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  #31  
Old 03-06-2017, 08:29 AM
sandyrs sandyrs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belopsky View Post
Do you remember what kind and what length stems?

Here is a bad photo of my Bob Jackson 21"

2017-03-06_07-15-12 by belopolsky.igor, on Flickr
It looks like your fit is very different from many of the bikes shown in this thread. Your bike has the bars almost level with the saddle. Absolutely nothing wrong with that, but comparing your fit to Mackers et al's is apples and oranges because their saddle and bars are just in a different position relative to one another.

If you like the fit and handling of your Bob Jackson but want less seatpost showing (not that I think there's too much- it looks just fine to me), there are plenty of custom builders who will build you a bike with a higher top tube but otherwise similar geometry, keeping the bars and wheels in the same place. Many are as affordable as a nice stock frame too.
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  #32  
Old 03-06-2017, 08:41 AM
belopsky belopsky is offline
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Originally Posted by sandyrs View Post
It looks like your fit is very different from many of the bikes shown in this thread. Your bike has the bars almost level with the saddle. Absolutely nothing wrong with that, but comparing your fit to Mackers et al's is apples and oranges because their saddle and bars are just in a different position relative to one another.

If you like the fit and handling of your Bob Jackson but want less seatpost showing (not that I think there's too much- it looks just fine to me), there are plenty of custom builders who will build you a bike with a higher top tube but otherwise similar geometry, keeping the bars and wheels in the same place. Many are as affordable as a nice stock frame too.
Not really trying to compare apples to oranges.

I also wonder how some of you ride with such large drops and not feel so much weight on your hands?
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  #33  
Old 03-06-2017, 10:08 PM
giordana93 giordana93 is offline
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Originally Posted by belopsky View Post
Not really trying to compare apples to oranges.

I also wonder how some of you ride with such large drops and not feel so much weight on your hands?
(will treat this as partial answer to your other thread since similar topic)

1. custom frames are nice and all, but it's not that hard to track down a production frame that will fit, given the evolution of the road bike market towards:

a) fewer sizes overall that fit most bodies with longer seatposts, flipping stems and other componentry adjustment. doesn't always yield the prettiest result from the aesthetic side of things, but that is fashion/eye of the beholder. If ride quality is there, who gives a hoot?

b) "endurance," "comfort road," or gran fondo bikes that are now probably the majority of those sold. compared to the old race geometry style, these offer a taller head tube and shorter top tube (& maybe a longer wheel base) that work well for someone with long legs and short torso. a taller head tube keeps the drop manageable without resorting to a jacked up stem; short top tube fits the shorter torso (btw, this is the origin of women-specific design)

2. regarding larger drops: long arms need it for sure, so there is that, but especially for faster riding, some people adopt a more forward roll of the hip that results in a lower front end and a good amount of drop. There actually is not that much pressure on the hands because of 2 factors: the rider's weight is shifted a bit rearward so s/he is balanced (which is why finding your fore-aft saddle position is key), and 2, with an effort from harder riding, the legs bear most of the weight. think of the extreme example of sprinting where there is actually negative pressure on the hands--one pulls up on the bars.

Finally, your Bob Jackson is a traditonal horizontal top tube. The same "size" bike in a modern sloping frame would have much more seatpost showing. (draw a horizontal line on the Giant and see how it looks) You have a decent amount showing as is, and your stem and hood combo gives a fair amount of reach, esp. for someone on the shorter torso side. You would tolerate more drop if the reach were shorter.

long story short, you could almost certainly find an endurance-geo bike that fits well. there are not too many made today with a genuine horizontal top tube though. sloping geometry allows more people to fit on fewer sizes à la XS-S-M-L-XL. You can either embrace that--try a M/54 or so--or dig up some vintage bike like your Jackson; or find a builder whose work you dig and choose every detail down to color and braze-ons. no bad answer
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  #34  
Old 03-07-2017, 06:20 AM
belopsky belopsky is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giordana93 View Post
(will treat this as partial answer to your other thread since similar topic)

1. custom frames are nice and all, but it's not that hard to track down a production frame that will fit, given the evolution of the road bike market towards:

a) fewer sizes overall that fit most bodies with longer seatposts, flipping stems and other componentry adjustment. doesn't always yield the prettiest result from the aesthetic side of things, but that is fashion/eye of the beholder. If ride quality is there, who gives a hoot?

b) "endurance," "comfort road," or gran fondo bikes that are now probably the majority of those sold. compared to the old race geometry style, these offer a taller head tube and shorter top tube (& maybe a longer wheel base) that work well for someone with long legs and short torso. a taller head tube keeps the drop manageable without resorting to a jacked up stem; short top tube fits the shorter torso (btw, this is the origin of women-specific design)

2. regarding larger drops: long arms need it for sure, so there is that, but especially for faster riding, some people adopt a more forward roll of the hip that results in a lower front end and a good amount of drop. There actually is not that much pressure on the hands because of 2 factors: the rider's weight is shifted a bit rearward so s/he is balanced (which is why finding your fore-aft saddle position is key), and 2, with an effort from harder riding, the legs bear most of the weight. think of the extreme example of sprinting where there is actually negative pressure on the hands--one pulls up on the bars.

Finally, your Bob Jackson is a traditonal horizontal top tube. The same "size" bike in a modern sloping frame would have much more seatpost showing. (draw a horizontal line on the Giant and see how it looks) You have a decent amount showing as is, and your stem and hood combo gives a fair amount of reach, esp. for someone on the shorter torso side. You would tolerate more drop if the reach were shorter.

long story short, you could almost certainly find an endurance-geo bike that fits well. there are not too many made today with a genuine horizontal top tube though. sloping geometry allows more people to fit on fewer sizes à la XS-S-M-L-XL. You can either embrace that--try a M/54 or so--or dig up some vintage bike like your Jackson; or find a builder whose work you dig and choose every detail down to color and braze-ons. no bad answer
Yes, hear you loud and clear. I suppose my question would be better phrased as - if I want to adhere to horizontal top tube and traditional geometry, are there any production frames (old and new) that would work. From looking and looking, seems like Italian frames have longer seat tubes than top tubes? I've often seen 54st 53tt which would be perfect for me with a 100mm stem.

Otherwise all the seat tubes are shorter than top tubes, unless the frame is about a 55 where I've often seen more square geometries.

And as an aside, I am not worried not want more drop, just wondering and I think you've explained this well!
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  #35  
Old 03-07-2017, 06:49 PM
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bocobiking bocobiking is offline
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Not a solution for everyone, but the geometries and fitting style of the 70s and 80s have always worked the best for me: shorter top tubes relative to seat tube length, and less seatpost so it's easier to have less seat-to-bar drop. As I said, not everyone would want this fit or this look, but I like both.

I've posted this bike before, but it illustrates the point.
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  #36  
Old 03-09-2017, 04:05 PM
belopsky belopsky is offline
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Originally Posted by bocobiking View Post
Not a solution for everyone, but the geometries and fitting style of the 70s and 80s have always worked the best for me: shorter top tubes relative to seat tube length, and less seatpost so it's easier to have less seat-to-bar drop. As I said, not everyone would want this fit or this look, but I like both.

I've posted this bike before, but it illustrates the point.
I like the look. My bob jackson is close to that, though I'd like less post showing, but in order to do that I'd have to get a bigger frame and run a smaller stem. up above you see a 90mm Grand Cru stem
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