Another Wahoo Kickr question

[makoti]

To use this thing with Campy, you have to change the freehub. The Official one costs $70. Is there an unofficial version? Will the one I use with my Powertaps work? It looks the same. I realize this is a bit doubtful, but if anyone knows of a less expensive way to do this, I'd love to know.
Thanks.

[Hank Scorpio]

This is one of the reasons I was put off buying the kickr. You spend over 1k for a trainer and then the company nickel and dimes you for small parts that should be included like the speed/cadence sensor and the campy freehub. Both together add over $100 to an already pricey device. Why not just sell a campy version out of the box or offer a credit for the returned shimano freehub. I just checked their site and see that they are also selling refurb'd units as well. They have been around what one year? And they ready have enough refurbs that they can offer them for sale? Rut roh!

[kramnnim]

Could you just use a Shimano 11sp cassette?

[dekindy]

Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio

This is one of the reasons I was put off buying the kickr. You spend over 1k for a trainer and then the company nickel and dimes you for small parts that should be included like the speed/cadence sensor and the campy freehub. Both together add over $100 to an already pricey device. Why not just sell a campy version out of the box or offer a credit for the returned shimano freehub. I just checked their site and see that they are also selling refurb'd units as well. They have been around what one year? And they ready have enough refurbs that they can offer them for sale? Rut roh!

You are definitely not with the trainer market. All the other product offerings do the same thing, are more expensive, and proprietary. Besides, a lot of folks already have their own sensors and monitors. Unbundling has been the norm in about every industry for a long time now.

My buddy did get a defective unit and had to return it. Probably just a misadjusted sensor. These units are replacing Computrainers in applications that users go to workout centers and pay per session or package fees to use; so with high volume usage some may be back for refurbishing? Anyway, thanks for the tip as I will look at the refurbished models as I was not aware of them!

[thirdgenbird]

Originally Posted by kramnnim

Could you just use a Shimano 11sp cassette?

Not if you use 10spd

A shimano 9spd cassettes and some adjustments may work ok for campy 10.

[JasonF]

I just bought a Kickr and have only 2 workouts on it but so far find it a useful tool to maintain fitness when I'm time-crunched and can't ride outdoors.

The unit works great with Trainerroad so that the Kickr is controlled by the Trainerroad workout selected. In other words, leaving the Kickr in "erg" mode allows it to be controlled by Trainerroad and resistance is automatically and seamlessly adjusted based on the particular watts the workout calls for.

I'm using the Campy freehub and was also a little annoyed that there was an upcharge for it as it seems they could simply ship a unit and include the appropriate freehub body to be installed by the end user. Anyway, I think you could get away using the provided Shimano cassette especially since you can leave the bike in a single gear and let the Kickr control resistance. In this way, the typical problems associated with using a Shimano cassette with Campy is irrelevant (e.g., poor shifting, differently spaced cogs, etc...)

[dekindy]

Originally Posted by JasonF

IAnyway, I think you could get away using the provided Shimano cassette especially since you can leave the bike in a single gear and let the Kickr control resistance. In this way, the typical problems associated with using a Shimano cassette with Campy is irrelevant (e.g., poor shifting, differently spaced cogs, etc...)

You would have to explain this to me as not having to use the gearing to change resistance and being able to have the appropriate gear and cadence for the resistance is what I would consider a major advantage for these types of trainers. I need help with climbing.

[makoti]

Originally Posted by thirdgenbird

Not if you use 10spd

A shimano 9spd cassettes and some adjustments may work ok for campy 10.

And that is the situation. Campy 10. Plus, if you do use Shimano 11, you need to get an adapter for that to work. It's only 9/10 right now.

[makoti]

Originally Posted by JasonF

I just bought a Kickr and have only 2 workouts on it but so far find it a useful tool to maintain fitness when I'm time-crunched and can't ride outdoors.

The unit works great with Trainerroad so that the Kickr is controlled by the Trainerroad workout selected. In other words, leaving the Kickr in "erg" mode allows it to be controlled by Trainerroad and resistance is automatically and seamlessly adjusted based on the particular watts the workout calls for.

