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Lovetoclimb
02-27-2012, 08:54 AM
My 2010 Athena shifter LH will not hold the cable tension necessary to keep the chain on the 53 ring. As they have somewhere between 10-12k miles, its maybe time to rebuild . . . and I am very interested in seeing how a shifter works internally. My shop sponsor has offered to help me but he has only done a handful of 10s shifters. I am curious are there additional steps for the 11s or just different parts? Any resources one can provide would be very helpful. Of course knowing OldPotatoe can fix any damage I do is a great safety net!

oldpotatoe
02-27-2012, 08:58 AM
My 2010 Athena shifter LH will not hold the cable tension necessary to keep the chain on the 53 ring. As they have somewhere between 10-12k miles, its maybe time to rebuild . . . and I am very interested in seeing how a shifter works internally. My shop sponsor has offered to help me but he has only done a handful of 10s shifters. I am curious are there additional steps for the 11s or just different parts? Any resources one can provide would be very helpful. Of course knowing OldPotatoe can fix any damage I do is a great safety net!

Something else going on. The innards of these levers is quite different than the 2008 and older, No springs, no spring carrier. Completely different design. 3 year warranty and the only shifter 'parts' available are complete shifter assemblies, and they would be Chorus, Record or SR. 2011 the innards of Athena and below changed again, and those are not compatible. But no springs, nothing to really wear.

About $110 for the assembly but smething else is going on.

Question, to ensure it's a 2010 not 2011 RH lever, one higher gear at a time(smaller cog) or multiple cogs with the thumb button?

ultraman6970
02-27-2012, 09:06 AM
Hmm... 110 for the assembly?? the brake lever of a 10 speed new version shifter, the last incarnation shaped one will fit in there???

Bob Loblaw
02-27-2012, 09:16 AM
Ouchie!

I like the way the 11s shifts and it's really nice-looking, plus they last a really long time and the ergos fit my hands nicely. But the $30 rebuildability of 10s will keep me riding what I have for a while.

BL

...the only shifter 'parts' available are complete shifter assemblies, and they would be Chorus, Record or SR...About $110 for the assembly...

oldpotatoe
02-27-2012, 09:24 AM
Hmm... 110 for the assembly?? the brake lever of a 10 speed new version shifter, the last incarnation shaped one will fit in there???

A 2010 anything(SR thru Veloce), 2009 anything, 2011 Chorus, Record or SR.

The brake lever blade will fit into any new shape ERGO lever.

oldpotatoe
02-27-2012, 09:26 AM
Ouchie!

I like the way the 11s shifts and it's really nice-looking, plus they last a really long time and the ergos fit my hands nicely. But the $30 rebuildability of 10s will keep me riding what I have for a while.

BL

Well, like I said, something else going on. I have seen what was described in 2008 and older Xenon, 2007/8 Centaur and Veloce but not in the UltraShift shifters.

Maybe make sure the two 3mm bolts on front and back are tight...they sometimes loosen.

ultraman6970
02-27-2012, 09:47 AM
That's the cheap way to pass from centaur 10 speed to 11 chorus then :D

Wonder if the FD lever will work fine with 11 tho. It should.


A 2010 anything(SR thru Veloce), 2009 anything, 2011 Chorus, Record or SR.

The brake lever blade will fit into any new shape ERGO lever.

oldpotatoe
02-27-2012, 09:57 AM
That's the cheap way to pass from centaur 10 speed to 11 chorus then :D

Wonder if the FD lever will work fine with 11 tho. It should.

It will, any FD 2008 and later, when they went to the non takeaprt design will work with any ERGO.

Lovetoclimb
02-27-2012, 11:28 AM
I am thinking back to when I bought the Athena groupset, and bet it was the first year Athena was offered. So it is probably 2009, NOT '10, though it sounds like that doesn't affect the performance. I will check those bolts mentioned for tightness. FWIW, the shifters are not mounted, any way I can easily test functionality?

oldpotatoe
02-27-2012, 12:20 PM
I am thinking back to when I bought the Athena groupset, and bet it was the first year Athena was offered. So it is probably 2009, NOT '10, though it sounds like that doesn't affect the performance. I will check those bolts mentioned for tightness. FWIW, the shifters are not mounted, any way I can easily test functionality?

