Lug stresses when removing headset

[jimbolina]

A lugged steel frame is usually clamped into a fixture and the cup removal tool is then hammered to force these press-fit components from the headtube.

Isn't that type of very harsh, blunt force particularly hard on the brazed lug joints, especially there near the headtube? Not to mention the entire frame which can act as a lever depending on where the clamp is applied.

Just wondering...

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by jimbolina

A lugged steel frame is usually clamped into a fixture and the cup removal tool is then hammered to force these press-fit components from the headtube.

Isn't that type of very harsh, blunt force particularly hard on the brazed lug joints, especially there near the headtube? Not to mention the entire frame which can act as a lever depending on where the clamp is applied.

Just wondering...

No...I've taken hundreds of cups out of head tubes with the proper tool and have never seen a head tube/frame/lug be damaged. I think having a 150-250 pound rider on it is more stress than taking cups out. A proper way is to hold the cup in your cupped hand while hitting tool also. Not really hitting it that hard either.

[11.4]

To echo Old Spud, to do it properly you hold the head tube with one hand and ask someone to put their hand under the cup to catch it when it falls out. Or hold under the cup if you don't have an accomplice.

The key is the idea of "falling out". If the head tube is prepped properly, the headset should slide in and slide out with only a little bit of effort. You definitely don't want it loose, but it isn't going anywhere. It'll be lubricated well before insertion and the lubricant will help it come out easily. You tap the removal tool with a plastic mallet, not with a sledge. It should disassemble very easily. If it doesn't, get some help for assistance or expertise.

And anyway, as Spud mentioned, what you can do with a few light taps of a mallet is nothing compared to what you do when you hit a pothole while riding. Your bike is tough.

[Mark McM]

Ditto what Old Potato said. Installing and removing pressed in headset cups is more a matter of firm tapping than it is hard smashing. As OP said, the forces/stresses from riding are much larger. (For example: If the races are not firmly bottomed out when installed, normal riding forces will finish pressing them in for you, which will exhibit itself by a loosening of the bearing adjustment.)

[jimbolina]

Appreciate the excellent responses as they make a lot of sense. I realize a properly brazed joint is pretty darn strong but often I ponder just how tough these sort of joints are in these odd situations. Oh well.

By the way, why would a plastic mallet be preferable to any other sort of hammering device (say, a regular hammer) if used as it should be?

Thanks.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by jimbolina

Appreciate the excellent responses as they make a lot of sense. I realize a properly brazed joint is pretty darn strong but often I ponder just how tough these sort of joints are in these odd situations. Oh well.

By the way, why would a plastic mallet be preferable to any other sort of hammering device (say, a regular hammer) if used as it should be?

Thanks.

Any slip and a plastic hammer won't chip and ding your frame. Softer material in a plastic or rubber hammer will do less ugly damage.

[93KgBike]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

Ditto what Old Potato said. Installing and removing pressed in headset cups is more a matter of firm tapping than it is hard smashing. As OP said, the forces/stresses from riding are much larger. (For example: If the races are not firmly bottomed out when installed, normal riding forces will finish pressing them in for you, which will exhibit itself by a loosening of the bearing adjustment.)

Ditto to both oldpotatoe and Mark McM; I have knocked hundreds and hundreds of headsets out of lugged head tubes, and never used more work than required to crack a walnut.

[David Kirk]

Originally Posted by jimbolina

Appreciate the excellent responses as they make a lot of sense. I realize a properly brazed joint is pretty darn strong but often I ponder just how tough these sort of joints are in these odd situations. Oh well.

By the way, why would a plastic mallet be preferable to any other sort of hammering device (say, a regular hammer) if used as it should be?

Thanks.

In most cases the brazed joint will be stronger than the tubes themselves. Hammer away.

dave

[jimbolina]

Good insight David. Thanks.