and where he was in relation to it but I've seen way too many dip****s who think they can talk/text in bikes (AND of course cars/SUVs/trucks etc) to and ride (drive) safely to just saw awww... poor Levi.

if you've NEVER pulled over on the side of the road/shoulder to check your phone for navigation, etc, well then you are in the MINORITY... god help you if you are ever broken down (bike or car) and have to wait/work on the shoulder and somebody hits you there... lighten up already sheesh.

[harryblack]

i hope you ride with more alacrity than you READ benitosan-- i said you don't ride (or drive) + text, you STOP and do your communications or research etc. ridiculous Levi is looking for a map while on the bike in the first place; guy's ridden how many miles in his life and still has a poor sense of direction?

the more Levi talks about this btw, the more it sounds like spin control. If he was hugging a wide shoulder like that he would have said so from the start.

if you've NEVER pulled over on the side of the road/shoulder to check your phone for navigation, etc, well then you are in the MINORITY... god help you if you are ever broken down (bike or car) and have to wait/work on the shoulder and somebody hits you there... lighten up already sheesh.

[benitosan1972]

Levi just bike texted me to tell you that you're spot on HarryBlack! :banana:
PS how many roads do you know by heart in countries you seldom/never frequent?

[benner]

Any doctors out there? I have seen compartment syndrome in action and I think about it when I hear, "My leg is twice its normal size and it’s hard as a rock".
Scary.
I know, pure speculation based on almost no info ...

Anyways ... For more info, checkit:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0002204/

[goonster]

i said you don't ride (or drive) + text, you STOP and do your communications or research
I do not understand how it makes any difference whatsoever in this case whether Levi was stopped and looking at his phone, or riding and looking at his phone way out on the outer edge of the shoulder when he was hit from behind by a car.

If that driver had hit a guardrail or road marker out there, would you have found a way to hold the object partially responsible for not being fully aware of its surroundings?