UPDATE! if you had this issue - would you give up cycling?

[itsflantastic]

the story:
when I rode across the country about 5 years ago, I crashed once (trying to transport a 24 pack of beer to the campground :beer: ) Anyway - I got nailed in the perineum. Had to sit down for a while. The next day I kept riding and didn't think twice.

got back and found I had prostatitis. got pretty sick until I started on antibiotics, but the doc said I could keep riding if I got a special seat when I was better, so I did.

Well, every time I put on serious miles it seems that it comes back, and I get sick again. I've been sick w/ colds on and off since August, and I realized that all of it correlates to long car rides/bike rides starting with my 1 day bicycle trip from Boston to New Haven, CT.

I'm so frustrated with it all and I'm afraid to ride anymore.
I'm taking the PSA caps with palmetto and eating pumpkin seeds, etc. Starting to feel better.

So

When I AM better -
Do I get back on the bike?
or put the Bruce Gordon and the Peg up for sale?

I'd be a changed man...
and how would I get around the city?
OFf road rollerblades? :D

[AngryScientist]

maybe you just havent found the right saddle?

the SMP line of saddles seems to be made just for such a thing.

if i were you, i wouldnt give it up, but alter the riding, quite a bit. unless you're riding with a group or racing, i dont see any reason not to get off the bike every so often and walk a bit, get the blood flow normalized, and hop back on. take more breaks, stand up when you ride more.

i do this often, even if i'm riding long, and comfortable sitting, i get out of the saddle every few minutes minimum, re-establish good blood flow. i never ride just seated for longer than a few minutes.

dont give it up, i say keep experimenting until you find a comfortable formula that works for you.

[staggerwing]

Had to look that one up. Doesn't sound in anyway pleasant.

Still, I've had so much fun over the last six years, since I rediscovered cycling as a mid-lifer. Can't imagine giving it up at this point. I could see, if the situation warranted, perhaps a different type of cycle, such as a recumbent.

A couple of times a year, I take a long ride on the Little Miami Trail in SW Ohio. Invariably, the people with the warmest smiles are those that have to work hard just to be out there. Last time out there, a younger guy was pounding it hard on a hand cycle.

Good luck in finding a workable compromise to keep riding.

[Hawker]

I know this may not be a good choice...but it is a choice...how about a recumbent?

Me thinks it is hard to just "give up" something. It has to be replaced with something else that meets some of the same criteria cycling does.

At 61 I have some problems of my own in the nether region...but don't just throw in the towel. You can do that when you're 91.

[fiamme red]

You might try the ISM Adamo saddle. There was a thread about that the other day on the randon list, and one person, who at one time had to switch to a recumbent because of saddle problems, is now back on an upright, doing over 12,000 miles a year.

http://groups.google.com/group/randon/browse_frm/thread/50d09d92c067bfd0#

I've been riding ISM Adamo saddles for two years now (more than 25,000 miles). I find them the very best for protecting the soft tissue areas. In my opinion the Century model is the best for brevet use. I use the Road model on my fixed gear and on the tandem. I've had great success with both of them and recommend them highly. However, one must be prepared for a short adaptation period. The saddle design puts more weight on the sit bones region taking pressure of the other areas. The sit bones may take awhile to adapt to the added pressure. They can be quite sore for period of time. However, once adapted the saddle becomes very comfortable and is suitable for long rides. Also, be sure to set it up according to the video instructions on the ISM website. Proper positioning is important to comfort. They use a slightly nose down angle, which differs from most saddles. Oddly, it doesn't have you sliding forward in that position. Given the shorter length of the saddle one may find minor handling differences at first. Removing hands from the handlebars needs to be re-learned as it feels shaky at first.

All the above are minor adjustments needed to ride these saddles successfully. Speaking for myself it was well worth the time investment.

[William]

You might try the ISM Adamo saddle.

Very interesting...

http://www.ismseat.com/






William

[rePhil]

I had the acute version twice, thankfully many years ago. Both times started innocently with a cold. I neglected to look after myself both times and ended up needing antibiotics. Nowadays, I try to take it easy and manage my colds better.
Good luck.

