OT: car advice

[YoKev]

Originally Posted by Kobe

Sat in the Kia Niro at the Philly Auto Show, plenty of room for me at 6'6". Kia has come a long ways and has an outstanding warranty. Plus 52 mpg in the city.

http://www.caranddriver.com/kia/niro

The Niro seems very nice indeed

I drove a '16 Kia Rio 5-door for two weeks while on vacation, and I was impressed with it. I don't know what that says about me and my car tastes, but it struck me as a well built car that represented a great value for what it was.

If the Cee'd wagon was available here I'd probably have one.

[pncguy]

"All-wheel drive is not available..."

I think I'll stick with an Outback for my driving in Colorado.

[likebikes]

Originally Posted by Aaron O

My mechanic is definitely not a fan of turbo.

I'm guessing he's never seen one in person/driven one, let alone had to work on one as it's a new vehicle that just became available?

he sounds like a quack.

[andeww]

Originally Posted by Louis

I saw one this morning for the first time! In black and a very sleek car -- On the flip side, i am not used to seeing alfas on the street and wasnt sure if it was new jaguar or kia

[Aaron O]

Originally Posted by likebikes

I'm guessing he's never seen one in person/driven one, let alone had to work on one as it's a new vehicle that just became available?

he sounds like a quack.

Actually he's done a damn good job at fair pricing over the years; I like him very much. I don't know much about cars, but even a one hour search on line made it pretty apparent that there have been numerous problems with turbos of various manufacturers...and it's pretty easy to see that they're more complicated and there are greater pressures involved.

Your post really rubs me wrong...it's fine to disagree, but calling someone you've never dealt with a quack on line (over something that seems like a very reasonable opinion) is pushing it. It makes me far more likely to discard your opinion as iconoclast.

Anyway...on a whim test drove a Kia Soul as well...very different than the Civic, apples and oranges, but I liked it very much. EXTREMELY comfortable. No where near as fun to drive, but I'm not sure how relevant that is in traffic. Hard not to like the warranty as well.

[shovelhd]

Originally Posted by Aaron O

Actually he's done a damn good job at fair pricing over the years; I like him very much. I don't know much about cars, but even a one hour search on line made it pretty apparent that there have been numerous problems with turbos of various manufacturers...and it's pretty easy to see that they're more complicated and there are greater pressures involved.

An hour online searching for problems with any type of vehicle is going to find numerous issues. You'll rarely see the positives, so you have no reference for how many had no problems.

VWAG has been making turbo powered gassers for quite a while. Turbo failures haven't been remarkably high on these vehicles. The thing that kills turbos is dirty oil. Keep it clean, and they'll last a very long time. That said, Honda hasn't offered turbos recently, have they? If so, I'd be a lot more concerned about first year issues than any issue in particular.

[Vientomas]

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...reliable-.html

[p nut]

Originally Posted by shovelhd

... That said, Honda hasn't offered turbos recently, have they? If so, I'd be a lot more concerned about first year issues than any issue in particular.

Not in the US, but they've been delivering turbo/FI engines for at least the last 8 years, outside of US.

[carpediemracing]

Drove the wife's car ('17 Civic EX T) today to get summer tires/wheels put on. I think it's the third time I drove it. It's 174 hp but compared to my car (boosted 2002 Sentra, realistically 270-280 hp at the wheels, probably a few hundred pounds lighter) it seemed pretty lethargic. Even the 205 hp spec on the Si would probably not feel super peppy.

On the other hand I thought I was going to hit the steering wheel when I put the brakes on at the bottom of our 22-ish % grade driveway (to get a grade I measured 7" drop in 32" using a couple straight edge levels). So the Sentra could probably use better or at least more responsive brakes.

Raining so not sure of the grip/etc but I spec'ed out a +1 (18" vs 17" rim) and then a +0 to get more width (245/40 vs 215/45, for an 18" rim). So 30mm more tread width, identical rolling circumference. It was quiet, smooth, and the few times I pushed a bit it seemed pretty good. I'm curious how it'll be in the dry.

A picture link that will expire:

[carpediemracing]

I really like the 2005-2011 Civics, the 8th gen (I also like the 92-95 Civics). My brother has an Si with maybe 185k on it, he's approaching or hit 190k. Thing handles incredibly well, nice shifter, feels very nimble, and 4 doors in my favorite blue color. I really like his car.

