Another SoCal Masters Racing Douchebaggery

[livingminimal]

Originally Posted by shovelhd

You don't read very well, do you? Or is your comprehension clouded by prejudice?

Prejudice? Yes, I have extreme prejudice against douchebags that behave like this in a race. That is true. I am sorry to admit it.

I am also sorry you have to feel so offended and have your feelings shredded because my perspective is that these **** wads should have been on a relaxed neighborly ride around their community, chatting and enjoying themselves and not assaulting other cyclists.

My dad raced. Lots of my friends raced. I used to race. I do not anymore, and this video (and people like you, really) are as good of reasons as any not to.

I am sorry that offends your delicate sensibilities.

PS: What's comprehension mean?

[azrider]

Originally Posted by ptourkin

Update on John from Sarah:

"Update on John Walsh: he's still in ICU but being moved to a room tomorrow. The MRI report was clear. Numbness in legs likely from bruised nerve. Here's the not so good part, he has 2 breaks in his collarbone so they have to do surgery for stability. It might require two surgeries 1 day apart. First one is Wednesday morning. Second one Friday, if required. John will be in OC at least through the weekend. Hoping to get him home on Monday or Tuesday. Thanks again for your amazing support, love and guidance."

Man I sure hope this guy makes it, I wonder if the guy that did it has reached out to them.............

[livingminimal]

Originally Posted by ptourkin

Update on John from Sarah:

"Update on John Walsh: he's still in ICU but being moved to a room tomorrow. The MRI report was clear. Numbness in legs likely from bruised nerve. Here's the not so good part, he has 2 breaks in his collarbone so they have to do surgery for stability. It might require two surgeries 1 day apart. First one is Wednesday morning. Second one Friday, if required. John will be in OC at least through the weekend. Hoping to get him home on Monday or Tuesday. Thanks again for your amazing support, love and guidance."

God that's so ****ed.

[carpediemracing]

The last race I did was a couple Sundays ago. With a distinct lack of fitness I was lucky the race never got too hard. I ended up placing. It was slower than a Tuesday Night B race (Cat 3-4-5) neutral lap for at least the first lap.

Racing is racing, even if it's not hard. In fact, I'd argue that if you're riding hard all the time in a race you're doing it wrong or you're weak like me. Average under 160w for a Cat 3 race suffering like a dog doing it, place 3rd in said race, and then we'll talk.

[carpediemracing]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

More than that, he lowered his shoulder, and then drove it into the back of the victim's arm. A shoulder-to-shoulder or shoulder-to-hip contact would have just knocked the victim sideways. By driving into the back of the victim's arm, it guaranteed that the victim's handlebars/front wheel would be turned sideways, immediately dropping the victim onto the ground.

This was a pre-meditated battery.

I want to bump this comment because that was my point. He did this intentionally with pretty good knowledge of what it'd do (take down the rider unexpectedly).

It's even more effective than actually punching the rider because the move used physics to really topple the guy, whereas punching another rider while on a bike is pretty ineffective due to physics.

[John H.]

If that was his intention, why wouldn't he have come up on the right side and took him to the curb? Would have been much easier.

Originally Posted by carpediemracing

I want to bump this comment because that was my point. He did this intentionally with pretty good knowledge of what it'd do (take down the rider unexpectedly).

It's even more effective than actually punching the rider because the move used physics to really topple the guy, whereas punching another rider while on a bike is pretty ineffective due to physics.

[T.J.]

Originally Posted by John H.

If that was his intention, why wouldn't he have come up on the right side and took him to the curb? Would have been much easier.

I agree with John. Coming up on the right and pinching him into the curb would have been easier and less obvious is it was intentional

[carpediemracing]

Originally Posted by John H.

If that was his intention, why wouldn't he have come up on the right side and took him to the curb? Would have been much easier.

I can't answer for the rider, but I'm guessing the wind was from the right (I only watched the one bit so not sure if that's true, but the rider in front was on the curb). Automatic response is move up on the left, and it's an automatic excuse. "I was moving up through the gap on the sheltered side and he moved over on me." Totally believable.

I've never been accused of being a dirty rider, and I have to say that I am pretty sure that no one has ever crashed because of my riding (as a promoter I suppose I indirectly killed someone).

The reason why I've never been called a dirty rider is because if I ever did anything on the bike it was totally excusable and understandable. Just like moving up the sheltered curb side and ending up with contact.

In a similar move, but in my case not meant to take anyone out, I moved up a similarly tight spot in a crit going into the final sprint. I wanted to draw in a rider (the one that had been screaming obscenities at me for 15 minutes during the race, hitting my helmet/shoulder/arm/hand, brake checking me at 45 mph, etc, to the point that the rest of the field gave us room to fight). My goal was to draw him into the sprint way too early (600m out?) and ruin his race. My pre-race goal had been met - we had a teammate in the break, he needed a top 6 to upgrade, there were 5 in the break including him, and they'd won the race so he got 5th at worst.

