Electric Bikes: The ethical conundrum

[FlashUNC]

Interesting piece from the New Yorker today on the ethical -- and social -- implications of ebikes/pedal assist bikes.

http://www.newyorker.com/culture/cul...bike-conundrum

In some ways, the bike-ification of New York City can be seen as the ultimate middle finger raised to Robert Moses, a hero for building so many parks who then became a crazed highway builder who wanted to demolish part of Greenwich Village to make room for a freeway. But are all the bikes a triumph for his nemesis, Jane Jacobs, and her vision of cohesive neighborhoods anchored by street life, by which she meant the world of pedestrians on the sidewalk?

[Mark McM]

Here in Massachusetts, electric bikes are a legal conundrum. Massachusetts laws currently categorize electric bikes as Motorized Bicycles, which is the same category in which MoPeds are classified. This means that:

- They must be registered with the DMV, and must have a registration sticker or plate attached.

- They can not be operated by anyone under 16 years old.

- They operator must have a drivers license or learners permit.

- The operator and any passengers must wear helmets.

- They can be operated in bike lanes adjacent to roads, but can not be operated on off-road paths (such as rail trails).

While I have not heard of these rules being enforced for e-bikes, they could be. According to the first requirement above, the dealer that sells the motorized bike is responsible for collecting the registration fee and attaching the sticker/plate. I wonder if the local bike shops that sell these even know the laws that apply to them.

[PepeM]

Meh.

People need to be less insecure.

[notsew]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

Here in Massachusetts, electric bikes are a legal conundrum. Massachusetts laws currently categorize electric bikes as Motorized Bicycles, which is the same category in which MoPeds are classified. This means that:

- They must be registered with the DMV, and must have a registration sticker or plate attached.

- They can not be operated by anyone under 16 years old.

- They operator must have a drivers license or learners permit.

- The operator and any passengers must wear helmets.

- They can be operated in bike lanes adjacent to roads, but can not be operated on off-road paths (such as rail trails).

While I have not heard of these rules being enforced for e-bikes, they could be. According to the first requirement above, the dealer that sells the motorized bike is responsible for collecting the registration fee and attaching the sticker/plate. I wonder if the local bike shops that sell these even know the laws that apply to them.

Seems reasonable to me. Its no different than a 50cc vespa that tops out at 35 mph.

[homagesilkhope]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

Interesting piece from the New Yorker today on the ethical -- and social -- implications of ebikes/pedal assist bikes.

Plus - less directly - PDA's, selfies, social media, etc.

Thanks for the link.

[Louis]

A motor's a motor, whether the energy comes from internal combustion or a chemical reaction in a battery.

Of course, plenty of strong riders can often go just as fast as some riders with an electric motor, so perhaps motor vs no motor is itself an artificial distinction. After all, a chemical reaction in a battery vs chemical reaction in muscles, what's the difference?

It all comes down to power and how long it can be generated.

[numbskull]

The article has nothing to do with ethics.
If your sail boat has a motor in it is that an ethical issue, moral issue, or neither?
Are bicycles any different?

[Tony T]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

In some ways, the bike-ification of New York City can be seen as the ultimate middle finger raised to Robert Moses, a hero for building so many parks who then became a crazed highway builder who wanted to demolish part of Greenwich Village to make room for a freeway….

Moses had enough foresight that on the Parkways he made the overpasses low so that trucks could never use them. His highways tore through and apart neighborhoods in Brooklyn, but when he wanted to go through Brooklyn Heights (where a lot of Brooklyn Judges lived), he took a right and built that part of the Gowanus Expressway by the piers.

However, one can never forgive Moses for the Dodgers leaving Brooklyn for LA in 1957 (O'Malley wanted a new ballpark in Downtown Brooklyn (near the Subways), but Moses would only entertain a new Stadium in Queens (Shea Stadium). Anyone interested in the History of the Brooklyn Dodgers, see The Ghosts of Flatbush (2007 HBO Documentary) — O'Malley was always the villain in Brooklyn's loss of the Dodgers but the real blame goes to Moses. Best quote in the film wad the old joke: "If you asked a Brooklyn Dodger fan, if you had a gun with only two bullets in it and were in a room with Hitler, Stalin and O'Malley, who would you shoot? The answer: O'Malley, twice!")