I know someone with a 2007 Si with 30,032 miles on it (last week, when she brought it in for emissions). 4 door, blue, pristine, 80 year old woman whose husband doesn't fit in it and doesn't drive a stick so it's garaged all the time. I can't justify buying the car (although if one of you wants to let me know). I'd buy it in a heartbeat if I could store it or if I didn't have my Sentra.

Honda has been selling a turbo through Acura (SUV, I think the CRV sister car) from 2007. However from what I've read it got pretty poor mileage. I don't know anything more than that.

Our Civic (1.5 turbo) gets in the mid-upper 30 mpg range for a tank. The car has just 1240 miles on it so not many tanks, but so far that's what we've gotten. When I got out of the car it had 250 miles range left and 38.2 mpg for the tank (I assume it's for the tank because I was on the gas quite a bit and started with 38.5 mpg).

Regarding turbos and the techs I work with... Some have turbos, most do not. Might be a function of money as much as preference.

[Aaron O]

The car I most enjoyed was definitely the hatchback. I'm getting the (turbo) hatchback. It's done.

Metallic Grey Civic Hatchback EX is the winner!

I want to thank everyone who gave me such great advice on the thread. You were, as I've come to expect, extremely helpful throughout this intimidating process. Even the comment that annoyed me above helped me feel better about the turbo.

Thanks all!

Particular thanks to those who got me away from coupes and helped to understand them.

[batman1425]

Nice choice. Honda is relatively new to the turbo mass market compared to some makers, but the tech is quickly becoming common across all brands for the increased performance to fuel economy ratio. While early turbo platforms from many makers suffered poor reliability, the modern examples IME are just as reliable as their normally aspirated counterparts.

Heck - my car as stock pushes over 17lbs of boost in a 2L 4cyl. Nearly 150hp/L and gets 30mph at 70mph. It can even reliably tolerate +4-5psi with aftermarket software on the stock hardware. Todays engines are far more well thought out and purpose designed with for turbo applications - vs. the more "bolt on" approach to a standard NA plant that early turbos were. Signs point to you having a good experience with this car.

Enjoy!

[Aaron O]

Here was my rough, unscientific, order of preferences after the extensive research and test driving...

Civic Hatchback
Kia Soul
Civic Sedan
Subaru Imprezza
Ford Focus Hatchback
Mazda 3
Kia Forte
Hyundai Elantra
Honda Fit
Chevy Cruz
Toyota Corolla IM

[likebikes]

followup report now that you've owned it for 7+ months?

[carpediemracing]

I'll pipe up. We have about 6000 miles on the car. I've driven it with summer tires (S-04, 245/40-18) and winter tires (Blizzak WS80, 215/55-17?).

Car handles really well, steering is a bit quicker than I'm used to, but that makes throwing the car into a turn really fun. I save it for when I'm alone as Junior complains about cornering too fast. With the S-04s it turns in incredibly quick, with the Blizzaks it's a bit lethargic. To me this is the strongest point of the car. It handles similarly to my coilover Sentra in turns.

On ripply wavy bumps it's actually pretty comfortable. The magic of good shock design. The same bumps (I drive over them every day getting to/from work) are undriveable at the same speeds in my Sentra, it shakes my head so much my vision blurs. In the Sentra I have to go about 5-8 mph in first gear, the 2017 Civic it's whatever I can do crossing the intersection, 5-10-15-20 mph.

Regularly get 36 mpg local driving, 39 mpg on the highway (70-75 mph typical speed).

Some engine noise on the highway. Locally virtually none.

I never got to redline for many months, and only hit it maybe 3 times? The engine definitely runs out of breath a bit, but I'm comparing it to a torque monster (TDIs, 230+ lbs torque), a boosted Sentra with a massive turbo (at least 100 hp over the Civic, breaks tires loose in 3rd gear, not sure of torque but in the high 200s), and the endless/steady push Expedition (300 lbs). Never really feels underpowered in steady state stuff like the interstate, even on long hills.

Rear seat is big enough for me. I usually sit there with Junior (he sits in the center). Headroom is close but good, and I sit tall for my height so that's a good test for height. Legs I have short legs so of course it's okay for me.