Bottom Bracket Stuck!

[tbushnel]

I just swapped my components from one frame (titanium) to another (steel). The bottom bracket (campy chorus ~'93) in the titanium frame is stuck. My LBS tried to get it out, but couldn't and in the process "stripped" the interface used for removal. The BB works fine, but I was hoping to sell the frame since it is the wrong size for me and would like to sell it without the BB (or actually I don't want to sell it knowing the BB cannot be removed without signifcant problems for whomever might buy it).

Any suggestions? I would entertain anything, including things that would render the BB unusable.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions

Ted,

[Too Tall]

Did they mash both sides? If you can get one side out than there is a nice heavy duty VAR tool that uses friction to get the cup out...it's a three person job but it will come out. Your least desirable option is to get busy with a dremel tool, shop glasses and alot of patience.

[ada@prorider.or]

I just swapped my components from one frame (titanium) to another (steel). The bottom bracket (campy chorus ~'93) in the titanium frame is stuck. My LBS tried to get it out, but couldn't and in the process "stripped" the interface used for removal. The BB works fine, but I was hoping to sell the frame since it is the wrong size for me and would like to sell it without the BB (or actually I don't want to sell it knowing the BB cannot be removed without signifcant problems for whomever might buy it).

Any suggestions? I would entertain anything, including things that would render the BB unusable.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions

Ted,


well never put alu in direct contact with alu components
make sure there is a isolation layer between them
this becuase there is a differant of current flow so actuly
titanium will eat the aluminum so to say

[Jeremy]

Hi Ted,

Try removing the cable guide and squirting some liquid wrench or PBlaster through the hole in the shell. You should try to direct the spray so that it gets between the threads of the cup and shell. Let this sit awhile and then try the following. If the splines on the cups are not completely gone you should still be able to use the splined tool. It is very easy for the tool to slip, which leads to it getting "stripped". The spindle should be hollow, so place the tool into what is left of the splines and then run a long bolt with large washers through the spindle and tighten the tool to the cup. This will prevent the tool from slipping when you place a long wrench on the tool and remove the cup. As you loosen the cup you will have to loosen the through bolt as well. Once the cup is loose enough so that the tool will not slip you can remove the through bolt. Repeat for the other cup. This works most of the time. If the spindle is not hollow you need to get a longer 8X10mm bolt and use the threads in the spindle to lock the tool into the cup. A crank bolt is usually not long enough to do this, so youo need to find a longer one.

Jeremy

[ada@prorider.or]

well i would be simple on this
its already gone so
take a saw and cut the cup until you hit the titan tread
another one about 10 mm away from the first cut the same procedure
then take little screw driver or a tool to cut away soory do not know the english word
slowly hit it the section of 10 mm to the inside of the cirkel not put it to the inside of the bb
if you have some clearance from the tread you can hassle a little and it would come out
then the bigger piece you also have to do the same procedure this way you safe the frame and damage only the cup
if the tread is damage cut the tread again
well that i would do it

i had a experiance with a crank and a pedal this way in the tour with jan ulrich the pedal was not good they only had one crank 177.5 and its was essentail to safe the crank
worked whole night but get the job done
it was a time titan axel stuck to the crank
with out doing any isolation stuipid a small paper would have done the job
this is called surface tension crrrent flowing from one material to another

[Matt Barkley]

Cees - That is a cool short story about Jan's crank and titan pedals. :beer:

[Marron]

Hi Ted,

Try removing the cable guide and squirting some liquid wrench or PBlaster through the hole in the shell. You should try to direct the spray so that it gets between the threads of the cup and shell. Let this sit awhile and then try the following. If the splines on the cups are not completely gone you should still be able to use the splined tool. It is very easy for the tool to slip, which leads to it getting "stripped". The spindle should be hollow, so place the tool into what is left of the splines and then run a long bolt with large washers through the spindle and tighten the tool to the cup. This will prevent the tool from slipping when you place a long wrench on the tool and remove the cup. As you loosen the cup you will have to loosen the through bolt as well. Once the cup is loose enough so that the tool will not slip you can remove the through bolt. Repeat for the other cup. This works most of the time. If the spindle is not hollow you need to get a longer 8X10mm bolt and use the threads in the spindle to lock the tool into the cup. A crank bolt is usually not long enough to do this, so youo need to find a longer one.

Jeremy

Jeremy has correctly identified the importance of securing the tool to the cup. I keep a supply of washers and bolts in my shop for this purpose. There are a couple of specialty tools from VAR and Park that accomplish the same thing at greater expense and complexity. Most of the time what appears to be a irretriveably distrorted cup will back out when secured in this fashion.

[JanG]

If you don't have bolts and washers laying around, you can try something I picked up from the Park Tool web site. Use a QR skewer to hold the BB tool in the splines. Obviously, this only works for hollow axles and tools designed to work with a wrench.

[Big Dan]

I use my homemade headset press to hold the bb tool in place....

good luck........ :help:

[Dude]

I unfortunately am in the same position as you. However, the drawback is that I am the shop. Soaked the MF with penetrating oil for a day, tried one side, stripped the splines (while using the QR skewer). Soaked it for another day and stripped out the other splines (still using the QR skewer).

Right now, i've used a drill, dremel, steel headed hammer. Those are the most effective tools so far just to bash the spindle out from between the cups. I haven't even gotten to the "hacksaw" phase yet. And yes, have used up all of my patience.

Whats wierd to me is that your shop they said they couldn't get it out? Even if the splines are stripped there are ways of getting it out - case in point.