So I moved up the super tight left side in a straight with a strong crosswind from the right, a move designed to pull the other rider through. I was going to basically dump him in the wind but fate took over. The rider second wheel did the exact same move just as I pulled up next to him. I'd jumped super early, like 15-20 seconds too early for an early jump, and jumped super hard, so he probably didn't expect anyone in the 10-15" of pavement to his left. We hooked bars and toppled. The screamer went ass over teakettle right over me. We were all okay physically (not even road rash - we all tumbled into grass) and I couldn't help but laugh as I picked myself up off the ground. I hadn't planned it but it was a totally appropriate end to the race. My teammate got 5th and his upgrade. The rest of us were fine. And I had another story to tell.

[William]

Originally Posted by John H.

If that was his intention, why wouldn't he have come up on the right side and took him to the curb? Would have been much easier.

You are assuming the rider is thinking logically in the moment outside of "Eff you" mode. Very easy to call that here without the adrenaline and anger of the moment as a result of getting (accidentally) pinched.






William

[William]

Keep it civil people. No reason to go off and break the forum code and earn time out.





William

[T.J.]

Originally Posted by carpediemracing

I can't answer for the rider, but I'm guessing the wind was from the right (I only watched the one bit so not sure if that's true, but the rider in front was on the curb). Automatic response is move up on the left, and it's an automatic excuse. "I was moving up through the gap on the sheltered side and he moved over on me." Totally believable.

I've never been accused of being a dirty rider, and I have to say that I am pretty sure that no one has ever crashed because of my riding (as a promoter I suppose I indirectly killed someone).

The reason why I've never been called a dirty rider is because if I ever did anything on the bike it was totally excusable and understandable. Just like moving up the sheltered curb side and ending up with contact.

In a similar move, but in my case not meant to take anyone out, I moved up a similarly tight spot in a crit going into the final sprint. I wanted to draw in a rider (the one that had been screaming obscenities at me for 15 minutes during the race, hitting my helmet/shoulder/arm/hand, brake checking me at 45 mph, etc, to the point that the rest of the field gave us room to fight). My goal was to draw him into the sprint way too early (600m out?) and ruin his race. My pre-race goal had been met - we had a teammate in the break, he needed a top 6 to upgrade, there were 5 in the break including him, and they'd won the race so he got 5th at worst.

So I moved up the super tight left side in a straight with a strong crosswind from the right, a move designed to pull the other rider through. I was going to basically dump him in the wind but fate took over. The rider second wheel did the exact same move just as I pulled up next to him. I'd jumped super early, like 15-20 seconds too early for an early jump, and jumped super hard, so he probably didn't expect anyone in the 10-15" of pavement to his left. We hooked bars and toppled. The screamer went ass over teakettle right over me. We were all okay physically (not even road rash - we all tumbled into grass) and I couldn't help but laugh as I picked myself up off the ground. I hadn't planned it but it was a totally appropriate end to the race. My teammate got 5th and his upgrade. The rest of us were fine. And I had another story to tell.

Brake checking at 45mph in a crit? HUGE downhill ?

[sailorboy]

Originally Posted by shovelhd

Who the eff are you to tell anyone how to spend their day? Sheesh.

The only reason I mentioned racing level is because as you move up the categories, contact is assumed, and riders know how to handle it. Overly aggressive and dangerous behaviour, though, is not tolerated, and is often dealt with in other ways. At best, it was a stupid move. At worst, the guy is a criminal.

I have to say I'm tired of seeing the tone you put out on this forum and talking down to anyone and everyone who critical of racing in any way on this forum. Who the eff do you think YOU are?

You come off as some washed-up 50+ cat 2 with an axe to grind who also works for USAC or something and that gives you the right to savage anyone who disagrees with you? Earlier you ask someone if they race, then answer the question for them in the same post and then basically say his opinion doesn't mean *****. Get over yourself.

[93KgBike]

Originally Posted by carpediemracing

I want to bump this comment because that was my point. He did this intentionally with pretty good knowledge of what it'd do (take down the rider unexpectedly).

It's even more effective than actually punching the rider because the move used physics to really topple the guy, whereas punching another rider while on a bike is pretty ineffective due to physics.

Agreed. This is the opposite of a close call.

[earlfoss]

Im a Freds

[earlfoss]

Someone please tell me how to spend my day and hurry because it is getting late.

Someone tell me why they stopped riding on the road or how this stuff doesn't happen in MTB or whatever. From what I can tell, each area of cycling, and pretty much any hobby you can imagine has a similar spectrum of normal of insane participants.

Can you accept that people enjoy things for reasons you may not have considered? Bike racing, for example? Keyboard hotheads!