The ongoing hookless rims saga

[drgonzo]

Hookless rims - the solution to a problem we never had

https://velo.outsideonline.com/road/...-a-mass-crash/

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by drgonzo

Hookless rims - the solution to a problem we never had

https://velo.outsideonline.com/road/...-a-mass-crash/

I'm no fan of hookless rims, but there was a statement in that article that was quite odd:

Hansen said that there were even bigger issues in the past when teams used hooked rims with hookless tires, something he described as “an even worse disaster.”

I never heard of a hookless tire?

[lunardds]

Not a great endorsement for those foam liners either. My understanding is the hookless is basically held on by the air pressure so when the pressure drops.......bye bye tire?

[Mikej]

There are hookless tires?

[Mark McM]

In the February 9th edition of the Escape Collective's Performance Process podcast, guest J.P. Ballard of Swiss Side (maker of aerodynamic bicycle wheels and other components) said that he has seen tires blow off hookless rims, even below the maximum allowed pressures, and that is why Swiss Side will never make hookless rim wheels. He also poo-poo-ed the idea that hookless rims provide any performance advantage to cyclists, the only advantage is that they cost about $20 less to make per wheel.

[drgonzo]

Originally Posted by lunardds

Not a great endorsement for those foam liners either. My understanding is the hookless is basically held on by the air pressure so when the pressure drops.......bye bye tire?

I'm no expert but I believe it's the opposite, when the pressure goes above a certain amount (~80psi), they can be prone to blowing off. Others here will certainly know more.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by lunardds

Not a great endorsement for those foam liners either. My understanding is the hookless is basically held on by the air pressure so when the pressure drops.......bye bye tire?

Hookless bicycle tires are held on by a tight clinch between the bead and the rim bed*. But unlike hookless tire/rim systems in other industries, whose tires have stiff steel beads, the bicycle industry insists on using flexible cord beads. These flexible cords can more easily bulge up and over the rim sidewall under internal and external forces.

*The tight clinch between bead and rim can create another issue - the high circumferential pressure on the rim can reduce the static tension on the spokes, making wheels weaker after installing a tight tire.

[fourflys]

well, my Giant Revolt has hookless rims (run tubeless), but I don't run the 42mm tires much over 50psi, so I assume I'm good.. but for smaller tire road pressures, seems like a latex tube is looking pretty good right about now (esp since pros hardly ever run anything above 30-32mm)..

[Dave]

Originally Posted by Mikej

There are hookless tires?

There are tubeless tires rated for use with hookless rims, but not all tubeless tires are hookless rated. I had early model Michelin tubeless that were not hookless approved. I used them hookless, but the bead stretch after a year caused them to unseat when the air was let out to check the sealant level. With the valve core in, I couldn't get air in fast enough to seat. No such problem with Pirelli P-Zero TLR. I put an old one on with a tube for a few rides and had a hard time getting it off the rim. Some soapy water and a lot of pushing finally unseated the bead.

[.RJ]

The people that are interested in pushing this are trying to spin all sorts of nonsense about how hooks are redundant and benefit the consumer - I am not buying it, at least not yet, and not from the same industry that thought press fit 30 and shoving cables through headsets is a good idea - its all cost savings on the manufacturing end, nothing else.

Its really not ready when the margin of error is less than the accuracy of most floor pumps, or you have to get out a spreadsheet to determine tire and wheel compatibility.

Lawyer tabs, limit screws and brake pad retaining screws/pins are also redundant, but there's a reason they all exist.

[GregL]

Every time I read one of these threads (hookless rims/tubeless tires for paved road riding), I smile and think how glad I am to be riding conventional clinchers on hooked rims. No fuss, no drama, and very few flats. Am I giving away a few watts to more “modern” tubeless setups? Sure. But apparently not enough watts to keep me off masters podiums. My mantra: to finish first, you first must finish.

Greg

[bicycletricycle]

+1

Originally Posted by gregl

every time i read one of these threads (hookless rims/tubeless tires for paved road riding), i smile and think how glad i am to be riding conventional clinchers on hooked rims. No fuss, no drama, and very few flats. Am i giving away a few watts to more “modern” tubeless setups? Sure. But apparently not enough watts to keep me off masters podiums. My mantra: To finish first, you first must finish.

Greg

[AngryScientist]

True or false: There are no hookless rim brake rims ?

[bigbill]

My newest carbon road wheels are hooked. I didn't even consider hookless because I am certain that I can find a replacement tubeless tire in most bike shops. They currently have 28mm Panaracer Agilest tubeless.

I hear good things about hookless MTB rims but I have two good sets of wheels with no need of upgrading.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

True or false: There are no hookless rim brake rims ?

Well, Cadex has two hookless rim brake wheel sets:

Cadex 42 Tubeless wheels
Cadex 65 tubeless wheels