Why are used titanium bikes going so cheap?

[bargainguy]

Not that I'm complaining...just scored a nice used ti IF CJ myself.

But it got me thinking, along with the nice Merlin Extralight w/C-Record that went yesterday for $1299 BIN on ebay, and dozens of similar examples. I know someone who just scored a ti Holland complete bike for $1K used.

I don't think ti bikes were ever manufactured in the same quantities as other bikes from the big three of Trek, Giant & Specialized, so it's not exactly like the marketplace is flooded with them.

I realize ti may be falling out of favor compared with carbon, but ti seems to be making a comeback with boutique builders, and never really was abandoned by some - Moots, Seven etc.

Any insights? I'd really like to know what the market forces are here.

Don

[dekindy]

Total lack of demand. My buddy in Evansville, IN can find no steel there and I cannot find any here in Indianapolis. Titanium is even rarer; is that possible? Actually my LBS has 3 Serotta titanium bikes in stock and I am trying to get my buddy interested in Fierte Titanium. I would also hazard a guess that a far higher percentage of titanium bikes are custom so that further limits the market?

[AngryScientist]

i've wondered the same thing often myself lately.

i think its the "real" market value coming through. prices of new Ti are just so stratospherically high right now that it makes a good deal on a used frame look like a great deal. i think that Merlin that sold was a '99 right?

let's face facts, thats a 13 year old frame, with components a few generations removed from current. sure it's a nice bike yet, but $1300 is still a lot of money, it is to me at least.

and now: who are the potential pool of buyers? racers want CF, or alu at the least, certainly not 15 year old gear. guys with big paychecks want custom new, not someone else's recycled frame. value oriented noobs will look to alu. with the shiniest paint job. everyone else is happy on a hybrid.

the fact that as many ultra high dollar (>$5k for frame alone) frames sell amazes me as it is.

[dave thompson]

*Any* used bike is going to be relatively cheap, compared to new cost, be they steel, alu, carbon or Ti. Go to EBay and check out the completed sales of your favorite bike/frames. I think you'll be quite surprised.

[eddief]

have never owned my perfect or near pefect ti ride. his Lynskey was exquisite to behold. i am so fond of the simple understated brushed finish. all that said, you'd be hard pressed to convince me it rides better than my off the rack S-Works Roubaix. even if i am totally full of crap in that regard, the numbers of carbon bikes on the road would suggest there are many of us crappers. aesthetics, price, performance, status, marketing, poundage.

[yakstone]

I am a titanium disciple and still find Ti frames as beautiful as ever.
I was fortunate enough to be in Steamboat Springs last week and stopped in the Moots plant for a tour. Talk about a first rate plant and looking at all that Ti as well as all of those built up Moots rigs was simply inspiring!

Of course at $4K plus per frame they should be stunning, and they were!

Impressive place to say the least.

Titanium is still my material of choice; especially if you can find a rig in the secondary marketplace that happens to fit.

[lemondvictoire]

The resale prices of used is bikes is down and everyone seems to be short of cash! All of the 4 bikes/frames I picked up recently have been from sellers located in the east of the US. The deals were a Fierte IT w/Ultegra 10 speed bike for $1276 shipped, Lynskey frameset R230 w/enve fork/Chris King headset/7900 crankset for $1650 shipped, Lemond Victoire Ti Carbon w/all Ultegra 10 speed (no wheels, crankset,seat ) for $1050 shipped, and lastly a 08 Giant TCR Advanced frame w/fork headset/intergrated seatpost for $440 shipped! Also, I recently passed up a couple of second chance offers on complete Guru Geneo w/Dura Ace for $1150 shipped.


The prices have been cheaper than cheap and some have come from second chance offers too! Lots of auctions have not been making their reserve prices and sellers are getting desperate to sell too! Also I think that certain sizes are in demand too and may that be a consideration of how the market is. Certain brands are really hot and rare. I lost out on a 2 auctions for IF Crown Jewel Ti framesets too and bidding was fierce!

Great time to Buy and it's a Buyers Market on the used bikes!! More $$$ for Beer and other Toys!! :beer:

[charliedid]

Some people think them too vertically compliant and torsionally flexible, robbing them of much needed power. That, and Pros ride plastic...

Just a hunch.