[Bob Ross]

I know this may not be a good choice...but it is a choice...how about a recumbent?

imho when a 'bent is medically warranted it is a great choice.

[pjmsj21]

I would also suggest a recumbent.....yes there are those dyed in the wool cyclists that look down on them (no pun intended), but riding one for a few years is what got me back into cycling. There are many performance oriented models that can be quite fun to ride and I wouldn't even be surprised if your average speed went up unless you do a lot of hills. In any event it would be an easy decision for me.

[thwart]

Well, every time I put on serious miles it seems that it comes back, and I get sick again. I've been sick w/ colds on and off since August, and I realized that all of it correlates to long car rides/bike rides starting with my 1 day bicycle trip from Boston to New Haven, CT. What comes back? The prostatitis, or just getting sick?

If you get recurrent episodes of prostatitis from riding you should consider talking with a urologist, or at least your family doc. And a good bike fitting would be wise.

I would certainly do that before considering changing to a recumbent or giving up cycling altogether...

But if you've just been sick (not prostatitis, but colds and such) a lot recently it might be related more to other factors, not cycling itself.

[slowgoing]

Well, every time I put on serious miles it seems that it comes back, and I get sick again. I've been sick w/ colds on and off since August, and I realized that all of it correlates to long car rides/bike rides starting with my 1 day bicycle trip from Boston to New Haven, CT.

How about after you're healthy, resume riding shorter distances, and when you've been healthy for a while doing that and are ready, ease into long distances very slowly to minimize the shock to your prostate and immune system

Bummer that long car rides have the same effect.

[veloduffer]

What comes back? The prostatitis, or just getting sick?

If you get recurrent episodes of prostatitis from riding you should consider talking with a urologist, or at least your family doc. And a good bike fitting would be wise.

I would certainly do that before considering changing to a recumbent or giving up cycling altogether...

But if you've just been sick (not prostatitis, but colds and such) a lot recently it might be related more to other factors, not cycling itself.

Just to add, serious exercise does compromise your immune system. Cyclists and other endurance athletes are more prone to catching colds and the like. Pro racers try to avoid people with colds like the plague because of the lingering effects.

[Ahneida Ride]

PUMPKIN SEEDS

I swear by them .....

BEWARE of CIPRO and it's related antibiotics ...

Cipro can pay havoc with your tendons ....
Achilles rupture is not that rare.
I would NEVER take Cipro again
too much weird stuff, from loss of vision to tennis elbow.

Just Google the side effects of cipro.

[Charles M]

get with at least one other doctor...


Try and isolate your cut off point of OK versus Sick milage.

And are you just getting sick or is it the other thing too?


We're really just giant air filters and frankly, getting older sucks. Your immune system has a limit. find it...



Get with a very good cycling experienced Physical Therapist working with a fit specialist and try a few saddles Include the new SanMarco Mantra... HUGE cut out without removing support for "real" riding.


If you can't make it work, dont do it.

[wooly]

Flan - like everyone else, I would recommend trying different saddles and other medical solutions before giving up the bike. After being off the bike for a couple of years (self-imposed) and coming back to it, I've realized that the lifestyle and positive impacts on my physical and mental wellbeing are too great to leave behind. All the best to you and good luck.

[itsflantastic]

1.Re: Cipro - thanks for the heads up. I was going to ask my doc for that again

2.Re: Pumpkin seeds - I am eating those like crazy

3.Re: a good bike fitting. Any suggestions for someone in Boston?

4.Re: a recumbent. No! :D Since Car rides do it too, I think this wouldn't help the situation any

5.Re: ISM. It's so ugly! ack! Maybe??? I don't know. I have really liked Specialized Toupe saddles. I experience no discomfort while riding. Maybe I just need a good fitting. . . . See # 3.

