OMG-hide the children

[oldpotatoe]

And product managers and geeks in general.

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/have-magura-and-acros-teamed-to-develop-a-fully-hydraulic-road-group-32838

Electro-hydraulic?

Yeegads, on a enthusiast road bike? Ridden on the road?

This ought to be an interesting thread, winter, discussion group, I think it's a HUGE answer to a not asked question.

Rumor has it sram will be first to the floor with a wetdisc/road group..can't wait(rolleyes).

[spacemen3]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I'm just a caveman. I fell on some ice and later got thawed out by some of your scientists. Your fancy bicycle technology frightens me. Electronic drivetrains. Hydraulic transmissions. My primitive mind cannot grasp these concepts. But... there is one thing I do know: we must do everything in our power to make bikes more complicated and expensive than they need to be. ;)

[Louis]

Let's make it as complicated as we can, because wire-actuated just doesn't work well enough.

[phcollard]

I want hydraulic downtube shifters :)

[AngryScientist]

:confused: :confused:

http://cdn.mos.bikeradar.com/images/news/2012/01/04/1325709888815-1258877l4jpt9-500-90-500-70.jpg

[Elefantino]

And product managers and geeks in general.

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/have-magura-and-acros-teamed-to-develop-a-fully-hydraulic-road-group-32838

Electro-hydraulic?

Yeegads, on a enthusiast road bike? Ridden on the road?

This ought to be an interesting thread, winter, discussion group, I think it's a HUGE answer to a not asked question.

Rumor has it sram will be first to the floor with a wetdisc/road group..can't wait(rolleyes).
Specialized once thought about developing a disc road group and will soon sue both Magoura and SRAM.

[Louis]

Let's face it, this stuff isn't done because it's a major improvement. It's done so folks have something new to buy. I don't play that game, but if others want to, I won't insist on laws to stop them.

But always going to the fancy new stuff for everything in your life does result in a heck of a lot of effort that IMO could be put to better use.

[phcollard]

Let's face it, this stuff isn't done because it's a major improvement. It's done so folks have something new to buy. I don't play that game, but if others want to, I won't insist on laws to stop them.

But always going to the fancy new stuff for everything in your life does result in a heck of a lot of effort that IMO could be put to better use.

My vote for post of the day, Louis!

Like.

[witcombusa]

Words can't express how much I find this disturbing...

So how 'bout this...

[EDS]

Let's face it, this stuff isn't done because it's a major improvement. It's done so folks have something new to buy. I don't play that game, but if others want to, I won't insist on laws to stop them.

But always going to the fancy new stuff for everything in your life does result in a heck of a lot of effort that IMO could be put to better use.

No one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Cycling is a hobby to many, what is so wrong with people having choices as to what to spend their money on?

99% of us don't need anything more than a $1500 Shimano 105 equipped aluminum framed bike, but company's like Serotta exist for a reason.

Ride what you like!

[Dekonick]

No one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Cycling is a hobby to many, what is so wrong with people having choices as to what to spend their money on?

99% of us don't need anything more than a $1500 Shimano 105 equipped aluminum framed bike, but company's like Serotta exist for a reason.

Ride what you like!

I'll take the $1500 Veloce equipped STEEL frame. :beer:

Hehe - couldn't resist.

Sometimes engineers just need something to tinker with to earn their keep...

[Louis]

No one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Cycling is a hobby to many, what is so wrong with people having choices as to what to spend their money on?

99% of us don't need anything more than a $1500 Shimano 105 equipped aluminum framed bike, but company's like Serotta exist for a reason.

Ride what you like!

I don't think I said anything that contradicts what you say here.

There's a wide spectrum of options, from $10 garage sale bikes to $XX,000 what ever. You ride what makes you happy.

But just because you happen to want something and like it and buy it, that doesn't mean that some won't think that it's wretched excess. You may not care one whit, but that's life. :)

[nahtnoj]

I'd buy a hydro rim brake 6 days a week and twice on Sunday to go with my ceramic-rimmed wheels.

Never having to replace cables and no increase in lever effort when its cold out? Sign me up.

[Fishbike]

Let's face it, this stuff isn't done because it's a major improvement. It's done so folks have something new to buy. I don't play that game, but if others want to, I won't insist on laws to stop them.

But always going to the fancy new stuff for everything in your life does result in a heck of a lot of effort that IMO could be put to better use.


I like the fancy old stuff. Oh yeah, and make mine steel too. Instead of 105, can I have Veloce?

[Bob Loblaw]

I keep reading about technological advances like this that solve problems I don't seem to have. I suppose I am a Luddite.

BL

[crankles]

ok. so i tried the acros mtb shifters and i liked them. worked great. now would i pay 4 times as much just to get a sealed system....mmmmmaybe ;-)

[Ti Designs]

I keep reading about technological advances like this that solve problems I don't seem to have.

Yeh, that pretty much says it all...

[don compton]

No one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Cycling is a hobby to many, what is so wrong with people having choices as to what to spend their money on?