[Fixed]

Some people think them too vertically compliant and torsionally flexible, robbing them of much needed power. That, and Pros ride plastic...

Just a hunch.
+1
a great bike is a great bike
cheers :beer:

[Elefantino]

Some people think them too vertically compliant and torsionally flexible, robbing them of much needed power. That, and Pros ride plastic...

Just a hunch.
But ti planes.

Carbon does NOT plane.

[Chance]

Any insights? I'd really like to know what the market forces are here.

Don
No insight, just guess that a flood of low-cost titanium frames from overseas over time placed a lot of pressure on price.

And while on this subject, in my opinion it’s one of the main reasons the “custom fit” phenomenon was marketed so aggressively. If you convince enough riders that making the top tube 1/2 CM shorter or longer instead of using a different stem makes all the difference in the world then you have the potential to differentiate yourself from the foreign products. And price accordingly.

That price premium doesn’t necessarily transfer to second owners. Nothing against custom since most of mine are, but prefer to keep them because of fast depreciation.

[tiretrax]

I think it's more influenced by the pro peloton. Look around on an LBS's group ride or charity event. Mostly carbon, lots of Treks and Specs. It's rare to see a metal bike unless the person 1. is a member of this forum, 2. is a hipster, 3. a retrogrouch, or 4. on a fixie (see #2).

[bargainguy]

Correct that the Merlin I referenced was a '99. My ti IF CJ is an '02.

I dunno about the cheap ti imports. I wouldn't even consider one, but I'm sure many would, esp. if the "Motobecane" name was on them!

Pro peloton, sure, that makes sense. People always want the latest and greatest.

Vertical compliance, yeah, that makes sense. I suppose we could also ask how many here are recreational riders (more comfort-based) than serious racers who want to extract every last drop of performance from their ride.

Used prices down in general? For some brands, certainly.

From what I've seen, steel seems to be making a comeback, carbon still somewhat high but deals are around, and ti seems to be taking a nosedive unless it's from a boutique builder or really small production run company. So if that's true, previous ABG bikes (Merlin, Litespeed, Quintana Roo) are not small production, but others (Seven, Moots, IF) still are.

FWIW, I paid $1700 plus shipping for my ti IF CJ.

Don

[oldpotatoe]

I am a titanium disciple and still find Ti frames as beautiful as ever.
I was fortunate enough to be in Steamboat Springs last week and stopped in the Moots plant for a tour. Talk about a first rate plant and looking at all that Ti as well as all of those built up Moots rigs was simply inspiring!

Of course at $4K plus per frame they should be stunning, and they were!

Impressive place to say the least.

Titanium is still my material of choice; especially if you can find a rig in the secondary marketplace that happens to fit.


RSL is $4550 frame and fork. Fork is about $450, frames are less than $4k.

Vamoots and CR are $3050.

[Jaq]

Titanium and carbon are the mission-critical substances of the coming generation of robotic super-warriors that are going to destroy mankind and rule the post-apocalyptic world.

Keeping the price down ensures the wide-spread dissemination of these materials, allowing hasty field repairs of broken robotic appendages and weaponry, such as the phased plasma rifle in ze 40 watt range.

Thanks, Ti & carbon lovers. You've doomed us all.

[oldfatslow]

Titanium and carbon are the mission-critical substances of the coming generation of robotic super-warriors that are going to destroy mankind and rule the post-apocalyptic world.

Keeping the price down ensures the wide-spread dissemination of these materials, allowing hasty field repairs of broken robotic appendages and weaponry, such as the phased plasma rifle in ze 40 watt range.

Thanks, Ti & carbon lovers. You've doomed us all.

Finally a reasonable explanation. I'm going to hide an IED in my seat tube in the event the machines come for my Moots.

[Ramjm_2000]

Seems to me $1000-1300 is par for course for upper end ti frames. Never managed to get more than that regardless of brand (IF, Moots, Serotta).

[peanutgallery]

not a Serotta but not a bad deal of what I perceive to be a nice ride. what does a made in china bike with force run from Specialized or Trek?

[gpl916]

I bought the Merlin on Ebay with the Record for $1299. It did seem like a good deal as most frames I was looking at were $1200 to $1400. I haven't ridden Ti yet, just steel and AL. I can't wait though.

I am not sure that is going to be the one I stick with. A Legend is on my wish list (or Moots, or Seven).