Hard to check unless hooked to the derailleur(spring).

ultraman6970
02-27-2012, 12:48 PM
You can mock the position in a pipe or an old handlebar, then use an old cable and tight the cable with the hands... just pull the cable and start clicking with the other hand, the cable should move.

Dave
02-27-2012, 06:41 PM
Be sure that the problem is not something simple, like needing to turn the big ring limit screw out 1/8-1/4 turn. If you get the screw set wrong, it will put a lot of tension on the cable, attempting to reach the needed position, but not quite making it. Then the FD will fall back one notch.

The ultrashift levers are very easy to disassemble, but there are no spare parts available, so that won't help.

Here's a link to some info that I posted long ago.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/campagnolo/inside-2009-ergopwer-154068.html

oldpotatoe
02-28-2012, 08:55 AM
Be sure that the problem is not something simple, like needing to turn the big ring limit screw out 1/8-1/4 turn. If you get the screw set wrong, it will put a lot of tension on the cable, attempting to reach the needed position, but not quite making it. Then the FD will fall back one notch.

The ultrashift levers are very easy to disassemble, but there are no spare parts available, so that won't help.

Here's a link to some info that I posted long ago.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/campagnolo/inside-2009-ergopwer-154068.html

Completely correct Dave however, some of the shops, like me, buy a lever assembly and part it out so there are some small parts available. Shift levers, discs, some springs have broken, so kinda yes, depending, sometimes, there are small bits available. I'm not the only shop that dos this, I hope.

Having said all this, I don't think I have the LH innards, some RH ones tho, 10s and 11s.

Ralph
02-28-2012, 09:28 AM
Be sure that the problem is not something simple, like needing to turn the big ring limit screw out 1/8-1/4 turn. If you get the screw set wrong, it will put a lot of tension on the cable, attempting to reach the needed position, but not quite making it. Then the FD will fall back one notch.



http://forums.roadbikereview.com/campagnolo/inside-2009-ergopwer-154068.html

This....or adjust cable. I have had the same problm with 10's Ultra Centaur until I got it adjusted right. That's one reason I like the cable adjusters brazed to my head tube to fix adjustment issues like this.

giverdada
02-28-2012, 12:37 PM
so, i'm still confused: is 11 speed campy rebuildable or not? are we stuck with the entire shifting assembly and only able to move over the brake lever and hood? i love the 11 speed hood design and feel, and i'm stuck on ultrashift as my favourite shifting mechanism ever, but i got into campy because of its rebuildability as a major factor. i'm hoping it's rebuildable.

Lovetoclimb
03-05-2012, 04:15 PM
I found this bolt on both shifters to be loose, much more so on the LH (front Der.) shifter. When I tightened both down using minimal finger pressure the shifter clicked audibly . . . problem solved?Athena LH shifter suspect bolt!

Dave
03-05-2012, 07:10 PM
so, i'm still confused: is 11 speed campy rebuildable or not? are we stuck with the entire shifting assembly and only able to move over the brake lever and hood? i love the 11 speed hood design and feel, and i'm stuck on ultrashift as my favourite shifting mechanism ever, but i got into campy because of its rebuildability as a major factor. i'm hoping it's rebuildable.


Sure it's rebuildable, but you can't buy the individual parts that might be needed. The upside is that the new design has no highly stressed parts that wear out quickly, so replacing parts should not often be needed. The old design required regular replacement of the g-springs and the spring retainer.

About all you can do is take the shifters apart (also much easier), clean up the innards and regrease.

Lovetoclimb
03-09-2012, 09:19 AM
Bumping this to see if any Campy mechanics have an opinion ony last post (re the bolt tightening at the rear of the shifter).

oldpotatoe
03-09-2012, 09:24 AM
Bumping this to see if any Campy mechanics have an opinion ony last post (re the bolt tightening at the rear of the shifter).

I'll bet it did, needs to be fairly tight, there is a 3mm bolt on the front also that needs to be checked.