Thanks all. keep the thoughts coming. they are helpful

[jimcav]

temporal relationships does not equal causality. saddle time and prostatitis: that is possible--try adamo--you sit on them in a completely (differnt and in my experience painful until you get used to it) way
colds/sick does not equate to prostatitis
recent evidence suggests endurance athletes need more vit d, and it is a big player in your immune system. I used to get sick all the tilme, literally was sick more than not--all colds and GI stuff with very little truly well periods. got my Vit D checked, it was under 20, and now i take D3 supplement and have not had a cold, bronchitis, gastroenteritis since--going on a year now

good lcuk
jim

[Spicoli]

There is a good thread on the Velocipede forum on the subject, not sure if you have checked that out? It should be a sticky.

I have what would technically be called "Prostatitis" also, aswell as one of my teamates. I have been through alot with this and have learned what works for me and have found a way to train and get by with it. I say "technically" above because Dr's tend to lump any kind of slowing of urine flow as "prostatitis" when with cyclist it appears many times it has nothing to do with the prostate at all. I went for a long time thinking that it was the prostate causing the obstruction when in fact my prostate is normal and healthy.

Now obviously I'm not a Dr and this was my experience with it so take it for what it's worth but I'd bet most of us cyclist's with this have some type of obstruction caused/aggravated by cycling. Have you ever had a "spermaticeil"(sp?) It's a clumping of tissue/blood ect. that can lodge itself in the urinary tract. Did you feel as though you passed something almost kidney stonish in the past few years blood at some point? My Dr's and my theory is at some point I injured myself on the bike, and the result was scare tissue or weaked section of wall in my urinary tract that when aggitated by saddle time either swells closed or gets pressed upon by surrounding tissue causing weak urine flow or completely stopping it at times. A good test to rule out your prostate is simply to try flomax....if its a swollen prostate causing the issue the flomax should relieve it. If you have no change I'd look towards an obstruction. Unfortuntly if it comes down to this your urologist will have to go "UP" river with a camera and check out the path. If anything is discovered you deal with it accordingly.

Sorry I know I'm just touching the surface of this and may be a bit vague with things but I was blown off by alot of very highly recommended urologist's who never really got past shotgunning a script or "telling me to quit cycling or "take an aspirin" :crap:

Few tips; that worked for me are,
-stay hydrated, the extra fluid keeps the pressure up and helps IMO. The rub on that is occasional panic urination.
-Saddle is huge, SMP's did not have a wide enough junk hole to do anything for me, Adamos are good but the hole is still not wide enough to help me. What I have found is saddles like a "San Marco Mantra" and Selle Italia "Super flo" have the widest junk hole and keep me from getting inflamed. You really want the width of hole when it comes to saddle choice.
-Take a couple weeks off and get a base line to see if it gets better/normal. Start from there with trying one of these saddles.

Just some random thoughts on the subject, dont give up...............you can find a way to figure out what works for you :beer:

[Spicoli]

temporal relationships does not equal causality. saddle time and prostatitis: that is possible--try adamo--you sit on them in a completely (differnt and in my experience painful until you get used to it) way
colds/sick does not equate to prostatitis
recent evidence suggests endurance athletes need more vit d, and it is a big player in your immune system. I used to get sick all the tilme, literally was sick more than not--all colds and GI stuff with very little truly well periods. got my Vit D checked, it was under 20, and now i take D3 supplement and have not had a cold, bronchitis, gastroenteritis since--going on a year now

good lcuk
jim

Hey Jim...I think what he is saying is the theere can be a "back flow" of urine which can lead to infection/sickness. In really bad inflammations it can cause some serious kidney problems that manifest into other health probs.

[itsflantastic]

re: the post being confusing jim - my apologies for not articulating things well!

basically, I've had experience in the past w/ this (3 times now it's been bad) and my doctor and I have figured out that when I get prostatitis, I have a tendency to get colds too. My immune system takes a big hit, and it can get infected. He usually treats it with Cipro. So I have the regular discomfort that goes along with the prostate trouble, and then some. This time around,I did a long ride in July, and ever since, each long ride/car ride is followed by prostatitis discomfort & a cold.

Maybe Vit. D has something to do with it. . .
Maybe fit. I know both of my bikes are a touch too small probably...
Maybe there is some other yet to be determined issue (i kind of hope not!)