[classtimesailer]

“But, I feel there is a clear line between human power and non-human power,” he added. “I think there should be a very simple classification: human-powered or not human-powered. And if you are not human-powered, you should not be using human-powered infrastructure. You should be in the street. E-bikes being licensed as motorized vehicles is good. E-bikes being in human-powered infrastructure is no good. . . .”

There is now a speeding ex-cager in the bike lanes that we have to be cautious of.

[SoCalSteve]

Originally Posted by classtimesailer

“But, I feel there is a clear line between human power and non-human power,” he added. “I think there should be a very simple classification: human-powered or not human-powered. And if you are not human-powered, you should not be using human-powered infrastructure. You should be in the street. E-bikes being licensed as motorized vehicles is good. E-bikes being in human-powered infrastructure is no good. . . .”

There is now a speeding ex-cager in the bike lanes that we have to be cautious of.

They scare the piss out of me on when I'm riding on bike paths. It feels like they do not have a clue how powerful and potentially dangerous their e bikes can be.

[bigbill]

I saw an article about E assist off road hand cycles, I'm good with that. If it improves access for people who might not normally be able to full enjoy trail riding, I'm for it. It's not like a hand cycle is blowing past you on a climb but they might on the descent where the assist wouldn't be in play.

[sdrides]

The bike infrastructure in my area is the singletrack network, and handicap accessibility is the only possible justification I could stomach for e-bikes on the trails. I feel the same way when I ride in the city or on bike paths: a motor is a motor; if you have one, use the motorists route.

That said, I'm completely fine with the e-bike and am considering getting a little 250W setup. My commute is 10 miles with 1100 feet of climbing, including the last 2.5 miles. Makes it difficult to arrive in a work-appropriate state, but I think a little boost here or there would solve that.

[unterhausen]

I'm resigned to losing some routes/singletrack because ebikers can't control themselves. We'll see though, hope I'm wrong

[stien]

I've got a horse in this race. Calm down. This is being sensationalized for no reason.

Pedal assist (legal ones) top out at 20mph. If you're within the law, it's safe. If not, then it's the wild west. You can have an unregistered/uninsured motor scooter that tops out at 20mph* and nobody is up in arms about it. They use bike lanes, split traffic, the shoulder, etc. I typically commute faster on a solo bike than I do with my e-bike anyway (I also have a more upright position and am carrying two dogs + gear on the e-bike as well). Other roadies crush the bike path (that I avoid BTW) much faster.

*As long as you don't rev it too much! The cops don't care if you have the ability to go faster.

[verbs4us]

Originally Posted by stien

I've got a horse in this race. Calm down. This is being sensationalized for no reason.

Pedal assist (legal ones) top out at 20mph. If you're within the law, it's safe. If not, then it's the wild west. You can have an unregistered/uninsured motor scooter that tops out at 20mph* and nobody is up in arms about it. They use bike lanes, split traffic, the shoulder, etc. I typically commute faster on a solo bike than I do with my e-bike anyway (I also have a more upright position and am carrying two dogs + gear on the e-bike as well). Other roadies crush the bike path (that I avoid BTW) much faster.

*As long as you don't rev it too much! The cops don't care if you have the ability to go faster.

It think the issue is more nuanced. As SoCalSteve pointed out, they can scare the **** out of you on a bike path. I see the issue more as safety than ethics. Yes, they top out at 20--and they can do that for long stretches up hill when even the Cat 2's are out of the saddle at 12 mph. On a crowded five-foot wide bike path, an e-bike weaving at 20 mph is not safe, either for the rider (who, in NYC, is nearly always helmetless) or for the walkers/runners/dog-walkers/rollerbladers/cyclists and other inhabitants of the path.