99% of us don't need anything more than a $1500 Shimano 105 equipped aluminum framed bike, but company's like Serotta exist for a reason.

Ride what you like!
Your 99% comment is somewhat questionable. Are you assuming that all of use want a race bike so we can go faster? Bike riders come in all shapes and sizes.
Don C.

[Don49]

Looks like all the pieces are in place to add Antiskid Braking Systems to a bicycle. Wonder if that's next.

[Steve in SLO]

Such inelegant insimplicity...

[CaptStash]

Looks like all the pieces are in place to add Antiskid Braking Systems to a bicycle. Wonder if that's next.


Anti planing! :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

[jamesutiopia]

Does this mean we can have a hydraulic rear disc brake on the tandem?

[EDS]

Your 99% comment is somewhat questionable. Are you assuming that all of use want a race bike so we can go faster? Bike riders come in all shapes and sizes.
Don C.

I am not assuming anything. Are you assuming that big manufacturers only make race bikes? Off the shelf bikes come in all shapes and sizes.

[charliedid]

What, no motor?!!

Sheesh.

[zap]

I'd buy a hydro rim brake 6 days a week and twice on Sunday to go with my ceramic-rimmed wheels.

Never having to replace cables and no increase in lever effort when its cold out? Sign me up.

Didn't magura have hydro rim brakes in the early 90's?

[nahtnoj]

Didn't magura have hydro rim brakes in the early 90's?

Yes, they mounted on cantilever posts and were quite effective.

[zap]

Does this mean we can have a hydraulic rear disc brake on the tandem?

Sure-as long as it's not an S&S frame.

[benb]

Sign me up for mechanical shifting & hydraulic disc brakes on all my bikes when that combo is available for road bikes...

I could care less if the braking is exactly the same as mechanical Ultegra or D/A brakes.. I'll switch (when I need a new group) just for the lower maintenance.

[tiretrax]

Maybe it's a conspiracy by manufacturers to make complicated systems so that people will have to have their bikes serviced by trained mechanics at the LBS.

[oldpotatoe]

Sign me up for mechanical shifting & hydraulic disc brakes on all my bikes when that combo is available for road bikes...

I could care less if the braking is exactly the same as mechanical Ultegra or D/A brakes.. I'll switch (when I need a new group) just for the lower maintenance.

Guess you don't have a MTB with wet brakes.....when they work, they are great(on a MTB/Tourer/tandem), when they don't it is a multi tool, multi fitting, multi fluid 'pain'. Replacing a cable and some housing is l;ight years easier.

Plus, most....snick, snick, snick, snick, snick......

[oldpotatoe]

Maybe it's a conspiracy by manufacturers to make complicated systems so that people will have to have their bikes serviced by trained mechanics at the LBS.

Except most 'trained mechanics' at Local Bike Shop, USA have a hard time with a set of STI, rear der, front der, tuneup.

Manufacturers don't like us, we see the silly crappola they buy and foist onto us, and point it out.

'What were you thinking when ya made 'that'???

[Frankwurst]

I keep reading about technological advances like this that solve problems I don't seem to have. BL

Yup. Like Ti Designs said "That pretty much says it all" :beer:

[jh_on_the_cape]

I keep reading about technological advances like this that solve problems I don't seem to have. I suppose I am a Luddite.

BL

others might have problems that you do not have. Different terrain and riders.

I agree that hydraulic shifting sounds odd. But I said that about disc on mtb and now I am a total convert to that. But I still run 8 speed. I think that was better. I will be forced to convert soon though.

Let the market sort it out.

[djg]

I don't think I said anything that contradicts what you say here.

There's a wide spectrum of options, from $10 garage sale bikes to $XX,000 what ever. You ride what makes you happy.

But just because you happen to want something and like it and buy it, that doesn't mean that some won't think that it's wretched excess. You may not care one whit, but that's life. :)

Zactly. I think it's an unsung positive externality to such developments. It's not just that somebody pays for -- and appreciates (mebbe) -- the latest thing, as the latest thing, and maybe some other people think "cool," it's that we get to sneer at the nuttiness of it all (plus, I get to point out to my wife that my prized race bike cost less than half of what might be spent at the LBS.

Not sure what sort of maintenance issues folks are having with caliper brakes on road bikes, which seem sort of trouble free to me -- replace the cables maybe once a year? Brake pads now and again?

[William]

Maybe we're in the era of the local mechanic, seeing the transition coming of the need for factory trained mechanics to deal with the "advancement" in bike technology/engineering to the point where the individual can't work on them themselves without specialized (not the company) tools and training. How long until the big Trek/Specialized/Giant super stores have multi-bay Service departments open 24/7 to service the bikes you no longer can?

Are the days of the backyard/local mechanic on the way out? Or did I just get to close to the guy selling the Panasonic in the other thread? http://www.dnb.in.ua/style_emoticons/default/ganja.gif





William

[AngryScientist]

How long until the big Trek/Specialized/Giant super stores have multi-bay Service departments open 24/7 to service the bikes you no longer can?

