The TdF Bikes...Interesting Thoughts on Fit, Design and Marketing

[Jason E]

Originally Posted by Gummee

I don't bend like that any more. Middle age done did me in

M

... You know, as opposed to a 23 year old professional athlete....

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[fogrider]

Originally Posted by chengher87

I know Sagan's Cannondale is custom fitted to his body. I believe his frame is fairly asymmetric (even by Cannondale standards and from what I've read not mass produced). I assume the "stars" get theirs and the rest make do.

the top riders get custom bikes built by builders, they use the same basic materials but they are built for the rider by a builder and not a factory worker in Asia. look at Cav's bike, pretty sure you can't find that at the dealer. the domestique's bikes are another story. and yes, even pros crash when going hard and fast with 50 close friend on roads they're not familiar with. it's crazy that Contador crashed because he hit a pothole...I'm I the only one that thinks someone should have at least patched that?

[sante pollastri]

Originally Posted by fogrider

the top riders get custom bikes built by builders, they use the same basic materials but they are built for the rider by a builder and not a factory worker in Asia. look at Cav's bike, pretty sure you can't find that at the dealer. the domestique's bikes are another story. and yes, even pros crash when going hard and fast with 50 close friend on roads they're not familiar with. it's crazy that Contador crashed because he hit a pothole...I'm I the only one that thinks someone should have at least patched that?

No,you are wrong,it's made in Asia,and not by a phantom framebuilder.
Only big factories can do hi tech carbon frames.

[sante pollastri]

Originally Posted by beeatnik

http://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum...tml#post408667

According to the opinion of Mr Sachs:

I think many of the positions in the pro peloton are atrocious. There's way too much weight too far ahead of the central movement. Most cats have their hands way too low in space to negotiate very much at high speeds. And I think the frame styles, being as small as they are, exacerbate many of the handling problems. Oh, and a lot of the industrial made bicycles have front centers that seem too short, and matching rears as well. That last part is an observation, not an opinion based on measuring a cross section of bicycles atmo.

Problem is that mr Sachs hasn't got experience in pro races,he only watch tv and pics,like us.
Big factories are in the play from a lot of years,and develop new frames with the pro's feedbacks.
Race is not about static elegance....

[soulspinner]

To me we have arrived at a point where some frames seem too stiff and dont ride over irregularities in the road with the same control a bike with the right amount of flex (for a given rider). Rain combined with bad roads at high speeds only makes the situation more sketchy.......or skittery (is that a word?) YMMV

[Peter P.]

I think Happy is making some bizarre claims about fit that have no merit.

99% of us AND PRO CYCLISTS can fit stock frames.

I WILL suggest as others have, that carbon wheels, with their poorer heat dissipation and subsequent poorer braking, can be a contributing factor. It's likely a partial reason for the push for road disc brakes.

The newer frame designs with the longer, lower, stem slammed position could also be a contributor. I question the ability to see comfortably down the road and all around you for long periods of time when you have to crane your neck more with these bikes. It could explain the "Chris Froome Stem Staring" phenomenon.

[fuzzalow]

I agree with the OP on one his points that the current bikes are better for the marketers rather than the fit of the riders. But that does not make automatic that a pro rider cannot be made to fit into a stock frame geometry. It can be done but it doesn't have to be pretty, it just has to work. The bike setups can look cartoonish because some of the riders must cram themselves into the smallest frame sizes in order to get the bar drop they require - too much headtube is a hard point chassis restriction that is impossible to get around. So there is no choice but to go a smaller frame size and extend the contact points outwards with maximum stem lengths and saddle setbacks.

It does not help if the bike manufacturer sponsor makes bikes with longer headtubes to sell to the general public and also expects the same geometry from these molds to be used to fit a pro who rides in the manner of long 'n' low. Trying to make that incompatibility work is how you get the slammed 160mm stem. I don't follow the trends in how the big manufacturers spec bikes but it seem logical if they want to sell bikes that they gotta be made high in the front end - aging demographic at play here.

Sorry to sound like a broken record here but I feel obligated to say it: if you rely on core strength and flexibility to ride a drop bar bicycle, you are riding in a manner that is injurious to your long term health in your ability to be a sport cyclist. You will most assuredly not be riding in this way as your age advances - your spinal discs will diminish in flexibility and the abuse of riding with a curved spine will drive the frontend of your bike to get higher and higher if you continue riding in the way that has always been.

My observation from last years TdF re: Froome is that he is simply a gangly, inelegant rider that pedals a bike with power but not grace. Froome does not run much length and bar drop that I can see so his staring at his stem is just his unique quirk and not a response to him being torsoed-horizontal, as it were. IMO Richie Porte has a far better fit & position and form on his bike than Froome. And also Sir Bradley the year before that.

[firerescuefin]

Originally Posted by sante pollastri

Problem is that mr Sachs hasn't got experience in pro races,he only watch tv and pics,like us.
Big factories are in the play from a lot of years,and develop new frames with the pro's feedbacks.
Race is not about static elegance....

Your opinions are very strong, often times borderline offensive., and your statement about Richard is ignorant.

[fuzzalow]

Originally Posted by firerescuefin

Your opinions are very strong, often times borderline offensive., and your statement about Richard is ignorant.

Don't worry about it. sante is just prodding for a reaction. That form of irritant is learned behavior that plays well ATH. Here in these hallows, not so well.

[Climb01742]

All this makes the approach that colnago took for years look very smart: a zillion sizes of his c bikes with usually 1cm increments and tube+lug construction to make custom at least possible in carbon. Ernesto understood racing and fit apparently.

[sante pollastri]

Originally Posted by firerescuefin

Your opinions are very strong, often times borderline offensive., and your statement about Richard is ignorant.

be quiet,Little boy,and try to write something with sense.

[sante pollastri]

Originally Posted by fuzzalow

Don't worry about it. sante is just prodding for a reaction. That form of irritant is learned behavior that plays well ATH. Here in these hallows, not so well.

my biographer.....

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by sante pollastri

Problem is that mr Sachs hasn't got experience in pro races,he only watch tv and pics,like us.
Big factories are in the play from a lot of years,and develop new frames with the pro's feedbacks.
Race is not about static elegance....

wow...I guess the internet was late to Italia...and google...and manners...and......

Big factories, who want to make a bunch of $....none is Europe, BTW--the really nice corporate offices are tho, with pretty receptionists, 'sorry, Mr Colnago is out to luuch, he will be back in 4 hours'....

[Gummee]

Originally Posted by Jason E

... You know, as opposed to a 23 year old professional athlete....

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

The point still stands: when you're relying on 130, 140, and up to 165mm stems (check the pics on most of the cycling websites) to make a frame fit, handling suffers. Too much weight in the wrong spots for the frame design = bad.

Ditto with fitting people using super short stems.

I get that running lots of drop is 'the pro thing to do' but when guys that are 6' + are riding frames smaller than I'm on at 5'8" something's gotta give.

M

[sante pollastri]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

wow...I guess the internet was late to Italia...and google...and manners...and......

Big factories, who want to make a bunch of $....none is Europe, BTW--the really nice corporate offices are tho, with pretty receptionists, 'sorry, Mr Colnago is out to luuch, he will be back in 4 hours'....

I'm sorry,but I can't reply to a clown plenty of campy tattoos.