[tbushnel]

I will get to serious work this weekend. Dude, let me know how that turns out. Is yours a titanium frame as well? Oh and the shop did say that they could probaby get it out, but that it would likely cost me significant shop time. I figured I would pool opinions here and give it a whirl myself before I throw in the towel.
Jeremy, thanks again for your input. I am on my way to find some liquid wrench tomorrow. I may have to pay you for all this advice ;)
Ciao,
Ted.
:banana:

[Jeremy]

I unfortunately am in the same position as you. However, the drawback is that I am the shop. Soaked the MF with penetrating oil for a day, tried one side, stripped the splines (while using the QR skewer). Soaked it for another day and stripped out the other splines (still using the QR skewer).

Right now, i've used a drill, dremel, steel headed hammer. Those are the most effective tools so far just to bash the spindle out from between the cups. I haven't even gotten to the "hacksaw" phase yet. And yes, have used up all of my patience.

Whats wierd to me is that your shop they said they couldn't get it out? Even if the splines are stripped there are ways of getting it out - case in point.

Hi Dude,

Is there anything left to get a tool into? If there is you may try this EXTREME method. The frame is titanium, if you use a propane torch and heat up the bb shell, then dump ice cold water on it, the corrosion between the shell and the cup may crack because of the thermal expansion rate. The temperature of a propane torch won't get hot enough to damage the frame. I had to do this once on a steel frame and it worked. If there is nothing left to put a tool into, can you drill holes into the cup for an old style bb pin spanner? You can use the crank bolt and a large OD washer to hold the (non adjustable) pin spanner in place. After the heat/cold cycle you may have enough purchase to remove the cup. As a last resort, you could drill a series of closely spaced holes around the perimeter of the non-drive cup. Then use a dremel tool to remove the material between each hole. This should allow the spindle with the attatched 30mm OD bearing to be forced through the remains of the non-drive cup. Once the spindle is removed you can carefully cut the cups out of the shell with a hacksaw. You do this by opening a hacksaw and then reinstalling the blade through the open shell. Cut two slots about 3/4" apart as close as you can get to the threads with mauling them. Remove the saw and pry the small piece out of the shell. Then you can remove the larger piece by prying it together until it collapses and then you can remove it from the shell. Then do the other side if necessary. Unfortunately, you have to either remove one cup or remove the end of one cup in order to force the spindle/bearings out of the BB.

I know this sounds crazy and extreme, but if you have truly exhausted other possibilities, it may be your only hope. If you are careful, you can do this without damaging the frame. However, it is a good idea to run a bb tap through the shell afterwards. I have had to cut out the cups on an aluminum frame, because if I had unthreaded the shell it would have destroyed the threads. Good Luck.

Jeremy

[Jeremy]

I will get to serious work this weekend. Dude, let me know how that turns out. Is yours a titanium frame as well? Oh and the shop did say that they could probaby get it out, but that it would likely cost me significant shop time. I figured I would pool opinions here and give it a whirl myself before I throw in the towel.
Jeremy, thanks again for your input. I am on my way to find some liquid wrench tomorrow. I may have to pay you for all this advice ;)
Ciao,
Ted.
:banana:

Hi Ted,

I thought that Dude was working on your frame. I hope you don't have to go to the extreme measures that I described to him. I hope all of the advice is helpful to you. If you are careful and patient you should be able to get it out.

Thanks,

Jeremy

[chrisroph]

Find a var tool. It clamps to the cup form both sides and allows you to apply tremendous torque to the cup.

[Kane]

I watched a wrench friend of mine work on a bb cup for about 20 minutes one day. He has a PhD and 15 years experience as a bike mechanic. He asked his boss for ideas. After ten seconds the boss said are you sure that they aren't Italian threads.

Wham shizam!! End of mystery. Good luck.

Cheers,

Kane

[tbushnel]

hopefully the LBS was aware that it is an Italian threaded BB. They seemed to know that, but whether that knowledge came before or after their attempts at removal remains mere conjecture.

Ted
:argue:

[Jeremy]

hopefully the LBS was aware that it is an Italian threaded BB. They seemed to know that, but whether that knowledge came before or after their attempts at removal remains mere conjecture.

Ted
:argue:


Hi Ted,

Most people start with the non-drive side when removing a bb. That side is clockwise threaded on Italian and English. So, if the BB wasn't stuck they would have got the non-drive out even if they mistakenly though it was English.

Jeremy

[tbushnel]

Jeremy, your hired! ;)

[Jeremy]

Jeremy, your hired! ;)

Cool, how about moving costs?

Thanks,

Jeremy

[ada@prorider.or]

Jeremy, your hired! ;)

you got to be kidding that the bike shop did not see what kind if threat was in the bike
becuase its written in the cup
and you could easily measure it
what the name of that bike shop ?

[tbushnel]

thanks to all the good advice I received the BB came out smooth as butter. I added some liquid wrench through the hole for the cable guide attaching screw and I guess fortunately got sidetracked for several days. After some soaking, I put together my $1.69 worth of hardware to secure the BB tool to the BB (through the hollow spindle with long 3/16th bolt). With modest effort the non-drive then the drive side cups came off. No slippage at all, so I guess the cups aren't really stripped. They just don't look pretty.

Ciao,
Ted.
:banana: :D :banana:

[Jeremy]

Hi Ted,

Congratulations, I'm glad that you got it out.

Jeremy

[Jeff N.]

Now take that BB and slam dunk that sumbeech in the nearest trash can! Jeff N.