OT: Need a new laptop

[ceolwulf]

Oh, don't think it's been mentioned yet but, if you go Mac always buy refurb from the Apple refurb store. Warranty is same, machines are tested more thoroughly than new, cases are new (I believe ... maybe someone can confirm or deny), and prices are quite a bit less.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by OtayBW

I was with you right up to this point....

Mac maybe tres chic in the Boulder cafe's, but they don't work for everybody....

Originally Posted by AJosiahK

Ive not used to newer generations of PCs and am not opposed to it but have naturally gravitated towards Apple stuff and just like their OS etc better.

[/QUOTE]

What people do in cafes have nothing to do with the OP saying he prefers an Apple.

[OtayBW]

^ It's just forum dialogue, Peter. Relax....

[fuzzalow]

Originally Posted by OtayBW

^ It's just forum dialogue, Peter. Relax....

Wanna know what'll take the edge off of the bitter bipartisan Apple & Microsoft rancor underlying every one of these type of discussions? $20k divied up as 100 shares of AAPL and 100 shares of MSFT. Now you've got skin in the game, now you've got a reason to understand their core businesses and their approach and challenges. And you cheer like hell for both sides to win 'till you're sick of winning - while you build wealth in the process. Everybody wins.

I'm not kidding.

[Rada]

Originally Posted by fuzzalow

But for most of the world, their exposure to computing is in effect through their interactions with their smartphone. And with the smartphone as new-age proxy for computer use - Apple is still the dominant OS. So we certainly agree on the downward curve as to overall desktop & laptop usage numbers as a proportion of the personal technology landscape. Heck, every online bank wants me to trade securities on my iPhone. What does the average consumer need a desktop for? Which means that demand curve degradation has laptops following just closely behind the desktop cousins.

No love or hate for AAPL or MSFT, I'm long both.

Not correct concerning smart phones either. Android OS has a huge share lead over Apple OS. Guess what kernel Android's OS is based on? Technically Apples' OS is not in the top two most used.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ating-systems/

[froze]

If you're use to the Apple operating system then stay with what you know, plus the Apple has the most reliable computers.

Personally I never cared much for Apple operating system plus having been in the business world for 40 plus years I grew up on dos and evolved all the way through the various changes to Windows 10 (which I don't really care for), just never had the need to learn Mac OS so it's alien to me.

But if you're not going to be messing in the business world stay with what you know.

[fuzzalow]

Originally Posted by Rada

Not correct concerning smart phones either. Android OS has a huge share lead over Apple OS. Guess what kernel Android's OS is based on? Technically Apples' OS is not in the top two most used.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ating-systems/

You're missing the context. This thread was Macs versus Windows laptops. Not Chromebook or Chrome OS on a Dell/HP/etc.

Android therefore is not in the discussion when I was making and extended point concerning the laptop wars of Macs versus Windows as spilling over into the AAPL-MSFT proxy war involving smartphones and their corresponding OSes.

That's all for me on this one. The tedium is killin' me. See you at the next stop.

[tbike4]

I used to work in photography/design and NOBODY used a PC. I think it was against the law. A giant G-5 on every desk. The trash can looking Mac pro that replaced it hasn't had an upgrade in years. I am not sure what design pros use now, maybe a souped up PC.

I work in IT now and we use 27" iMacs since most of what we do is web based. I run Parallels with Windows 7 for the software only written for Windows. I have a Mac Book Pro at home and a PC at home with Windows 10 and boy it bugs me. I had 2 BSOD just yesterday. Once while merely trying to shut down.

The answer for the OP is: Cake is better than pie, sometimes.

[Rada]

Originally Posted by fuzzalow

You're missing the context. This thread was Macs versus Windows laptops. Not Chromebook or Chrome OS on a Dell/HP/etc.

Android therefore is not in the discussion when I was making and extended point concerning the laptop wars of Macs versus Windows as spilling over into the AAPL-MSFT proxy war involving smartphones and their corresponding OSes.

That's all for me on this one. The tedium is killin' me. See you at the next stop.

I did not miss the context, merely pointing out that you made an incorrect statement.