And as has been mentioned, Campagnolo now 'officially' sells only 'assemblies' but there are work arounds. Some warranty centers, if they warranty a lever that doesn't require a send back, strip the levers for parts. And I have done that also, stripped a lever for parts but as has been mentioned, no shift springs or spring carriers so no real 'rebuild' required. take apart and re-assembly is pretty easy with aonly a couple of 'gotchcas'. Removing the hood is one, makes getting the front spring into the slot much easier and making a tool to rehook the thumb button return spring is another.

ultraman6970
03-09-2012, 01:32 PM
Potato do you see that he has the white version if the thingy I was asking you last time??? Or that's a washer???

SeanScott
10-18-2015, 06:48 PM
Bumping an old thread but this is exactly what happened to my Record 11 speed FD shifter. I messed with the front derailleur and cable for months. Today I googled to see if I could get a rebuild kit for my shifter and this thread popped up.

FYI for those running Campy 11 speed. If your front trimming is not crisp, this screw may be loose. Mine was and now it shifts like new.

Thanks again Paceline! So thankful I found this post.

scho74
01-09-2016, 03:25 AM
Another Google search lifesaver!

cmg
09-13-2016, 10:49 PM
sorry for pulling this thread back up...... on two different sets of 11 speed shifters, the finger shifter spring has managed to commit suicide. does any one know where i can get the part? or do i have to get a lever body? i'm looking for a shifter lever. can i use s shifter lever from a 10 speed? my love affair with campy maybe ending if i can't get parts. or i maybe converting back to 10.....any ideas?

oldpotatoe
09-14-2016, 06:27 AM
sorry for pulling this thread back up...... on two different sets of 11 speed shifters, the finger shifter spring has managed to commit suicide. does any one know where i can get the part? or do i have to get a lever body? i'm looking for a shifter lever. can i use s shifter lever from a 10 speed? my love affair with campy maybe ending if i can't get parts. or i maybe converting back to 10.....any ideas?

So many questions...the spring that centers it or the spring that holds the lever forward? No, the shift lever blade is different for 2008 and older, 10s levers. The shift lever blade is the same for 2009+, all models. I have shifter parts, both the blade and springs. If it's the spring that holds it forward, new shifter blade.

PM or email me. I can install(not hard but can be difficult)..$25 labor per.

Pchisholm172@gmail.com

OBTW-if this were a out of warranty shimano or scam shifter..into the trash it would go so don't do anything rash..:rolleyes:

45K10
02-05-2017, 11:49 AM
I'm resurrecting this thread because I'm wondering what grease you guys are using when you service the 11 speed Campy shifters. I serviced a left side Chorus shifter a couple of months ago and it initially felt like new but it has
gotten soft already.

I am going to try again but I am wondering if a different grease might help. I used the the green Park grease to service it.

Thanks

oldpotatoe
02-07-2017, 08:45 AM
I'm resurrecting this thread because I'm wondering what grease you guys are using when you service the 11 speed Campy shifters. I serviced a left side Chorus shifter a couple of months ago and it initially felt like new but it has
gotten soft already.

I am going to try again but I am wondering if a different grease might help. I used the the green Park grease to service it.

Thanks

Soft?

I'd say, like the previous posts, make sure the wee bolts that hold the front and back 'guts' in place are tight. Nothing to really get 'soft' in there, with wee ball bearings and very hard steel notched discs.

Grease is oil in soap, I use lithium, some inside the shift disc and on the plates and such that are sandwiched inside the shifting mechanism 'sandwich'.

45K10
02-07-2017, 09:50 AM
Soft?

I'd say, like the previous posts, make sure the wee bolts that hold the front and back 'guts' in place are tight. Nothing to really get 'soft' in there, with wee ball bearings and very hard steel notched discs.

Grease is oil in soap, I use lithium, some inside the shift disc and on the plates and such that are sandwiched inside the shifting mechanism 'sandwich'.

Thanks OP. Yeah, by "soft" I mean the clicks aren't as solid as they should be. I ripped into it yesterday and serviced it again and the bolts were loose. I torn it down completely, used some Lithium based grease this time, and it is working fine for now. We'll see how it holds up

kansukee
02-07-2017, 10:41 AM
This may be useful for someone out there: years ago I was trying to find a washer and rubber end cap for a Campy EPS charger plug (I had bought a kit that was missing those two small parts). After much searching I found Si at year1cycles. Great dude and he can source just about any Campy part for you or even custom make one for you_ in my case he had to machine the washer and he even sent me an extra one.

oldpotatoe
02-07-2017, 03:29 PM
Thanks OP. Yeah, by "soft" I mean the clicks aren't as solid as they should be. I ripped into it yesterday and serviced it again and the bolts were loose. I torn it down completely, used some Lithium based grease this time, and it is working fine for now. We'll see how it holds up

Bit of blue loctite on those bolts, make 'em tight!!

cpamplin
02-09-2017, 06:44 PM
I tightened up those 3mm screws last night and 11s shifters are crisp again! Good tip, thank you.

