Jonas Vingegaard Breaks Collarbone & several ribs

[Ewiser]

[m_sasso]

Originally Posted by GregL

Cut It looks ugly. As cyclingnews reported, that turn has tree roots underlying the pavement. High speed turn with significant bumps - what could possibly go wrong?

Greg

And all those faster, low pressure, fat tires, 25's+ did nothing for attenuation and traction on this road surface and corner. Good to hear no one lost their life.

[nmrt]

Wow! Tire width has been brought up.
I posit that if they were running higher pressures and narrower tires, attenuation and traction would have been even less.

Originally Posted by m_sasso

And all those faster, low pressure, fat tires, 25's+ did nothing for attenuation and traction on this road surface and corner. Good to hear no one lost their life.

[GregL]

I don’t think any road bike tire at any pressure would have made a difference. Even a motorcycle would have been knocked off its line on that bumpy corner. I’m thankful no one was killed and that the reported injuries have good chances of healing completely.

Greg

[trener1]

I gotta say, some snotty remark about wider tires is completely uncalled for in this thread.

There is definitely a time and place for sarcasm, I am totally fine with it, but this thread in not the place for it.

[merckxman]

Bumpy, too fast, course easier with many riders at high level...

https://youtu.be/kEhK_qryPnc?si=yGJUPI7nfxyaY75H

[45K10]

Who do you think Jumbo picks as the leader of the TDF?
Jorgenson, Kuss, someone else?

I would be very surprised in Jonas is back in time to get in any kind of shape for the TDF.

[merckx]

Originally Posted by 45K10

Who do you think Jumbo picks as the leader of the TDF?
Jorgenson, Kuss, someone else?

I would be very surprised in Jonas is back in time to get in any kind of shape for the TDF.

I've submitted my application.

[Ewiser]

[benb]

Originally Posted by GregL

I don’t think any road bike tire at any pressure would have made a difference. Even a motorcycle would have been knocked off its line on that bumpy corner. I’m thankful no one was killed and that the reported injuries have good chances of healing completely.

Greg

Kind of a stretch. A motorcycle would crash if the rider overcooked the corner or panicked and grabbed the brakes just like these guys overcooked the corner.

But there is no way a motorcycle can't negotiate that corner at a very high speed. Especially a sportbike with good suspension.

Many of these riders on their road bikes successfully negotiated it at the same speed as the guys who crashed.

We have no idea if the guys who started the chain grabbed the brakes or something.

Most of the riders accounts say they just screwed up.

The lead rider has no problems and looks very relaxed. Anytime you are following someone and they are fine and you crash behind them it is a huge stretch to say the corner was impossible to ride through.

[GregL]

Originally Posted by benb

Kind of a stretch. A motorcycle would crash if the rider overcooked the corner or panicked and grabbed the brakes just like these guys overcooked the corner.

But there is no way a motorcycle can't negotiate that corner at a very high speed. Especially a sportbike with good suspension.

Many of these riders on their road bikes successfully negotiated it at the same speed as the guys who crashed.

We have no idea if the guys who started the chain grabbed the brakes or something.

Most of the riders accounts say they just screwed up.

The lead rider has no problems and looks very relaxed. Anytime you are following someone and they are fine and you crash behind them it is a huge stretch to say the corner was impossible to ride through.

Respectfully, you're stretching and reading into my words.

I didn't say a motorcycle couldn't negotiate the corner. I suggested it's line would have been altered by the bumpy corner.

I never mentioned the racers' bike handling skills. I just offered my opinion that tire width/pressure had little or nothing to do with yesterday's crashes.

The lead rider has more options when choosing their line than those that follow. Racing in a pack is much different than riding/racing solo or when following someone single file. The lines may be considerably different for those in the pack. If you've ever raced a road bike, I'm sure you know this.

Greg

[benb]

Originally Posted by GregL

Respectfully, you're stretching and reading into my words.

I didn't say a motorcycle couldn't negotiate the corner. I suggested it's line would have been altered by the bumpy corner.

I never mentioned the racers' bike handling skills. I just offered my opinion that tire width/pressure had little or nothing to do with yesterday's crashes.

The lead rider has more options when choosing their line than those that follow. Racing in a pack is much different than riding/racing solo or when following someone single file. The lines may be considerably different for those in the pack. If you've ever raced a road bike, I'm sure you know this.

Greg

I have raced. The video footage is too bad IMO to tell how bumpy the corner is.

But when 99% of the Peloton goes through the corner at full speed just fine it's not road conditions. Whatever bumps are there in part of the corner lots of people went over those bumps without crashing.

And a performance motorcycle is much more akin to a F/S mountain bike when it comes to getting knocked off the line. The limits over bumps are in a different universe compared to a road bike.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by GregL

Respectfully, you're stretching and reading into my words.

I didn't say a motorcycle couldn't negotiate the corner. I suggested it's line would have been altered by the bumpy corner.

I never mentioned the racers' bike handling skills. I just offered my opinion that tire width/pressure had little or nothing to do with yesterday's crashes.

The lead rider has more options when choosing their line than those that follow. Racing in a pack is much different than riding/racing solo or when following someone single file. The lines may be considerably different for those in the pack. If you've ever raced a road bike, I'm sure you know this.

Greg

I agree with this assessment. It's not exactly the same but we often see when the roads are wet, a whole bunch of riders going through a corner just fine, and then one rider who appears to be cornering just the same as everyone else happens to hit a bit of pavement. That is a little bit slipperier than the rest and slides out. No way to really know in advance.

I think something very similar could have happened here, where there were a few bumps in the road, most of the riders missed them, but all it takes is one rider hitting the wrong bump at the wrong angle to mess up his corner and it can start cascading through the peloton.

[Permanent socks]

The modern age of the internet sure does have a lot of experts!! Haha

They should race slower?!
All corners should be free of any danger...?!

If these attitudes keep up it won't be long before uci world tour races are only virtual.

But then what about the indoor air quality??!

[GregL]

Originally Posted by Permanent socks

The modern age of the internet sure does have a lot of experts!! Haha

They should race slower?!
All corners should be free of any danger...?!

If these attitudes keep up it won't be long before uci world tour races are only virtual.

But then what about the indoor air quality??!

Funny you should mention this. I know several riders in my local area who would rather race on Zwift than in real life. It shows in their bike handling skills when they venture outside. Personally, I'd be happy if they stayed indoors - it would keep the rest of us safer! The double-edged sword of virtual racing: it is bringing some new racers to the sport, but they may not have some of the skills necessary for racing in the real world. I'll be leading a new racer clinic for my team in a few weeks. We'll be teaching new racers fundamentals of racing in a pack, including cornering, sprinting, attacking, and team tactics.

Greg