But It's keeping me off the bike (3 weeks now). I'm wary of getting back on
so far, the feedback has been quite helpful. thanks!

[19wisconsin64]

Hi, first, i switched all my saddles to SMP, worth every penny. you can usually get one with a few rides on it for about 125 to 150 on this forum for a good price. i ride the glider model. very quick to get used to, you will never go back.

hang in there!!

[Nelson99]

I know you and your doc have identified this as a prostate issue, but it is possible that it could be something nearby, specifically your perineal muscles.

Do you have definitive evidence that your prostate has a bacterial infection? What is the cipro doing exactly? Are you sure that it isn't other treatments you undertake concurrently with the cipro that provides relief?

Perineal muscle spasms can give very similar symptoms to prostate irritation. One (not so pleasant) way to differentiate between the two is through a digital rectal exam where the doc specifically palpates the perineal muscles at the base of the abdomen, and compares the discomfort elicited to that from palpating the prostate. Obviously, the one that hurts more is the culprit. A simple prostate exam can be misleading because you will have perineal discomfort as soon as his finger goes in, which the doc may interpret as prostate if he does not specifically differentiate between the two.

In my experience, prostate inflammation can actually be helped by moderate bicycling, whereas perineal muscle spasms will almost always be further irritated by pressure and will need rest to recover. An alternative treatment for perineal spasm is injection with Botox. Weird, I know.

So, have you had a second or third opinion? Have you asked about differentiating between perineal spasm and prostate inflammation? Have you had a PSA test? Are you sure you have an infection?

The answers to these questions will make all the difference to successful treatment. Apples and oranges....

Finally, don't sell your bikes until you have given this at least a year to resolve. Diet, stress, sitting, etc.. Can all lead to unexpected resolution. Not yet time to give up hope.

Good luck.

[Elefantino]

Have you been diagnosed with chronic prostatitis?

I've had it for 26 years and usually have a flareup every year or two. Antibiotic (trimethoprim, no Cipro for me) takes care. If you haven't had a cystoscopic diagnosis yet, the fun hasn't begun yet. Look it up. Prepare to wince.

I have SMP Gliders, but and good-fitting cutout saddle will do.

Good luck. Amd know that chronic prostatitis doesnt necessarily mean prosty problems later on.

[benitosan1972]

Were you on the 42ride in '07-'08???

[Spicoli]

I know you and your doc have identified this as a prostate issue, but it is possible that it could be something nearby, specifically your perineal muscles.

Do you have definitive evidence that your prostate has a bacterial infection? What is the cipro doing exactly? Are you sure that it isn't other treatments you undertake concurrently with the cipro that provides relief?

Perineal muscle spasms can give very similar symptoms to prostate irritation. One (not so pleasant) way to differentiate between the two is through a digital rectal exam where the doc specifically palpates the perineal muscles at the base of the abdomen, and compares the discomfort elicited to that from palpating the prostate. Obviously, the one that hurts more is the culprit. A simple prostate exam can be misleading because you will have perineal discomfort as soon as his finger goes in, which the doc may interpret as prostate if he does not specifically differentiate between the two.

In my experience, prostate inflammation can actually be helped by moderate bicycling, whereas perineal muscle spasms will almost always be further irritated by pressure and will need rest to recover. An alternative treatment for perineal spasm is injection with Botox. Weird, I know.

So, have you had a second or third opinion? Have you asked about differentiating between perineal spasm and prostate inflammation? Have you had a PSA test? Are you sure you have an infection?

The answers to these questions will make all the difference to successful treatment. Apples and oranges....

Finally, don't sell your bikes until you have given this at least a year to resolve. Diet, stress, sitting, etc.. Can all lead to unexpected resolution. Not yet time to give up hope.

Good luck.

This is good advice to keep in mind, the "prosatitis" term get used too often I think and keeps many from finding the real culprit. Not everyone but worth looking into :beer:

Another side effect of cycling is an inability to relax your pelvic floor. People talk about core strength but what can happen is the lower abdominals dont relax enough and spasm after long or hard cycling efforts causing the same symptoms. I think we are learning alot more about how it may be a few of the these issues working together that get the urinary system all jammed up.