VoyTirando
05-21-2018, 11:18 PM
While stripping a frame to build another, I pulled out the old shift cable to install a fresh one. Somewhere in the process I hit the lever and the barrel had rotated from zero. When I pressed the button nothing happened. A weak click and then nothing. Repeated attempts resulted in further Nothing. I tried poking something sharp in there to see if I could force it. Nothing. Then, unwisely I took off the back bolt to see if I could manually rotate the wheel with some improved access. Nope: all I got was a pile of small parts and an internal, 'oh, crap....'.

Before said disaster, the left shift wasn't great: a VERY hard drop from large to small ring, no trimming. Now it's toast.

Anyone have thoughts on whether this can be repaired? Whether it's worth it?

In the meantime, I've got an old mirage I'll throw in the left side. Mismatched but works fine....

macaroon
05-22-2018, 06:32 AM
While stripping a frame to build another, I pulled out the old shift cable to install a fresh one. Somewhere in the process I hit the lever and the barrel had rotated from zero. When I pressed the button nothing happened. A weak click and then nothing. Repeated attempts resulted in further Nothing. I tried poking something sharp in there to see if I could force it. Nothing. Then, unwisely I took off the back bolt to see if I could manually rotate the wheel with some improved access. Nope: all I got was a pile of small parts and an internal, 'oh, crap....'.

Before said disaster, the left shift wasn't great: a VERY hard drop from large to small ring, no trimming. Now it's toast.

Anyone have thoughts on whether this can be repaired? Whether it's worth it?

In the meantime, I've got an old mirage I'll throw in the left side. Mismatched but works fine....

If all of the innards fell out, then just put them all back together again in the right order and it should work.

macaroon
05-22-2018, 06:48 AM
You should have something like this

oldpotatoe
05-22-2018, 07:33 AM
While stripping a frame to build another, I pulled out the old shift cable to install a fresh one. Somewhere in the process I hit the lever and the barrel had rotated from zero. When I pressed the button nothing happened. A weak click and then nothing. Repeated attempts resulted in further Nothing. I tried poking something sharp in there to see if I could force it. Nothing. Then, unwisely I took off the back bolt to see if I could manually rotate the wheel with some improved access. Nope: all I got was a pile of small parts and an internal, 'oh, crap....'.

Before said disaster, the left shift wasn't great: a VERY hard drop from large to small ring, no trimming. Now it's toast.

Anyone have thoughts on whether this can be repaired? Whether it's worth it?

In the meantime, I've got an old mirage I'll throw in the left side. Mismatched but works fine....

Is it Ultrashift? Multi higher gears with thumb button? Send it to me and I can fix it. If Powershift, no real 'fixing'...If the toothed disc goes 'past' the wee lever on the shift lever, it will do what you are saying..need to reassemble..but send it to me.

cmg
05-22-2018, 08:31 AM
What holds the spring? Does it anchor on the body of the shifter or does it have the ring with the post?

oldpotatoe
05-22-2018, 08:59 AM
What holds the spring? Does it anchor on the body of the shifter or does it have the ring with the post?

11s Shift disc with notches facing another with wee ball bearings pushed by teeny springs. No shift springs ala older ERGO and that older ERGO post was to anchor a spring that made the shift effort easier..starting in 1998. The spring in the back anchors n body. As does the spring in the front. Another one anchors in a hole in the body the one at the base of the shift guts in the back.

gfk_velo
05-22-2018, 07:33 PM
While stripping a frame to build another, I pulled out the old shift cable to install a fresh one. Somewhere in the process I hit the lever and the barrel had rotated from zero. When I pressed the button nothing happened. A weak click and then nothing. Repeated attempts resulted in further Nothing. I tried poking something sharp in there to see if I could force it. Nothing. Then, unwisely I took off the back bolt to see if I could manually rotate the wheel with some improved access. Nope: all I got was a pile of small parts and an internal, 'oh, crap....'.

