The fall of Kona Bikes :(

[Old School]

Originally Posted by buddybikes

Have to tell pathetic self as I ride with a little power, getting exercise, enjoying life, keeping my A1c down, that this isn't recreational.

same here.

[notsew]

Thanks, Private Equity!

This is such a drag. Kona was always a huge part of the biking community up here, sponsored our CX races (even had a race we would hold at their old warehouse), a local club (via the shop) and all kinds of events. The local Kona bike shop would show up and do neutral support... Just all around doing good stuff. There was a time when almost every bike you saw on the mountain was a Kona (as has been said, now they are all Transitions. Guilty!)

I'll happily blame the money guys in Greenwich, but if we are being honest, the bike industry jumped the shark when $5,000 bikes became the norm. The tails of the covid boom are going to haunt the industry for another few years. I suspect we are just getting started. Next stop recession, personal income drops and so do the rest of the dominos.

Bummed in Bellingham.

[EB]

Originally Posted by KonaSS

Tangent - how or why are your Eagle AXS derailleurs obsolete?

I have a couple, they don't feel obsolete.

SRAM's focus is now the new and shiny Transmission. They're still selling previous gen but we'll see.

Edit: Take a look at OEM spec - Eagle AXS is effectively dead already on OEM mtb builds.

[rothwem]

Originally Posted by buddybikes

Have to tell pathetic self as I ride with a little power, getting exercise, enjoying life, keeping my A1c down, that this isn't recreational.

I swear I'm not being snarky--is there any reason why you couldn't do that on a regular bike?

[ridethecliche]

Originally Posted by rothwem

I swear I'm not being snarky--is there any reason why you couldn't do that on a regular bike?

I think that riding on the road requires being able to ride at a certain speed for safety even if it's for short periods of time. If I haven't ridden in a while, I end up riding the trainer for a while till I feel comfortable outside again. I feel like a liability if I'm riding outdoors and am out of shape.

Others can't exert themselves since they may not be able to get their heart rate up past a certain level.

There are a lot of reasons why someone might want the assist.

One of my supervisors used to race a ton when she was in grad school but now has an e-assist road bike and said that it lets her ride with her husband or just at a level where she can exert herself without going over.

Everyone has different goals. I'm just stoked to see folks getting out and getting exercise and fresh air.

[ridethecliche]

I'm kind of in a weird spot here but even though I know the effects of inflation and bike tech and..... etc.

I still can't get over the fact that I bought a race-able caad9 with 105 for 1300 and that was a frame that was recently tour-ridden.

I think the market has changed where the trickle down effect doesn't quite work the same way, but I really do think that the increase in integration and tech has really pushed price of bikes up like crazy.

IIRC a full DA with zipp supersix was like what... 6.5k? Now you'd be hard pressed to get a top of the line bike from them for 10k which is inflation adjusted-ish.

I know there's a huge difference in tech here since that top of the line bike now has electronic shifting, is more aero, disc, etc etc etc. But I think it still alienates people to see things that are that expensive. I think on average, wages haven't really kept up with inflation much so the average person feels the pinch more than ever and it further makes things like bikes look elitist.

In reality, I think things are the result of poor planning. Thinking the demand during and post pandemic would keep up. It happened in so many industries including musical instruments, like with fender, that things grew too fast, then they slashed and burned when reality started to set in.

That said, I'm a little bummed that I wasn't really in place to capitalize on some of these sales. It would have been nice to have bought a fully modern fleet for the price I've paid for my cobbled together used bikes/parts.

[benb]

Bikes have gone sideways a lot the last 10 years, then they had to spend a whole bunch more money to try and make sure they didn't get slower as they went sideways.

You see the same model of bike now versus the one 10 years ago and the new one gained a ton of weight from the disc brakes + electronic groupsets, then they worked to minimize that weight gain. As a result in the same model you're often paying for a higher grade of Carbon in the frame/fork and you're paying for fancier cockpit bits made of carbon along with carbon wheelsets whereas that same bike 8-10 years ago would have had alloy wheels. The new one will still be heavier but the price went into making it 500g heavier instead of 2000-2500g heavier.

[tootall]

Originally Posted by Hilltopperny

I have three brand new bicycles that I bought over the winter. They are all carbon with two being full suspension mtb's and one gravel with a combined retail price of over $15,000. I picked up all three shipped to my door for under $6,000 brand new with full warranties. That is less than the original retail of the Rocky Mountain Instinct. Things have only gotten worse since then.

I don’t know where these super duper deals are, I’ve been looking for a steal on an XL gravel bike for months and I still haven’t found what I’m looking for.

