World Championships Discussion (With Spoilers)

[bobswire]

Originally Posted by nooneline

Marianne Vos won her 3rd road WC in 2013.
And her 3rd cx WC in 2010. And 3 more in a row after that.

An apt comparison.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by Climb01742

Interesting that we have two incredibly dominant riders today -- Froome and Sagan -- yet they're as different in skills and personalities as you can imagine. One seems like he actually enjoys it!

Lol.

One is dominant in Grand Tours. The other wins literally just one race on the calendar. Weird one of the most dominant riders in the world can't win in the Spring when it matters.

[FL_MarkD]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

Lol.

One is dominant in Grand Tours. The other wins literally just one race on the calendar. Weird one of the most dominant riders in the world can't win in the Spring when it matters.

Agree, patiently waiting on Froome to win in the spring .....

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

Lol.

One is dominant in Grand Tours. The other wins literally just one race on the calendar. Weird one of the most dominant riders in the world can't win in the Spring when it matters.

Huh?

This year alone, Sagan has won 3 single day races, 9 stage race stages, and the Points categories in 5 races. (He likely could have won more stages and perhaps another Points category if he hadn't been ejected from the Tour de France early in the race.)

Chris Froome won the GC category in 2 races, the Points and Combination category in 1 race, and only won 2 stage race road stages.

Froome and Sagan have different skill sets, so you can't draw a direct comparison between them. But claiming that the Sagan "wins literally just one race on the calendar" is completely wrong, and even saying he "can't win in the Spring" is wrong too, as he won the Spring Classic Kuurne-Brussels-Kuurne this year, and the Tour of Flanders and Gent-Wevelgum last year.

When it comes simple length, the list of Sagan's wins is longer than the list of Froome's wins.

[MattTuck]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

Lol.

One is dominant in Grand Tours. The other wins literally just one race on the calendar. Weird one of the most dominant riders in the world can't win in the Spring when it matters.

C'mon man. Let's not short change him. He's won a bunch of races this year.

KBK
2 stages at Tirreno Adriatico
1 stage at Tour of California
2 stages at Tour de Suisse
1 stage at Tour de France
1 stage at Tour of Poland
2 stages at the BinckBank Tour
Grand Prix Cycliste Quebec

Sure, only 2 of his other wins have come in one day races... but... hey, he's the preeminent classics rider of the modern era. Can't argue with facts.

Seriously though, he is a great rider and animates most races that he's in. But for sure, the World Championships have been the high point of his season this year. Last year, he did have significant wins throughout the year and in the spring.

The thing is, it is not for lack of talent or natural ability. If you added a stronger classics team and a bit more tactical guidance from the DS, I think he'd be killing it in the spring. If he'd have ended up on Quick-Step, oh boy.

That said, I think he is a sponsor's dream. He generally follows the Greg Lemond formula -- do well at the Tour and World Championships. I think Sagan enjoys the spring races, but I think the audience for those performances (even if they are more pure bike racing) are tiny compared to the global audience for the Tour in July.

And wearing the rainbow stripes is a huge draw for his personal brand and the team, in terms of mentions and spotlight.

He's doing a lot of things right, even if there were some questionable decisions this year. Honestly, he'd probably be two monuments heavier if not for a jacket in Belgium and taking one pull too many in Italy.


PS. BinckBank Tour is a real tour. Even though it sounds like someone just made it up.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

C'mon man. Let's not short change him. He's won a bunch of races this year.

KBK
2 stages at Tirreno Adriatico
1 stage at Tour of California
2 stages at Tour de Suisse
1 stage at Tour de France
1 stage at Tour of Poland
2 stages at the BinckBank Tour
Grand Prix Cycliste Quebec

Sure, only 2 of his other wins have come in one day races... but... hey, he's the preeminent classics rider of the modern era. Can't argue with facts.

Seriously though, he is a great rider and animates most races that he's in. But for sure, the World Championships have been the high point of his season this year. Last year, he did have significant wins throughout the year and in the spring.

The thing is, it is not for lack of talent or natural ability. If you added a stronger classics team and a bit more tactical guidance from the DS, I think he'd be killing it in the spring. If he'd have ended up on Quick-Step, oh boy.

That said, I think he is a sponsor's dream. He generally follows the Greg Lemond formula -- do well at the Tour and World Championships. I think Sagan enjoys the spring races, but I think the audience for those performances (even if they are more pure bike racing) are tiny compared to the global audience for the Tour in July.

And wearing the rainbow stripes is a huge draw for his personal brand and the team, in terms of mentions and spotlight.

He's doing a lot of things right, even if there were some questionable decisions this year. Honestly, he'd probably be two monuments heavier if not for a jacket in Belgium and taking one pull too many in Italy.


PS. BinckBank Tour is a real tour. Even though it sounds like someone just made it up.

To be the "pre-eminent classics rider of his era" wouldn't he need to, yanno, win classics?

Ye Gods, GvA (who is still God) won E3, Omloop, Gent Wevelgem AND Roubaix this year. You can string a series like that across about five of Sagan's last Spring Classics campaigns. Gilbert won Amstel Gold and Flanders, and this is after his Ardennes rampage just a couple years ago.

C'mon. If best one-day racer is the guy who wins lots of stages in shorter stage races, and doesn't win during the actual biggest one-day races on the calendar, then sure, Sagan fits the bill.

[kramnnim]

FlashUNC, your trolling is getting worse and worse. lol.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by kramnnim

FlashUNC, your trolling is getting worse and worse. lol.

I'm sorry if my criteria for best one-day racer is someone who wins, yanno, big one-day races.

Its a novel concept, sure. Its like calling Adam Hansen the best Grand Tour rider ever. I mean, sure, if you're using a set of criteria that doesn't start with "well, who wins the races?"

I've never seen more excuses for someone who doesn't win Monuments to be called this generation's Merckx. Its bizarre.

[MattTuck]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

To be the "pre-eminent classics rider of his era" wouldn't he need to, yanno, win classics?

I think you missed the point of my post

[FlashUNC]

I don't doubt he's marketing hype. That much is pretty clear.

[justaute]

Sorry for the re-post, if this was already mentioned.

I didn't watch the entire U23 Championship, so I missed this incident of the Finnish rider Joni Kanerva. Wow...it's terrible. Apparently he's sustained several serious injuries including fractured vertebrae, fractured collar bone, broken ribs, etc.

http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-n...-worlds-crash/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNyzM58NUzQ

[kramnnim]

Has anyone who matters claimed Sagan to be the "best one day racer?"

[weisan]

“I don't want to be the second Eddy Merckx, I want to be the first Peter Sagan,”

[Drmojo]

Originally Posted by kramnnim

FlashUNC, your trolling is getting worse and worse. lol.

nuff sed

[m4rk540]

It's not trolling, he's playing the role of Informed Contrarian. Let's compare LeBron and Kobe. LeBron has the eyepopping stats (a la Sagan) and Kobe has the rings (a la GVA). One season, LeBron has a higher scoring average, another season(s) Kobe. But who would argue (although a solid argument could be made) that Kobe is/was a better player.

So, FlashUNC is a Kobe fan.