Before said disaster, the left shift wasn't great: a VERY hard drop from large to small ring, no trimming. Now it's toast.

Anyone have thoughts on whether this can be repaired? Whether it's worth it?

In the meantime, I've got an old mirage I'll throw in the left side. Mismatched but works fine....

As Old Potatoe says, part of the answer depends on whether it's UltraShift (easily fixable) or PowerShift (fixable if you have access to the spares but can be a bit hit-and-miss).

If it's PowerShift, which is what I am guessing from your description of pre "oh crap" feel on the lever, you might be able to reassemble with a new cable bushing if you can find one - and it might be OK. The problem that you have, though, is that the plastics used for the thumb lever and the cable bushing have degraded (usual reason is spraying mineral oil into the shifter) and the contact areas are worn. PowerShift relies on two accurately timed operations inside the lever to work properly and wear in the interface between the thumb lever and the cable bushing will upset that timing.

Older PowerShift levers with black cable busing were more susceptible to this - newer ones, since Feb 2014 (white cable bushing) are better, because the materials change that is evidenced by the colour of the cable bushing makes them less susceptible to accelerated wear of the plastic parts.

If you are going to try the reassembly route, scrub the lever out with soapy water first to get all vestages of oil out, dry, then reassemble with the correct, synthetic grease and pay attention to the mechanism in the front of the lever - the finger lever return spring coils around a plastic bushing at the front of the lever and if that gets displaced, the spindle that everything revolves around does not come far enough "back" into the rear portion of the lever - so when you assemble the other lever parts onto it, the various components are not accurately placed and you will get lever function problems anyway.

Best get someone who knows what they are doing onto this gig, as you can spend alot of time getting nowhere if you don't know how the lever should go back together and what to look for along the way.

oldpotatoe
05-23-2018, 07:49 AM
As Old Potatoe says, part of the answer depends on whether it's UltraShift (easily fixable) or PowerShift (fixable if you have access to the spares but can be a bit hit-and-miss).

If it's PowerShift, which is what I am guessing from your description of pre "oh crap" feel on the lever, you might be able to reassemble with a new cable bushing if you can find one - and it might be OK. The problem that you have, though, is that the plastics used for the thumb lever and the cable bushing have degraded (usual reason is spraying mineral oil into the shifter) and the contact areas are worn. PowerShift relies on two accurately timed operations inside the lever to work properly and wear in the interface between the thumb lever and the cable bushing will upset that timing.

Older PowerShift levers with black cable busing were more susceptible to this - newer ones, since Feb 2014 (white cable bushing) are better, because the materials change that is evidenced by the colour of the cable bushing makes them less susceptible to accelerated wear of the plastic parts.

If you are going to try the reassembly route, scrub the lever out with soapy water first to get all vestages of oil out, dry, then reassemble with the correct, synthetic grease and pay attention to the mechanism in the front of the lever - the finger lever return spring coils around a plastic bushing at the front of the lever and if that gets displaced, the spindle that everything revolves around does not come far enough "back" into the rear portion of the lever - so when you assemble the other lever parts onto it, the various components are not accurately placed and you will get lever function problems anyway.

Best get someone who knows what they are doing onto this gig, as you can spend alot of time getting nowhere if you don't know how the lever should go back together and what to look for along the way.

I'll add, the droopy thumb button Powershift is WAY more durable and robust than the pre droopy thumb button ones. GFK can correct but I think those started in 2015 model year.

VoyTirando
05-25-2018, 12:27 PM
So, per OP's description, it's power shift. One great at a time via the droopy button (though of course this is the front/left). Noting 'looks' broken. But the pile of parts sadly doesn't look like the picture above. The final bit that I stupidly removed was what I'd describe as a cheap metal disc, secured by a bolt, under which was the white cable-carrying wheel. I suspect that an attempt at reassembly is best a job for OP

In the meantime, the 8spd mirage shifter I've got mounted, paired with a 10 speed Chorus front derailleur, on a chorus 10 crank, works wonderfully with my otherwise 11 speed (chain/cassette, rear/left shifter/mech) system.