Are the days of the backyard/local mechanic on the way out?



i doubt it, no matter how extravagant this stuff gets, it will always be worlds simpler than auto mechanics, and the backyard, independent car guys live on, even with modern cars.

i vow never, ever to take my bike to a shop for any work that needs to be done on it. if i need to buy more tools, or specialized stuff, i will, its quicker and cheaper in the longrun always to work on your own bike.

this is even more true if you do any type of touring or riding relatively far from "civilization". understanding how the machine you're depending on works has always been important and necessary to me, and that will never change.

[Bob Loblaw]

This sort of implies that weak products and ineffective technology are rejected by buyers who have a clear sense of what a bicycle needs to do for them. I have not observed this to be the case.

BL

Let the market sort it out.

[tiretrax]

Except most 'trained mechanics' at Local Bike Shop, USA have a hard time with a set of STI, rear der, front der, tuneup.

Manufacturers don't like us, we see the silly crappola they buy and foist onto us, and point it out.

'What were you thinking when ya made 'that'???


Unfortunately, the first sentence is too true. However, the "advancements in technology" should drive more service business for you - I don't know if many people want to invest in speciallized tooling costing several hundred dollars per tool (i.e. campy 11 chainbreaker). That would be a good thing if the new gear were better designed.

[benb]

Guess you don't have a MTB with wet brakes.....when they work, they are great(on a MTB/Tourer/tandem), when they don't it is a multi tool, multi fitting, multi fluid 'pain'. Replacing a cable and some housing is l;ight years easier.

Plus, most....snick, snick, snick, snick, snick......

I have been using Hydraulic brakes on my MTB since 2005... I have never had to replace a hydraulic line, never had to bleed them, never had any trouble at all.

The only maintenance I've done is change the pads, which takes no more time then (maybe less) then changing normal rim brake pads, as there is less adjustment to be done afterward. And the pads last forever.. my pad budget on my road bikes in that time period has probably exceeded the cost of the (very expensive) hydraulic system on the MTB in that time period, not to mention I don't think I've ever gotten 5 hard years out of a set of rim brake calipers.

But why would I be afraid if they do need maintenance? They are about a zillion times simpler then car/motorcycle hydraulic systems, and I've successfully worked on those in the past. It's not necessarily that much more time consuming, and since it gets done with 1/10th or less the frequency it's a win, even if the bicycle system ended up being very complicated with linked brakes and or something like ABS.

My only real complaint is I would prefer hydraulic brakes that used standard SAE/whatever bleed connectors so I could use the car/motorcycle tools I already have... maybe they've done that now, but I haven't bothered to look since I have no need to buy new brakes.

[Charles M]

Your 99% comment is somewhat questionable. Are you assuming that all of use want a race bike so we can go faster? Bike riders come in all shapes and sizes.
Don C.


And ride on all sorts of terrain in lots of different weather...


"on a road bike?"

As if mountain bikes going from "tradtional" clampers to disc to Hydro disc was the result of completely different operation.



And yeah, lets toss frame materials in here too...


Birds of a feather

http://community.greencupboards.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Dodo_bird.jpeg

[redir]

I think it's cool. I really wish I bought the disk brake version of my cross bike back in the day but I didn't because of some of the UCI races. I'd rather have hdro shifting then electronic, no batteries to deal with. Seems ideal on dirty nasty MTB and Cross bikes too, just not yet at that price point.

[oldpotatoe]

I have been using Hydraulic brakes on my MTB since 2005... I have never had to replace a hydraulic line, never had to bleed them, never had any trouble at all.

The only maintenance I've done is change the pads, which takes no more time then (maybe less) then changing normal rim brake pads, as there is less adjustment to be done afterward. And the pads last forever.. my pad budget on my road bikes in that time period has probably exceeded the cost of the (very expensive) hydraulic system on the MTB in that time period, not to mention I don't think I've ever gotten 5 hard years out of a set of rim brake calipers.

But why would I be afraid if they do need maintenance? They are about a zillion times simpler then car/motorcycle hydraulic systems, and I've successfully worked on those in the past. It's not necessarily that much more time consuming, and since it gets done with 1/10th or less the frequency it's a win, even if the bicycle system ended up being very complicated with linked brakes and or something like ABS.

My only real complaint is I would prefer hydraulic brakes that used standard SAE/whatever bleed connectors so I could use the car/motorcycle tools I already have... maybe they've done that now, but I haven't bothered to look since I have no need to buy new brakes.

Bike stuff in general are not standardized and MTB discs really aren't. A look thru the pages of any parts distributor will tell you that.

You shouldn't be afraid but I have worked on car hydro disc brakes and MTB and MTB, due to their size, weight, and non compatibility, are far more complicated and sometimes vexing to work on. Even with bleed tools, all looks great, button it back up and the lever goes to the handlebar, open back up, check for leaks, do again...etc. NOT complicated, probably wrong word but then find a wee brass fitting or squish ring that needs replacement on some obscure formula brake...and of course, thats the one you don't have.

Bike shop perspective, who see lotsa bikes, not just one or two.