I'm using the Campy freehub and was also a little annoyed that there was an upcharge for it as it seems they could simply ship a unit and include the appropriate freehub body to be installed by the end user. Anyway, I think you could get away using the provided Shimano cassette especially since you can leave the bike in a single gear and let the Kickr control resistance. In this way, the typical problems associated with using a Shimano cassette with Campy is irrelevant (e.g., poor shifting, differently spaced cogs, etc...)

Hadn't thought of this, but I'd think that you'd want to be able to change gears at some point.

[kramnnim]

Oops, I forgot about you C10 users...

And yeah, you don't really need to shift if you use Erg mode. It automatically adjusts the resistance, regardless of your cadence, etc.

[BSBD]

Originally Posted by JasonF

I just bought a Kickr and have only 2 workouts on it but so far find it a useful tool to maintain fitness when I'm time-crunched and can't ride outdoors.

The unit works great with Trainerroad so that the Kickr is controlled by the Trainerroad workout selected. In other words, leaving the Kickr in "erg" mode allows it to be controlled by Trainerroad and resistance is automatically and seamlessly adjusted based on the particular watts the workout calls for.

I'm using the Campy freehub and was also a little annoyed that there was an upcharge for it as it seems they could simply ship a unit and include the appropriate freehub body to be installed by the end user. Anyway, I think you could get away using the provided Shimano cassette especially since you can leave the bike in a single gear and let the Kickr control resistance. In this way, the typical problems associated with using a Shimano cassette with Campy is irrelevant (e.g., poor shifting, differently spaced cogs, etc...)

However, you are going to want to go off "erg" mode on occasion to do FTP tests if that's important to you.

I kind of went through some of this recently as I have a Powerbeam Pro I picked up last year. I think it is a great unit but the software that they have contracted out (Virtual Training) is nice but very rough around the edges. I think Trainer Road is the far better solution. The biggest thing for me as I run power on the bike (Stages) and still wanted to run the "erg" functionality of the trainer which Virtual Training can't do. Virtual Training only lets you select one or the other. Additionally, even though Stages provides cadence, Virtual Training couldn't cleave that off the Power packets coming from the arm so I would've had to run another cadence sensor, which I could never get working consistently. This was in addition to their support just giving up on the case.

Trainer Road I like because I can have it control the trainer, get the power from the power meter, and actually provides feedback over the ANT+ pairing so you can see what is going on whereas on VT it's kind of an anybodies guess affair. Also, their training plans and work outs are nicer than anything I saw on VT. As a FYI, I tried both their iPad and Windows versions.

[makoti]

To answer my own question...Yes, you must use their freehub to make it work. Pisses me off, but that's it.
And they do have refurbs for $900. Just got one with the hub for $970, so about $130 less than a new one without the hub. Comes with a 1 year warranty, same as new.

[Hank Scorpio]

I was using Trainerroad this past winter with rollers and it is somewhat difficult to get a really hard workout in because you cant just jump on and blast away. Well probably some people could but I am not that great at rollers yet. I wanted to buy a device that would offer a more consistent workout without having to worry about launching myself into the dresser during hard efforts.

DC rainmaker has the best comparison of trainers I was able to find. I was intrigued by the ability of TR to control the Kickr but there are few complaints of it not working that well in the TR discussion forum. That was a while ago so I am sure a lot of the bugs have been worked out by now. It seems that all of the power based trainers (powerbeam, kickr, lemond revolution, b'kool) have drawbacks that are either hardware or software related. I guess I should look into the Kickr again and just continue to use my garmin speed and cadence sensor.

[Hank Scorpio]

I have a semi related question. If you could only purchase one or the other would it be better to purchase a Powertap wheel and normal non powered trainer or a power based unit like the Kickr? I understand the pt wheel will be more versatile in the long run as it can be used outside but would the indoor training benefits of the Kickr be better?

[kramnnim]

Power meter would be better.