I love the look of Ti and want bikes I don't have to worry about the paint on.

[Kontact]

I wonder how much effect the 1" head tubes and level TTs have to do with the low prices.

It is nice to see more 1" forks available.

[likebikes]

ti is relatively cheap now because it was overpriced to begin with.

guess which tubset was cheaper in the ti heyday, an upper end ti tube set or a steel one?

[Kontact]

ti is relatively cheap now because it was overpriced to begin with.

guess which tubset was cheaper in the ti heyday, an upper end ti tube set or a steel one?
Ah, ti? No one made "tubesets" back in the heyday, they took expensive hydraulic tubing and butted, swaged and bent it into bicycle tubing, then connected it with expensive machined BB shells and water cut dropouts.

Steel tubesets have gone up in price with more choices since then.

[54ny77]

i'd like a vamoots in a 54, cheap. lemme know when you see one. :p

[Fixed]

I wonder how much effect the 1" head tubes and level TTs have to do with the low prices.

It is nice to see more 1" forks available.

level TTs will make a come back
cheers imho :beer:

[rockdude]

This is the best time of the year to buy bikes..... Its all seasonal. Wait untill June 1 and see what prices are.

[harryblack]

that's the good news... the bad news is i haven't come across a 54 Pegoretti yet! one Love #3 came up and auction ended early, don't know if somebody bought it direct or seller got cold feet...

not to drift too much but one thing I found surprising in used alu is the price prime Cannondales get-- not expensive but not dirt cheap either, which was great because I sold Caad 4 & Caad 5 frames to fund my purchase of a Caad 10.

*Any* used bike is going to be relatively cheap, compared to new cost, be they steel, alu, carbon or Ti. Go to EBay and check out the completed sales of your favorite bike/frames. I think you'll be quite surprised.

[ahsere]

A couple of years ago I bought a black Legend Ti on the bay for 1200 shipped, the pics and the write up weren't too clear but I took the chance, and I got an almost brand new Legend with flawless Ultegra 6700! It was a 2007, at the time I thought I had gotten the best deal ever, and boy I was right. I totally loved that bike, did my first centuries on it and it became "the bike I´ll never get rid of", and the bike that convinced me to sell my two carbon bikes. I crashed it a few months back, and I looked high and low for a comparable deal, to no avail, ended up buying a Waterford. I cannot afford to buy a new Legend or a Moots, but even if I could I think I´d go for steel, because new Ti is insanely priced, IMO. It also devalues a lot, like all sumptuary items. That said, that Legend turned me into a metalhead, no going back to plastic for me.

[bargainguy]

Kind of in the same boat as you. Sold my carbon and now in steel or ti only. The ti IF CJ was $1700 with Chorus 10 & Neutrons, the shot peened finish and less than 500 mi. A new frame/fork only is $4K.

Don

[ajz07]

I found my merlin on craigslist as a complete bike with 7700 parts for ~850. Love that thing, understand it is older ('98), and not an extralight, but the ride is wonderful. Different than CF. Have seen them going for relatively cheap on ebay, and figured it was lack of demand coupled with the winter market.

[tuxbailey]

I bought the Merlin on Ebay with the Record for $1299. It did seem like a good deal as most frames I was looking at were $1200 to $1400. I haven't ridden Ti yet, just steel and AL. I can't wait though.

I am not sure that is going to be the one I stick with. A Legend is on my wish list (or Moots, or Seven).

I love the look of Ti and want bikes I don't have to worry about the paint on.

Lucky you! Do post a follow up once you get the bike. It looks good. I got the same wheels on my Extralight as well.

[gpl916]

Lucky you! Do post a follow up once you get the bike. It looks good. I got the same wheels on my Extralight as well.

I am excited to get it. UPS says it will be here Monday- can't wait. I will post pix after I change a few things; put on my Arione, black Fizik tape, maybe a carbon Campy crank. I like all black components on Ti.

[eippo1]

I am excited to get it. UPS says it will be here Monday- can't wait. I will post pix after I change a few things; put on my Arione, black Fizik tape, maybe a carbon Campy crank. I like all black components on Ti.


Nice score. I am making the same switch myself. I got a Dean and I will be swapping all the parts from my Tarmac. Good thing it's all black :hello: