Packing heat while on tour/middle of nowhere

[bobswire]

Just when I think I've heard it all..... http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2...ster/23640143/

[fuzzalow]

Originally Posted by jr59

This is going to go south.

No, it isn't. Stop hoping that it will so the more probing and difficult questions can be ducked.

Some people think that no bad people will/want to do harm. And some believe that they would rather be prepared for such a thing. NO amount of sats, or logic will change the other side.

I say a little prayer everyday, that I never need to use a weapon. Yet I still carry it on the off chance that I might. I also assume that all I meet are armed as well .hat way I will always error on the side of being ready.

As you wish. Your experience is different as from being in the jewelry business. Looking for you because perps think you've got a bag of Rolexes is very different than going after a bike rider riding remote trails.

Why does a bike rider need to carry a gun?

[Brian Cdn]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

Being from Australia, I find this thread so hard to comprehend. The premise and some of the reasonings behind responses are just bizarre to me.

All I can say is that I'm glad I live in a country where guns are seriously hard to come by. I have never felt the need to carry any sort of weapon and I travel through rough areas.

Feel sorry for you guys...

Echoing my Commonwealth mate down-under, I too find the idea of, or even the thought of, having to carry a weapon OTB something extremely foreign to our way of life in Canada.

You're all welcome to come for a safe ride up here, but please bring only your passports and your bikes.

Cheers

[Schmed]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

Being from Australia, I find this thread so hard to comprehend. The premise and some of the reasonings behind responses are just bizarre to me.

All I can say is that I'm glad I live in a country where guns are seriously hard to come by. I have never felt the need to carry any sort of weapon and I travel through rough areas.

Feel sorry for you guys...

To be fair, very few people have been eaten by Koala bears. If you had mountain lions, grizzly bears, and black bears, would you then consider it?

Now... the two-legged people.... our murder and violent crime rate is way higher than Australia (but your rape rate is higher). Probably due to guns. Who knows for sure.

That being said, in 47 years, I've never personally known anyone that was a victim of a violent crime or murder. If your perception is that people are randomly shooting people here, then that's way wrong. It's mostly bad guys shooting bad guys (thankfully).

Don't feel sorry for us Yanks. We live in a great country!

[saab2000]

I have never owned a weapon and until last spring, I had never fired one.

I'm neither anti nor pro gun. I grew up in the Midwest where everyone had guns and virtually everyone used them safely for hunting or recreational shooting. They were everywhere but not really part of my smaller world. So to some extent I'm desensitized.

Where my strong opinions form is when I'm told that I not only have a right to bear arms, that I have a responsibility to bear arms. I was once told this.

Since this conversation started with carrying while riding I began to wonder....

I've had a handful of incidents in my cycling life of several decades where I thought my actual, physical safety was threatened. I once had a pickup truck in rural MN, pass me close by and pull ahead a couple hundred feet, then stop. I stopped. He rolled forward at about 5 MPH. He was clearly waiting for me to do something to give him the right to come out and beat me up or confront me or whatever. Eventually, after a minute or two of this cat and mouse game he took off. I don't know how he felt threatened by a skinny college kid on a bike in his 5000 lb pickup truck but I know we've all experienced these events.

I've had a couple other times too.

I don't know of any of these where the presence of a firearm would have been helpful. Maybe in the incident I describe above, but even then it's hard to imagine how that would have created a happy outcome.

I have no intention to ever buy a weapon though I'm not really opposed to them either. They're just not part of my world. They are meant to kill and I'm not really a killer of a person.

The place I wouldn't mind having one is with the occasional dangerous farm dog. But the odds of shooting one on the run while I'm riding are no better than winning the lottery. That said, I'd have no hesitation to take down some of the dogs I've experienced over the years. I have zero sympathy or tolerance there for the dog or the owner.

But I'm still not going to carry a gun.

[William]

Originally Posted by fuzzalow

...What situations, other than invented scenarios, does a cyclist need a firearm? Coming across the hypothetical, random crazy violent nut case is pretty thin reasoning - most large urban areas have more crazies per square mile or riding in the subways right next to you than you're likely to find out in the wild. Because short of having somebody wanting to steal/harvest your vital organs, there's not that much value for theft can be found on a touring cyclist. Ironically, if you are a cyclist packing heat and I were looking to rip you off for your valuables, the most valuable piece I'd want to steal from you is your piece!

If the OP is within the confines of the law, why do you have an issue with it? Invented scenarios? Here are two non invented incidents out in the back country....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECs8ZrmH8D8

Jump to about 10:45...
http://www.pinkbike.com/news/2014-hu...eru-video.html

These are just two I remembered. I'll bet I could find more if I searched.

Give me a scenario where having a firearm saved the day. IMO it is no where near as prevelant and commonplace as to be supportive of the number of guns bought, sold and in circulation. Most LEOs have the good fortune to not draw their weapon and that is the more typical experience, isn't it? All these stories about guns saving the day and not one tale about it told around the fireplace.

Here is one...
http://www.policeone.com/Officer-Saf...Texas-officer/

I agree, many officers go through there careers not needing to use their firearms, but then again there are a large number who do and they are thankful for the protection.

So I'll ask one more time, If the OP is operating within the confines of the law, what exactly is your issue?








William

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

Being from Australia, I find this thread so hard to comprehend. The premise and some of the reasonings behind responses are just bizarre to me.

All I can say is that I'm glad I live in a country where guns are seriously hard to come by. I have never felt the need to carry any sort of weapon and I travel through rough areas.

Feel sorry for you guys...

That's the issue/problem in the USA. Tons and tons of guns. Genie is out of the bottle, can't put him back in.

[mcteague]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

That's the issue/problem in the USA. Tons and tons of guns. Genie is out of the bottle, can't put him back in.

Agreed. In a fantasy world I can imagine the US getting over gun ownership but just can't see reality getting to that point.

Tim

[pbarry]

Here's an interesting story, about running in the back country:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ds-parole.html

[Schmed]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

That's the issue/problem in the USA. Tons and tons of guns. Genie is out of the bottle, can't put him back in.

I find it easy to slip into the mentality that "everyone else has one, so we better have one to protect ourselves".

I often ride alone and in lion/bear country and very remote. For that reason, I considered carrying, but decided pepper spray was a better fit. I just hope I don't mistake that pepper spray for a water bottle and take a big swig.

[bcgav]

To echo what William said, plenty of examples of four-legged and 2-legged predators out there, and not limited to the US.

http://www.cougarinfo.org/attacks4.htm

10 June. At about 1:15 in the afternoon, an adult cougar pounced Click to see Linnell after attack on 40-year-old Dean Linnell of Pemberton, BC, as he rode along the Far Side Trail in the Crumpit Woods area, just outside Whistler, B.C., about 30 miles north of Squamish, knocking his bike to the ground and barely missing him with its claws. Linnell was riding with three friends on a training run for the upcoming Test of Metal ride. He was alone, in front of his group by a few minutes, when the cougar jumped from above and behind. Luckily, the cougar caught the back end of his bike, not touching him but sending him crashing off the trail. He went over the handlebars and hit a tree, with his bicycle landing on top of him. He had glimpsed the blur of brown hurling toward him, and his extensive experience in the woods told him it had to be a cougar, so the 5' 8", 145 pound man was already yelling aggressively as he got to his feet--to do all he could to deter it.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2014/05/1...ifornia-trail/

A Massachusetts man has been fatally shot and his friend injured in a violent robbery on a Northern California hiking trail.
The Tehama County Sheriff’s office says Saturday that 69-year-old Francis “Pat” Gregory was killed in the random attack Friday in the remote trail north of Red Bluff.
Lt. Dave Greer says the robber shot Gregory and his friend — a 76-year-old man from Manton, California — after taking their money and belongings. The victims were left for dead on the trail until another hiker came upon them about three hours after the shooting.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/australi...910-2tj0o.html

A group of Australian hikers were injured and two members of their support crew were killed during a savage machete attack on a remote trail in Papua New Guinea that is said to be one of the hardest treks in the world.

Self defense is a personal choice and responsibility. You can't rely on the immediate response of law enforcement to save you, your loved ones or another innocent victim, if God forbid, you're in the wrong place at the wrong time, and sometimes only lethal force and the right mindset and preparation will help you prevail. Being defenseless, trying to cooperate and offer no resistance, or pleading for your life may not save you, see above.

[Gsinill]

"law abiding", "acting within the confines of the law", "responsible person"...
A lot of folks were all of the above until they pulled the trigger.

Similar to the saying "Opportunity makes the thieve", a gun can bee seen as an opportunity to avoid deescalation.

[SlackMan]

Originally Posted by professerr

Sure it is. But call it what you want - the numbers speak for themselves, and I only suggest that people look at them vis-a-vis the gun crime rate, and claims that more guns means fewer gun crimes.

You can call it what you like, but it's not a trend. I estimated for a trend via a regression, and it is not even close to statistically significant.

[SlackMan]

I see many posts claiming that one rarely would ever use a gun in a self defense situation. Although one might argue about the exact context of bike riding in the OP, it is a myth that guns are almost never used for self defense. The link below is just for events in Texas.

http://gunssavelives.net/tag/tx

You can look up your state in data at the link below:

http://gunssavelives.net/browse-by-state/

[jr59]

Originally Posted by jr59

This is going to go south.

Some people think that no bad people will/want to do harm. And some believe that they would rather be prepared for such a thing. NO amount of sats, or logic will change the other side.

I say a little prayer everyday, that I never need to use a weapon. Yet I still carry it on the off chance that I might. I also assume that all I meet are armed as well .hat way I will always error on the side of being ready.

Originally Posted by fuzzalow

No, it isn't. Stop hoping that it will so the more probing and difficult questions can be ducked.



As you wish. Your experience is different as from being in the jewelry business. Looking for you because perps think you've got a bag of Rolexes is very different than going after a bike rider riding remote trails.

Why does a bike rider need to carry a gun?

I'll stand on what I wrote. No amount of any info is going to change my mind or your mind on this. Sorry you feel differently.