[ridethecliche]

Originally Posted by tootall

I don’t know where these super duper deals are, I’ve been looking for a steal on an XL gravel bike for months and I still haven’t found what I’m looking for.

You missed the deal on intense bikes @ costco. It'll probably happen again but likely not for a while.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by tootall

I don’t know where these super duper deals are, I’ve been looking for a steal on an XL gravel bike for months and I still haven’t found what I’m looking for.

I believe he picked up a Rocky Mountain Instinct from the pros closet in December, and two Intense bikes from Costco more recently. I also picked up one of those Rocky Mountains, and they were all sold out about an hour after I bought mine.

Costco deal lasted about a week, but even that didn't last forever. It helps to follow various forums and websites dedicated to deal tracking (including the PSA thread here, and the mtbr subform on deals), you also have to be ready to make a purchase on a moment's notice if you want the best deals. The really good ones are gone quickly. On more than a few occasions I've had good deals that sell out between the time I put them in my cart and when I finish checking out.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by prototoast

So overall, I think in most cases, the extra money people are spending on bicycles reflects an increased willingness to pay for higher quality more than a general increase in the price level of bicycles, but I admit that there is so room for disagreement on assessments of quality.

Or to put it in terms of Economics 101, prices go up as demand rises.

Bikes are being sold at a wider range of price points, from $300 - $15,000. Furthermore, the average consumer can choose from more than a dozen different brands, which means there should be more than enough competition between brands. If the prices people are paying for bikes are going up, it is only because people are willing to pay those prices.

[litcrazy]

I am curious about this idea of factoring in quality when tracking inflation.

I used the Prius as a reference point with this in mind. Hybrid technology has improved such that the rise in price of a Prius also comes with performance benefits. Perhaps that's not true for a pair of jeans, an apple or a gallon of gas. But that's why I noted the much lower price increase for the Prius where this same consideration would apply.

I also chose cable actuated 105 to put aside the question of the cost of electronic shifting. Still, the price increase was 80%.

Because bikes are a luxury item, I also chose 105 level because it stands at a particular status level in the Shimano hierarchy. Quality is so hard to measure. I do think more modern bikes by many measures are better for a particular kind of rider. Though very few riders fit in this category (shifts better in a sprint under power...).

However, in my mind the cost of 105 can't be mitigated by saying now Claris is better, because as a luxury item, Claris doesn't offer the same respectability/prestige as 105, and so much of what is being sold is respectability/prestige. Thus, you can't compare a 2024 Camry to a Lexus even if it has the same horsepower and as many speakers.

Finally, I don't dispute the role of supply and demand, but if it does feel at odds with the sense of obligation I feel I'm supposed to feel to local shops, small brand and MUSA parts. Based on this logic, I should hope for a sharp drop in prices as a market correction to the 80% increase in price over the last 10 years. Unfortunately, I have too much of a parasocial relation to many in the bike industry to not feel bad for the real world impact this would/will have for many involved.

[dddd]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

Or to put it in terms of Economics 101, prices go up as demand rises.

Bikes are being sold at a wider range of price points, from $300 - $15,000. Furthermore, the average consumer can choose from more than a dozen different brands, which means there should be more than enough competition between brands. If the prices people are paying for bikes are going up, it is only because people are willing to pay those prices.

That's true, but I'm thinking about what effect that the newer features are having on the numbers of bicycles being sold at various price points.

I recently looked at the lowest end of the market price range MTB's, and found that often-heavier bikes having narrower overall gearing with conspicuously-wide ratio gaps are replacing the former simple triples, while of course selling for around 30-40% more than just a few years back.

That Costco sale, particularly on the full-suspension models, was one for the record books. I missed out, but also missed out on dealing with anything having to do with thru-axles or having 80cm handlebars and all making their physical size more like my old dirt bikes.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by dddd

That's true, but I'm thinking about what effect that the newer features are having on the numbers of bicycles being sold at various price points.

I recently looked at the lowest end of the market price range MTB's, and found that often-heavier bikes having narrower overall gearing with conspicuously-wide ratio gaps are replacing the former simple triples, while of course selling for around 30-40% more than just a few years back.

That Costco sale, particularly on the full-suspension models, was one for the record books. I missed out, but also missed out on dealing with anything having to do with thru-axles or having 80cm handlebars and all making their physical size more like my old dirt bikes.

https://www.propain-bikes.com/us/products/outlet/

Killer deals are still out there.

[avalonracing]

Originally Posted by dddd

That Costco sale, particularly on the full-suspension models, was one for the record books. I missed out, but also missed out on dealing with anything having to do with thru-axles or having 80cm handlebars and all making their physical size more like my old dirt bikes.

The Specialized deals through the local dealers and the website were at least that good. (On arguably better bikes).