Pedal stroke- toes down??

[sjbraun]

I went for a 45 mile ride with my wife this morning. She's trying get back in cycling shape so we can enjoy the El Grupo Fall Fundo in mid-November. (Due to some ridiculous work demands, she pretty much gave up riding for the last year.) Riding behind her today, I noticed her toes point down at the bottom of her pedal stroke. In contrast, my foot is pretty flat at the bottom of the pedal rotation.

Do pointed toes impede her? Not sure if I should try to "correct" a bad habit/fit or if cyclists simply have different pedaling styles.

Thanks

-Steve

For more info on El Grupo, follow the link. They are an outstanding youth cycling organization and add considerably to the cycling culture in Tucson

http://www.elgrupocycling.org/

[FlashUNC]

Pointed toes worked for this guy, who seemed to do well for himself...

[berserk87]

I have seen a lot of different pedaling styles over the years. As people differ in their anatomical makeup, I think that pedaling style is an individual thing.

That being said, there are some riders out there that might benefit from some tweaking, particularly if they are having pain with the way they are currently set up.

You can see a wide variety of toes down vs. flat foot in the pro peloton, and those folks can all ride.

What is best a compromise between the position maximizes efficiency and/or power output, but allows for comfort enough to be able ride for whatever time period is required.

[thirdgenbird]

I ride toes down too. I think I read somewhere that it is a trait more common in women than men.

This guy seems to make it work:
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=azgKCHhcsBc

[carpediemracing]

My wife started with a really toes down position. After some gentle suggestions she rode with a bit more of a flat foot, still toes down but not like a ballet dancer "en pointe".

The main reason for the change was that she was cramping her calves. With more of a flat position, still toes down mind you, it got a lot better.

I'm guessing that if a woman wears heels her tendency will be to have a more accentuated toes down position. It seems that wearing heels regularly reduces calf flexibility.

The Missus doesn't wear heels normally but she had pretty dramatic foot surgery as a child so her feet are a bit messed up.

[Coluber42]

My better half rides with his toes pointed down, and it doesn't seem to cause him problems. I guess it's just what you're used to; but if the lowers his saddle to where he'd even be able to ride flat footed, his knees bother him. Maybe it's because he hasn't made a concerted effort to change it, but it's just how he rides. I ride with my feet flat, and interestingly, the difference is enough that he likes his saddle slightly higher than I like mine, even though my inseam is a good bit longer. Go figure.
If nothing hurts, I wouldn't worry about it. Toes down does make you less likely to have problems with toe overlap with the front wheel, or kicking panniers in the back. I suspect that some folks who ride toes-down got in that habit as a result of one of those things.

[merlincustom1]

It's a non-issue. Your body gravitates to what's natural.

[ultraman6970]

Could be her style or could be that she is seated too high. Seen guys that pedal like your wife tho, but if she is doing ballerina type of toe down I would call that really "interesting" tho.

W/o telling her lower the saddle like 1 cm and see what happens if the pedaling goes better and she starts kicking butt... then dont touch that saddle high no more hehehe

[dogdriver]

Another tidbit-- watch her hips (stop laughing). If they're rocking, I'd lower her saddle a bit. If they're stable, she likes to point her toes when she pedals.

[leftyfreak]

Originally Posted by merlincustom1

It's a non-issue. Your body gravitates to what's natural.

I think it's far more accurate to say that the body learns physical patterns, and makes them habitual. The familiar pattern is what feels "natural" but there is absolutely no guarantee that this learned habit is the best approach for a given task. To give an example, I teach saxophone, and all students have to learn to finger the instrument. If I were to never teach them correct fingering technique, a small number would just happen to do it well, with relaxed digits and no wasted motion, but many more would move their fingers stiffly and hold their fingers three inches above the keys. All these students are playing "naturally" but only a few fall into a pattern that is ideal without instruction. "Natural" is just habit, nothing more or less. The few people who intuitively fall into a habit that is the most efficient, ideal circumstance, are either just fortunate or are outliers who are unusually attuned to their physical processes and can self-correct in a way that most can't. The good news for the rest of us is that with good instruction, we can learn better habits.

As for the toes down query by the OP, I was taught that keeping the foot flat, and pressing the foot into the whole sole of the shoe to transfer power, is the most efficient way to pedal. Toes down is particularly problematic at the top of the pedal stroke however. This was demonstrated to me when I was on a trainer. By simply putting his index finger on the toe of my shoe, my coach was able to prevent me from pushing the pedal over the top of the pedal stroke. In the toes down position, I was relying on the little muscles along the front of the shin, and that doesn't work so well. With a flat foot, you can kick forward with the quads, and that works much better.

Of course, the OP didn't mention if the toes down situation presented itself at the top of the pedal stroke as well as at the bottom...

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by sjbraun

I went for a 45 mile ride with my wife this morning. She's trying get back in cycling shape so we can enjoy the El Grupo Fall Fundo in mid-November. (Due to some ridiculous work demands, she pretty much gave up riding for the last year.) Riding behind her today, I noticed her toes point down at the bottom of her pedal stroke. In contrast, my foot is pretty flat at the bottom of the pedal rotation.

Do pointed toes impede her? Not sure if I should try to "correct" a bad habit/fit or if cyclists simply have different pedaling styles.

Thanks

-Steve

For more info on El Grupo, follow the link. They are an outstanding youth cycling organization and add considerably to the cycling culture in Tucson

http://www.elgrupocycling.org/

IMHO-IMHO..if the rest of the fit is 'right', toe up or down or parallel is more physiological than psychological..in other words, you can't really 'think' your feet anything but what they are gonna do when you are pedaling.

[Mark McM]

As has been said here, the angle of the foot is a personal preference. But it can affect seat height, which is why some fitters don't set seat height strictly on leg length, but instead base it on the angle of the knee joint during the pedal stroke.

[giordana93]

not a problem, but I would check her cleat placement just to be sure.

[cderalow]

I ride slightly toes down. Doesn't seem to really bother me. If i ride perfectly flat footed for too long my right knee begins to bother me (previous MCL tear)

[mktng]

My pedaling tends to change throughout the ride. Depending on effort. Grade.. Etc etc. It just does what it does. Just gotta make sure the saddle height and position is spot on. Haha