[Bob Loblaw]

I haven't seen this suggested so I will throw it out there. Have you been checked for allergies? It sounds like a left field suggestion but it isn't. Allergies aren't fixed, they come and go, and they trigger all sorts of infections from colds to bronchitis to sinus infections, even pneumonia.

I have some experience in this area, and after years of misery I am now only sick once or twice a year. And a riding buddy went from zero problems to scary asthma/aspirin allergy in one season.

Even if it's only a contributing factor, it could make your life easier if you get that squared away. And it's easy enough to get checked.

BL

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . that conclusively reveals bacterial infection? If it only happens with a long bike or car ride, I'd be very skeptical of bacterial cause, even if you seem to get cold symptoms. Has the doctor had you on an extended antibiotics regimen to make absolutely sure if there's bacteria in there it has been eliminated? There are so many resistant strains now and if you've got one it might take a long time on something like Vancomycin to really get rid of it.

I agree with others . . . there's lots of different stuff down there and if the beginning of it is definitely traceable to that one incident where you got a physical injury then I'd think there was something that was ruptured, strained, or otherwise damaged that has not repaired itself.

Only other thing I can think of is if it is indeed repeated bacterial and you have done the drugs, then maybe your physical injury created some sort of rupture that allows lower GI bacteria to get out and keep reinfecting? Even normal bowels are full of nasty stuff . . .

But what the hell do I know . . . The only doctor I've ever been or played has been with this girl that--uh, never mind . . . :p

BBD

[Trirunt]

Don't give up on cycling until you've tried every possible solution. Great ideas listed on saddles (Adamo!) and other options. One of the challenges of sport is working through the problems that crop up. Those who find a way to stay in the game win.

[itsflantastic]

Went to a really good urologist, who did a rather uncomfortable exam. I'll spare you the details. As it turns out the prostatitis was a misdiagnosis years ago, and I kept using the same doctor who kept misunderstanding what was going on.

Nelson99 got it right. It was my perineal muscle having spasms of some sort. The doctor thinks they are stress induced. Right now he has me taking 600 mg of ibuprofin 2x a day for the inflammation for 1 week.

Any other suggestions on how to treat this situation?

Thanks! He told me I could ride a bike. I almost cried I was so happy. Got out today and had a blast.

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . .to hear! Good for you! So does this really prove that Ibuprofen is the duct tape of the pharmacological world? :)

BBD

Went to a really good urologist, who did a rather uncomfortable exam. I'll spare you the details. As it turns out the prostatitis was a misdiagnosis years ago, and I kept using the same doctor who kept misunderstanding what was going on.

Nelson99 got it right. It was my perineal muscle having spasms of some sort. The doctor thinks they are stress induced. Right now he has me taking 600 mg of ibuprofin 2x a day for the inflammation for 1 week.

Any other suggestions on how to treat this situation?

Thanks! He told me I could ride a bike. I almost cried I was so happy. Got out today and had a blast.

[54ny77]

that s&%! works wonders.

glad to hear the OP is on the road to a less spastic future! :beer: :banana:

. . .to hear! Good for you! So does this really prove that Ibuprofen is the duct tape of the pharmacological world? :)

BBD

[thwart]

Any other suggestions on how to treat this situation? Thanks! He told me I could ride a bike. I almost cried I was so happy. Got out today and had a blast. Great news... although I would've loved to have that Bruce Gordon. :D

The advice from others re: cut out saddle may still be useful for you, since the cause of the perineal spasm may be multi-factorial. There is that temporal relationship with cycling and issues...

[Hawker]

God bless you Bro...hope things clear up well for you. It's always good to get a second or third opinion...even if you like the first guy.

[junkfood]

Glad to hear you got good news! Hopefully things continue to get better!

Jake

[jmeloy]

I'd still get a good bike fitting as well. Maybe hop on the train and go down to DC and see our buddy Smiley! Forum approved as a great fitter!