[Rada]

It's always easiest to stick with what you know and are comfortable with. I dropped off MS in 2007 with XP getting old. I Tried OSX 10.5 and really wanted to like it, but gave it up. Sold the Apple to a friend and built up my own computer and loaded it with Ubuntu. I've moved on from Ubuntu, but I'm sold on Linux and open source. Personally I believe my devices should adapt to me, not the other way around.

[Johnny Alien]

Originally Posted by ftf

That doesn't change the fact that apple has never, not once, broken 10% in the desktop/laptop market, ever, they are the esoteric fringe, period, as they are, "intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest."

This is true worldwide but in the USA macOS has been over 10% for awhile. If you take the "desktop" out of that and look at OS alone (which includes mobile OS's) then Apple not only breaks 10% but has a higher percentage than Windows. So there are more people using an Apple created OS then there are people using a Windows based OS. Apple is no longer a niche company. The desktop is a declining product though which will continue. If Apple laptops and desktops were more affordable you would see their percentage increase in that market as well. The bottom line is that Jobs was a pioneer in computer usability and purpose and the current leaders are not. They play catch up and rest on their reputation. Is the hardware great? Absolutely. But there are plenty of Windows products that are as good and better.

[tylercheung]

that being said, Apple never goes for market share - that battle is brutal and you are competing with a huge landscape of Asian manufacturers who are racing to the bottom and making PC's with no margin at all. Their goal are differentiated machines that are really well suited for specific tasks, and boast design and tech features that differentiate from everyone else.

They are opinionated machines, and it really goes towards you either like them or you don't, but they won't compromise their vision for the machine to please everyone. They tried to do that in the 90's and it pretty much almost killed them. It killed everyone else - Dell had to go private and is a shell of itself, Gateway is dead and IBM dropped PC manufacturing like a hot potato to Lenovo...and it is telling that Lenovo isn't doing that great in a market where Huawei and a whole panoply of no-name manufacturers in shenzhen can sell you a "good enough" PC for $100-200 USD. The other makers will happily make you a machine where any single spec is better than Apple's, but as a whole, are inferior.

Apple's profit share of the laptop industry...that part they are doing quite well. And for the money, the value you get out of it is still very much worth it over the competition for most people, especially if you are familiar with their app ecosystem. For other people...the rest of the PC market is approaching a purely competitive market and there are a plethora of choices.

[tylercheung]

Originally Posted by Rada

I did not miss the context, merely pointing out that you made an incorrect statement.

One can argue that MSFT vs Apple is irrelevant...these days, MSFT is very much a services company, and their biggest competitor is Google, or maybe Amazon. MSFT and Google are very much courting Apple's customers who provide most of the profits in the apps/services space. I would say they are way more interdependent than competitors in many ways these days. In the Nadella era, if you use MS Azure, Office 365, One Drive, etc, they could care less whether the OS/Laptop is a MacBook or a Win10 book. The irony is that MS may nowadays be pouring more engineering resources into Linux than Win 10 what with all the competition being on deep learning, cloud services, etc. It is a bloody fight to the death between the companies mentioned above, vs. now the Alibaba, Baidu, Tencent, etc.

[froze]

I've said this earlier but I'm not a fan of Windows 10, I liked Vista, never had any problems with it and it much easier to navigate; also with Win 10 I'm suppose to buy office 360 at a cost of $99 a year...that's BS! Right now I'm using Microsoft office 2010 which I've had since 2010 and never have to pay an annual fee. I have sneaky feeling that when I have to replace this computer and be forced to get Windows 12 (or whatever it will be called) MS will make sure that any previous Office suites will not function at all and we'll be forced to buy into their yearly plan. At that point I will be going to Linux and use their open source office suites, and say screw you MS. As it is I'm real tired of them constantly changing Windows, and if they eliminate being able to use older programs that will be the last straw for me. There are some programs I have that I can't even use with Win 10, but fortunately they're not important ones or I would have switched to Linux this last time.

I don't think Mac OS has this issue, maybe someone with Mac OS can say yay or nay to that, but that is another option for me when the time comes is to go to Apple, but I think going with a Linux and a PC will be less expensive.

[wc1934]

don't buy a Toshiba - they are in financial crisis - might not be in business for long - most conglomerate's are becoming dinosaurs.

http://money.cnn.com/2017/04/11/inve...ghouse-crisis/