e-Bikes...thoughts?

[pasadena]

Originally Posted by rkhatibi

I've been considering building one as a fun project. Used hardtail MTB donor bike, battery, and a 750w mid engine kit. Looked like it could be done for less than $2k all in if based on the Bafang BBS02.

Example

That's almost exactly what I have. works great
It's not as seamless as a Bosch motor but it's also a lot cheaper and more powerful.

Ebikes sell huge here in the USA as well as Europe. Stromer and other brands can't keep them in stock.

They are really fun and practical. I tend to think of them more as functional rather than recreation-if that makes sense, but work well for everything.

Don't think of it as a replacement for a bike, but a new type of bike.

[ofcounsel]

Originally Posted by christian

Fine with them for commuters, but if I see a Specialized Levo on my local mtb trails, you won't find the bike or the body.

I'll make sure to pack the heat ;-)

[malcolm]

Serious question. Why not on the mtn bike trails?? I don't want one at least not yet. The reason I ask is last time I was in Park City I saw two on racks but they were clearly mtn bikes with motorized bottom brackets. Is it the same reason hikers and mtn bikers don't like motorcycles on the trails, they tend to cause significant damage??

[christian]

Yes. The Levo makes more than 3x the power of a rider on a standard bicycle. That's going to cause significant wear on the trail and is inappropriate. I ride a motorcycle. I like motorcycles. I don't ride my motorcycles on hiking trails...

[allan6344]

As a hiker I don't distinguish between e-mtb or mtb. I use a Specialized Turbo for my 37 mile RT commute and now it's fun to ride the road bike on weekend group rides again. I was getting too worn down during the week and it was taking too much time. It's like taking 20 years off and I'm still getting exercise. I am not a big fan of the throttle only, high power, home builds which is what most people picture.

[malcolm]

Originally Posted by christian

Yes. The Levo makes more than 3x the power of a rider on a standard bicycle. That's going to cause significant wear on the trail and is inappropriate. I ride a motorcycle. I like motorcycles. I don't ride my motorcycles on hiking trails...

I hear you and that's what I thought. I grew up on motorcycles and started racing motocross and cross country/enduro after that and as I got older just riding. In the past 5 years or so I've sold off all my motorcycles dirt and road. Still love them but just don't fit with what I do these days.

By the time I left dirt bikes behind I was riding mostly small/low knobbie trials type tires and for all except mud they were actually quite good and I'm not sure they weren't better on rocky hard pack. Motorcycles certainly damage the trails. Mountain bicycles I think much less so. Unless you have abundant loamy top soil I've not seen a lot of difference between hiking and mtn bikes. hard pack once there is a trail more damage comes from wash at least in my experience. Multi use is a thorny problem.

[christian]

Originally Posted by allan6344

As a hiker I don't distinguish between e-mtb or mtb.

Really? I'm a reasonably fit mountain biker. Let's say I can put down 220w on a steady climb, maybe 500 for 30 seconds to get over a feature. On an e-mtb, I'd be able to put down a steady 750w or over a 1,000 watts for brief periods. That's at least as much as an CRF50F or similar kids motorcycle. So 20-25 mph uphill rather than 8. I think you'd notice that as a hiker; certainly as an equestrian. To me, it also blurs the definition of what we allow on trails. I don't want full-power e-motorcycles like an 85 mph Zero FX on my MTB trails, for instance.

I do think your commute seems like an ideal use for one.

[pasadena]

slippery slope of logic

do we have a mtb weight limit for the trails and ban pro riders that regularly double the wattage of most mtb riders? Do we ban people above a certain weight?

e-bikes are not motorcycles. It's an easy myth that people can point to very few, very powerful niche e-bikes.

e bikes are mostly pedal assist. Even with throttle, I honestly don't see any more trail damage.

I can argue less trail damage but it's pointless to argue on the internet.

Besides the amount of use, what causes trail damage is poor riding skills and ignorance on how to use trails.
Ignorant trail ettiquete causes far more damage than anything else. Irregardless if it's a 19lb XC bike or a 50lb DH bike, or a 250lb rider or a 90lb rider.

What this argument does do is simply give more power to close down trails to all bikes, based on self-fulfilling myth.

[christian]

It's really not slippery. One has an electric motor. One doesn't.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by pasadena

slippery slope of logic

do we have a mtb weight limit for the trails and ban pro riders that regularly double the wattage of most mtb riders? Do we ban people above a certain weight?

e-bikes are not motorcycles. It's an easy myth that people can point to very few, very powerful niche e-bikes.

e bikes are mostly pedal assist. Even with throttle, I honestly don't see any more trail damage.

I can argue less trail damage but it's pointless to argue on the internet.

Besides the amount of use, what causes trail damage is poor riding skills and ignorance on how to use trails.
Ignorant trail ettiquete causes far more damage than anything else. Irregardless if it's a 19lb XC bike or a 50lb DH bike, or a 250lb rider or a 90lb rider.

What this argument does do is simply give more power to close down trails to all bikes, based on self-fulfilling myth.

Irregardless isn't a word.

Good for commuting, getting there faster without being all sweaty. Same as a scooter. Just cuz it has 'pedals' doesn't mean it isn't a scooter.

[Jad]

The useful distinction that some are making about e-bikes is that (most?) people use them for practical purposes: to get somewhere faster with less effort than on a solely pedal powered bike. The idea that they're scooters makes sense in that case. In any event, an e-bike is a type of bike, scootery as they may be.

I'll take people on a variety of bike over alternatives any day. "One Less Car" can still hold with e-bikes, so I appreciate their place in the wheeled world. If an e-bike gets someone pedaling--with assistance or without--it's probably a good thing these days.

[Ralph]

My wife has had serious surgery on both knees (RA). She cannot climb, and her distance is limited to about 10-12 miles on a mostly level bike trail. She averages about 8-10 MPH. So she is kinda limited in what she can do. I usually ride with her on the trails 2 days a week, and with my normal riding buddies on the roads 3 days.

We're thinking about an E Bike for her, or perhaps a rear E wheel for assist. I think she is the perfect candidate for one. It would allow her to ride on longer rides...at a tad faster pace......perhaps still on the trails.....and both of us would enjoy the ride more.

[p nut]

Originally Posted by pasadena

...e-bikes are not motorcycles...

I think by definition, they are motorcycles:

M-W dictionary--
: a vehicle with two wheels that is powered by a motor and that can carry one or two people

[fogrider]

Originally Posted by Ralph

My wife has had serious surgery on both knees (RA). She cannot climb, and her distance is limited to about 10-12 miles on a mostly level bike trail. She averages about 8-10 MPH. So she is kinda limited in what she can do. I usually ride with her on the trails 2 days a week, and with my normal riding buddies on the roads 3 days.

We're thinking about an E Bike for her, or perhaps a rear E wheel for assist. I think she is the perfect candidate for one. It would allow her to ride on longer rides...at a tad faster pace......perhaps still on the trails.....and both of us would enjoy the ride more.

you might even consider a tandem!

[SuperColnago]

Need e assist on my Corsa Extra!😂